So What's Next? - Tuluk Version

[Culinary Critic]

I want staff to re-open Tuluk, just so people can freak the fuck out and flip their lids and remove their clothes every time they think about not being able to detect a witch just from skills anymore.

Re-open Tuluk.

The gates are barred from the inside, none enter His Ivory for a decade.  And none leave.
Strange sounds come from within the White Walls.  Not quite screams, not quite moans.  Not quite human.
Odd, terrifying lights are visible over the closed walls at night.  Flashes in every colour imaginable.
Few see it, and none stay to watch when, after a week of absolute silence, the west gates begin shaking, pounded and battered from the far side.  They bow out, but hold.
Weeks pass.  Then more weeks. The same battering flares up at every gate, over and over, harder and harder, though all hold.  It becomes part of the background.  The shrill cry of a hunting hawk, the rustle of the wind through the  foliage in the Grey Forest, the snarl of a pouncing gortok, the battering of the gates.
One day, a traveller slows on the North Road and stops just before making his turn to Morin's.  He stares along the road...at the west gates of Tuluk, unable to look away from the sagging ruin that was once stout timber.  Large scraps cling to the points of the broken beams, some cloth, some flesh, some unrecognizable.
A breeze drifts along the road, carrying the scent of smoke, dust and charred meat from beyond the gate, though no sound follows it.
Later, a group of brave souls leave Morin's, heavily armed and armoured.  They proceed cautiously into the city, vanishing into the unnatural gloom.
Hours later, they return to tell the tale of the empty roads, the gates and doorways hanging open, the looming buildings, their insides darker than they should be at high sun.  The once proud artwork defaced, defiled, broken, shattered.  The only gate that held, and held fast, was that into the Heart. 
That it had been assaulted was obvious.  The road outside littered with bones, assorted rags and scores of arrows.

Now....GO!

[Asmoth]

I want staff to re-open Tuluk, just so people can freak the fuck out and flip their lids and remove their clothes every time they think about not being able to detect a witch just from skills anymore.

Re-open Tuluk.

The gates are barred from the inside, none enter His Ivory for a decade.  And none leave.
Strange sounds come from within the White Walls.  Not quite screams, not quite moans.  Not quite human.
Odd, terrifying lights are visible over the closed walls at night.  Flashes in every colour imaginable.
Few see it, and none stay to watch when, after a week of absolute silence, the west gates begin shaking, pounded and battered from the far side.  They bow out, but hold.
Weeks pass.  Then more weeks. The same battering flares up at every gate, over and over, harder and harder, though all hold.  It becomes part of the background.  The shrill cry of a hunting hawk, the rustle of the wind through the  foliage in the Grey Forest, the snarl of a pouncing gortok, the battering of the gates.
One day, a traveller slows on the North Road and stops just before making his turn to Morin's.  He stares along the road...at the west gates of Tuluk, unable to look away from the sagging ruin that was once stout timber.  Large scraps cling to the points of the broken beams, some cloth, some flesh, some unrecognizable.
A breeze drifts along the road, carrying the scent of smoke, dust and charred meat from beyond the gate, though no sound follows it.
Later, a group of brave souls leave Morin's, heavily armed and armoured.  They proceed cautiously into the city, vanishing into the unnatural gloom.
Hours later, they return to tell the tale of the empty roads, the gates and doorways hanging open, the looming buildings, their insides darker than they should be at high sun.  The once proud artwork defaced, defiled, broken, shattered.  The only gate that held, and held fast, was that into the Heart. 
That it had been assaulted was obvious.  The road outside littered with bones, assorted rags and scores of arrows.

Now....GO!

I'd be down for a post apocalyptic Tuluk... A ghost town that could be taken over by rogue magickers and criminals!

[Molten Heart]

I want staff to re-open Tuluk, just so people can freak the fuck out and flip their lids and remove their clothes every time they think about not being able to detect a witch just from skills anymore.

Re-open Tuluk.

The gates are barred from the inside, none enter His Ivory for a decade.  And none leave.
Strange sounds come from within the White Walls.  Not quite screams, not quite moans.  Not quite human.
Odd, terrifying lights are visible over the closed walls at night.  Flashes in every colour imaginable.
Few see it, and none stay to watch when, after a week of absolute silence, the west gates begin shaking, pounded and battered from the far side.  They bow out, but hold.
Weeks pass.  Then more weeks. The same battering flares up at every gate, over and over, harder and harder, though all hold.  It becomes part of the background.  The shrill cry of a hunting hawk, the rustle of the wind through the  foliage in the Grey Forest, the snarl of a pouncing gortok, the battering of the gates.
One day, a traveller slows on the North Road and stops just before making his turn to Morin's.  He stares along the road...at the west gates of Tuluk, unable to look away from the sagging ruin that was once stout timber.  Large scraps cling to the points of the broken beams, some cloth, some flesh, some unrecognizable.
A breeze drifts along the road, carrying the scent of smoke, dust and charred meat from beyond the gate, though no sound follows it.
Later, a group of brave souls leave Morin's, heavily armed and armoured.  They proceed cautiously into the city, vanishing into the unnatural gloom.
Hours later, they return to tell the tale of the empty roads, the gates and doorways hanging open, the looming buildings, their insides darker than they should be at high sun.  The once proud artwork defaced, defiled, broken, shattered.  The only gate that held, and held fast, was that into the Heart. 
That it had been assaulted was obvious.  The road outside littered with bones, assorted rags and scores of arrows.

Now....GO!

I'd be down for a post apocalyptic Tuluk... A ghost town that could be taken over by rogue magickers and criminals!

Zombies, not the undead kind, but the brain dead kind.

[MeTekillot]

Make Tuluk a city of warring clans, with a clan NPC in almost every room, and you only have protection from lawlessness if you're in the right area and in the right clan.

[Asmoth]

I honestly would prefer the city either destroyed totally or used.  Having it closed as is, I feel adds nothing to the game.

[Patuk]

Maybe so, but it certainly doesn't detract from it either.

[Delirium]

I actually love the idea of Tuluk as a ghost town. I don't want to take half-measures, either. I think Tuluk should be completely, unequivocally, no death-of-superman Never Coming Back.

Turn Tuluk into a labyrinth of ruins, full of plague, disease, and dead bodies - where Really Spooky Shit happens, especially at night.

You could open up the "rebuild" (aka ruined) areas systematically as a series of RPTs, where groups of players go to loot the remains of the city - and maybe ex-Tuluki patriots take exception to that fact. Groups of ex-soldiers who remained in the city, criminal gangs who took advantage of the chaos to gain in strength, various hostile NPC factions to contend with.

I'm imagining empty, half-burnt mansions, abandoned warehouses, empty taverns, made into the hideouts of criminals, witches, and ex-soldiers, who all fight each other but mostly stick to their areas of the city. There's loot to be found, and places to seize as your own... if you can deal with the terrors that walk in the night, and the gangs who stalk the day.

Build up Morin's into a true village, where Tuluk has lost control - do the merchant Houses let Kadius have it? Do they squabble for control? Do they each put a stake in it?

Meanwhile, the Kryl grow restless...

How does Allanak react to this? Maybe they start eyeing expansion... Luir's Outpost would be a tidy first prize, without Tuluk to protect them.

So, so, so much political and plot-related chaos could result from finally letting Tuluk die that it is insane. Let it happen.

(Yes. It would require a shit ton of building. That's what we recruit builders for, right guys?)

[BadSkeelz]

I wouldn't really want to see Tuluk destroyed. It's the last cultural bastion against a rising tide of magick-loving wankery.

[BadSkeelz]

That said... I don't particularly like the weird state of limbo it's in now, where we can "Virtually" visit the interior (sometimes) but don't actually know what's going on and thus have nothing to report back.

[Delirium]

The bastion of magicker-hatred would be all the Tuluki refugees and PCs in Morin's.

[BadSkeelz]

Morin's is not yet a viable cultural center. It needs building up first before the rest of Tuluk would need tearing down.

Edit: Also northern PCs should be able to get Northern Templar guilds.

[Delirium]

Morin's is not yet a viable cultural center. It needs building up first before the rest of Tuluk would need tearing down.

Good point, I agree with building up Morin's first.

[Asmoth]

Morin's is not yet a viable cultural center. It needs building up first before the rest of Tuluk would need tearing down.

Edit: Also northern PCs should be able to get Northern Templar guilds.

As long as it's not Lirathan Templar...

[Malifaxis]

I think we should stop calling it Tuluk, and just start referring to it by the number of times it has been destroyed, occupied, or rebuilt.

[Delirium]

this isn't even Tuluk's final form


... that's why I want to NOT death-of-superman it. Let it actually die. If another civilization takes over the space, let it be something else entirely.

[Asmoth]

this isn't even Tuluk's final form


... that's why I want to NOT death-of-superman it. Let it actually die. If another civilization takes over the space, let it be something else entirely.

Well there is still the matter of Psychic, Immortal Muk Utep who is somewhere.

What you gonna do about that eight foot tall killer?

[Case]

Being in a virtualized civil war doesn't necessarily turn it into an apocalyptic hellhole. The whole 'refugees' thing is/was way overblown when citizens are allowed to (virtually) visit. It is just a virtual city. So much player apocrypha.

[Delirium]

Muk and Tek (or whoever is posing as them) duke it out and kill each other, getting rid of both of those story-ruining all-powerful jerks in one fell blow.

[BadSkeelz]

Being in a virtualized civil war doesn't necessarily turn it into an apocalyptic hellhole. The whole 'refugees' thing is/was way overblown when citizens are allowed to (virtually) visit. It is just a virtual city. So much player apocrypha.

Staff have gone in record (at least in my requests) that not all refugees are able to return.

Having a virtually open City with no way to get reliable news out of it is a clunkier solution than just walling it off completely. Player Characters have zero idea what's going on inside - to claim that you do is verging on power gaming.

[Case]

Being in a virtualized civil war doesn't necessarily turn it into an apocalyptic hellhole. The whole 'refugees' thing is/was way overblown when citizens are allowed to (virtually) visit. It is just a virtual city. So much player apocrypha.

Staff have gone in record (at least in my requests) that not all refugees are able to return.

Having a virtually open City with no way to get reliable news out of it is a clunkier solution than just walling it off completely. Player Characters have zero idea what's going on inside - to claim that you do is verging on power gaming.

People have been claiming all sorts of BS IG. But it never got walled off completely!

[BadSkeelz]

It should have been

That GMH trade and certain unknown personages with the proper "credentials" can visit the interior of Tuluk is true. Most PCs cannot.

Basically the only people who can visit the virtual city are virtual NPCs.

[Case]

It should have been

That GMH trade and certain unknown personages with the proper "credentials" can visit the interior of Tuluk is true. Most PCs cannot.

It's not been consistently stated by staff.

[BadSkeelz]

Staff statements on Tuluk have been sloppy on the boards going back to the original closure announcement, but it's a little more definitive in game.

[Bogre]

Like gladiator PCs -

everyone apps in secondary roles in the closed off city state

and plays out the internecine war until

some faction remains standing

[Jingo]

Whatever they do, I think they should avoid trying to mirror Allanak. I.E. Templars, nobles and social hierarchies should not even be comparable.

More interesting would be warring bardic troupes that seek patronage from a Templar-lite caste. Make caste structure horizontal instead of vertical. So those within a caste can compete to become the "noble" at the head of the caste.

That's me throwing ideas at the wall.

[Vox]

I actually love the idea of Tuluk as a ghost town. I don't want to take half-measures, either. I think Tuluk should be completely, unequivocally, no death-of-superman Never Coming Back.

Turn Tuluk into a labyrinth of ruins, full of plague, disease, and dead bodies - where Really Spooky Shit happens, especially at night.

You could open up the "rebuild" (aka ruined) areas systematically as a series of RPTs, where groups of players go to loot the remains of the city - and maybe ex-Tuluki patriots take exception to that fact. Groups of ex-soldiers who remained in the city, criminal gangs who took advantage of the chaos to gain in strength, various hostile NPC factions to contend with.

I'm imagining empty, half-burnt mansions, abandoned warehouses, empty taverns, made into the hideouts of criminals, witches, and ex-soldiers, who all fight each other but mostly stick to their areas of the city. There's loot to be found, and places to seize as your own... if you can deal with the terrors that walk in the night, and the gangs who stalk the day.

Build up Morin's into a true village, where Tuluk has lost control - do the merchant Houses let Kadius have it? Do they squabble for control? Do they each put a stake in it?

Meanwhile, the Kryl grow restless...

How does Allanak react to this? Maybe they start eyeing expansion... Luir's Outpost would be a tidy first prize, without Tuluk to protect them.

So, so, so much political and plot-related chaos could result from finally letting Tuluk die that it is insane. Let it happen.

(Yes. It would require a shit ton of building. That's what we recruit builders for, right guys?)

This. I love all of this.

[Malifaxis]

[Culinary Critic]

I actually love the idea of Tuluk as a ghost town. I don't want to take half-measures, either. I think Tuluk should be completely, unequivocally, no death-of-superman Never Coming Back.

Turn Tuluk into a labyrinth of ruins, full of plague, disease, and dead bodies - where Really Spooky Shit happens, especially at night.

You could open up the "rebuild" (aka ruined) areas systematically as a series of RPTs, where groups of players go to loot the remains of the city - and maybe ex-Tuluki patriots take exception to that fact. Groups of ex-soldiers who remained in the city, criminal gangs who took advantage of the chaos to gain in strength, various hostile NPC factions to contend with.

I'm imagining empty, half-burnt mansions, abandoned warehouses, empty taverns, made into the hideouts of criminals, witches, and ex-soldiers, who all fight each other but mostly stick to their areas of the city. There's loot to be found, and places to seize as your own... if you can deal with the terrors that walk in the night, and the gangs who stalk the day.

Build up Morin's into a true village, where Tuluk has lost control - do the merchant Houses let Kadius have it? Do they squabble for control? Do they each put a stake in it?

Meanwhile, the Kryl grow restless...

How does Allanak react to this? Maybe they start eyeing expansion... Luir's Outpost would be a tidy first prize, without Tuluk to protect them.

So, so, so much political and plot-related chaos could result from finally letting Tuluk die that it is insane. Let it happen.

(Yes. It would require a shit ton of building. That's what we recruit builders for, right guys?)

Like you're reading my mind (and no, you're not That Person),

Internally, a gaggle of bards and minstrels hold the circle against the near feral tribals of the market.  Meanwhile the sharps in the Warrens maintain a tenuous hold over the rough and tumble crowd of humans who stick close to what was once the Tooth.  Roving bands of former Merchant House servants and crafters swarming lone, wandering figures for a sip of water.  Friel's the domain of The Tikki, led by a ruthless, mutliated mul...

Externally, everybody wants something.  A foothold in Morin's or the vast riches of the Heart.  Access to the market of the masses who must have piles of useless sid tucked away.  Kurac looking to expand, Kadius and Salarr at each others throats over such a massive, lucrative prize of an estate.

In Allanak, back room meetings to decide how the spoils will be divided because, of course, we will be the conquers, crushing all between us and what we want.  How do we keep the lowly merchant houses from our just reward?  Where will my noble family build their northern estates?

Hunting contracts, mining contracts, forestry, herbs, fruit, wine....oh my.

Sorry...get carried away.  Enjoy this game a little too much sometimes.

[Asmoth]

I love pretty much all these ideas, except for the ones where people are like leave it how it is.

I personally think it would be ironic if one day the gates were open and people started wandering into the city for respite, only to find out that the city is ten times more dangerous than the outdoors.

[Majikal]

Allanak take over Tuluk, nobles from the south expand into tuluk. Leaves the option of playing an occupied tuluki again which was fun and keeps the staff workload ideally the same (no tuluki clans open for play). Opens the option for more murder, corruption, betrayal from the tuluki loyalists who want to watch the southies burn and opens up a reason to travel once again. Nobles get to brave the wilderness with their wagons and whatnot to check on their northern investments.

Fun had by all.

[Asmoth]

Allanak take over Tuluk, nobles from the south expand into tuluk. Leaves the option of playing an occupied tuluki again which was fun and keeps the staff workload ideally the same (no tuluki clans open for play). Opens the option for more murder, corruption, betrayal from the tuluki loyalists who want to watch the southies burn and opens up a reason to travel once again. Nobles get to brave the wilderness with their wagons and whatnot to check on their northern investments.

Fun had by all.

Majikal for staff, 2016!

[Armaddict]

Allanak take over Tuluk, nobles from the south expand into tuluk. Leaves the option of playing an occupied tuluki again which was fun and keeps the staff workload ideally the same (no tuluki clans open for play). Opens the option for more murder, corruption, betrayal from the tuluki loyalists who want to watch the southies burn and opens up a reason to travel once again. Nobles get to brave the wilderness with their wagons and whatnot to check on their northern investments.

Fun had by all.

Majikal for staff, 2016!

Sounds very similar to the rebellion era.

[Marauder Moe]

Would love to see Tuluk return, radically altered or not, but we haven't exactly had a population boom since it closed.   

[Delirium]

We haven't exactly had highly visible, world-spanning plots that every clan and indie can get their paws in participating, either.

We've had cool plots, don't get me wrong. But they've been relatively inclusive, or prone to being hidden behind closed doors while the rest of us dawdle.

[Asmoth]

We haven't exactly had highly visible, world-spanning plots that every clan and indie can get their paws in participating, either.

We've had cool plots, don't get me wrong. But they've been relatively inclusive, or prone to being hidden behind closed doors while the rest of us dawdle.

It's difficult to run a plot or story where Joe Salt-Grebber and Mike Noble are both involved.

[Delirium]

See the entire first 3/4 of this thread?

[Harmless]

these are cool ideas, but i have to stop reading because if any of it ended up happening or if something like it did, I'd feel spoiled. Use the idea command in game, guys :p

[IAmJacksOpinion]

Wat? How the hell would you fit any of these ideas in the MUDs limited character buffer? Not like there's any real possibility of any of them happening anytime soon...

I do like the idea of something resistence-esque coming out of it though.

[Erythil]

I don't think it should happen until all the tablelands stuff is over. 

I don't think it should be destroyed, either, I like knowing it's there.

I wouldn't mind seeing all the gith players funneled into the Sun Legions or something for a proper, focused, time-limited war with clearly defined objectives.

[Vwest]

Nuke it.

Give me the button, I'll push it.

[hyzhenhok]

I like the idea of making Tuluk a lawless, dangerous place. Basically turn it into Raam from Dark Sun. Get rid of Muk Utep (he's is a cool guy, so you can have him disappear mysteriously instead of outright killing him. Maybe he can come back later). In their absence, the faux equality of citizens vanishes as nobles try to seize and maintain power. The lower castes do not appreciate this and rebel, trying to overthrow the nobility. They all splinter into factions, grabbing turf and fighting for power. Shadow Artistry is no longer a tool of the templarate, but elves running wild pilfering wealth and killing important folks. Bonus points because the theme of the new Tuluk would very much provide a contrast to Allanak, instead of just being Allanak's *subtle* cousin of brutal oppression.

You could actually make this the IC reality right now without changing basically anything. Turn Morin's into the stronghold of one of noble families, keep the gates sealed because the factions that control them value having a closed flank over open trade.

Then, if the circumstances call for it, you can open up a transformed Tuluk. Make it a fractured, dangerous place filled with different factions and hostile NPCs. You can re-open it piece by piece, as the various factions in the city gradually warm up to allowing outsiders in again. No pressure to make the place a PC population center right away, but you'd be setting the groundwork to make that happen should it every become warranted.

[Norcal]

Would love to see Tuluk return, radically altered or not, but we haven't exactly had a population boom since it closed.   

I want Tuluk back. It provides balance in the game. Yet if staff hold true to the reason why it was closed, Moe is right, we just don't have the numbers for a full Tuluk come back.

However it could go the way Delirium is suggesting.

[th3kaiser]

My ideal world would be closing Nak and everybody gets to play tribals. Love to see everybody indies or in tribes. Be a blast having tribe on tribe conflict without them being giant ungainly wars between citystates.

[FantasyWriter]

My ideal world would be closing Nak and everybody gets to play tribals. Love to see everybody indies or in tribes. Be a blast having tribe on tribe conflict without them being giant ungainly wars between citystates.

<3

[ChibiTama]

Can we at least save the cotton?

[little chicken woman]

Can we at least save the cotton?

I loved the cotton. I loved it so much. I'd love to see a one-room field, maybe.

[Delirium]

I've been thinking about this, and a much less resource-intensive way to handle Tuluk could be to just nuke it from orbit, basically.

Have it self-destruct due to civil war and let Allanak capitalize on its weakness, Muk & Tek battle it out, leave it haunted, despoiled rubble where nothing grows.

Have a few rooms describing the ruins which can gradually be built out in subsequent projects and RPT releases, but also include some sort of IC reason why it is just totally empty of civilization and the very idea of trying to live in that place is insane. Disease, plague, horrible otherworldly creatures spilling out of some rift in reality, whatever floats your skimmer and keeps the place entirely uninhabitable.

Then let Morin's be the new northern center of civilization. If it gets built up, it gets built up. If it doesn't it doesn't. Let players decide.

[BadSkeelz]

What about the curren state of Tuluk is requiring we blow it up, again?

Heck, it doesn't even impede rogue mages jerking off next to the Harzen gates.

[Delirium]

If

1) the current state of limbo is just weird and ill-defined

and

2) staff is unable to devote resources to running two full cities with separate clans,

then it seems to follow that the best solution for IC coherency is to reach closure with Tuluk, but leave Morin's as a (much smaller) center of northern-based roleplay.

[BadSkeelz]

I think an answer can be gained for #1, if I wasn't continually too drunk to post an ATS question and ask "What the feck is up with Tuluk? Who can go in, who can go out, what's going on?"

#1 isn't a systemic failing, it's just communication that can be fixed with a single definitive post.

[Asmoth]

What about the curren state of Tuluk is requiring we blow it up, again?

Heck, it doesn't even impede rogue mages jerking off next to the Harzen gates.

I'm sure staff would jump at the chance to animate a Jedi Templar with their crazy abilities to murder said mage if they found out.

[BadSkeelz]

You'd think. But Staff are generally paying attention to players who aren't such wankers, figurative or literal.

[Asmoth]

You'd think. But Staff are generally paying attention to players who aren't such wankers, figurative or literal.

Suggestion, new staff position, Twink Patrol - They search the world for twinkish or unthemely behavior and met out justice!

[little chicken woman]

Cotton for Morin's!

[Centurion]

I love Tuluk's area. Hate 'Nak's area. I'd love to see Tuluk come back, but if that's never to happen, get rid of it. Destroy it, have Nak take it over, kryl invade and take nest inside, just please do something with it. Change the world, advance the history, kill Muk finally. Have someone else rise and change the whole leadership. Having the same two figureheads in charge of the world for forever can be boring. Well, that's not entirely true there has been a small change if I remember right, but almost.

If Allanak conquered Tuluk, it would be fun as shit for me if I had a noble in Allanak and I got to travel and inspect my northern estate on occasion. Then there is some danger, some adventure. Fun being a Arm soldier and patrolling Tuluk's streets and there are NPC/PC rebels to deal with, and there is an actual threat. It's been done before, but that was a long time ago now. I wouldn't mind a rehash.

[Pale Horse]

I love Tuluk's area. Hate 'Nak's area. I'd love to see Tuluk come back, but if that's never to happen, get rid of it. Destroy it, have Nak take it over, kryl invade and take nest inside, just please do something with it. Change the world, advance the history, kill Muk finally. Have someone else rise and change the whole leadership. Having the same two figureheads in charge of the world for forever can be boring. Well, that's not entirely true there has been a small change if I remember right, but almost.

If Allanak conquered Tuluk, it would be fun as shit for me if I had a noble in Allanak and I got to travel and inspect my northern estate on occasion. Then there is some danger, some adventure. Fun being a Arm soldier and patrolling Tuluk's streets and there are NPC/PC rebels to deal with, and there is an actual threat. It's been done before, but that was a long time ago now. I wouldn't mind a rehash.

Jokes on us.  Staff are already plotting what is going to happen with Tuluk.

In these plans, Tuluk conquers Allanak, suckers!

[ChibiTama]

Morins could be BOOMING with cotton. Everyone would be scrambling to get their hands on some!

[Molten Heart]

Are Tuluk and Muk Utep secretly responsible for full elementalists being removed from the game? That'd be horrible and if so, need to be punished.