Spamcasting!

[thewolfen3]

Need I quite actually say that much about it? I wish to know what you all view as acceptable for the practice and also improving with this matter.

As always, no actual mechanics required, simply opinions as well as suggestions.

[BadSkeelz]

Introduce critical spell fails where you explode.

[MeTekillot]

Emote as much with your casting as much as you would do with your sparring.

[Lizzie]

So like if you're a broccoli mage, you could do this:

emote The sudden stench of boiled broccoli permeates through the air as @ raises ^me arms overhead. Dead-eyed, as though in a vegetative state as well, #me begins to chant.

and then spam cast til you're out of mana.

[Armaddict]

emote The sudden stench of boiled broccoli permeates through the air as @ raises ^me arms overhead. Dead-eyed, as though in a vegetative state as well, #me begins to chant.

I hope you're super proud of that.

[Revenant]

Spamcasting is fine, just get it out of the way, then get back to emoting about huddling in a corner and crying over your freak of nature status, then way a Templar begging for a hug, be sure to specify you're not talking about the cuddler. More crying. Go out, spook out other mages with your weirdness. Run away, cry some more, think One of these days, I'll show them ALL. I'll SHOW them!

Repeat until mage explodes. Welcome to Armageddon.

[Nergal]

Some suggestions:

- Treat training spells like clans treat training skills. Clans set time for sparring and time for other things as a way to structure the day for PCs. So set a time for yourself too. For example, high sun for a Krathi or at night for a Drovian. Take a day off under certain conditions, like if you're a Whiran and the winds are low.

- Emote/think/feel the process of practicing being under the effect of a spell, if you're casting a spell on yourself.

- Don't worry too much about "spamcasting" unless you're doing it to the exclusion of other things a person would reasonably do and doing it for more than 10-20 minutes or so. If you're roleplaying your character, you're not spamcasting.

[Jihelu]

If you think it would make someone raise an eyebrow, use a few emotes.
If note, you should be fine.

[Asmoth]

The system is sorta wonky in comparison to the rest of the skill system.

As it says in the help file about learning, you learn from failing, and this is partially true for casting, but it's also different if you're talking about increasing the horns of power.

Add in the un and nil reach, real and no effect spell casting and it gets even a little more murky. I know I personally am of the opinion that I wish nil casting was differently emoted command wise instead of looking the same as a real cast, because it's not. So on the outside someone might think you're doing mon un babyeater instead of Wek nil gemlove.

I almost wish the system gave you learning the more spaced out the casting was, like say that I haven't faster spell one in a real life day and I'm trying to get it from Wek to Yuqa, and it took that into effect and gave me a bonus to bumping the power chance versus just being a random dice roll or however it's handled now.

Magick is wierd as shit, the only other system in arm that has confused me as much is the way.

My personal opinion about spam anything is as Nergal said, if you're avoiding people and not role playing them that's a problem, but it also is a system that inherently requires you to cast a shitload to learn, so it's almost a trick box, don't cast too much, be ineffective and weak, cast too much, you're a twink.

I am not a two paragraph, think about every action using the think command and feel every emotion through feel command player, mostly because that's tedious oocly, but I do throw what I feel is a decent amount out.  I just think that sometimes the view of magic mere from the outside is that people only ever see them in one part of their role, the water mate filling barrels over and over and not the person talking about their family they had before they turned wierd.  Or they are using that one person who emotes like they are going for an Oscar in the muddies and assume that everyone else must be a Joliarts trained arm player to do it "right".

[HavokBlue]

I don't know if it's the lack of sleep or what, but the above post is a little bit confusing to read.

[Asmoth]

I don't know if it's the lack of sleep or what, but the above post is a little bit confusing to read.

It's difficult to be too clear on the subject without getting into exact mechanics and having people freak out.

[RogueGunslinger]

IF we're being honest. Skill-gaining is weird as shit in Armageddon in general. It's the only game I've ever played where I look forward to, and celebrate failures.

I'd much rather progression happen on critical success and maybe even a small % of just random use, instead of just failure. That way people aren't trying to manufacture failure in order to progress. And players who are in certain clans can see some progression where the current system stagnates them and puts them behind hunters and the like.

[Delirium]

The most important way to avoid feeling like you're just spamcasting is spend a lot of time - moreso than you would on a normal character, even - developing your character's personality and quirks.

They need habits, hobbies, likes/dislikes, and you need a firm grasp on who they are and how they react to the world.

To do this you really need to be comfortable with solo-roleplay, so that you can develop your story and get a solid feel for your character, whether or not there are witnesses around.

The reason for this is that otherwise, it's way too easy to just feel like your character is nothing but a spell-casting robot, because basically that's what they will be.

source: 1+ years as a gemmed who avoided mingling with mundanes and still had a wagonload of fun.

[HavokBlue]

I don't know if it's the lack of sleep or what, but the above post is a little bit confusing to read.

It's difficult to be too clear on the subject without getting into exact mechanics and having people freak out.

It was more a grammar/sentence structure thing. Sorry. It's hard to bring up without coming across as mean which is not my intention. I think some potentially good points are maybe lost in a post I had difficulty reading but like I said, I'm suffering from lack of sleep right now so if I'm just crazy, disregard me.

[Asmoth]

I don't know if it's the lack of sleep or what, but the above post is a little bit confusing to read.

It's difficult to be too clear on the subject without getting into exact mechanics and having people freak out.

It was more a grammar/sentence structure thing. Sorry. It's hard to bring up without coming across as mean which is not my intention. I think some potentially good points are maybe lost in a post I had difficulty reading but like I said, I'm suffering from lack of sleep right now so if I'm just crazy, disregard me.

No harm no foul, I rolled outta bed and was using my phone in the shower to reply, which is an autocorrect punctuation failure all day.

[wizturbo]

You do not need to spam cast in order to skill up quickly as an elementalist.  I promise.  Treat training spells like any other skill and they'll advance quite swiftly, and you can spend your time having fun making friends, frenemies and enemies instead of staring at 49/106 waiting for a tick.

[HavokBlue]

I don't begrudge people who want to play powerful PCs and I don't begrudge people who derive a good portion of their enjoyment from skilling up their PC.

I think if you do these things to the exclusion of everything else your PC should realistically be doing, or you go sit in a cave and spamcast for five days so you can go PK random hunters with your sick new whiran just because, you should feel bad.

Part of having coded power is handling that power responsibly. Just because your Krathi CAN obliterate that orphanage doesn't mean you SHOULD, regardless of your thinly veiled excuse like "WELL MY PC HATES ORPHANS BECAUSE THIS ONE TIME IN MY VIRTUAL BACKGROUND" or whatever.

[Case]

I spamcast before logging out, otherwise cbf'd. RP is more fun and I'm in no rush. I doubt the benefit anyway, mages die super fast from overconfidence.

[Asmoth]

You do not need to spam cast in order to skill up quickly as an elementalist.  I promise.  Treat training spells like any other skill and they'll advance quite swiftly, and you can spend your time having fun making friends, frenemies and enemies instead of staring at 49/106 waiting for a tick.

This is why I sorta wish there was more code transparency.
Hypothetically:

If I knew that I could slice ginka fruit once an to get better from the get go, Then I wouldn't slice ginka fruit more than once an hour unless I had a reason.

As Help Time says, we play at a really fast pace and you are at a bit of a disadvantage due to things such as stats,action time and fear of bad notes.

If you knew right off the rip what the timers were then it would be easier to plan our it day without being impotent or twinkish.

[Delirium]

In almost every single scenario, the code enforces realistic behavior. So generally you can act like a sentient being would, and you'll progress.

The same is true for magick, maybe even moreso than several mundane skills.

As Case said, a major danger is overconfidence.

Including what I fondly term "30 day warrior syndrome". Not my invention, but it's applicable.

[Asmoth]

Part of having coded power is handling that power responsibly. Just because your Krathi CAN obliterate that orphanage doesn't mean you SHOULD, regardless of your thinly veiled excuse like "WELL MY PC HATES ORPHANS BECAUSE THIS ONE TIME IN MY VIRTUAL BACKGROUND" or whatever.

Why would you kill a bunch of orphans anyways you MONSTER!

(Protects all the orphans)

[Asmoth]

In almost every single scenario, the code enforces realistic behavior. So generally you can act like a sentient being would, and you'll progress.

The same is true for magick, maybe even moreso than several mundane skills.

As Case said, a major danger is overconfidence.

Including what I fondly term "30 day warrior syndrome". Not my invention, but it's applicable.

Few things,

One, how do you really know that it's realistic? Without seeing the code, nobody really knows, they are just spitballing.

Two, the overconfidence is probably a result of people saying that a magicker can wreck people at five days in. It seems that the perception is that magickers are super deadly when they really aren't. (I've killed magickers with warriors and rangers with no issue and been on the swap of that).  So stop treating magickers like they are a nuke when they are really a cherry bomb.

[Revenant]

I agree that if we all knew right from the get-go how the skill timers worked, we'd see a lot of bad habits brought over from hack and slash muds drop off considerably. The joy of the game is weaving a character into an on-going, collaborative story. Skill ups are a tedious chore and I'd prefer to be doing something else with my time, however, they are a necessary evil. When I first started playing, some of the lectures my PC was receiving from others made me feel like a real idiot for having assumed it would work the same as non RPIs I've played, that reward grinding more than interaction. I'm glad I got over that, but it can have a negative effect, the not knowing this thing or that thing. Some things, I think, like basic game mechanics, could have a good deal of benefit if spelled out for newer players. Find out IC just makes some of us feel a bit put-out by the concesdending ways and manners in which we end up learning.

[Delirium]

The helpfiles say it. Don't have time to look it up, but I'm sure if you browse through you will find what I am talking about.

[Nyr]

In almost every single scenario, the code enforces realistic behavior. So generally you can act like a sentient being would, and you'll progress.

The same is true for magick, maybe even moreso than several mundane skills.

As Case said, a major danger is overconfidence.

Including what I fondly term "30 day warrior syndrome". Not my invention, but it's applicable.

Few things,

One, how do you really know that it's realistic? Without seeing the code, nobody really knows, they are just spitballing.

It is true:  in almost every single scenario, the code enforces realistic behavior.  So generally you can act like a sentient being would, and you'll progress.  The same is true for magick.

http://www.armageddon.org/help/view/FAQ%209 explains how skills work.  http://www.armageddon.org/help/view/FAQ%2013 covers magicker FAQ stuff in general.

[Synthesis]

You don't need to spam skills to skill up.

I don't know how many times I've had to say it, but people just don't get the memo.

Trust me, I was pretty damn good at skilling up in my day, and spamming is just not necessary.  It's actually counterproductive if using the skill incurs risk or expense.

Yes, some of the combat skills progress really slowly, but they seem to progress in exactly the same manner (i.e. spamming is neither necessary nor helpful).

My rule of thumb was always "if it fails, stop and go do something else for a while."  It works.  Really well.

[th3kaiser]

Wait, you mean you're not good at skilling up anymore? You've changed, man.

[Asmoth]

You don't need to spam skills to skill up.

I don't know how many times I've had to say it, but people just don't get the memo.

Trust me, I was pretty damn good at skilling up in my day, and spamming is just not necessary.  It's actually counterproductive if using the skill incurs risk or expense.

Yes, some of the combat skills progress really slowly, but they seem to progress in exactly the same manner (i.e. spamming is neither necessary nor helpful).

My rule of thumb was always "if it fails, stop and go do something else for a while."  It works.  Really well.

Then what do you consider a failure in power level leveling? Anything that doesn't bump you from Yuqa to Kral?

Or is it supposed to be a failure when that happens?

[Lizzie]

No Synthesis, you don't "have to" spamcast to skill up.

But you do have to cast until you fail to branch. If you want to branch sooner rather than later, then you have to cast more often than less often. Casting over and over again in the same "session" for the purpose of attempting to fail (and therefore raise your "branch-points") is called spamcasting.

[Asmoth]

No Synthesis, you don't "have to" spamcast to skill up.

But you do have to cast until you fail to branch. If you want to branch sooner rather than later, then you have to cast more often than less often. Casting over and over again in the same "session" for the purpose of attempting to fail (and therefore raise your "branch-points") is called spamcasting.

This doesn't codedly work, unless they are casting at super weak power.

[aeglaeca]

I don't have the impression from the help file that you automatically skill up when you fail, but that there's a chance to skill up upon failure. So casting until you fail a few times seems within reason of the documentation (and also rather tedious).

I'm still on my first character but after seven RL months of play I haven't gotten all my guild skills up to journeyman or even apprentice, so as far as skilling up goes I can understand why players feel the need to twink, especially those who spent karma to play their PCs.

[Asmoth]

I don't have the impression from the help file that you automatically skill up when you fail, but that there's a chance to skill up upon failure. So casting until you fail a few times seems within reason of the documentation (and also rather tedious).

I'm still on my first character but after seven RL months of play I haven't gotten all my guild skills up to journeyman or even apprentice, so as far as skilling up goes I can understand why players feel the need to twink, especially those who spent karma to play their PCs.

Some skills will get raised stupid fast because of player time versus character time.

Like almost every character I have ends up with badass foraging from salting and general grebbing (ranger finding food and water. Stone worker finding stones etc) and I wouldn't consider that twonking at all because I need food and water and I need Sid to get better gear and/or buy spice.

But someone who sneaks everywhere or hides in every room they go into is a twink unless they are an elf or rinther because they are sneaky dirty fucks (it's a joke)

[aeglaeca]

My PC also has a lot of playtime. She just doesn't fail very much. She's very much playable, I'm just saying I completely understand why people would think they need to spamcast (or spam anything) to skill up.

[RogueGunslinger]

Follow a daily schedule for training, much like clans have, and you'll be progressing about as fast possible. Obviously this is going to be different based on wisdom, but it's a good general rule.

If you did this every day and logged in for 24 hours straight you'd be very surprised how much your character will have progressed. No spamming involved whatsoever. The problem of twinking generally comes in when players can't find an easy, realistic ways to train.

[wizturbo]

If you want to play a powerful magicker, the absolute best way to practice your skills is to actually use them in IC situations whenever possible. 

It's more fun, tends to advance skills plenty fast, but most importantly you actually get to experience how some of these spells work.  You think you know how they work, but you don't get a feel for all of their little clever idiosyncrasies without actually trying them in real situations.

[Synthesis]

I don't have the impression from the help file that you automatically skill up when you fail, but that there's a chance to skill up upon failure. So casting until you fail a few times seems within reason of the documentation (and also rather tedious).

I'm still on my first character but after seven RL months of play I haven't gotten all my guild skills up to journeyman or even apprentice, so as far as skilling up goes I can understand why players feel the need to twink, especially those who spent karma to play their PCs.

There's a long-running debate over whether your wisdom score affects a variable "chance to skill-up on failure," whether it affects "amount skilled-up on failure," whether it affects cool-down time, or some combination of the above.  Everyone has their guesses...hypothesis testing is very difficult though, because of the lack of a proper control group.

No Synthesis, you don't "have to" spamcast to skill up.

But you do have to cast until you fail to branch. If you want to branch sooner rather than later, then you have to cast more often than less often. Casting over and over again in the same "session" for the purpose of attempting to fail (and therefore raise your "branch-points") is called spamcasting.

Work smarter, not harder, I always say.

[Malken]

Get drunk (both in game and in real life) and put lots of heavy rocks in your backpack (both in game and in real life) before you cast to improve your chances of failing and also wondering what you're doing with your life.

[Inks]

It's fine. Even max karma players spamcast. Just have a social life outside the temple / lair of doom. Wanting to get better a mage is the same as wanting to get better as any class. Just don't do shit like sleep to regain mp faster between casts and think about what you are doing and who you want to kill/ kank/ both while you grow in power.

Your Pc isn't your skills, if you don't have connections/ friends as a powerful pc your skills / stats won't help you much.


In the end just be realistic as a living person in Zalanthas.

[Synthesis]

Get drunk (both in game and in real life) and put lots of heavy rocks in your backpack (both in game and in real life) before you cast to improve your chances of failing and also wondering what you're doing with your life.

About the only time you absolutely -need- to resort to shenanigans like that is when you're trying to master a mandatory two-handed branched weapon skill on a warrior.  As far as I can tell, nothing else in the skill-related code is so reliable as a warrior's primary hand attack.  I'm sure the staff are aware of it, and I'd be pretty disappointed if they fussed at anyone for training in that way, when it's essentially forced by the code.  It's pretty evil to hand someone a branched weapon skill, and also say, "you'll never master it, and if you try, we'll give you bad account notes."

[Nyr]

Prepare for disappointment.

[BadSkeelz]

It's a good thing that the branched weapon skills are mostly pretty silly. Knives, pikes, and tridents? Really? At least polearms are impressive, even if plenty already exist as chopping or bludgeoning weapons.

Thanks for the thread, OP. I was starting to fear magickers again, but now I can just go right back to resenting and hating them.

[Synthesis]

Prepare for disappointment.

Well, you could be a smartass and leave your honeypot there, or you could have someone look into fixing the problem.

[Nyr]

I mentioned it last month.  If you do the stupid stuff Malken mentioned, you will be asked not to do it.  You do not get a free pass if you believe that there is literally no other way to get your skills increased.

[wizturbo]

Also, maybe mastering some of these advanced weapons is something the staff don't want?  It's perhaps not the best implementation, to have a carrot out there that people want to reach out for but cannot grasp, but the end result may be a net positive for the game.  In my limited experience, some very advanced warriors are so ridiculously overpowered that having this soft cap on their development seems like a great idea to me.  

[Miko]

Some suggestions:

- Treat training spells like clans treat training skills. Clans set time for sparring and time for other things as a way to structure the day for PCs. So set a time for yourself too. For example, high sun for a Krathi or at night for a Drovian. Take a day off under certain conditions, like if you're a Whiran and the winds are low.

- Emote/think/feel the process of practicing being under the effect of a spell, if you're casting a spell on yourself.

- Don't worry too much about "spamcasting" unless you're doing it to the exclusion of other things a person would reasonably do and doing it for more than 10-20 minutes or so. If you're roleplaying your character, you're not spamcasting.

Very helpful post that I think some version of would look great in a helpfile. This question will inevitably come up again and again.

[Synthesis]

I mentioned it last month.  If you do the stupid stuff Malken mentioned, you will be asked not to do it.  You do not get a free pass if you believe that there is literally no other way to get your skills increased.

Eh, well.  To be clear:  I've never done anything that extreme.  I have gone out and done things that really were quite stupid in the grand scheme of things, but could at least be vaguely justified as being in-character.  I'm sure anyone watching knew what the game was.  I think the game is a little silly, though.

Also, maybe mastering some of these advanced weapons is something the staff don't want?  It's perhaps not the best implementation, to have a carrot out there that people want to reach out for but cannot grasp, but the end result may be a net positive for the game.  In my limited experience, some very advanced warriors are so ridiculously overpowered that having this soft cap on their development seems like a great idea to me.   

The problem is that there are some very large perks to having a weapon skill mastered.  Not just "to the point where you no longer miss," but actually mastered as a code percentage.

If you can't master it, you're nerfing yourself quite badly, and while the branched weapons do have some little code perks, they don't come anywhere near to compensating for what you lose by walking around at (apprentice).  It's like...what the hell would be the point of branching "cure light wounds" from "cure serious wounds?"  The only reason anyone even bothers carrying around these weapons is a) they don't realize they're nerfing themselves, b) they don't have any weapon skills in the first place, so a pike is just as good as a spear, c) they're showing off that they branched but really have no intention of ever using that glaive in a fight, or d) they're one of the rare few who intently focused on mastering the branched skill and trained in -just- the right way over 25-30 days' played, and actually have it mastered.

Anyway, the point is:  you only need to do dumb shit to master your skills if you want to master a warrior's branched weapon skill.  The trick is to find a "dumb shit" niche that is plausibly justifiable ICly.  Any other skill or spell in the game can be pretty easily trained without doing silly things, especially spamming, which is what this thread was about.

[wizturbo]

....while the branched weapons do have some little code perks

A bit of a derailment, but as far as I understand it the benefit from these are far past little code perks. 

From the helpfile:  "If one possesses, for example, the 'chopping weapons' skill, then one's usage of an axe is improved both in ability to land blows and to parry those of others, the degree of improvement depending on one's level of accomplishment in that skill."

If you don't know how to use a pike, your defense against it is going to be hampered.  That's not a little thing, that's huge.

[Synthesis]

....while the branched weapons do have some little code perks

A bit of a derailment, but as far as I understand it the benefit from these are far past little code perks.  

From the helpfile:  "If one possesses, for example, the 'chopping weapons' skill, then one's usage of an axe is improved both in ability to land blows and to parry those of others, the degree of improvement depending on one's level of accomplishment in that skill."

If you don't know how to use a pike, your defense against it is going to be hampered.  That's not a little thing, that's huge.

You're woefully misinterpreting that sentence, dude.

It means "If you are good with an axe, you will be better at parrying incoming blows with the axe, that you're using."

The implication is "if you suck with a pike, you will suck at parrying with a pike."

[wizturbo]

Ah, well, if your interpretation is accurate then I stand corrected.  I was always under the impression that not knowing how to use an axe means you're going to be more vulnerable to axe wielders, so there was an incentive to being well rounded.

[bcw81]

Guys, c'mon. Back on topic with y'all.

[Eyeball]

The problem is that the magick system nearly demands spam casting at a certain point of progression with a particular []. Either that or I don't understand how progression works with the system.

[manonfire]

Spamcasting has a place at a specific point in skill mastery, but until you get to that point, there's a better way to go about things.

[wizturbo]

The problem is that the magick system nearly demands spam casting at a certain point of progression with a particular []. Either that or I don't understand how progression works with the system.

Naw, not really.  There are short windows where it might speed things up a bit, but the system definitely doesn't demand it.

[Hicksville Hoochie]

I think the best advice I can give, as how I personally treat the game world, is that you're playing a character first, and a set of coded skills second. Make your PC live as you play, and have fun with your working at skilling up. Don't be afraid to take time off leveling, and going out and doing things a living, breathing person would do. Or maybe be fanatical about being the greatest and overdoing it a bit - but make sure that whatever you're doing is expressed through your characters actions and emotions. Not only does it keep one from looking like a random skillbot, it'll likely make one enjoy their character that much more in the end.

[Incognito]

A question like - do you HAVE to spam cast - I HAD to jump in

You don't HAVE to spam any skill or spell.

You MAY opt to do so.

Interspersed with appropriate RP and at realistic time intervals - will make it more palatable to Staff as well as other players.

If you sit in a spot and start spam casting or skilling or crafting - without doing anything else and zero RP - expect "bad stuff" (tm) to happen to you....

As far as magickers in particular - one thing I've experienced is - for a solo rogue PC, there are certain *conditions* (for lack of any other term which will not reveal IC info) which are more helpful in casting your spells, and also that it is not always easy (ICLY and OOCLY time constraint wise, to get to those optimum conditions every time you log in - so, i would personally say that spamming spells sometimes is fine.

As against this - if you're running a gemmed mage - you have the freedom to practicse your spells throughout the entire day in your temple - so you have more flexibility in spacing out your spell casting.

I hope that helps in some small way.

PS: This is my personal opinion - Staff might have varying opinions - T&C's apply

[Beethoven]

Hm. How much casting is 'spam' casting?

[Marauder Moe]

My personal opinion is give it the same bar as sparring.

Sparring for half a day is pretty common.

Sparring for an entire day is uncommon.

Sparring for an entire day and night is unrealistic/powergamey.

[bcw81]

Hm. How much casting is 'spam' casting?

Morning through night in a concealed location without any emotes whatsoever.

[Synthesis]

My personal opinion is give it the same bar as sparring.

Sparring for half a day is pretty common.

Sparring for an entire day is uncommon.

Sparring for an entire day and night is unrealistic/powergamey a complete waste of time.

[RogueGunslinger]

My personal opinion is give it the same bar as sparring.

Sparring for half a day is pretty common.a complete waste of time.

Sparring for an entire day is uncommon.a complete waste of time.

Sparring for an entire day and night is unrealistic/powergamey a complete waste of time.

ftfy

[Beethoven]

Hm. How much casting is 'spam' casting?

Morning through night in a concealed location without any emotes whatsoever.

Ah, well, no, that is not necessary.

[The Silence of the Erdlus]

My personal opinion is give it the same bar as sparring.

Sparring for half a day is pretty common.

Sparring for an entire day is uncommon.

Sparring for an entire day and night is unrealistic/powergamey.

I used to spamcast for half a day, every day. Nyr pointed it out and told me to stop doing it.

[Eyeball]

You don't HAVE to spam any skill or spell.

You MAY opt to do so.

My experience is that you do need to spam somewhat, after a certain point for a given [], to [] in any reasonable length of time.

[RogueGunslinger]

You don't HAVE to spam any skill or spell.

You MAY opt to do so.

My experience is that you do need to spam somewhat, after a certain point for a given [], to [] in any reasonable length of time.

Only if you want a gain every training session. Which is sort of meta-gamey.

[Eyeball]

You don't HAVE to spam any skill or spell.

You MAY opt to do so.

My experience is that you do need to spam somewhat, after a certain point for a given [], to [] in any reasonable length of time.

Only if you want a gain every training session. Which is sort of meta-gamey.

Let's say you [] once a game day then, and play two games days each RL day.

In my experience, it would take 150 RL days to [].

[CodeMaster]

That almost seems kind of fast to me, if by [] you mean conjure Medusa hair.

[RogueGunslinger]

It's interesting how the system works. Make it easier and the people who can play for 8+ hours a day will be getting maxed character in a couple weeks. Make it harder and the people who only have 1-2 hours a day will take 6+ months. And then of course there's those skills that don't quite play by the rules.

I think the realistic answer lies somewhere in giving people the ability to make slowly generating skill bump allocations based on their time logged out of the game. And for the ones that don't play by the rules you can make successes cause gains.

But, of course, that's only if you want everyone to be able to gain skills at generally the same rates, with the only modifiers being time since creation and character intelligence. I'm sure the person putting in all those extra hours might feel like they're getting cheated if it were the case.

[Clearsighted]

It doesn't take long to max a gicker, whatever your playtimes.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

We need skills. I wouldn't play if we didn't have skills. But, I'd rather not have to grind to get them. A system of any sort that allowed me to make gains and still have fun RPing would be the most ideal. Most of my characters end up half-skilled in combat because I'd rather RP. But to RP certain characters, you need skills, so you need to grind.

I always end up being the guy who's bark is worse than his bite.

[Clearsighted]

We need skills. I wouldn't play if we didn't have skills. But, I'd rather not have to grind to get them. A system of any sort that allowed me to make gains and still have fun RPing would be the most ideal. Most of my characters end up half-skilled in combat because I'd rather RP. But to RP certain characters, you need skills, so you need to grind.

I always end up being the guy who's bark is worse than his bite.

Play more magickers, problem solved! But yes, I hear you about any other class, re: combat skills.

[Chettaman]

So I was reading the faq that Nyr posted about magickers and skimmed over how they manifested. Trauma and developed at an early age and  something else... anyway.

What if there was someone who had an affinity but had no idea. Grew up her whole life as a gardener. You know, bringing things to life and stuff and it wasn't just easy for her she made the impossible happen. - she just chalked it up to her being the best damn gardener ever.

What's everyone's view on this person? They're using their magick and they've been doing it their whole lives. Would that be considered training?... should this person ''practice magick IC'' Or just emote it subtle-like. (or both) Or should they emote their ability at all?

[wizturbo]

What's everyone's view on this person? They're using their magick and they've been doing it their whole lives. Would that be considered training?... should this person ''practice magick IC'' Or just emote it subtle-like. (or both) Or should they emote their ability at all?

Just my two cents on this...  As I understand it, in order to create a magickal effect, you have to say the magick words.  Cantrips, and odd elemental affinity emotes not withstanding, to do magick you have to utter the proper incantation.

Now, an elementalist might be a fantastic gardener because they're in tune with nature, but they wouldn't be doing any magick to get those results, it's just their innate skill at gardening.  To actually get stronger at using magick, i.e. practicing magick, you need to actually cast it in my opinion.

[Jihelu]

What's everyone's view on this person? They're using their magick and they've been doing it their whole lives. Would that be considered training?... should this person ''practice magick IC'' Or just emote it subtle-like. (or both) Or should they emote their ability at all?

Just my two cents on this...  As I understand it, in order to create a magickal effect, you have to say the magick words.  Cantrips, and odd elemental affinity emotes not withstanding, to do magick you have to utter the proper incantation.

Now, an elementalist might be a fantastic gardener because they're in tune with nature, but they wouldn't be doing any magick to get those results, it's just their innate skill at gardening.  To actually get stronger at using magick, i.e. practicing magick, you need to actually cast it in my opinion.

From what I read in the cantrip page you could use X cantrips, if you are X magical class, to help 'grow' things due to your affinity to X element. Maybe thats why X part of Allanak has so many trees or something.

[FantasyWriter]

You can grow lots of things in the desert with an unending supply of water.

[BadSkeelz]

Further proof that magick is a threat to our harsh desert landscape gameworld.