The Cold and Damaging Yourself

[TheWanderer]

I'm not saying I'm smart or anything - quite the contrary - but from what I vaguely recall from third grade science, don't deserts get extremely cold at night? It's due to their inability to trap the heat in vegetation and cloud cover... or something.

After a quick search on the trusty internet, they usually drop to somewhere between 5-10 degrees °C (or 40-50 degrees °F). Is there a reason our many deserts don't get that teeth-chatteringly cold? Magick? The atmosphere which allows for things like giant bugs?

As a secondary topic introduced into this thread solely because I'm lazy, can there be a coded way to damage myself? In small increments preferably, like 5-10 hitpoints. For example, as though actually entering the command, "damage self."

[Lizzie]

1. Zalanthas isn't the planet earth, or even remotely close to the same size planet.
2. Zalanthas doesn't exist in the same solar system; the sun is a different sun, and Zalanthas is a different distance from it.
3. Zalanthas's climate doesn't depend on the same moon and in fact depends on THREE moons.
4. Zalanthas's entire climate and eco-system revolves around magick that can be manipulated by people.
5. It's a fantasy game, not science fiction.
6. Magick
7. It's not supposed to be realistic; see #5.

[IAmJacksOpinion]

During colder periods of the year, night-time temperatures can drop to freezing or below due to the exceptional radiation loss under the clear skies. However, very rarely do temperatures drop far below freezing.

Source link: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Desert_climate

There's also a neato graph which shows average temperatures by month for an area in North Africa, which is probably the closest you're going to get to Zalanthas on planet earth.

But, it looks like an average nighttime in January is like 40 degrees F, versus like 70 degrees F in July. Maybe it's the Wisconsinite in me speaking, but 40 degrees is t-shirt weather dude. It's uncomfortable, but you're not in any real danger. So sit back, relax, and drink another sixer of Spotted Cow.

[nauta]

I wouldn't mind an answer from staff (maybe it's on the gdb) or other players on the Cold Question.  If you do 'weather' at night you get something like: "It is a cool night."  But how cool is cool?  Here's as much as I've found about temperature from 'help weather':

The wind itself can blow hot winds from the Salt Flats across the world, raising the temperatures in cities such as Allanak to well above 140 degrees (Fahrenheit, which is roughly 60 degrees Celsius).

(On a slightly related topic: I've seen blue sky in room descriptions in a certain area.  Are these bugs?)

ETA: Found an old discussion with the exact same question!

http://gdb.armageddon.org/index.php?topic=4414.5

[nauta]

As to the damage self:

Code Select Expand


> kill self
You stab you, barely grazing your arm.
You swiftly dodge your pierce.
>disengage


[IAmJacksOpinion]

As to the damage self:

Code Select Expand


> kill self
You stab you, barely grazing your arm.
You swiftly dodge your pierce.
>disengage


Srsly? I think the message for > kill self is actually something like "You swing your arms futiley through the air." unless that got changed?

[nauta]

I was joking, but now that you mention 'kill self', my next PC is totally going to be named 'Self'.

[Jihelu]

I think the wildly swing thing is an echo people see and it just tells you that you can't do it or something?

[RogueGunslinger]

It actually DOES get cold at night sometimes. Also I'm fairly sure certain areas get colder than others.

[valeria]

It actually DOES get cold at night sometimes. Also I'm fairly sure certain areas get colder than others.

I've seen "cool" (at least) mentioned in weather messages at night as well.

[TheWanderer]

But how cool is cool?  

[Pale Horse]

It actually DOES get cold at night sometimes. Also I'm fairly sure certain areas get colder than others.

I've seen "cool" (at least) mentioned in weather messages at night as well.

There are locations in the game world where the temperature actually gets to "freezing" when you check with the "weather" command.

If you've managed to find them, congratulations.  Hope you brought a tent.

[IAmJacksOpinion]

Yeah, it definitely does. I know that, in my n00b days, I did a lot of mining and travelling on foot at night for that very reason.

I wonder if the point was for there to be coded negs for being stuck outdoors at night?

[nauta]

But how cool is cool?  

In the clothing help file:

In general, Zalanthan fashion shares similarities with Middle Eastern and North African styles. Zalanthas is a desert planet, comparable to some of Earth's great deserts; temperatures commonly reach temperatures of 125 degrees Fahrenheit. There are, however, various environmental and cultural differences between Zalanthas and Earth that have shaped Zalanthan fashion into something unique.

Which means pace Lizzie we can make reasonable inferences from terrestrial desert climates and weather (in particular the Middle East and North Africa) to zalanthan desert climates and weather.

In that old thread from 2003 I liked to above, there was a reference made to an old help file where it stated that temperatures got as low as 60F at night.

But I think the upshot is that it doesn't get teeth-shattering cold, although nipples might stand to... except in these weird freezing places.

[Delirium]

There are definitely specific areas that get exceptionally cold, just as there are places which get exceptionally hot.

It's pretty neat.

An actual temperature range for the sake of OOC reference points would be cool.

[Suhuy]

I live in a desert nation in the Middle East. Winter can be slightly cool, but summer is hell day or night.

And forget that dry heat crap you always hear about. The humidity here is so godawful that Florida sounds dry from here!

So I'd say it depends which desert you're talking about. The Zalanthan desert need not be cold at night simply on the grounds that it's a desert.

[Suhuy]

Also, a Zalanthan day is shorter than an earth day. So the desert doesn't have enough time to cool in Suk-Krath's absence.

[Desertman]

Also, a Zalanthan day is shorter than an earth day. So the desert doesn't have enough time to cool in Suk-Krath's absence.

Tell me more about the RL desert you live in. I am now interested.

[Jihelu]

I used to live in kuwait if anyone wants to know about the weather.
From my perspective at the time night time was the best thing ever, during the summer it was still hell but slightly less hell, while in winter I might actually wear a jacket if I went out at night during the winter months.

[RogueGunslinger]

I live in arizona. Four days ago it was raining and chilly during the daytime. A week before that I was sweating and it was pretty stuffy without AC.

Today it's hot enough that the wind no longer feels pleasant. Probably a High around 92-95 Fahrenheit. This is what I usually consider the start of summer, turn the Evap cooler on early, run it almost all day. Night-times are usually warm enough from the day that you leave your windows open and its pleasant.

When I lived in Phoenix the nights werre often just as stuffy and hot as it feels today during the daytime.

So yeah, lots of variation based on where you live, and even just the weather patterns changing.

[flurry]

...don't deserts get extremely cold at night?

(40-50 degrees °F)

:looks at the thermometer. (45°F)

:looks at the calendar. (May 4)



(Sorry, I'm a northerner. I can't help it.)

Okay, on topic, and in all seriousness, I don't think it gets cold enough in Zalanthas to be anything beyond (harmlessly) chilly at times. Especially considering how covered people tend to be when in the desert.

[AdamBlue]

One of these days, it should just straight up fucking snow in Zalanthas and freak everyone the fuck out.

[valeria]

...don't deserts get extremely cold at night?

(40-50 degrees °F)

:looks at the thermometer. (45°F)

:looks at the calendar. (May 4)



(Sorry, I'm a northerner. I can't help it.)

Okay, on topic, and in all seriousness, I don't think it gets cold enough in Zalanthas to be anything beyond (harmlessly) chilly at times. Especially considering how covered people tend to be when in the desert.

Yeah, anything over 40 is basically t-shirt weather. 

(Edit: Whoops, bad quotation skills.)

[Pale Horse]

One of these days, it should just straight up fucking snow in Zalanthas and freak everyone the fuck out.

We ended up with a new moon when it rained.

Any bets on what'll happen with snow?  A new city?  A cold city.

[Armaddict]

One of these days, it should just straight up fucking snow in Zalanthas and freak everyone the fuck out.

We ended up with a new moon when it rained.

Any bets on what'll happen with snow?  A new city?  A cold city.

Mammoths that hunt meks.

[AdamBlue]

A city of elementals that exists up in the mountains where instead of currency they drain your life force from you to pay for services, which temporarily lowers your max HP?

[Erythil]

One of these days, it should just straight up fucking snow in Zalanthas and freak everyone the fuck out.

We ended up with a new moon when it rained.

Any bets on what'll happen with snow?  A new city?  A cold city.

Accepting summons for Amos of the Boreal Valley plz soapstone

[Jihelu]

We are Dark souls now

[Erythil]

We have to link the First Frost so that the Age of Water can come again

Go slay the three immortal kings for their lord souls and release the stolen defiling energy back into the land

[catchall]

There's no need to appeal to "magick," "fantasy," or other hand-wavey things here.  All you have to do is watch one IC day cycle.  Nights on Zalanthas are about 1/3 as long as the day.  There isn't enough time to get that cold before the sun comes up again.

[IAmJacksOpinion]

There's no need to appeal to "magick," "fantasy," or other hand-wavey things here.  All you have to do is watch one IC day cycle.  Nights on Zalanthas are about 1/3 as long as the day.  There isn't enough time to get that cold before the sun comes up again.

+1.   

Day to night ratios are about the same in most places on earth with 15-16 hours of sunlight per day during the Summer to 8ish hours of dark. As others have said, it doesn't get "cold" at night in earth desert climates, it just gets less hellish. And the "weather" command corroborates this in game. Zalanthas is running pretty similar to earth in regards to the behavior of the temperature. There's reaaally nothing to discuss here...

[Majikal]

This has been brought up before (not the cold, but the self-damage) and there have been plenty of times I would have loved something exactly like this.

[TheWanderer]

Okay, but, uh, deserts rapidly cool down within the first hour or so - rock and sand quickly lose the heat they've gathered.

If the Zalanthian desert begins slowly cooling during dusk and continues to do so during the first hour of night, it might not drop to the 40s/lower 50s of real deserts, but it could hold at the upper 50s/mid 60s in its final hour.

I guess what you consider cold is subjective, but there's no doubt that the denizens of a place that sits at roughly 120 degrees during the day are going to notice the drop.

whatever. i realized I don't really care anymore.

--------

As for the second part, yes. I've wanted to be able to damage myself on numerous occasions.

bloodletting2016

[Jihelu]

A way to represent how fucked I get by some npc interaction? Hell yeah.
A way to represent a blow I believe should have hurt me real bad? Hell yeah.
A way to commit honorable sudoku? Maybe.

[TheWanderer]

[Norcal]

I spend a lot of time on the southern edge of the Sahara.  It gets hot, especially this time of year. It does cool off a bit at night..EXCEPT  when we have a lot of dust or cloud cover.

Now I don't know about clouds in Zalanthas, yet there is dust.  And I have spent all too many nights sweating in my cot when the temperature at night stays well above 100 degrees due to dust.

As mentioned, there are areas of the game where it gets cold at night.  Using a bit of logic should let you know where.

However, even though Arm is a MUD and has lots of nice code, some things you just have to totally RP.  It would be nice to see this happen more often.