The Future of Quit

[CodeMaster]

Also I think burglars should get city quit.  Maybe in non-crowd rooms or while hidden.

[valeria]

I like quit how it is currently, but with one exception: people should be able to quit freely on all of the settlement streets and in the markets.

It isn't about treating you like children for abusing wilderness quit capabilities. It's about keeping the wilderness mostly wild. And in my opinion, the lack of prevalent quit rooms contributes to that.

[Fujikoma]

How about this, we give all city guilds and subguilds city quit, and give all outdoorsy guilds (to include warrior and rogue mages) and subguilds wilderness quit, or maybe remove mages from the list because pick a fucking outdoorsy subguild you gicker scum? That would seem an ideal solution to me. Ranger quit is very powerful and prone to abuse, however, so I can kind of see why quit OOC is a thing.

[Fujikoma]

Or on the flipside, could just remove the limitations from quit OOC, it will still be logged, and still require a reason, so if there is abuse it'll be obvious.

[BadSkeelz]

I've seen enough shenanigans from players to think giving everyone quit-anywhere (wilderness or streets) is a bad idea.

A subguild or 2 with wilderness quit wouldn't game-breaking. But wholesale expansion of Quit would be more trouble than it's worth.

[Adhira]

Just add more quit rooms.  Shouldn't be so rare, they're an OOC construct.

I mentioned in a previous Producer report that this is one of the projects I'm planning to tackle this year. Subguilds and guilds first.

[Fujikoma]

I've seen enough shenanigans from players to think giving everyone quit-anywhere (wilderness or streets) is a bad idea.

A subguild or 2 with wilderness quit wouldn't game-breaking. But wholesale expansion of Quit would be more trouble than it's worth.

As have I, honestly, and, sadly.

[Asanadas]

Here's what I say: quit delay (of 2+mins) everywhere, and keep quit rooms insta-quit.

And auto quit for everyone logged out more than 10 minutes.

If your character goes link-dead for more than 10 minutes, they should be removed from the PC world. I've seen so many good characters and stories be destroyed from this OOC problem. This is a legacy from DIKU days, and frankly should be dealt away with for the betterment of the in-game narrative.

Seriously, a man is going to stand out in the desert with a full waterskin and die of thirst? All because his player lost connection. That's a failure of this medium of DIKU to provide what it's intended to provide: a story narrative.

And if anyone abuses it, they will have their accounts limited to quit rooms only; just like it is now with quit ooc.

I think this would vastly improve the experiences of people who don't have access to large blocks of playing time or other knowledge resources out there.

[th3kaiser]

I've literally never had a problem with this and I play almost exclusively wilderness PCs. With the advent of quit ooc this is a complete non-issue. Had a bit of a think about this and with one or two exceptions cannot think of any areas in the game when you're not within 25-30 rooms of a quit room, they're all over the place.

[Ender]

I think one of the biggest problems I have with a lot of the wilderness quit rooms in the very hard to reach places are described like this:

A STINK ROOM [NESW QUIT] 
THIS ROOM SMELLS LIKE IF SOMEONE DIED WHILE POOPING AND VOMITING AT THE SAME TIME.  IT'S SO BAD THAT YOU'RE ALREADY A BAD PLAYER FOR HAVING READ THIS FAR WITHOUT LEAVING, PUKING, OR PUTTING IN A STORAGE REQUEST FOR DYING OF BAD SMELLS.  WHAT A BAD PLAYER YOU ARE.

[Narf]

I've literally never had a problem with this and I play almost exclusively wilderness PCs. With the advent of quit ooc this is a complete non-issue. Had a bit of a think about this and with one or two exceptions cannot think of any areas in the game when you're not within 25-30 rooms of a quit room, they're all over the place.

The proximity of a quit room is only useful if you know where it is.

[Case]

I think one of the biggest problems I have with a lot of the wilderness quit rooms in the very hard to reach places are described like this:

A STINK ROOM [NESW QUIT] 
THIS ROOM SMELLS LIKE IF SOMEONE DIED WHILE POOPING AND VOMITING AT THE SAME TIME.  IT'S SO BAD THAT YOU'RE ALREADY A BAD PLAYER FOR HAVING READ THIS FAR WITHOUT LEAVING, PUKING, OR PUTTING IN A STORAGE REQUEST FOR DYING OF BAD SMELLS.  WHAT A BAD PLAYER YOU ARE.

We should have 5 star hotels in the wilderness for nobles on a jaunt, maybe a few more motels like Luirs along the main routes, and an outlaw boutique to capture that Destroyer Of Life market. Nothing says badass secret villain like smelling of pymlithe shampoo after a busy day at the edgy rogue mage factory!

[LauraMars]

I think one of the biggest problems I have with a lot of the wilderness quit rooms in the very hard to reach places are described like this:

A STINK ROOM [NESW QUIT] 
THIS ROOM SMELLS LIKE IF SOMEONE DIED WHILE POOPING AND VOMITING AT THE SAME TIME.  IT'S SO BAD THAT YOU'RE ALREADY A BAD PLAYER FOR HAVING READ THIS FAR WITHOUT LEAVING, PUKING, OR PUTTING IN A STORAGE REQUEST FOR DYING OF BAD SMELLS.  WHAT A BAD PLAYER YOU ARE.

I don't understand this

Is every quit room in the wilderness filled with rotting corpses?

If so, why? I seem to remember most of the wilderness being mostly sand or scrub, with some rocks I think. I can't really remember. dear god what happened out there? I haven't been to the desert since 2009

[Fujikoma]

I think one of the biggest problems I have with a lot of the wilderness quit rooms in the very hard to reach places are described like this:

A STINK ROOM [NESW QUIT] 
THIS ROOM SMELLS LIKE IF SOMEONE DIED WHILE POOPING AND VOMITING AT THE SAME TIME.  IT'S SO BAD THAT YOU'RE ALREADY A BAD PLAYER FOR HAVING READ THIS FAR WITHOUT LEAVING, PUKING, OR PUTTING IN A STORAGE REQUEST FOR DYING OF BAD SMELLS.  WHAT A BAD PLAYER YOU ARE.

I don't understand this

Is every quit room in the wilderness filled with rotting corpses?

If so, why? I seem to remember most of the wilderness being mostly sand or scrub, with some rocks I think. I can't really remember. dear god what happened out there? I haven't been to the desert since 2009

What else would a true Zalanthan sleep on?

[Armaddict]

Seriously, a man is going to stand out in the desert with a full waterskin and die of thirst? All because his player lost connection. That's a failure of this medium of DIKU to provide what it's intended to provide: a story narrative.

Losing link suspends your hunger and thirst.  It does not protect you from random baddies out in the desert.  It really is a luck of the draw, in its current state.

That said, I have lost characters to linkdead.  I have lost characters to afk, because there is a post from 2006 or something that is the last definitive status of staff opinion on ranger quit, which is basically 'use it for long-term survival, not as a way to take a quick afk safely, or we will remove it from rangers' that I followed up until the last year or so.  I have also had a linkdead death returned from death because it was clear the other player was not trying anything, but instantly attacked the moment they got the message I was linkdead.

I agree that these sorts of deaths do not add to the game, and would like for there to be a grace period before you're removed from the game.  'Hunt' should return that someone made camp here, so that complaints can be forwarded in the case there is a pursuit avoided in this way.

[RogueGunslinger]

I have a lowered opinion on anyone who thinks the ability to quite anywhere anytime is a bad thing. It's an incredibly stupid argument to back.

I've had multiple issues with quit-ooc. Usually right after I sparred with someone and need to log out. Oh, combat timer, better quit-ooc... Oh wait, I already did that last time. Better just leave my pc in game and hope they don't dehydrate to death by the time I get back....

You should be able to quit anywhere, anytime.

[nauta]

'Hunt' should return that someone made camp here.

A million +1s on that.  For me, it's a bit immersion breaking, and it strikes me as a relatively easy whack in the code, but I'm no coder.

I also love the idea of a 'quit' delay.  Remember: you can quit out to avoid NPCs stalking you, which is another avenue for abuse.

There was a very recent discussion on Quit Anywhere on the gdb.

[Fujikoma]

'Hunt' should return that someone made camp here.

A million +1s on that.  For me, it's a bit immersion breaking, and it strikes me as a relatively easy whack in the code, but I'm no coder.

I also love the idea of a 'quit' delay.  Remember: you can quit out to avoid NPCs stalking you, which is another avenue for abuse.

There was a very recent discussion on Quit Anywhere on the gdb.

Yeah, but NPCs stalk relentlessly, players should be afforded more opportunities. I'm not averse to quit being used to get away from NPCs, it only starts to really bother me when it's used on PCs.

[TheWanderer]

I like quit how it is currently, but with one exception: people should be able to quit freely on all of the settlement streets and in the markets.

It isn't about treating you like children for abusing wilderness quit capabilities. It's about keeping the wilderness mostly wild. And in my opinion, the lack of prevalent quit rooms contributes to that.

I like this post

I have a lowered opinion on anyone who thinks the ability to quite anywhere anytime is a bad thing. It's an incredibly stupid argument to back.

I've had multiple issues with quit-ooc. Usually right after I sparred with someone and need to log out. Oh, combat timer, better quit-ooc... Oh wait, I already did that last time. Better just leave my pc in game and hope they don't dehydrate to death by the time I get back....

You should be able to quit anywhere, anytime.

here's a thought: tap one of the quit rooms upon logging back into the game.

[BadSkeelz]

I have a lowered opinion on anyone who thinks the ability to quite anywhere anytime is a bad thing. It's an incredibly stupid argument to back.

I've had multiple issues with quit-ooc. Usually right after I sparred with someone and need to log out. Oh, combat timer, better quit-ooc... Oh wait, I already did that last time. Better just leave my pc in game and hope they don't dehydrate to death by the time I get back....

You should be able to quit anywhere, anytime.

If you're able to spar, you probably have a quit room nearby. Maybe you should get in the habit of using it after you re-enter the game from a quit OOC, just to reset the timer.

The problem with "quit anywhere, anytime" is that it's too open to abuse. I know this because the current quit code is abused plenty.

Edit: Got my timers confused...

[hopeandsorrow]

I have a lowered opinion on anyone who thinks the ability to quite anywhere anytime is a bad thing. It's an incredibly stupid argument to back.

While I agree with ya bud.  The following statement does not induce a constructive discussion, I know your feel but man...

And the argument isn't stupid per-say.  They're worried by abuse and well lets face it, some players have proven to be colossal shit bags, distract staff from doing fun stuff.  It's a fair argument if even we think it's unwarranted and not very valid in 2016.

But that's why I'm in the delay camp.  I'm an infamous 'Shit I GOTTA GO" guy or the ranger quit guy.  A min/2 min delay prevents abuse while still giving an unfortunate player like me time to attend what ever interruption is happening.  Whether family or work related.

[Armaddict]

It's an incredibly stupid argument to back.

Not really.  Even traditional MMO's with an 'exit now' option leave your character in game for varying degrees of time to prevent it being used as an escape.

If you think that such is incredibly stupid to back in a multiplayer game, then single player is probably right up your alley, or you're arguing to allow you to quit but still allow bad things to happen to you for a grace period, otherwise you're kind of missing the point of why such things exist.

Edited to add:  In addition to the suggestions of using quit rooms upon logging back in, you could also try either not engaging in combat/putting yourself in a non-quitting position as you get closer to the time you need to leave, or if you've been ambushed with something that needs tending to, let them know you were ambushed and will need a couple minutes.

[Asanadas]

Seriously, a man is going to stand out in the desert with a full waterskin and die of thirst? All because his player lost connection. That's a failure of this medium of DIKU to provide what it's intended to provide: a story narrative.

Losing link suspends your hunger and thirst.  It does not protect you from random baddies out in the desert.  It really is a luck of the draw, in its current state. ...

Hey, I agree with the rest of your post, but in this particular situation, what you're talking about didn't happen (hunger and thirst). I wish I could talk about it more, but in respect to the player, I can't provide a lot of details. The staff already knew about it, heh. That's been over and done with for a year, though, so I used that example to illustrate just how bad a linkdead experience can be -- especially with all the time and love we put in our characters.

It adds nothing to the game, and indeed subtracts enjoyment from people who care about their characters, to lose them to this failure of the DIKU medium. If I could get access to the code and change it with the intention of creating a better RPI and less of its ancestral hacknslash, this is one of the changes I would make.

[Fujikoma]

If you got killed while AFK, I think I would consider that poor form.

[Armaddict]

Seriously, a man is going to stand out in the desert with a full waterskin and die of thirst? All because his player lost connection. That's a failure of this medium of DIKU to provide what it's intended to provide: a story narrative.

Losing link suspends your hunger and thirst.  It does not protect you from random baddies out in the desert.  It really is a luck of the draw, in its current state. ...

Hey, I agree with the rest of your post, but in this particular situation, what you're talking about didn't happen (hunger and thirst). I wish I could talk about it more, but in respect to the player, I can't provide a lot of details. The staff already knew about it, heh. That's been over and done with for a year, though, so I used that example to illustrate just how bad a linkdead experience can be -- especially with all the time and love we put in our characters.

It adds nothing to the game, and indeed subtracts enjoyment from people who care about their characters, to lose them to this failure of the DIKU medium. If I could get access to the code and change it with the intention of creating a better RPI and less of its ancestral hacknslash, this is one of the changes I would make.

I have gone linkdead for days at a time, unintentionally, and come back to 'reconnected', and been neither hungry or thirsty.