Subdue - Down for the Count

[Malifaxis]

I had a thought.  I have them all the time, usually they do no one any good... but this one, I think, may at least be interesting.

Okay, when you subdue someone successfully, it's determined that you have a pretty good control of where the body goes, and what it does when it gets there.  Roleplaying out the hold is always good, and a number of people do it in various ways from joint locks, to the old arm around the neck, to sitting on your opponent.

What I would like to get some feedback on (good and ill) is the idea of being able to force your opponent in to a certain position depending on your hold.  Something like:

Subdue joe

You subdue Joe Schmoe despite his attempts to resist.

emote wrenches %joe arm behind his back, then levers !joe to the ground on his knees.

subdue joe sit/rest
Using your leverage, you force your opponent to the ground.

This can be extremely useful in several situations, as I see it.  Foremost is making sure that your target doesn't automatically sprint off the second you release your hold.  To use an example:  l337 militia man spots Joe putting spice in his backpack in the dormitory of a certain allanaki bar.  Joe is quickly subdued for questioning, but that militia man can not get the backpack to look in it... he has to have Joe remove it.  Joe can't remove it while subdued.  If militia man releases Joe, Joe can instantly quit out and avoid the problem if Joe is a twink (which does happen).  However, if militia man were able to force Joe to the ground, Joe could not instantly quit out, militia man could re-subdue joe if he rises without permission.

Two other things I wouldn't mind seeing, one much simpler than the other:

Subduing or being subdued adding the 'no-quit' flag that you get from combat.  'You are too excited to quit just now!"  This would also prevent the aforementioned quit problem.

The second, and more complex one, would be the initiation of a sleeper hold.  Based on both person's subdue skills, as well as the strength of the aggressor and the endurance of the victim.
Subdue victim (success)
Sleeper victim/subdue victim sleep
You tighten your grip upon (target) and begin to cut off the airflow.

This wouldn't be an instant sleep, just like IRL, it would take time, and the person would know what was going on, and could try to get out of it.

Thoughts?  Comments?  Insults?

Malifaxis
-Who hopes this idea isn't another flop.

(Edited to include the subdue/sleep action message, and the not instant thing)

[Lazloth]

subdue joe sit/rest
Using your leverage, you force your opponent to the ground.

*shrug*

Subduing or being subdued adding the 'no-quit' flag that you get from combat.  'You are too excited to quit just now!"

Agree.

The second, and more complex one, would be the initiation of a sleeper hold.

Silly.  Makes sap obsolete.

[Dakkon Black]

1: Absolutely agree. Realistic and rad. Make the bastard sit.

2: Great idea. Why not id be exited if I had big burly arms wrapped around me

3: not silly at all. Thats like saying axes make swords obsolete. Its a differnt way to put him down and very realistic. Sap is hard to do. So is sleeper. Every round of combat his stun goes down 20. I love it.

[Carnage]

1.)Not really. If someone wants to get away they'll just stand run w w w. It's only a second or two difference between when they get away and when they don't.

2.)Sure.

3.)Too overpowering.

Something I would personally like to see: Another message for when somone is nosaved and subdued. It looks better to templarate and Militia if you willing hand yourself over.

Then again, I was in the Byn and had a trooper who felt bad for me being so shitty in combat when they were so awesome, so I'm pretty sure they would purposely nosave and let me beat them in wrestling to make my character feel better. Eh, I'm inbetween on the matter now.

[Sephiroto]

I'm all for the 'no quit flag'.  Some people seem to be abusing the ability to quit while being subdued.

[DrunkenSalarr]

A better use would be "subdue joe stand" and adjust the militia scripts so people sitting down on their way to jail to stop them from going doesn't happen anymore.

(This may have already been corrected).

[Anonymous]

Since it was brought up, I think some branches of the subdue skill would be very interesting...
Like maybe a hostage variation, where you subdue someone and attacks against you would go against the one held instead,as you are keeping them between you and harm's way.

While pressing his knife into the back of the cruel-eyed, frizzy-haired templar, the scarred, dune-eyed dwarf exclaims, in sirihish: "Don't come near me or the fancy-robes gets it!"