Cafe, More Venues, Stuff like that

[a french mans shirt]

the Kadian bar felt like a bar that everyone could go to, although this may partly stem from the integration into commoner society of noble society that Allanak does not have. Nobles up there felt free to sit with random, unknown commoners. Their presence in the same room as pc elves and rinthis is immediately noticed in Allanak.

consolidate to one single bar that can accommodate all tiers of society - different levels/entrances that have some semblance of cross-over. If nobles need something much nicer they can hit the Arboretum or Atrium.

Yes. This.

[Lizzie]

I don't remember the Kadian bar having more than one entrance. The Firestorm was 2 rooms west of what used to be the firepit, that was the only entrance.

I think one problem with Allanak, is that the center of trade is on one side of the city, while the center of congregation is on the other side of the city. This really makes no sense at all. But if you were to put them both on the same side, no one would ever go to the "other" side. That would also make no sense, from a design standpoint. So you really need to have a reason to go to either side of the city.

I think one possible solution, might be to simply shorten the round-time for movement within the bazaar. So you can get from the northeast corner of the market to the southwest corner in half the time it currently takes. And shorten the round-time movement on all the perimeter paths around the market as well. It doesn't have to be "elf-running" fast - but somewhat faster than it is now.

[BadSkeelz]

Is the Kadian Bar the Blue Vestric? I recall there being an entrance both from the Commons (West to East) and one from a road (south to north).

[manipura]

The Blue Vestric had two entrances. 
I think Lizzie was thinking of Firestorm, which had just the one entrance and wasn't just a couple rooms from the Sanctuary.

[Toofie]

Or we could expand the Gaj to have more rooms. One for whoever, one for fuckin' 'gicks, one for scummy scum, and a gambling room.

[evilcabbage]

yeah the blue vestric wasn't in tuluk, guys.

[LauraMars]

The Blue Vestric WAS in Tuluk. It was in the Red Sun Commons. The Kadian tavern was not the Blue Vestric, it was The Firestorm*, located in Freil's Rest, and it was closed. The bartender of The Firestorm went to bartend at the Vestric which I guess is why there might be some confusion. Gosh.

*I never liked the decision to remove it but all water under the burlap sack now I guess.

[BadSkeelz]

I didn't store on Tuluk, Tuluk stored on me

[650Booger]

just weighing in with a noobie opinion, that I think the number and variety of eateries/bars is pretty good.  each has a distinct purpose, in my view, and none should be changed or removed.  sorry to be a naysayer!

[Dunetrade55]

Screw that Kadian bartender, he kicked me out once for talking funny!... seriously though, I think it would be nice if the Gaj were moved closer to the Byn, the Merchant Houses, and the rinth. It's not supposed to be some upscale establishment and its current location doesn't really make much sense except it's closer to Red's. Personally, I'd rather the social tiers stay separated, there's a reason I cheered when the Atrium was reopened, keeps those tea-sipping socialites out of my gritty RP, unless I, you know, go sit in Red's or the Silver Ginka with the sole purpose of grossing them out by talking about poo and bugs. The power structure in Allanak is so freaking deadly that it's pretty undesirable to encounter an aide in the Gaj. You shouldn't just dump everyone together in the Gaj unless the social structure changes a good deal... that'd be a fricking slaughter, with a slew of senseless revenge-killings.

EDIT: Currently, its location seems only convenient to gemmers, if it were moved, then those gemmers would have to walk further for the opportunity to be ostracized, which, I get it would suck, but, comprimises.

[Ath]

My problem with moving it is that there is no realistic location to move it over that way.  It's a commoners bar, if anything it should be moved (if at all) closer to the Arena since it's theme is based on Gladiators and the Arena.

I do have a question though, if you were a commoner, where else would you go besides the Gaj?

[Riev]

Sometimes, if I'm not a 'rinthi or a dirt grebber, I'll go to Red's. Usually with the knowledge that I MIGHT run into a noble who might have me whipped for not bowing low ENOUGH (the floor is only so malleable!).

Unfortunately, there IS nowhere but the Gaj, as a "and the Gladiator" tavern, is so far removed from where much of its patronage might come from. Sure, the commoner's quarter is right there, but the majority of places that EMPLOY commoners are on the exact other side of the city.

Maybe like Tuluk did, have a commoner's bar set up in the Arena? Its a bit closer to... well.. everything. Vennant gets a job there, lets one of the waitresses pick up the slack at the Gaj. You can go to the Gaj, but "The Gladiator" tavern is now open for business with the same piss whiskey you've enjoyed for years.

[Ath]

I highly doubt there will be anything new added, it's already spread a bit thin.

[Miradus]

My problem with moving it is that there is no realistic location to move it over that way.  It's a commoners bar, if anything it should be moved (if at all) closer to the Arena since it's theme is based on Gladiators and the Arena.

I do have a question though, if you were a commoner, where else would you go besides the Gaj?

Perhaps a streetside eatery on some well-traveled avenue. Something without walls but maybe just a few stools clustered around the Armageddon equivalent of a food truck.

[Riev]

On an OOC level, most people tend to use the taverns as a "place I can idle where I can feel relatively safe from muggers and thieves".

A 'food' cart or 'general public' gathering area wouldn't go as well unless it had the Arm constantly patrolling.

As interesting as it would be, this is part of why previous attempts haven't gone well. The Gaj is nearly 100% safe, and if someone DOES try something while you're AFK/Idle, the soldiers are absolutely everywhere in a tavern. In some upstart public area? Its just asking for a bored serial killer to come by, or an arsonist to set your shiz on fire.

[Kankfly]

While I understand it from an IC perspective, it does seem to me that opening up more bars/clubs/drinking hole will spread the PC population even thinner, if they go to the new bar at all. From my current experience with the Gaj, it doesn't seem as busy as it was years ago (correct me if I'm wrong).

So, totally understanding what you are trying to get here, but right now there's the Gaj, Red's Retreat, the Oash bar, the Arboretum, and the Atrium tea sipping place. It just already feels divided to me.

[Ath]

I'm asking about existing, not new.

[Riev]

I'm asking about existing, not new.

Existing places where Commoners are allowed:
Gaj, Red's, Silver Ginka, Oash (and maybe the Atrium? I'm not fancy)

Folley, Mantis

So, up to 7 "public meeting hangouts" that all possibly cater to the majority of the citizens of the city/PC base.

[John]

My problem with moving it is that there is no realistic location to move it over that way.  It's a commoners bar, if anything it should be moved (if at all) closer to the Arena since it's theme is based on Gladiators and the Arena.

I do have a question though, if you were a commoner, where else would you go besides the Gaj?

A "safe" 'rinthi bar that didn't involve traipsing all the way through the 'rinth to get to. In order to enhance the "corrupt" militia you could even have off-duty soldiers in there who don't react to crime code. It could be done with existing venues by adding a new path to the location.

[Lizzie]

Hardened mercenaries (the Byn) whose back wall abuts the Screaming Mantis bar, really screams for the Screaming Mantis to be a hardened mercenary bar. Something on the order of:

"Okay Flaming Fist-Gortok-Shitcloaks, you can go into the Mantis, but you can't go out the back way into the Rinth. If you try, JimBob the Rinthi elf with max shiv will max shivify your face. If you manage to slip past him and I find out, *I* will max-shivify your face."

And open a doorway from the outside entry of the Byn compound, into the Screaming Mantis bar. Let the Bynners take turns on Tavern-Watch, Kurac-style, for the mutual benefit of the Rinthis and whoever else is typically found in there. Make it still considered "a place where you won't find templars or Allanak soldiers" but equally still a place where rinthis will cut you if they catch you fucking up.

[Marauder Moe]

So what I've noticed over my last few characters (last few years) is that it generally doesn't even occur to many players that other spaces besides taverns can be used for gathering and roleplaying.  

I had tried, to varying degrees of success, to popularize certain spots simply by idling there myself.

A significant problem is people speedwalking.  Even ones who knew/liked my character would just breeze past.

People sit in taverns without buying drinks/food, so surely that's not a REQUIREMENT for a gathering space, is it?  

The only coded thing that made some locations awkward was lack of seating where everyone could talk.  I'd like to see a lot of individual bench objects aggregated into "a group of benches" so you can have 6-8+ people all take part in the same conversation.  Or maybe for places smaller than taverns, somehow script "talk" to echo to the whole room.

[a french mans shirt]

I'd like a low-class restaurant for non-elves.

Somewhere where they don't serve ale so people don't go be idle there and get spread thin, but somewhere you might want to rp in for an hour, getting your cheap soul food and all that, having your I-want-my-spice meeting.

[a french mans shirt]

I think part of it is I'm interested in gaspies being coded and actually becoming known to people as an allanaki thing for those who don't visit the arbotoreum and read the one mdesc of the one food.

[Feco]

+1 for The Mantis being accessible to everyone.  This would vastly improve the Labyrinth as a place to play, and would make Labyrinth-Other interactions less... awkward.

- Gaj would probably still be the main hub for commoners.  It's close to stables.  Newbs pop there.  No one can really stab you there (and get away with it).  This last point is important -- a brawl can't end in a killing, right there in the bar.  People like to not die.
- Bynners and people looking for trouble will go to the Mantis, at least sometimes.  The occasional killing there will probably keep people from just making it the new Gaj.
- Rinth characters are often lonely and have to go to the Gaj for some interaction.  Or they go to try and stir up trouble.  Now that the Mantis is populated, or at least, Rinthis know that people looking for trouble will go there, they'll go to the Mantis instead.  Rinthis in the Gaj always strikes me as really strange, but it's sort of necessary the way things are set up.
- Elf and Human rinthis still have other places to congregate away from non-rinthies, if they need to cause some REAL trouble.


There still needs to be a shitty little alley that leads to the Mantis, though, to maintain some separation from Allanak proper.  It just shouldn't be a maze, and it shouldn't have NPCs in it looking to fucking chop you up.  It should be crim-code free, though, so that soldiers don't feel like they're allowed to go patrol it or some shit.

I REALLY like this idea.  A lot.

[a french mans shirt]

I haven't played a rinthi in years, so now that Feco's explained it I kind of like the idea.

Humans and elves do go on the opposite sides of the rinth as refugees or troublemakers... I want to see what happens once the Jaxa Pah gets set back up again. What will be the policy? Will the elves designate the Mantis as a gateway area between the rinth and southside or will they send patrols to rough up human southsiders they find? Which policy do you think would be best? I'm under the impression that staff do intend to open an elf clan at some point and I'm guessing they'll just re-open the Jaxa Pah.