Coder Transparency - Cure/Poison Crafting

[nauta]

Actually if you use 'taste' on an herb you just do that - taste it, you don't take a bite like you do if tasting food.

This has been the case for a loooooooooooong time.

This is the case for many herbs/plants, but some I can think of that work for cures are -also- food.  In which case, you both are true.  (Source: I had a character that tasted everything.  Beware!  Not a bright idea.)

The solution is that you'd have to taste it first and then get another one.  I assume the tastes never change.

[BadSkeelz]

That's a relief and knocks down that concern, at least.

[lostinspace]

These changes are looking pretty cool, separating the effect of the cure from the color. Is there any chance we will be able to
>dye tablet red.dye
So that regardless of the herbs used we can still get the color we want?
It's going to be interesting and fun, that Runner pissing you off, give him a set of cures, but that green pill that's supposed to cure X, that actually just poisons him with Y as well. And the purple Y cure you gave him makes him start shitting his pants. I'm liking this a lot, it will be up to clan leaders or the individuals to choose the colors they want. I'm actually opposed to letting people know what they cure. You want guaranteed cures, buy them from a reputable vendor. Can't remember which of your cures is which. I guess you're just going to eat them like a handful of skittles.

[Bushranger]

Actually if you use 'taste' on an herb you just do that - taste it, you don't take a bite like you do if tasting food.

This has been the case for a loooooooooooong time.

This is the case for many herbs/plants, but some I can think of that work for cures are -also- food.  In which case, you both are true.  (Source: I had a character that tasted everything.  Beware!  Not a bright idea.)

The solution is that you'd have to taste it first and then get another one.  I assume the tastes never change.

Natua it's an incredible idea and you know it!

Nessalin, brew has been broken for like a bajillion years and I know there have been several projects started and stopped with it, these revisions sound pretty dang awesome! Cheers for tackling such a huge project that I've always had a fascination for.

[ChibiTama]

For existing PCs with high skills we respond via the request tool to help them convert their knowledge of current recipes over to new ones.

What type of request would we submit and does it need to be clanned?

[Harmless]

I like the sound of all these changes, Nessalin. I always thought the old system was "too easy." This is a great change for realism and difficulty. Now if I could just keep a character around who can brew..

[nauta]

Hi,

So here's a question about transitioning and game lore.  There are books (or were) in Dasari that talk about making cures for various poisons, and I tend to have my characters talk about cures not in terms of 'tints' but rather in terms of plants: For instance, bimbal leaves are good for curing the poison from the Booga Monster, because of its sap.  So: Can we assume that this sort of knowledge carries over, e.g., two bimbals will go into making a mash (which will then go into a tablet/vial) that still curs Booga Monster Poison?

[nessalin]

For existing PCs with high skills we respond via the request tool to help them convert their knowledge of current recipes over to new ones.

What type of request would we submit and does it need to be clanned?

A question request is fine.

It'd be preferable if you include an example of what cures your character already knows how to brew by way of which items you are able to combine into which cures.   

We can provide you with information on how to use craft to make equivalent cures, but aren't going to give all master brewers information about the new system that extends beyond what their character knew in the old one.

[nessalin]

Hi,

So here's a question about transitioning and game lore.  There are books (or were) in Dasari that talk about making cures for various poisons, and I tend to have my characters talk about cures not in terms of 'tints' but rather in terms of plants: For instance, bimbal leaves are good for curing the poison from the Booga Monster, because of its sap.  So: Can we assume that this sort of knowledge carries over, e.g., two bimbals will go into making a mash (which will then go into a tablet/vial) that still curs Booga Monster Poison?

Likely we'll want to update those books with modern information.

[BadSkeelz]

I've noticed that the new assess -v functionality shows legacy tablets as being composed of "wood" or "none." I don't know what a newer cure shows up as, but it got me thinking on two points:

1) Should something different be showing up from >assess -v?
2) Does analyzing a tablet/mash/vial (assuming you have brewing) show what went in to it, like with other crafts?

[ChibiTama]

For existing PCs with high skills we respond via the request tool to help them convert their knowledge of current recipes over to new ones.

What type of request would we submit and does it need to be clanned?

How long should we expect to hear back about this?
A question request is fine.

It'd be preferable if you include an example of what cures your character already knows how to brew by way of which items you are able to combine into which cures.   

We can provide you with information on how to use craft to make equivalent cures, but aren't going to give all master brewers information about the new system that extends beyond what their character knew in the old one.

[nessalin]

For existing PCs with high skills we respond via the request tool to help them convert their knowledge of current recipes over to new ones.

What type of request would we submit and does it need to be clanned?

How long should we expect to hear back about this?
A question request is fine.

It'd be preferable if you include an example of what cures your character already knows how to brew by way of which items you are able to combine into which cures.   

We can provide you with information on how to use craft to make equivalent cures, but aren't going to give all master brewers information about the new system that extends beyond what their character knew in the old one.

These requests should all now be answered.

[nessalin]

I'm interested in hearing back from players that filed and got a response about the new brew recipes based on their character's knowledge and skills.  Via e-mail or requests, please.

[nessalin]

After roughly two months the code for this seems stable.

If you have further feedback, please leave it in a request (if it is particular to your character) or in this thread.

[Delirium]

I'm a huge fan.

The only real quibble I have is that if you use a vial there is no way to see the color without assessing it, even if it is a glass vial, and sorting through empty vials vs. vials that have something in them is also a pain.

It can be tough to find enough different types of vials if you just want a different kind for each cure, too - so I'd love to have the color added to the sdesc of the vial itself until the cure is taken. i.e., a purple tiny glass vial, a red glass vial, etc etc.

[James de Monet]

A.  I have no idea how I missed this.

B.  I have DEFINITELY combined two things under the old system, and gotten a cure that did NOT work as anticipated.  Confused the hell out of me.

C.  Is there something more to this that I'm not understanding?  I try 'craft herb' and it says 'you can make a blah blah out of that'.  I say 'craft herb into blah blah'.  It says 'No recipes matched 'blah blah'.'  This happened to me with at least three different craft materials.

[Phoenix]

C. That confused me for a while too. For brewing, you can't do: craft <item1> <item2> into a so and so and so. You HAVE to use the number. So: craft <item1> <item2> into #1. Even if #1 is the only thing it can be made into.

[James de Monet]

Ahhhh.  I had tried that with something else when they first started numbering crafts, and convinced myself it didn't work to do that.  Good to see I was wrong!  Thanks!

[Dresan]

I am really hoping we get to see valuable poison crafting/brewing in the game.  However, it should be a combination of  brewing skill and poison skill.

There should be more value to having a poison skill at master. Gaining the ability to brew more potent poisons should be one of them. The ability to create poison with greater effect, pulse time, and even greater  ability to apply on a victim. Maybe even mix two different poisons together.

[najdorf]

As someone who recently had a slight (but not full) clue about the new system, I would like to have the following notes:
The new system is great that the actual plant culture / knowledge is essential to grasp now, as opposed to before. This provides a great deal of RP opportunity, also supported with code.
And I also liked it, because I like to discover things. It is like puzzle, a very complex one indeed!

My question / worry is whether the old system will entirely be removed after a while.
If old brew will remain, it is perfectly fine.
If old brew will be removed, then there may be a serious problem relating to playability, because finding poison type A will be at least 10 times easier than crafting its cure with the new system.

[nessalin]

The plan is for the old system to be removed.   It's state is a mix of accumulated (and honest) mistakes and unintended side effects from unrelated coding projects.

[Dresan]

If old brew is to be removed, I am hoping it gets replaced by two skills. Poison_crafting and Medicinal_crafting (name would need work )

It could work like this:
At journeyman medicinal crafting should allow a mastery of basic cures, soap and maybe some simple wines/ales. Greater skill mastery would allow the brewing of some advanced tablets that cure more than one poison at once, and at mastery herbal teas. Herbal teas should be the equivalent of coffee. It shouldn't last long after being brewed (very short decay timer) but if drunk while hot, it should provide better stamina recover for the IC day.

I can literally see a team move in to an area. The team begins to scout, set up and work, while someone starts a fire, and begins brewing a 'herbal tea' (zalantian coffee!). People sharring a drink before getting back to work, helping them get through the day a little easier. Not everyone would have the skill, and fewer still be able to master it, so it should be nice when you can find somoene who has mastered it to travel with you.

Hoping to see Poison crafting become its own skill, mostly because i would hate for everyone who can get brew new/old to get the ability to craft poisons. The poison skill itself already feels common enough.

[nessalin]

Moving cure/poison creation from the brew command to the craft command was, originally, about getting away from having two systems for 'crafting'.  The brew command uses a purely dynamic system (an object with certain qualities is considered a valid ingredient) while the craft command uses a purely static system (only exact objects can be used in specific recipes).  The cure/poison crafting brings the dynamic nature of the brew command into the crafting system.

Hopefully in the future it can be extended to other things that the brew command makes, like soap, wine, liquor.

The idea of having skills for crafting poisons and cures, separate from the poisoning and brew skills, is a good one.  We can look into that in the future.

[nessalin]

I realize this system is still confusing in many ways, so I took the time to make a diagram explaining it.

I hope this helps.

http://i.imgur.com/x2KFN64.jpg

[Lizzie]

Thanks Nessalin, I totally get it now! "Given enough time, all things will be made clear." -some philosopher person