Out of Character and you... the grey of grey areas.

[Dunetrade55]

I stopped reading after the archer scenario. I'd long had my suspicions about that player gaming things OOCly and have sent in complaints before, I know others have as well. Players are going to talk OOCly, like it or not, but some offenses are far worse than others. I wanted to thank staff for the plot they spawned to deal with the matter, I think it was excellent, appropriate, and made the virtual environment a real component to remind players, hey, it's more than just an armload of people playing a text game on the internet, it's a real world. My only complaint was it was allowed to fester for so long, but, I have to recognize that staff cannot act without some serious proof. I won't go into my personal experiences in this matter, staff is already aware of them and it's really not productive for me to whine about the rotten eggs I and some others had been served by another player. I honestly hope they grow out of the need to win Armageddon and start playing the game for the quality RP... which means being vulnerable or sometimes horribly abused, as I've been taught many, many times.

As far as the merchant house scenario, I was in there for the beginning of it, at least in the b and c involvement, and nothing aroused my suspicion of OOC collusion, as it seemed to slowly evolve over the course of various events and interactions, along with external circumstances. When the cave incident popped up, it was more crucial than ever to cement ties firmly, and I was trying to butt into the negotiations and shove them another way. I did find it interesting that one of the other players seemed to have a concept similar to mine in appearance, and slightly less-so in mindset, but I chalked it up to simply, there's only so many good ideas out there and sometimes two people simultaneously think the same thing. It looked completely legit to me, but staff says it's verified and I doubt they'd take such a strong stance if it weren't.

I mean, even if someone in this arrangement were OOCly colluding, my limited experience with it before I got stored gave me the idea it was straight up legit. Shocking to find out somewhere it wasn't.

[Armaddict]

I'm starting to feel like staff feels penned in to being hyperjudgmental and wield the hammer of thor's suspected justice purely off of the amount of shit they seem to hear about how unfair the game is and how they shouldn't die to random things or npc's or enemies they didn't know they had or suddenly.  Every death needs to be a spielberg movie, with them as a main character.  There's nothing wrong with verification and fixing problems, but some of these reactions from other players are ridiculous.

If you're going to twist every game-mechanic and hypothetical into why someone else is bad and you're good, I'm not sure how you got into this game in the first place.  There's a lot of shitty death on zalanthas, this is a pretty ruthless world, and a pretty ruthless game.  Imperfect in many ways, but some imperfections are in your favor, and some are not.

The 'playing to win' statement is old, and one that really only becomes applicable if you, too, are in the same mindset (i.e. You're playing to survive and tell a story; so are they.  The idea that their story went on and yours didn't makes you feel cheated.  No one is out there chuckling and making notches in their belt like they're the fucking highlander.)  No person truly set on a good story sees a story come to fruition and says 'That asshole was playing to win'; That's something that only comes about when it's -your- story that is important, which puts you in the same boat as everyone else, albeit perhaps less willing to have your character be mean in order to make sure they survive.  Which is...what people do, when it's hard to survive.

Anyway, edited my previous post to further explain why some of the responses are through tinted glasses in my opinion, but reaffirming that -this- is how I like to see things dealt with.  Make the game world react properly, with the caveat that it doesn't have to be an all out unstoppable punishment, but it does have to be a sudden moment of 'oh shit, right.  I got seen by VNPC's' or 'Oh.  Right.  Even though they're my soldier, that's causing a headache for other people who I'll have to fend off.'

[Synthesis]

There are some folks who will never be agreeable to any exertion of authority.

I suspect they are split into three camps:

1) The shitheads who are doing shitty things and want to keep getting away with it.
2) The victims of injustice who were accused of being shitty once, when they weren't, and now hold a permanent grudge against any accusations of shittiness.  (This group includes those who received a punishment that was disproportionate to their offense.)
3) The self-righteously naive, who know they themselves only do good things, and naively believe that everyone else is only doing good things, and that it naturally follows that all accusations of shittiness are unwarranted.

If you find yourself arguing about who should be punished for what with one of the above types, you aren't going to get anywhere.

[SuchDragonWow]

The 'playing to win' statement is old, and one that really only becomes applicable if you, too, are in the same mindset (i.e. You're playing to survive and tell a story; so are they.

I'm pretty sure he's referencing me, there.  During one of his prolific hate rants on his private Arm forum, he accused me of colluding with the player of Amos to kill his character, and that I only play to win the game.  Okely dokely, neighbor.

If it's true that Malik logged in to save Amos, I think that's unfortunate.  I think highly of both as roleplayers.  I wouldn't suspect them of something that cheesy.  I'm not really sure I believe it, but we all see different sides of each other.  I have heard that people do that, log in to save a friend from dying.  It seems a little shameless, to me.

You know, something happened to my IC situation a few months ago that made me suspect some OOC or meta-think was involved, and I was angry about it, at the time, sure.  But I moved on with my life, and it's pretty super to just let go, once in awhile.  This is supposed to be a game.  I can't believe we're talking about hiring enforcers or recruiting snitches.  What the fuck?

Maybe I'm #3 on Synthesis' list

[Ath]

So I think it's time to close this one. A lot of people have spoken up, given feedback, and some emotions have raised. The main thing to take away from this is that this shit does happen, intentionally and unintentionally. Any of you can report it via a complaint if you think it is happening. I will say that maybe staff can take some of the feedback here to approach situations differently, but we will still enforce the rules as we've written them.

All the feedback is greatly appreciated and I can see a few bits that I find useful. Thank you all for speaking up, even if others may not have are with you.