Half-giant hitpoints

[HavokBlue]

I don't want to be that guy and having experienced the misery of trying to get items made for specific purposes that can't really be solved by ordering a mastercraft I think it would be super cool if staff put out a submission call for half-giant items.

With that in mind, in lieu of any submission call, this is the sort of thing you can work on in-game until the if/when from the imms.

And with that in mind, I wonder if there are any mastercrafts designed for half-giants floating around in the DB that nobody remembers how to make.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

Ideally, weapons would be created with height and str suggestions in mind anyway.

Even simply putting a ideal user size on weapons and allowing deviations in either direction by a size or two  or three would solve most of these problems. Putting a size on weapons AND taking strength into account would be even greater. And for things like darts and throwing knives, size 0 means everyone can use it.

IE:

sword sized 6

giant can't use it
elf, breed, and human can use it normally
dwarf can use it two handed
halfling can't use it

[Kryos]

I've been chewing on this thought a bit, and, I think I'd actually support about a 20-30% bump in their base HP values.  The reason I say this is experiencing first hand a number of conflicts with extremely dangerous targets, either behind the wheel of a HG, or near them in action.

Things that hit hard, tend to be capable of 1 shotting not only the lesser health races, but half giants as well.  In short, the scaling of combat does falter as you compare humans to say, a tembo (a dangerous medium sized encounter), and a HG to say as a common example, a mekillot.  The former having some room for forgiveness if you're hit, realize how bad that is, and still possess a chance to take flight or chose another option of engagement.  With HGs and "big game", that first hit can be the end of the PC.  And I'm purposefully not talking about more uncommon challenges that people should have the joy of discovering themselves.

The ramifications of this in a player versus player environment wouldn't change the 'feel' much.  When a small type racial is attacking a HG, they're already playing the war of attrition game and knowing that 2-3 swings coming back their way would be the end of it, or even 1 lucky one.

Of course, this changes a bit if you veer from 'average' endurance on a HG to the higher ranges.  The higher ranges have about the right feel, I think.  So perhaps just adjusting the scaler so that what is now average is represented instead by what is now good to very good.

[roughneck]

I've been chewing on this thought a bit, and, I think I'd actually support about a 20-30% bump in their base HP values.  The reason I say this is experiencing first hand a number of conflicts with extremely dangerous targets, either behind the wheel of a HG, or near them in action.

Things that hit hard, tend to be capable of 1 shotting not only the lesser health races, but half giants as well.  In short, the scaling of combat does falter as you compare humans to say, a tembo (a dangerous medium sized encounter), and a HG to say as a common example, a mekillot.  The former having some room for forgiveness if you're hit, realize how bad that is, and still possess a chance to take flight or chose another option of engagement.  With HGs and "big game", that first hit can be the end of the PC.  And I'm purposefully not talking about more uncommon challenges that people should have the joy of discovering themselves.

The ramifications of this in a player versus player environment wouldn't change the 'feel' much.  When a small type racial is attacking a HG, they're already playing the war of attrition game and knowing that 2-3 swings coming back their way would be the end of it, or even 1 lucky one.

Of course, this changes a bit if you veer from 'average' endurance on a HG to the higher ranges.  The higher ranges have about the right feel, I think.  So perhaps just adjusting the scaler so that what is now average is represented instead by what is now good to very good.

I agree with this.

[Skeeter]

I think if you were to increase their HP, you'd have to cripple their agility more to compensate it.

I've seen HG's just kinda stand there, and somehow dodge every hit... Realistically, they're not going to be able to dodge even a novice users blows. A good supplement for their now even worse agility could be a skill added specifically for their race, a counter-attack ability since they're unable to catch up to most targets, they'd wait to weather a blow and THEN go for the guy, when he/she is in-close with them.

More HP would make sense, to accomodate it, but just on its own? Don't think so, though I do completely NOT understand how Mul's are supposed to be somehow stronger than HG's? -- THAT doesn't make sense to me.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

Muls are not stronger than giants.

[Cale_Knight]

I don't think half-giants need more total hitpoints, but I think it would be neat if they had a natural damage reduction that only kicks in when they take damage beyond a certain threshold (say, 50 damage).

This would allow HGs to absorb hits from bigger creatures, but wouldn't change their dynamic against normal-sized PCs and whatnot.

[CodeMaster]

I guess a half-giant is the biggest 'thing' a player can be.  I've never played one (but have immensely enjoyed the roleplay of some of them - here's looking at you, Treethoughts), of course -- so feel free to ignore this dweeb.  But if you read the help file for muls, it contains a little dig at half-giants:

Most of the height and cunning of their human ancestry is preserved as well--from a purely scientific point of view, a much better product than half-giants.

One way to interpret this is, vis-a-vis the other races in Zalanthas (incl. true, sea-of-silt giants), half-giants are kind of garbage.  Compared to the PC population, they're the big guys (maybe this is well-reflected in their current HP levels?).  But that's like being the big fish in a small pond.  Compared to many of the other unstoppable monsters that roam Zalanthas, they're minnows.  It kind of makes sense to me that they can get blipped by a Gaj just like the rest of us.

[racurtne]

What this means is that Half-giants are completely incapable of any sort of deception, as stated in the help-files. They are simply unable to lie intentionally. This would also mean that they wouldn't be able to perform any kind of feints in combat.  Also, the height thing is that half-giants are much -closer- to humans in terms of height than they are to the truly massive silt-giants. They're a great big magical 'meh'. They didn't get the desired brains of the humans, and they didn't keep most of the truly massive strength and height of the silt-giants. A near-silt-giant sized intelligent being would be the ideal, and half-giants fall far short. Muls are a superior product, packing dwarven strength onto a near human-sized body (stronger than either), and keeping near human-like intelligence and cunning.

[CodeMaster]

What this means is that Half-giants are completely incapable of any sort of deception, as stated in the help-files. They are simply unable to lie intentionally. This would also mean that they wouldn't be able to perform any kind of feints in combat.  Also, the height thing is that half-giants are much -closer- to humans in terms of height than they are to the truly massive silt-giants. They're a great big magical 'meh'. They didn't get the desired brains of the humans, and they didn't keep most of the truly massive strength and height of the silt-giants. A near-silt-giant sized intelligent being would be the ideal, and half-giants fall far short. Muls are a superior product, packing dwarven strength onto a near human-sized body (stronger than either), and keeping near human-like intelligence and cunning.

Yeah, that's what I meant to say.  they are a meh (but so are we all)

[Harmless]

Whoa, who the hell would want a silt giant sized humanoid with human intelligence? That is fucking scary.

Half giants are great, easy to control, easier to discriminate against, they're a vital member of the hierarchy. A great success, their only weakness is that they can all pretty much do what every other half giant can do, sort of, so they never get to be speshal. Waah. I have seen me many a half giant emo, let me tell you. Must be a fun ass race to play