Magick Code Suggestions.

[Asmoth]

Another thing that might be worth looking into... Perhaps eliminate some spells in favor of traits or perks to the class.

So say I learn a spell that's a utility based spell help me do X thing.

Instead of leaving it a spell and effect, why not have it where the mage has grown in power and just can do X spooky thing.

Like some of our status effects that spells currently give, but a few that are so simple, so basic in the scheme of thing that magickers develop the talent over time.

One that comes to mind is one that has to do with objects every magicker gets.  Due to the utility of that spell and it's awkward way it works, it honestly isn't worth being a castable spell.

[Majikal]

Which if you are actually doing anything besides pure grinding your tinkerbell Mage, you are falling behind the "twinks" and just those who get luckier with the rolls.

In the old system? Yes. Very much so.
With the new subguilds? No. At least as far as spell-flinging goes.

I think the mage system is heading in a more balanced direction, it needs less governing imo and provides some interesting posibilities for character concepts. Personally, they don't interest ME as much as they used to but I'm a dirty gick-lover and like seeing that big spell list. Overall though, I like the direction it's headed.

[lostinspace]

Personally, they don't interest ME as much as they used to but I'm a dirty gick-lover and like seeing that big spell list. Overall though, I like the direction it's headed.

Same here, I can't even think up a magick subguild concept that I would like to play. Every time I start I think, "oh spell x would also be great... oh, nevermind.", and that's the end of it. I love playing strictly magic type characters, but at least a few people are enjoying the new changes, right?

[Asmoth]

Having played with new and old mages, currently, I have to say I would switch glass canon for a tank that shoots fireballs.

[Hauwke]

Here is what it looks like to me:

Old system: Imma spend a couple days twinking and then shoot dumb fucks in the face wiv mah fiahballs!!!


New system: I am gonna spend some days twinking for fireballs and then join some sparring clan to make my krathi ranger the ultimate beastly beast of beasts!


Tl;dr pretty much the same except now you can also swing a sword.

[Lizzie]

Here is what it looks like to me:

Old system: Imma spend a couple days twinking and then shoot dumb fucks in the face wiv mah fiahballs!!!


New system: I am gonna spend some days twinking for fireballs and then join some sparring clan to make my krathi ranger the ultimate beastly beast of beasts!


Tl;dr pretty much the same except now you can also swing a sword.

Not even almost pretty much the same, because this:
join some sparring clan...

and never use your magicks in your clan, ever, because if you get caught you get PKed or gemmed, and definitely tossed out of the clan (unless you join Oash, which isn't a sparring clan).

[Armaddict]

My suggestion would be to bring back nilazis as full mages.  Bring back the 4 basic elements as full mages.  Make them all high-karma, so that they are rare-as-fuck.

Cap off the new subguilds not by skill, but by power.  Een or something.  Their spells are less powerful, but give them a skill called 'armed casting' that allows them to cast with a weapon in hand as an implement.  They don't need hands free, but they're less powerful by far.  Don't give these subguilds any of the true-disable spells such as sleep, paralyzation, etc.

I have not played a mage in some time, so if this is absolutely retarded, forgive me.  But I'm going completely off of theorycraft in my head.

[Jihelu]

My suggestion would be to bring back nilazis as full mages.  Bring back the 4 basic elements as full mages.  Make them all high-karma, so that they are rare-as-fuck.

Cap off the new subguilds not by skill, but by power.  Een or something.  Their spells are less powerful, but give them a skill called 'armed casting' that allows them to cast with a weapon in hand as an implement.  They don't need hands free, but they're less powerful by far.  Don't give these subguilds any of the true-disable spells such as sleep, paralyzation, etc.

I have not played a mage in some time, so if this is absolutely retarded, forgive me.  But I'm going completely off of theorycraft in my head.

You can cast with things in your hands, as I'm sure you know, if you have some special...well you'll figure it out.

[Armaddict]

My last mage was a long time ago.  I couldn't cast with things in my hands.

So my entire idea is outdated and you should ignore it!  XD

[Jihelu]

My last mage was a long time ago.  I couldn't cast with things in my hands.

So my entire idea is outdated and you should ignore it!  XD

You still can't but uh, certain items let you.
Lets just stop at that!

[Armaddict]

Deal.

Can you input on whether that sort of idea has any merit or whether it's just altogether meh, from the mage pov?

[Jihelu]

I'm confused on the question but I think this is the answer?


If you are a mage that wants to combat people and still cast the method of doing so is pretty alright.
That being said it may not be, talk to your local templarate.

[Lizzie]

Randomize. This could even work for all guilds and subguilds, or any that the staff want it to work with.

General idea, with Ruk "power-combat" subguild as the example:

This Rukkian will get all the necessary combat-based spells to function as a combat-based mage. If they want protective/defensive abilities they'd have to make that a priority when picking a main guild.

BUT - they would ALSO get up to 6 random spells added - maybe they'd come with one out of the starting six, and the other 5 would show up in branches. These other six could be any of the first or second-tier spells of ANY element other than nilaz. It wouldn't even show up on a specific schedule or after a specific spell is ready to branch. The code would be something like...

Call random 6(whir AND/OR elk AND/OR drov AND/OR viv AND/OR krath) "SpellX1, SpellX2, SpellX3, SpellX4, SpellX5, SpellX6."

If any of first 6 spells have gotten to een, chance of branching SpellX1 = 90%. Chance of branching SpellX2 = 70% etc.
If three of the first 6 spells have gotten to pav, and SpellX1 is already branched, then SpellX2 is at a 90% branch rate, SpellX3's pop rate increases, etc. etc.
If all of the first starting spells are at pav or better, then the increase increases further.
Once a mage has branched the entire skill tree, even if the last four spells are only available at wek, the chance of branching all six of the SpellX spells increase to 90%.

This way, it's POSSIBLE for a mage to pop all 6 of the extra spells right away (or maybe only 3 at the first tier, 2 at the second tier, and the last tier would unlock only when the caster has branched at least one spell on the third tier), but very unlikely. Plus, the player would have zero way of knowing which of the spells would branch, because it's totally random.

I think adding a new random "bonus points" factor to the subguilds would make them more attractive. It returns a lot of the mystery of magicks back to the game. It's make it scarier for non-mages to see, and more exciting for the mage's player to experience.

[Jihelu]

Giving, say a Ruk, straight Vivaduan spells would be strange, even from what I understand about magick lore.
Especially if they would give off the same cantrip.
So you like, do that Ruk thing that ruks do when they cast...and water pops out?
That'd be strange.


This idea, while I think it is nice, I don't think it fits in with the idea of elementalists in Arm. I do like the spell branching idea, just not the idea of random spells. Maybe from the same elemental guild.

THIS IDEA HOWEVER would be good for some crazy ass like, 'quasi' elemental. Not elkros but like, a strange 'inbetween' class that gets random spells at gen with random branching. Their cantrips being almost wildly violent or even actually having a coded effect on the world, same with their passive cantrips.
Maybe their connection to whatever elemental plane is so fucked it switches or is in several places at once, so they can have the wind at their hair and the earth shaking. Maybe someone could roleplay it that their elements don't like each other as well, so when someone casts for fire they can't (Icly) cast water for a bit.
Thats where I would see something like that.

I don't really like my own idea of 'lets give a class random as hell spells' because I guess you have sorcerer for that, given it isn't random, but I kinda do at the same time.

[Lizzie]

Giving, say a Ruk, straight Vivaduan spells would be strange, even from what I understand about magick lore.
Especially if they would give off the same cantrip.
So you like, do that Ruk thing that ruks do when they cast...and water pops out?
That'd be strange.


This idea, while I think it is nice, I don't think it fits in with the idea of elementalists in Arm. I do like the spell branching idea, just not the idea of random spells. Maybe from the same elemental guild.

THIS IDEA HOWEVER would be good for some crazy ass like, 'quasi' elemental. Not elkros but like, a strange 'inbetween' class that gets random spells at gen with random branching. Their cantrips being almost wildly violent or even actually having a coded effect on the world, same with their passive cantrips.
Maybe their connection to whatever elemental plane is so fucked it switches or is in several places at once, so they can have the wind at their hair and the earth shaking. Maybe someone could roleplay it that their elements don't like each other as well, so when someone casts for fire they can't (Icly) cast water for a bit.
Thats where I would see something like that.

I don't really like my own idea of 'lets give a class random as hell spells' because I guess you have sorcerer for that, given it isn't random, but I kinda do at the same time.

Prior to the switch from main to sub, all elemental lists came with spells that had nothing to do with their own element. All of them. It's not far-fetched, it was also an aspect of functionality. Each spell had to come from somewhere. The results weren't necessarily the same, or perhaps one elementalist might need a component to cast the spell while someone harnessing a different element would not need a component for the same spell. There was at least one nilaz and one rukkian spell on every single main-guild mage spell list.

There was also a very strange, but very plausible IC explanation for how this was possible, that had to do with the concept of "magick" being the overall term for the power-source that creates each of the elements.

[Lizzie]

My suggestion could be better honed in too - it's flexible. The old docs about magick (I haven't looked at the new ones) said that certain elements "got along" with certain others, and were diametrically opposed to certain others. So for instance - light is the antithesis to dark therefore drov + krath = cancel each other out and therefore not a good pairing.

So for the random 6 (or 4, or 2, or 3 - I'm not married to 6), they'd be random spells that only come from "cooperative" elements. Whira might pop a couple elkros and a couple rukkian spells. Krath might branch anything except for vivadu. Vivadu would add anything except krath. And so on.

[Jihelu]

I always assumed it was just: You were borrowing the words, not necessarily the element.
I recall all guilds but a certain one, not nilazi, had nilazi as a spell word for a certain spell and still do.
That doesn't mean they are conjuring anything from Nilaz/using its energy, or atleast I hope so, but they are just casting the spell.


But then again, me using that logic means that they could simply have random spells as well (so like your idea)
Idk.
I suppose it's just a matter of opinion on what the best system is. I would personally be fine with any change mentioned in our last few posts.


"So for the random 6 (or 4, or 2, or 3 - I'm not married to 6), they'd be random spells that only come from "cooperative" elements. Whira might pop a couple elkros and a couple rukkian spells. Krath might branch anything except for vivadu. Vivadu would add anything except krath. And so on."
If such a thing were to happen, that would be how i do it.
Maybe even a number.
Say you're playing a krathis or something.
You get like..
1 earth spell
2 wind ones
Etc.
And thats generally the same throughout all of them.
Though a whiran might get.
No earth spells
1 water
2 krathis
etc

[Dresan]

My only problem with the magicker sub-guilds are that someone playing a vivudian corruptor needs to find a viv/ruk creator in order to be able to use their spells in a combat situation without it feeling like twinking/suicide.

Really wish that would be changed.

[Jihelu]

My only problem with the magicker sub-guilds are that someone playing a vivudian corruptor needs to find a viv/ruk creator in order to be able to use their spells in a combat situation without it feeling like twinking/suicide.

Really wish that would be changed.

You could just go warrior and cast while in battle.
But for those who aren't...well Idk.

[Clavis]

i just want my full gickers back. Cause with the new subguilds lancer, berserker, agressor, what not you can be a gicky with mundane fighting abilities, crafting, riding... blah blah whatever. just my opinion.

[Lizzie]

i just want my full gickers back. Cause with the new subguilds lancer, berserker, agressor, what not you can be a gicky with mundane fighting abilities, crafting, riding... blah blah whatever. just my opinion.

Yup. Plus the level of guild-sniffing is even WORSE now than it was before.

look west
>The Temple of Vivadu
Some NPCs are here
A newly-minted gemmer is here.

think Oh awesome I need a healer for my crew!
Upon entering the temple:
Hey gemmer I need a healer.
"I might be able to do that, but I'm not sure."

(ooc think: So is he RPing being new to magick, or does he not have the heal spell on his skills list, or is it something that might branch for him and he just doesn't have it yet?)

The IC guessing game to find out the OOC information you need to know ensues.

Same with all the other elements. If your character needs specific things from specific gemmers, you have to ask them specifically and the only way you can be sure they do, is if they say they have it at the present time. If it's something that will branch eventually, or something that will never branch, you won't know which it is unless you start guild-sniffing.

Makes me want to just go OOC and ask flat out: "WHICH subguild are you dood?"

[Beethoven]

I love the subguilds but I do miss the old options. I'd be content with bringing back Nilazi, though. I'd never complain again. 

I seriously had a sinking feeling in my gut when I heard Nilazi were gone.

[Jihelu]

I think I've said this in ts or on skype or something.
But like.
I wish you picked a 'guild frame' and then could add/upgrade skills you wanted better.

One of the examples for this was like.
"I wish I could have higher haggle on a burglar"
Or
"I wish I could get rid of poison and get something else"

I feel like this would be better for magick guilds, though I suppose if they were still main guild, as well.


"think Oh awesome I need a healer for my crew!
Upon entering the temple:
Hey gemmer I need a healer.
"I might be able to do that, but I'm not sure.""
In that scenario I would say it is up for the gemmer to react to the world.
"Why the fuck does this person want me to use MAGICK on them?"
"Are they going to just kill me?
"I'm just going to be some stupid tool aren't I?"
Shit like that.
Though if your character is into that sorta thing/has no ways of making coin it could work ic.

For the whole 'guessing what they can do ic' thing I do agree that it is tedious and it sucks and I wish there was some fancy way of doing it.
"Hey heal me water mage"
Water mage: "I can't"
"Why the fuck not?"

The correct answer from the water mage should be something like "Vivadu hates me" or something.