Analyze and Brewing

[Maker]

Is analyze working on brewed objects?  I have a tablet that I brewed, but, when I try to analyze it, says I can't tell how it was made.  What caught my attention, though, was that the "You can't tell how it was made" message seems to fit the one the help file says means I don't have a skill that could make it.  Since Brewing is an archaic part of the code, I'm hoping this is just an oversight and that, one day, my analyze skill will increase to the point I will be able to discern how brewed objects are made.

[Delusion]

Analyze doesn't increase. I think that how brewing works, and how it's different from conventional crafting, is something that should probably be found out IC rather than bringing it to the GDB. Experiment, or ask other PCs.

[Maker]

is something that should probably be found out IC rather than bringing it to the GDB

Find out if the implementation of game mechanics is functional....IC?  Not asking about how to brew anything.  Just wanted to know if it works on brewed items.

[X-D]

Analyze only works on items that use the "craft" Syntax to make...far as I know.

[Lizzie]

is something that should probably be found out IC rather than bringing it to the GDB

Find out if the implementation of game mechanics is functional....IC?  Not asking about how to brew anything.  Just wanted to know if it works on brewed items.

It doesn't work on brewed items for a number of reasons. For the liquids (such as tea and booze) it's because the analyze skill is analyzing the container, not its contents.

On solids (such as tablets), it's because there are *so* many possible ingredients it would scroll the screen several pages just to analyze a single tablet (since it offers you every possible combination, as long as your character is skilled enough to see every possible combination).

[solera]

This explains a bit.  On one PC I figured I couldn't brew a tablet yet, because I couldn't analyze a basic one. I thought my brew skill must have been a clan skill for homebrewing.
It's a pity, because I have wanted to do this since I started playing and this PC was the first one to accumulate a few Ranger skills.  Next time!

[Synthesis]

Using assess -v on plant products will help immensely, assuming you have the skill.

[Nyr]

The reason you can't analyze brewed items is because of the fact that brewing is an odd beast!  It is presently a craft as well as a skill.

Brew is a craft when you use the "craft" command.  The end product created from this command can be analyzed.
Brew is a skill when you use the "brew" command.  I don't think you can analyze stuff created from this command because analyze is specifically for crafted items.

[Maker]

The reason you can't analyze brewed items is because of the fact that brewing is an odd beast!  It is presently a craft as well as a skill.

Brew is a craft when you use the "craft" command.  The end product created from this command can be analyzed.
Brew is a skill when you use the "brew" command.  I don't think you can analyze stuff created from this command because analyze is specifically for crafted items.

Seems like brewing and crafting are similar in that they both function using recipes of items.  If analyze works the way I expect it would, which would be to provide the user with the ingredients the recipe calls for, would it not be trivial to extend analyze to function with brewed items?

[Maker]

Ahh, or is it that brewing is not a skill on a continuum and that analyzing any brewed item by someone with the brew skill would give the ingredients, making brewing, itself, trivial?

[kayza]

I think it be neat if ingredients got more general descriptions and only people will certain skills that use them would really know their value.(doesn't have to require actual use)

So if you then made a different char, you would not just pick up the same item and say.. hey I know this can be made into a sword or tablet or whatever.

But since I'm just yapping, let's just overhaul the entire crafting/brewing system while we are at it also!

[Nyr]

There is a crafting system and a brewing system.  The stuff created by brewing is brewing stuff.  The stuff created by crafting is crafting stuff.  Analyze works on crafted goods.  If you used the "brew" command to make something, you cannot analyze the finished product.

[Maker]

There is a crafting system and a brewing system.  The stuff created by brewing is brewing stuff.  The stuff created by crafting is crafting stuff.  Analyze works on crafted goods.  If you used the "brew" command to make something, you cannot analyze the finished product.

Oh.  So the intention is that brewed objects, by design, should not be able to be analyzed?

[Delirium]

I don't think it was by design - the brew system pre-dates the crafting system by at least a few years, if I recall correctly.

This game is old.

[Maker]

I don't think it was by design - the brew system pre-dates the crafting system by at least a few years, if I recall correctly.

This game is old.

Honestly, it would make sense, though.  Who can look at a brick of mashed/ground up herbs and flowers and tell you what herbs and flowers were put into it? That would sit better with me than just that brewing is an old mechanic that was never updated because, yes, the game is old, which means there was plenty of time to update it... 

[Nyr]

The crafting system is newer than the brew system, IIRC.  At some point, staff wanted to create crafting recipes using "brew" as a prerequisite--thus it was added to the crafting system.  It was even debated whether brew should be moved entirely to the crafting system.  "It's old, it needs to be updated." Once it was reviewed, it was made clear that brew is a unique animal and not necessarily broken or outdated, just different.  

I had to bang it into my head that brew was not crafting.  It made it a lot easier to understand.

[Maker]

I had to bang it into my head that brew was not crafting.  It made it a lot easier to understand.

Fair enough.  Commencing banging.

[Kismetic]

While we're here, does brew ever go above novice, or is it like analyze?  Or more to the point:  Can you fail a brew attempt?

[thatkid]

There is a crafting system and a brewing system.  The stuff created by brewing is brewing stuff.  The stuff created by crafting is crafting stuff.  Analyze works on crafted goods.  If you used the "brew" command to make something, you cannot analyze the finished product.

Aww man
That makes it harder to play the cliche, evil sophisticate noble who can tell what ingredients were put it into a wine just by tasting it D:

[Schrodingers Cat]

While we're here, does brew ever go above novice, or is it like analyze?  Or more to the point:  Can you fail a brew attempt?

I've failed while crafting things that require the brew skill.

[Maker]

While we're here, does brew ever go above novice, or is it like analyze?  Or more to the point:  Can you fail a brew attempt?

I've failed while crafting things that require the brew skill.

But did you use the brew command or the craft command?  I think Nyr was saying that brewing has both "brew"ed object s and "craft"ed objects.  I think I remember reading a thread from a while ago when I was researching past discussions on this that brewing does not increase.

[Kismetic]

It seems I have some exploring to do with brewing. 

[Schrodingers Cat]

Just to clarify, I used the craft command.

[Drayab]

I've failed while crafting things that require the brew skill.

But did you use the brew command or the craft command?  I think Nyr was saying that brewing has both "brew"ed object s and "craft"ed objects.  I think I remember reading a thread from a while ago when I was researching past discussions on this that brewing does not increase.

You can increase your brew skill by failing to crafts objects that are part of the brew skill's craft set, just like all the rest of the crafting system. Specifically, this works when you are using the craft command, as in you type 'craft <ingredients> into a <finished product>.' Further, you can use the analyze command on these products to see how they are made.

The brew command is the strange beast, and how it works is best learned IC. Analyze doesn't work on products produced with 'brew tablet <ingredients>'.

[Maker]

Really don't think you can raise brewing...