Release Note discussion!

[Kialae]

I enjoy anything which stimulates the market. Armor degradation, food degradation, now spice degradation. All good moves by staff.

[RogueGunslinger]

I don't like decay. If feels like instead of using our props to facilitate roleplay we're using our props force it. It shouldn't be an OOC hassle to represent parts of the game world.

Now instead of having props that that help make a scene or to explain my character, I have to fully commit playtime to the upkeep of that prop. This just pushes me away from wanting to make a character who is a spice addict.

This would all be fine if that actually led to more interesting roleplay. Like, oh your shit decayed, so now you have to go seek out a PC dealer and re-up, yay more roleplay opportunity! Sadly that isn't how it usually works in game.

[Malken]

I don't like decay. If feels like instead of using our props to facilitate roleplay we're using our props force it. It shouldn't be an OOC hassle to represent parts of the game world.

Now instead of having props that that help make a scene or to explain my character, I have to fully commit playtime to the upkeep of that prop. This just pushes me away from wanting to make a character who is a spice addict.

This would all be fine if that actually led to more interesting roleplay. Like, oh your shit decayed, so now you have to go seek out a PC dealer and re-up, yay more roleplay opportunity! Sadly that isn't how it usually works in game.

If you're a spice addict, spice decay shouldn't affect you at all ;p

And it -does- lead to more interesting roleplay for those who are in the business of selling/buying spice.

Money sink is always a good thing, especially in a game like Armageddon where making money is ridiculously easy.

[James de Monet]

Am I the only one who thinks the decay rate is incredibly fast?

Maybe I'm doing something wrong, but some spice that was in a worn container (though not a spice specific one) has already changed descriptive words twice since the announcement (I'm not quite sure what they all mean yet), and my playtimes are not super high.  I have seen food that is many times as old not decay at all during that same period.

If I had to guess, I would say it went from normal to state 1 to state 2 in the space of about 3 RL hours played.

[sleepyhead]

Yeah I like the idea of decay but IMO it should be very slow, and right now it seems SUPER fast. The speed of the decay particularly hurts tribals who like to put things in communal spaces for everyone to share rather than hoarding spice on their person.

[ShaiHulud]

I'll go ahead and second what sleepyhead said. I like the idea, but it seems to decay faster than food. Even in my case and kit designed for spice.

[MatisseOrOtherwise]

Yeah, honestly like I've never known any drug IRL to decompose faster than food, except for if by "drug" you mean like, medicine that's a suspension injection thing where you have to mix it up and then inject it immediately. It should decay a slight bit slower than food in game.

[ShaiHulud]

I smoked a tube that looked normal, but turned rock-hard before the last puff..

[whitt]

I smoked a tube that looked normal, but turned rock-hard before the last puff..

giggity!

[Grogerif]

keep the speedy decay. Make it last twice as long, when injested.
Problem solved, everybody gets addicted.

[James de Monet]

I second that I like the idea of decay overall, but at the current rate I'm seeing, I think it reduces the ability to play some things, like: a casual spice hunter (getting 50 grains before the first ones decay could prove really difficult, unless I misunderstand the levels and how the states affect saleability), someone who uses many different types of spice but only in specific circumstances, someone who does not have regular access to a dealer (be it due to playtimes or role - if it takes RL days of time to contact a dealer, such people will never be able to throw a party with spice, because it will decay before the RPT), etc.

Also, I'm not aware of any spice specific containers available from NPCs in either Allanak (proper) or Red Storm, so it would seem to require a PC to track down Kurac ASAP, and disproportionately punish those who can't, both now and in the future.

my playtimes are not super high.

Had to double back for the unintended pun.

[Riev]

Spice has almost always been a "Flavor" item in the game, despite some having some serious coded advantages and disadvantages. Recently, staff have tried making it "easier" to obtain, they made it CHEAPER so people would be more open to it. Now they're adding the rot-code to it, which I think really fleshes out the idea of "I really need a pinch right now, oh man I better find someone". Unfortunately, people would rather a shiny new breastplate that protects just as well as their old breastplate but has the "shiny" keyword attached, than they would an on-demand stat-boost.

I'm down for making the effects last 90minutes/9 in game hours so that it goes from Dawn to Hunt, to Late at Night to come down. Let it rot, but make it more feasible.

[Fredd]

 Drugs go bad all the time.

But not like this. I'de like to see bad spice...Be bad for you. Make you sick.  Maybe bad tho gives you terradin. Bad krentakh makes you mul rage. ect.

[Bushranger]

I have not had a chance to thoroughly test the spice decay yet but there are two things that come to mind when reading it:

a casual spice hunter (getting 50 grains before the first ones decay could prove really difficult, unless I misunderstand the levels and how the states affect saleability)

I have played characters who were solely, or mostly, spice hunters and you can go RL days between being able to go out sifting again. You have 25 grains, you need 25 more, check the weather but it's too stormy around Red Storm to see anything. These storms, especially around Red Storm, can be too fierce to see for two or three days in a row (it might have some lulls that occur during the night but you still can't see to forage then) and if you're unlucky enough to log on only during these times you can go quite a while before you can sift more.

Also, I'm not aware of any spice specific containers available from NPCs in either Allanak (proper) or Red Storm, so it would seem to require a PC to track down Kurac ASAP, and disproportionately punish those who can't, both now and in the future.

Kron in the Kurac Warehouse has a leather spice pouch in his list of goods for sale. One. When that sells, to a pc or npc, you need to wait for another reboot. Perhaps someone could edit his merchant file and increase the number he has on offer until someone custom crafts a spice hunters bag?

My second concern is that 16 Zalanthan days is 24 hours. That seems awfully short and I fear will mean people no longer stash any spice in an apartment. It means it will become much rarer burglars breaking in to find some spice, or to plant some spice and call a Templar, as you would have to co-ordinate everything within a single day or the spice poofs. People will be logging out with their spice to preserve the timer on it. The Allanaki Vice Squad won't be able to search an apartment to find spice

I think increasing the decay time to about a Zalanthan month would ease a lot of things. If you only need to contact your dealer every two RL weeks you would be more comfortable leaving spice in your apartment and it would certainly give sifters plenty of time to grab up their allotment.

[sleepyhead]

A month would be great I think.

[ShaLeah]

I've had the same weed for years. Like 5 years. Is it as potent as it was back then? No. But I still have it and yes, it still gets me high.

I like spice decay but not in its current form. I would appreciate it so much more if it LOST potency instead. Drugs don't turn to dust, trust me and my 5yr old ganja.  Could we make the high last less time or even risk having little to NO effect if it's old depending on how old? My super rich spice addict nooble WANTS to buy that 12 year vintage off the street rat. Imagine the role-play possibilities if it's shit to smoke! Murder!

While you're at it, cure shelf life. Make it happen. So long days of people keeping the same pills in their pouches for IC years.

[Grapes]

Pills suddenly not working would shake things up to a much better degree than dying spice addicts because the spice doesn't last long enough to deliver... personally, I would think, not good. Poison cure decay can be good, but not if there's no indication of degree of rot, not if it's hastily implemented without thought of the required logistics to get a cure pouch.

That would mean, the rest of you would be entirely at my mercy if I decided to throw a knife, and that should not be a comforting thought.

EDIT: Yeah, make spice last a few years. As it stands it seems to rot almost immediately.

[stark]

The same day I read about the decaying spice, I actually found some spice (in a pouch somewhere) and thought, hm, this saves me a trip to get spice! A real life hour later, it was all oily, and the next real life day it was hard as a rock. That seems a little too quick, although getting TO spice isn't impossible, it would be VERY difficult if I was playing something like a dainty noble aide or a shy daisy of a crafter.

[MatisseOrOtherwise]

A few years defeats the purpose. I think maybe one year, or two months, would be a good time for it to last. One month maybe - that's, what, two IRL weeks? But two days is ridiculous. Not even cakes IRL decay that fast, let alone what is basically weed/etc.

[Molten Heart]

.

[TheHandmaid]

Two real life days is just going to encouragee me not to need or use it. I cannot play everyday and it would be unfair to hold other's responsible for its drying out due to my unavailability for delivery.

[Akariel]

If your spice is rotting within 24 hours, you bought shitty non-Kuraci spice and unfortunately that's what you get. Unrefined, grain forms of spice will not last excessively long. And yes, this may cause a problem with the Spice Buyer NPC - Which is why Nessalin removed the 50 grain minimum to sell to him. You no longer need to wait to have 50 spices in your pouch to sell.

A single grain of spice on the floor will last, on average, 24 RL hours. If you put it in a standard backpack it should last 42.75 RL days, on average. If you are noticing a discrepancy with that please send in a request to let us know.

A single -pinch- of spice, for reference, can last 126.375 RL days, on average, inside a non-specific container. That is almost half a year. The larger the amount of spice, the slower it decays. A brick of spice, for instance, can last 378 RL days, on average, inside a non-specific container. That is over a RL year.

If you are noticing inconsistencies, it's possible some of the math on our end is a bit faulty and needs to be looked into. Please send in a bug request so we can take a look into it.

[MatisseOrOtherwise]

If your spice is rotting within 24 hours, you bought shitty non-Kuraci spice and unfortunately that's what you get. Unrefined, grain forms of spice will not last excessively long. And yes, this may cause a problem with the Spice Buyer NPC - Which is why Nessalin removed the 50 grain minimum to sell to him. You no longer need to wait to have 50 spices in your pouch to sell.

A single grain of spice on the floor will last, on average, 24 RL hours. If you put it in a standard backpack it should last 42.75 RL days, on average. If you are noticing a discrepancy with that please send in a request to let us know.

A single -pinch- of spice, for reference, can last 126.375 RL days, on average, inside a non-specific container. That is almost half a year. The larger the amount of spice, the slower it decays. A brick of spice, for instance, can last 378 RL days, on average, inside a non-specific container. That is over a RL year.

If you are noticing inconsistencies, it's possible some of the math on our end is a bit faulty and needs to be looked into. Please send in a bug request so we can take a look into it.

Well, those are good, good numbers. I guess it's just been some inconsistencies right now, that hopefully folk who are running into them more frequently can slam out. Once that's done, I see no reason at all to consider this an issue at all. Thank you for taking the time to explain, and good luck to those bughunting!

[James de Monet]

Oh, yeah.  I'm way more comfortable with those numbers than I was with my extrapolations from what I was seeing (but again, it's hard to tell, since I haven't deciphered the states yet - I filed a bug report in case you want to verify what I'm seeing, Akariel).  Thanks for the reply.

Edit: typo

[manipura]

If your spice is rotting within 24 hours, you bought shitty non-Kuraci spice and unfortunately that's what you get.

A single grain of spice on the floor will last, on average, 24 RL hours. If you put it in a standard backpack it should last 42.75 RL days, on average. If you are noticing a discrepancy with that please send in a request to let us know.

A single -pinch- of spice, for reference, can last 126.375 RL days, on average, inside a non-specific container. That is almost half a year. The larger the amount of spice, the slower it decays. A brick of spice, for instance, can last 378 RL days, on average, inside a non-specific container. That is over a RL year.

If you are noticing inconsistencies, it's possible some of the math on our end is a bit faulty and needs to be looked into. Please send in a bug request so we can take a look into it.

I didn't log in over Thanksgiving when this change went active and I came back a day or two later to several pinches of spice, in a non-specific container, decayed to a point where they couldn't be used one way but could be used another.  I think this was the second level of decay, but I'm not sure.

On the one hand you say if your spice is decaying extremely quickly you bought shitty spice, on the other hand you're saying that maybe some of the math is off.

Two game weeks is vastly different from half a year.  How do we know the difference between "it's possible some of the math on our end is a bit faulty" and "you bought shitty non-Kuraci spice and that's what you get"?  Send in bug requests for all inconsistencies, I guess?