Idea: Waiting and RL matchups hindering plots

[The Lonely Hunter]

Very often I find myself playing a PC who ends up waiting for another player to log in to get something from them. For example right now my PC is waiting for another PC for something. There is another PC waiting on my PC and in turn another PC waiting on them. This causes a bottleneck in advancing plots and now we have several people in a state of stagnation. When we aren't logged in our character doesn't vanish, they are assumed to be doing virtual tasks. Not having matching playtimes is an OOC limitation and I propose an idea to help remove some of the limitations that the pesky RL puts up.

This can be done at a Nenyuk bank or with some new sort of NPC.

The NPC is here tending some shelves.

Give large.bag regular.man

The NPC says, "Who is that for?

tell npc Amos.tall (You must use at least 2 keywords, perhaps one being the true 'name' to help avoid mixups.)

The NPC says, "Alright, I'll hold it for them. That will be X coins when they pick it up."

Amos goes to the NPC and types list
#1 A large bag is waiting for you for 100 coins
Amos types buy #1

Amos can leave another bag in return for the PC (payment or whatever).

The NPC can check the packs like the gate guards do if needed.

Maybe this can be done better with a completely different method but I think that the idea holds true no matter what platform it might use.

[Dar]

Can't you delegate, use other PCs to do this?

This can be abused to store stuff indefinitely, though I guess time limits can be made.

I still think that better solutions to this is to involve other players.

[The Lonely Hunter]

Other PCs are always the preference but not always feasible. Over the years I've had enough situations end up putting the brakes on things that caused me to have this idea.

[Narf]

Can't you delegate, use other PCs to do this?

This can be abused to store stuff indefinitely, though I guess time limits can be made.

I still think that better solutions to this is to involve other players.

This "solution" just moves the problem horizontally. Instead of waiting for players A and B to meet, the plot now can't advance until Players B and C meet. On average there won't be a time savings with that.

You'll get the biggest bang for your buck if you have one side of the equation available constantly. Personally, when I ran into this problem we used the bury code.

[Is Friday]

I agree this is a problem. Not sure if this is the right solution. Kudos for pitching the idea.

[Reiloth]

I think being able to receive way messages while offline would go a long way in helping leaders move plots forward.

[The Warshaper]

I think being able to receive way messages while offline would go a long way in helping leaders move plots forward.

Sort of an amazing idea here. Quick someone list some cons before I get way to excited for it.

[Reiloth]

I think being able to receive way messages while offline would go a long way in helping leaders move plots forward.

Sort of an amazing idea here. Quick someone list some cons before I get way to excited for it.

Only cons I can think of are "This guy is killing me please kill him later". But I dunno a way around that.

[Dunetrade55]

I think being able to receive way messages while offline would go a long way in helping leaders move plots forward.

OMG THIS!

Also would sort of hinder those awkward moments where you got righteous vengeance for a dead best friend or lover and it turns out they just had a change of schedule for a month. It's absolutely cringe-worthy the next time you see that PC and they're like, "So um, what happened to all our other friends?"

[Reiloth]

Other Cons:

*Merchants in GMH getting orders placed through them, turning it even more into a vending machine job.

Solution:

If you log out while barriered, you don't receive messages while offline.

[Reiloth]

TBH...I don't really like the Way idea. The ambiguity of 'is this person alive or just busy?' would be lost with offline messages, unless the Way worked differently which it doesn't. (You have to make contact with a person and then Psi them, so if they are dead, you won't be able to find their mind to send the message.) What I mean with working differently is 'psi <name> <message>', which just isn't how it works.

Instead, if you could leave messages for people, say Bartenders and Noble Gate Guards, you could still pass along messages and check messages in this fashion.

Why would leaving messages be an important step towards helping leaders and plots moving forward? Because simply put, a lot of plotting is waiting for timezones / playtimes to match up before you can move from step A to B, and when there is lots of back and forth on each step, you end up spending a month just getting a plot off the ground. Being able to leave a message along the lines of "This all sounds good, but these are my modifications/requests, you can go forward with it after that" would just kick things into motion. Waiting for that 'OK, Go for it' message for a week can be a buzzkill for a plot.

It could also help leaders by reducing pedantic Way messages and 'catch up' that you do sometimes for 20-30 minutes logging in. If people could/would leave messages with gate guards/bartenders/whatever, then you could get the gist of it and not need to have a way conversation. Imagine if a list of potential Runners gave their name at the Byn Gates, so the Sergeant could follow up with them at their leisure/when it suited them. I dunno, just riffing.

[Dunetrade55]

TBH...I don't really like the Way idea. The ambiguity of 'is this person alive or just busy?' would be lost with offline messages, unless the Way worked differently which it doesn't. (You have to make contact with a person and then Psi them, so if they are dead, you won't be able to find their mind to send the message.) What I mean with working differently is 'psi <name> <message>', which just isn't how it works.

Instead, if you could leave messages for people, say Bartenders and Noble Gate Guards, you could still pass along messages and check messages in this fashion.

Why would leaving messages be an important step towards helping leaders and plots moving forward? Because simply put, a lot of plotting is waiting for timezones / playtimes to match up before you can move from step A to B, and when there is lots of back and forth on each step, you end up spending a month just getting a plot off the ground. Being able to leave a message along the lines of "This all sounds good, but these are my modifications/requests, you can go forward with it after that" would just kick things into motion. Waiting for that 'OK, Go for it' message for a week can be a buzzkill for a plot.

It could also help leaders by reducing pedantic Way messages and 'catch up' that you do sometimes for 20-30 minutes logging in. If people could/would leave messages with gate guards/bartenders/whatever, then you could get the gist of it and not need to have a way conversation. Imagine if a list of potential Runners gave their name at the Byn Gates, so the Sergeant could follow up with them at their leisure/when it suited them. I dunno, just riffing.

Actually, that's better, and could actually make the beginnings of a Merchant House making use of R/W Cavilish and taking coins on each side of the exchange.

Excepting the moderately-sized coin pouch, the obese, bearded man says, in pompous accented sirihish, "Why yes, Amos, there /is/ a message for you."

After clearing his throat, and pulling a small paper out of a filing box, the obese bearded man says, iin pompous-accented sirihish, "Ah, here we go. Derpina says she's leaving you for Kadius's First Hunter, and she never wants to see your ugly face again."

[Samoa]

When you do this, you cut out any and all opportunity for anyone to learn of your plans and details. Just because you think they may be insignificant, does not mean they are insignificant to the third parties and their employers. Any and all communication should be, at minimum, mirrored in-game, online.

[Molten Heart]

.

[nauta]

When you do this, you cut out any and all opportunity for anyone to learn of your plans and details. Just because you think they may be insignificant, does not mean they are insignificant to the third parties and their employers. Any and all communication should be, at minimum, mirrored in-game, online.

I've gotta agree with this sentiment.  I've had plenty of times, like OP, where you need to get package A to person P, but you and P never overlap (or rarely).  So I can sympathize.

But I'm also of the view that we should open ourselves up to the risk involved in letting other PCs into our plots.  

So, suppose you need to deliver a knot of spice to Lord Puffleknees and you can't ever catch Lord Puffleknees on-line.  I would rather encourage people to open themselves up to the risk of hiring some random nobody to deliver the spice -- or, heck, hire the T'zai Byn.

If the in-between you hire dies and Lord Puffleknees gets pissed: new plot!

If the in-between steals the spice: new plot!

If the in-between gets caught with the spice: new plot!

[Reiloth]

True, those are good points. Risk minimization via message delivery is indeed a potential problem. But one could say that, with the exception of Mindworms, passing messages through the Way is 100% fault proof as well. I would think having the messages delivered in a remote spot, as someone above said could mean staking out these messenger spots to overhear rumors/gossip. It would be given in a public place (Like the bar) so the Bartender would just say it out loud, not message you over the Way. If it was something sensitive, maybe it would just be 'Soandso said to look for them, they had something important to talk about'. Or they might talk in code, 'Soandso said meet them by the tree that has birds that squeak, not squawk.'

The package delivery, I agree, would be a little too much risk aversion. But passing messages, I don't agree. I think with the prevalence of the Unseen Way, messages can be delivered (when convenient) with 100% secrecy. So providing a means for messages to be delivered via say/tell rather than the way just opens up more opportunities for plotting, not less.

[Molten Heart]

.

[Reiloth]

I think a coded delivery system would enhance the game and player interaction more than it'd take away. Merchant house merchants would actually do much more business this way if they could ensure delivery without having to line up play times.

There are better things to do than wait around for others in game, especially if they may never be found. The accumulated benefits of those things players did will greatly outweigh the loss of interaction of finding some other PC to help make the connection.

I tend to agree. Actually I didn't think about 'What if Merchants could fill orders and people could just pick them up/buy them from an NPC?'

[Desertman]

Hire a good assistant, or two if you need two.

Not only is this not needed, I think it would be terrible for the game.

[Samoa]

I agree with Desertman. This would not be long-term beneficial; I'm afraid I can't provide refutation to some of the counterpoints for various reasons, but this is what aides and assistants and junior merchants are for.

[Reiloth]

Fair enough. Good debates (and reaching conclusions that are beneficial to both sides) usually requires some effort though. I'm interested to hear why, rather than just cuz.

[Dunetrade55]

Fair enough. Good debates (and reaching conclusions that are beneficial to both sides) usually requires some effort though. I'm interested to hear why, rather than just cuz.

While I like the idea, I can kind of see how it'd unbalance things into making PCs seem like an even more disposable commodity than they already are, which is pretty damn disposable. It is a fair counterpoint.

[Reiloth]

Fair enough. Though I fail to see what makes a Merchant more of a disposable commodity -- Treating them like a vending machine, or allowing them to turn the ordering/selling of items into an actual vending machine.

Honestly, when I played an Agent in Kurac, I didn't have to do much ordering/selling, but I still got roped into it when Merchants weren't around. I was still Trade Ops, after all. And it was annoying as fuck. The better part of the role was the politicking and behind the scenes shit, and generally just being a Kuraci.

So I can only feel worse for people who have to craft/do orders for real, and probably for the same group of people that want to play dress up.

[Dar]

In my experience, if people are connected enough (usually in the same clan), they're able to use their sub forums or PMs to transmit simple messages such as, "Soandso needs to speak with you", or "suchandsuch was left in your footlocker".  So I can envision an NPC giving out stock messages like that. But no more. Anything custom, or complicated, and you really should involve other PCs to do your bidding.

[Reiloth]

In my experience, if people are connected enough (usually in the same clan), they're able to use their sub forums or PMs to transmit simple messages such as, "Soandso needs to speak with you", or "suchandsuch was left in your footlocker".  So I can envision an NPC giving out stock messages like that. But no more. Anything custom, or complicated, and you really should involve other PCs to do your bidding.

True. What about tribes, or non-clans though? PMs suffice, but it begins to feel like a meta-game there as well.