Half-Elf Roleplay

[musashi]

Tuluk 4 life yo. Only emo's point Allanak. 

[Bogre]

The stereotypes of whiny emo breeds and non grammatically inclined dwarves exist for a reason, I've seen both multiple times IG.

I've seen half-elves done well, I guess- but I don't really know what comprises 'well' for a half-elf. Not that many breed chars pop up in my memory as characters I remember. I'm not sure if that's because they're predisposed to be loners, or unclanned. Personally speaking, their roleplay hasn't really ever appealed to me much.

[DustMight]

I play my HEs like desertman. I think borderline personality or any cluster B fits better than just "depression." Antisocial. Aloof. Cycles of seeking approval. Oversensitive to rejection. Love hate duality. Etc.

As someone who works with borderlines frequently (one time six acutely ill female borderline patients all at once - it was a handful) I have to say, that's not a bad example.  Maybe dump the suicidal tendencies and make the HEs a little more slow to change (docs say, the breeds can cycle over the course of seasons if the player prefers).

I tend to play a lot (not all) of my HEs (my favorite race after mul) with a tough-guy loner attitude (often, however, they are not so tough and fall short of their own expectations) that hold grudges at the drop of a hat for the slightest offenses (real or imagined) but are also quickly forgive and forget if someone warms up to them. In this way, they can be easy marks (when someone plays on their need for attention/friendship) but can also be dangerous because they will remember insults for a long time and the magnitude of the response may be out of reason.  

I saw a really great HE played by a staffer over a long period of time and in reflection (it was not apparent at the time) they did an excellent job of it and anyone familiar with that particular character could do well to think on it's performance and consider HE mentality.

[Vwest]

My next half-elf ranger = StriderBlade Eastwood.

I'm your #1 fan, never change.

If people in Zalanthas were really as cruel as some people seem to want to portray them, they'd be swapping stories about how old they were when they decided it was time to kill their parents because they just weren't as strong or useful anymore. Since I haven't seen this IC yet (Sorcerer kings and nobles don't count, motives are different), I'm going to start with the assumption that they do perhaps have some kind of freaking humanity to them, even if nowhere near as pronounced as in our world.

I'm inclined to agree, I think the forum perspective is skewed by a lot of people looking out out-cred each other with their view of how harsh the game world is.

A society or group of societies where people were all as murderous, vicious and monstrous as the GDB would have you believe wouldn't last, it would never continue to exist given the harshness of Zalanthas. Even if the game world was as lush as Earth, that kind of society wouldn't work. I don't see NPCs or VNPC echos of people murdering each other in the street, of people cannibalizing each other or the powers that be engaged in non-stop acts of public torture or horrendous abuse.

I don't see the documentation that suggests everyone is out murdering the weak and the crippled for their threadbare shoes, or just because they 'aren't fit to live'. From some of the posts you see, you would think it was utter anarchy with bodies piling up in streets painted red with the blood of orphans recently butchered for fresh meat.

You cannot have a society like that, I don't care how fantasy minded you are.

Sorry, the 'rinth doesn't count as a society, I don't even know how we justify it existing at all if we're that hard nosed about pushing realism.

A little more on topic... I have nothing to post, I've never had a half-elf character before and it's a little daunting to balance it all out.

[ShaLeah]

The more I think about it, the more I think anything other than human should be a karma option. Especially half-breeds.

[Fujikoma]

How about just make all races, including humans, be a karma option? That'll sort out all the issues.  

EDIT: Mayhaps there's something to the above post, I really don't know. It would cut down on a lot of variety, freedom to explore, try new things though, in my opinion, which seems to me like it would be a bad thing.

Although, I don't know, whatever.

[ShaLeah]

How about just make all races, including humans, be a karma option? That'll sort out all the issues.  

EDIT: Mayhaps there's something to the above post, I really don't know. It would cut down on a lot of variety, freedom to explore, try new things though, in my opinion, which seems to me like it would be a bad thing.

Although, I don't know, whatever.

The hardest thing about life on Zalanthas is adjusting our real world thoughts/morals/limitations/closed mindedness/open mindedness to fit INTO the world. At least it was for me. Any mindset other than our own is difficult, add to mul mix all that shit Zalanthas has that's allowable, and normal, it's a bit overwhelming.

Being able to play the norm as a human, a normal human, seems an area that new players should familiarize themselves with before jumping into making harder things. Master the hatred towards breeds and elves before you play them so to speak. Get that human superiority nice and sharp.

[gfair]

The hardest thing about life on Zalanthas is adjusting our real world thoughts/morals/limitations/closed mindedness/open mindedness to fit INTO the world. At least it was for me. Any mindset other than our own is difficult, add to mul mix all that shit Zalanthas has that's allowable, and normal, it's a bit overwhelming.

Being able to play the norm as a human, a normal human, seems an area that new players should familiarize themselves with before jumping into making harder things. Master the hatred towards breeds and elves before you play them so to speak. Get that human superiority nice and sharp.

I had this thought as well with the recent Elf tribal thread - if Blackwing is a clan with such power, why not give the tribe a requirement of karma >= 2 to ensure that it is played responsibly?  I think it's safe to say that with great Karma comes great trust (There's a Spiderman paraphrase in there somewhere).

The Dwarven focus is not an easy thing to understand. Balancing the half-elf's love / hate relationship with others isn't either, they can impose some significant consequences.

Maybe not make them a Karma option, but time / experience options.  Say, if a player plays regularly for 3 months, then these options are unlocked.  Because let's face it - the human option alone would in no way limit the experiences new players could have. When I began I went after the elf, the half-elf, the Dwarf because they were all unique, Humans were Vanilla. But if we make the introductory literature Human-centric, we reveal their strengths and weaknesses and why we start off with them.

[musashi]

I understand the temptation, but I really will turn off new players.

I could have been playing Arm at least five years earlier than when I started. But I didn't. Because not being able to app a Mage out the gates turned me off to the game in a big way.

[ShaLeah]

The hardest thing about life on Zalanthas is adjusting our real world thoughts/morals/limitations/closed mindedness/open mindedness to fit INTO the world. At least it was for me. Any mindset other than our own is difficult, add to mul mix all that shit Zalanthas has that's allowable, and normal, it's a bit overwhelming.

Being able to play the norm as a human, a normal human, seems an area that new players should familiarize themselves with before jumping into making harder things. Master the hatred towards breeds and elves before you play them so to speak. Get that human superiority nice and sharp.

I had this thought as well with the recent Elf tribal thread - if Blackwing is a clan with such power, why not give the tribe a requirement of karma >= 2 to ensure that it is played responsibly?  I think it's safe to say that with great Karma comes great trust (There's a Spiderman paraphrase in there somewhere).

The Dwarven focus is not an easy thing to understand. Balancing the half-elf's love / hate relationship with others isn't either, they can impose some significant consequences.

Maybe not make them a Karma option, but time / experience options.  Say, if a player plays regularly for 3 months, then these options are unlocked.  Because let's face it - the human option alone would in no way limit the experiences new players could have. When I began I went after the elf, the half-elf, the Dwarf because they were all unique, Humans were Vanilla. But if we make the introductory literature Human-centric, we reveal their strengths and weaknesses and why we start off with them.

I understand the temptation, but I really will turn off new players.

I could have been playing Arm at least five years earlier than when I started. But I didn't. Because not being able to app a Mage out the gates turned me off to the game in a big way.

I wouldn't think a 3-6 month karma option for other than human would turn off more players than being told they're doing it wrong.

[Fujikoma]

Maybe having words more specific than "You're doing it wrong" would help. 3-6 karma options? I've seen posts from players playing two years who don't have a single point... Much less all the limitations imposed by that from guild/subguild options to even be in the range for special applications, not to mention I've read they want you to have some elven RP experience before you even try for desert elf. Are you sure this makes sense?

EDIT: What I see as the problem is far too few others playing races other than human to provide an example, though there are a few here and there I've run across. Tagging that shit with karma, it'll either need to be seriously buffed or it's going to die... Well, except dwarves...

[musashi]

I wouldn't think a 3-6 month karma option for other than human would turn off more players than being told they're doing it wrong.

You say that, but seriously. I played Harshlands instead of Armageddon despite UnderSeven (who went to high school with me) relentlessly trying to lure me over to Armageddon the whole time, for about five years.

I only finally crossed over because Harshlands puttered out to basically dead and still had nothing remotely resembling a mage option in the pipeline, so I was like ugh, fuck it. I'll deal with being mundane for my first couple of characters.

Needless to say, after buying into Armageddon, I love the karma system and think it's important for maintaining the feel of the game. I had a blast with the mundane classes I played, and <3 rangers something fierce.

But for potential new players who have not bought in yet, I think it's a barrier to entry as is, and would be worse if they looked at their options and saw just human. For the sake of restricting exceptionally rare and codedly powerful guild and race options, I think it's a barrier worth bearing, but we gotta have a balance there. Put too much stuff behind the karma wall and I think we'll quickly reach the point of diminishing returns when it comes to juggling getting new players, and keeping a high quality of RP.

[Lutagar]

HUMAN WARRIOR
NO ITEMS
FINAL DESTINATION

[hyzhenhok]

I disagree that half elves and dwarves are particularly difficult. Really it depends if the newbie has experience with roleplaying (and IRP MUDs). And it's not like newbies get into the game as dwarves/breeds with zero staff oversight. Their apps have to be approved just like everyone else's.

I can see the argument for elves, but not breeds and dwarves.

Though it'd be funny if breeds had a mul-like function, only instead of randomly raging and attacking shit they are randomly forced to >rebel.

[Delirium]

My first character was a half-elf. I read the docs. Despite my many newbie mistakes with the code and a few silly RP scenarios I still got kudos for "good half-elven roleplay".

So my point is that it's possible to jump into the game and play a race - other than human - well.

[Narf]

My first character was a half-elf. I read the docs. Despite my many newbie mistakes with the code and a few silly RP scenarios I still got kudos for "good half-elven roleplay".

So my point is that it's possible to jump into the game and play a race - other than human - well.

I think dwarf and half-elven role play is much more of a 'learn by doing' experience. In that sense, having appropriately responding human players is far more helpful to new players I think.

[Harmless]

I know somebody here who started out with half elves and is now easily one of the most celebrated players around.

[ShaLeah]

Maybe I've just never seen a "well played" half-elf?

Side effect of playing humans most likely. 

[hyzhenhok]

Maybe I've just never seen a "well played" half-elf?

Side effect of playing humans most likely. 

I think this is why you see people complain about badly RP'd breeds and dwarves: a lot of their racial roleplay happens internally. You don't see them being well-played because you can't read their inner monologues. Elves, by contrast, have racial docs the specify how external interaction should happen.

[Fujikoma]

I haven't played a breed (that I can remember) but I think I'd opt for a personality full of highs and lows, a propensity to addiction, envy, longing and a huge tendency to volley between extremes in thought primarily. I think it and muls are the hardest races psychologically.

Perhaps, ShaLeah, since you seem to have such a good grasp on how it's done, it would be a good idea to try it sometime and show people like me what it takes...

Playing a human, especially an avid breed hater, will limit your interaction with them and naturally dispose you to thinking what little you see of them is all there is to them. Meanwhile, playing a breed means you're pretty much going to be interacting with other breeds, maybe dwarves and elves, and just MIGHT be able to befriend a half-giant or two, while humans take every opportunity to crap on you. I'm not complaining, it's what you sign up for when you select the race.

If you do this, keep in mind, paranoia is your friend when they really ARE out to get you.

[manipura]

Perhaps, ShaLeah, since you seem to have such a good grasp on how it's done, it would be a good idea to try it sometime and show people like me what it takes...

Playing a human, especially an avid breed hater, will limit your interaction with them and naturally dispose you to thinking what little you see of them is all there is to them. Meanwhile, playing a breed means you're pretty much going to be interacting with other breeds, maybe dwarves and elves, and just MIGHT be able to befriend a half-giant or two, while humans take every opportunity to crap on you. I'm not complaining, it's what you sign up for when you select the race.

If you do this, keep in mind, paranoia is your friend when they really ARE out to get you.

I don't think this is necessarily true, not all the time at least.  There are plenty of humans that will interact with breeds, whether they despise them or not.  If a human thinks that they can take advantage of a breed or get them to do something for them, many will.  They won't necessarily like it, and maybe the whole time they'll have an internal running dialogue about how much they hate having to deal with this disgusting creature, but if they can see some benefit of using the breed to their advantage, they will. 
To many humans a breed is an undesirable 'thing' that they wouldn't choose to be around, but they realize that these undesirable 'things' are often more than willing to do whatever is asked of them in the hopes of maybe being accepted.

[ShaLeah]

Maybe I've just never seen a "well played" half-elf?

Side effect of playing humans most likely. 

I think this is why you see people complain about badly RP'd breeds and dwarves: a lot of their racial roleplay happens internally. You don't see them being well-played because you can't read their inner monologues. Elves, by contrast, have racial docs the specify how external interaction should happen.

Fair enough point, I -don't- know what's going on in their head, only what they outwardly show. That said, I have "friended" half elves, and I can say without a doubt that they were all played as either elves or humans without sticking to gaining the acceptance of the race they're acting like, they've all ended up being the kind that wants everyone to love them. Half-elves do have documentation that specify their norms.

I haven't played a breed (that I can remember) but I think I'd opt for a personality full of highs and lows, a propensity to addiction, envy, longing and a huge tendency to volley between extremes in thought primarily. I think it and muls are the hardest races psychologically.

Perhaps, ShaLeah, since you seem to have such a good grasp on how it's done, it would be a good idea to try it sometime and show people like me what it takes...

Playing a human, especially an avid breed hater, will limit your interaction with them and naturally dispose you to thinking what little you see of them is all there is to them. Meanwhile, playing a breed means you're pretty much going to be interacting with other breeds, maybe dwarves and elves, and just MIGHT be able to befriend a half-giant or two, while humans take every opportunity to crap on you. I'm not complaining, it's what you sign up for when you select the race.

If you do this, keep in mind, paranoia is your friend when they really ARE out to get you.

The thought of delving into that psyche isn't as unappealing to me as it once was but I don't think I'd do it the justice it deserves due to things outside the mentality roleplay.  I may try it though to challenge myself and make the lowest of the low breedy type, a gemmed rinther who lusts after half giants and stumps

To many humans a breed is an undesirable 'thing' that they wouldn't choose to be around, but they realize that these undesirable 'things' are often more than willing to do whatever is asked of them in the hopes of maybe being accepted.

I wouldn't feel so badly about the half-elves I have seen and dealth with if they had to work harder to get accepted. If they -were- taken advantage of (and mind you, paying 20 sid for that 30 sid hide is NOT taking advantage of them) and they stupidly kept coming back for more, it'd make more sense to me.

[Morrolan]

Okay, I'm going to try to >rescue this thread from "how bad can we treat the breeds"/"GDB hate-cycle."

Here are some things to think about when it comes to halfbreeds:

• Half-elves have a fundamental instability in their "character."*
• Additionally, half-elves can (almost) never call on even the most general kinship links with humans or elves. They lack the basic racial/tribal support network.
• For the two reasons above, as well as others, half-elves automatically have terribly low social status. This makes it impossible for them to attain certain positions.
• Half-elves are uncommon.

Just playing those four things should be enough to flesh out any half-elf.

* Note - This use of the word "character" takes more explanation, as we mostly have stopped using the word this way in English.

Half-elves present with symptoms similar to emotional/spiritual trauma, especially those associated with a lowered/fragile sense of self. What makes them different from other trauma victims is that theirs doesn't come from experience, even thought though such experiences can heighten their symptoms.

The half-elf's fundamentally fragile sense of self gives him or her neither the ability to trust (connect) nor to maintain an independent identity (not connect).

[The Silence of the Erdlus]

Okay, so.

I haven't done it yet because I'm not sure, but is it logical to play an Aragorn type of breed?

Many breeds in the game seem to take on a sort of 'LAME' label, in capital letters, in terms of how they perceive themselves. Aragorn doesn't have this. He knows he does not belong anywhere, he doesn't want any part of human or elven society, at least he acts like he doesn't, yet you get glimpses of what that kind of life is like for him, night after night of sleeping alone in the wilderness, and it seems unbelievably lonely and it must affect him somehow. Yet in my mind I can't separate being a breed from being a mentally broken individual, as well as a social outsider. Thoughts?

[Zoan]

All my half-elves are now forever going to be one variation or another of Thomas Raith.

I AM IN LOVE WITH MY GIRLFRIEND BUT HER LOVE BURNS ME I AM SO TRAGICALLY BEAUTIFUL AND ALONE.