Serial Killers

[Zharal]

I had to start this thread after reading the psychoath topic.  How do you feel serial killers should be played?  The only reason I ask is it seems the best serialkillers(  I dont mean the avarage killer or raider, this is arm and that is a part of the game, Im thinking of serial killers as a specialized individual that goes to the root of his emotional core.)
where very personable, friendly and often time where even well known by there victems. After reading the last topic, I found there to be a lot of thoughtfull Ideas and just am just curious on your
thoughts on how one would be played and in and also important what ways would'nt become frowned apon from the imms.(example being. if it where accidently missunderstood that a character is out on a twinking, pk KILLING spree or if hes actually is playing a valid part of his storyline and being)   I 've never been one to do PK's, always takes from the game in my opion.
But if such a character or characters where to exist, wouldn't he end up being the best of friends will all he comes in contact with and if  a certian idea or trigger  arises
from one of his associates/friends, for example says and off comment, or does and action that fires up the pyschopath in the indivdual and he starts planning the demise of the individial while still
being a good frind to his target and showing no signs of the situation at hand.  Hmmmm Perhaps its a role that you have to keep the imms notified of your actions and the thoughs behind them on a regualr basis so they can be up to date so you dont look like a killing twink....

[Synthesis]

Before we get started, let's make sure we're maintaining a distinction between people who kill primarily because it's their business, and people who kill for pleasure.  That is, thugs and hit men aren't necessarily serial killers.

Also, it's probably important to draw a line between killing because it makes sense within the gameworld vs. making sense within the code structure and the meta-elements of the game.  (E.g. it doesn't make sense for a common thug to kill everyone he mugs within the gameworld, but it makes much more sense when you consider meta-elements such as easy identification, lack of anonymity, the "it's a small world" phenomenon, OOC communication, etc.)

[bcw81]

If I remember right, I recall one of the staffers saying they would prefer players to not spawn as mass murderers, and would rather them get that way (deluded) through IC actions.

[Kinther]

Half the fun of roleplaying such a character would be the development of the personality.  Maybe you had a mate which was brutally murdered, then you go on a rampage to avenge them.  When all your enemies are rotting under the desert sun, you find you can't stop killing. 

Suddenly, you become Dexter Morgan.

[Zharal]

I agree that it should be something that develops ig. Slowly manifisting itself as perhaps a mental illness or a sittuation that changes the person mentally or even breaks there pysic but again it starts to crate a fine line between insanity and a natral pretator, not for coin or pleasure but because for some reason ofcorse made up ingame that causes the person to have to try and kill anouther being., or become vindictive and spend his life on the persuite of setting up his target to create and art of death that is extremly hard to capture.  Only on the thought that in rl most serial killers can go many years, some most there lives and never get captured. Aslo just one last thought, many serial kills go into a dormant stat, they can go into seculusion for many years with out killing again...

[Marauder Moe]

Only on the thought that in rl most serial killers can go many years, some most there lives and never get captured. Aslo just one last thought, many serial kills go into a dormant stat, they can go into seculusion for many years with out killing again...

Sounds like a good excuse to ignore that aspect of the character when things get too hot and/or no easy targets present themselves.

[Whiran Luck]

<A lot of stuff plus...> Only on the thought that in rl most serial killers can go many years, some most there lives and never get captured. Aslo just one last thought, many serial kills go into a dormant stat, they can go into seculusion for many years with out killing again...

I was going to write up a long post, but I'm tired.

It's best not to get your information off of tv shoes or fiction/pop culture or dramaticized accounts. My recommendation is if you want to play a serial killer, is to do a lot of research on it from a variety of sources, especially on the different psychopathologies that can lead people to become serial killers. Just from looking over a lot of the stuff posted here, there's a lot of stuff that's actually not correct and trying to generalize why people kill, especially in the form of serial killers just doesn't really work very well. All characters should really be who they are, with a what they do second, whatever they play. If you want to play any 'tricky' or abnormal role based on rl stuff, real research is your friend.

[Dar]

What makes a person a serial killer, answer that and you might be able to make a compelling character. Note that the term 'a serial killer' did not rise up only until a few centuries ago. Not because mental illnesses that made people  serial killers did not exist, but because there were plenty of ways of exercising the 'urges' without being coined a serial killer. Hell, how many people were considered great and brave warriors during the dark ages, who had those very same urges, but due to easy influx of enemies to kill, were never considered evil or sick. How many serial killers worked in Inquisition? Was Thomas Tarquemada a serial killer?

Same goes for Arm. You might want to play out Dexter Morgan, but ask yourself ... why? Why do you have to hide your killer nature, if you can just go join Byn, Kurac, or Militia. You will have plenty of opportunity to exercise your murderous sadistic qualities and people might actually pay and praise you for it.

Of course your murderous nature may be more extreme. In which case you are a rampaging murderer. But if that's the case, then it's doubtful that you have any kind of social skills to be a serial killer 'a le dexter' instead you a are little more then an animal. Such things do happen, and in the past times ... were quickly proclaimed to be possessed by the devil, hunted down like a rabid dog, and slain.

A hitman is a little different, since they might end up needing to take down people who are not nobodies, not breeds, and not enemies. People who have political clout and DO have connections who will exact revenge. While of course hitmen might be serial killers as well, but odds are they wouldnt be very successful at what they do, just due to the sheer amount of noise they would produce and the fact that they would be working for free.

[Spoon]

I think it could be a great role if done in good taste. There's a lot of panic in the OP about being smacked by the Imms for going on a killing spree... I really can't see this happening unless it's been done incredibly clumsily and without much thought. You should really be spending a long time gearing up to the actual killing. Serial killers are not going to be famous on Zalanthas... if you kill five people in ten years no-one's going to be shocked.

I suggest picking merchant. I can imagine picking an assassin would likely corrupt the concept.

[Desertman]

I don't like those serial killers that kill just to do it. The ones who will kill anyone they get a chance to kill.

I prefer the ones with a method to their madness. Like the one's who only kill blondes, or only kill people that accept gifts from them if they offer them, or something like that.

The creepo killers are the best killers.

Pic Related...

[Potaje]

I killed Captain Crunch, now the Militia is after me.

[Zharal]

I give you kuddos Dar, I like an agree with a good portion of your thoughts. But I think the lime between a killer and a serial killer is getting a bit tangled in my
opion. In Arm anyone can be a killer.. its a way of life. You want to kill join the byn or get a blade and die in the sands trying to take out a scrab.  Perhaps the
concept of a serial killer doesnt fit into arm, but I dont belive this not to be so.  My thoughts are that a Serial Killer as a norm ( I can be wrong here plz ust go with it)
Is not a killer, doesnt join the police to shot somone when the time is right. I belive they are usally very normal folks, have normal jobs and good friends but there
is just somthing not quite right and when the moment presents itself, an opertunity or possible the person wears just that one pair of shoes that trigers you into
a serial killer mood.  At this point one could spend months to years setting up the perfect situation to gain the most pleasure out of his act.  Remeber alot to
most serial killers follow the same method of action.  Over time the method can change slightly but there usally the same.  And sorry Im not much on T.V. I do alot of
reading.

[Krishnamurti]

You could play a serial killer who likes to hunt Chosen or Faithful in Tuluk. That would go against the grain, and it would both necessitate great skill at killing and getting away with it, as well as social skills to get in close or appear as distant from your true nature as is possible. You'd have to hide your true nature very carefully.

[spicemustflow]

There really is a lot of ways one can play a serial murderer. From Richard Trenton Chase chaotic evil kill-anything-for-no-reason type to more sane and organized type like, say, a copy of countess Bathory or some shit like that, you could have a powerful, rich individual with steady supply of slave meat and reason to torture and kill them. Also, not every serial killer has to have MO or even to murder all the time. I think that a less than capable soldier who scores a kill once in every blue moon but spends his nights in vivid fantasies to be far more interesting than some emotionless and capable Dexter clone.

Crimelibrary is a great site for those interested in serial killers (and other types of criminals in general): http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/index.html

[DustMight]

What is the attraction of playing a serial killer?


It always strikes me (my perspective, as flawed as it is) that these types of characters are an attempt to play killers with no real regard to the game world.  Is it a "I'm a killer, I don't care! Hahaha!" kind of thing?

Why not play someone who is mean and brutal and likes killing and has his/her own twisted logic and is deeper than a crazy? Why define them as a serial killer?  What do you get with that definition?  What does it free you, as the player of the character, to do or act out?  What do you gain?

Is is the attraction of playing the unrepentant villain?  The "evil guy?"  In my mind the best/worst evil guys are the ones that in RL run our corporatocracy, not the ones who run amok killing wayward folk for a number of years.  These so-called serial killers kill maybe 20, 50, 100 people in their lifetime while the former thousands, perhaps millions.  

Playing the guy who is "bad" because of the life around him forces him to be that way seems infinitely more interesting to me.

I remember playing at length with a famous character X.  Great character, supportive, helped out, taught - really enjoyable.  Everyone in his little group got close to him, loved him, was loyal to him.  Then came the time when he tricked me, got me alone and killed me for very IC plausible reasons.  At that point when he was just about to send my character to the dirt, he fessed up that he had also killed my characters best friend many months ago (that character had gone missing) for discovering a secret about him that up until then had only been a rumor.

So in on swell foop, nice guy turns to bad guy (was really a bad guy all along - maybe, maybe not), shows no mercy and explains everything all at once revealing our worst fears were true and that indeed we had tricked ourselves.

Was he a serial killer?  No.  Far more interesting.  Far more subtle.  The highest of RP.  Kudos to that player.

[Coat of Arms]

I'm pretty sure playing a serial killer is generally frowned upon by staff, but if you can actually pull it off in a way that doesn't do more harm than good to the game, you can probably get away with it. The problem is that that's very difficult to achieve in such a role, and it's most often attempted by the type of player who has no other way to make their characters relevant. An actual bona-fide serial killer is practically never attempted, but you get your fair share of people who kill whenever the thinnest excuse comes up, and that's what hurts the game.

If you were to play a serial killer in a less harmful way, the first thing to consider is that your targets don't always have to be PCs. Whenever you kill a PC for no reason, you've almost certainly hurt the game in some way, even if you can justify it with your background. A meaningless death accomplishes nothing while a death that comes as the consequence of actions sustains the game. It can also create more roleplay than it takes away through the death of said PC, but this is rarely the case when they were killed for the sake of killing.

So, target NPCs instead until killing a PC actually makes some sense. You could murder an NPC once per RL week for a month, leaving clues and asking staff to have witnesses spread rumors. That'll get a plot started and alert players to your presence without just killing a significant portion of the ones who are supposed to care. It's the presence of a serial killer that can create roleplay, not the deaths of PCs, this can happen once or twice along the way to emphasise the gravity of the plot and suggest to players that they can't just ignore it. If you just hide somewhere and gank someone now and then without providing the material to make a plot out of it, all you'll do is make some players lose their PCs and eventually you'll die to something. Going mainly for NPCs allow you to kill in a more visible way that allows you to not only attract player attention instead of deterring it, but also live long enough that your actions matter.

Never make a competition out of it. The goal shouldn't be to kill as many PCs as possible, that'll just make it a worse game for all your victims. Once you've managed to establish a plotline around your activities, you can kill a PC to make the plotline peak a little, but not until that death adds more than it costs. Your ultimate goal is to be a positive factor in the game, and it takes a lot of effort and consideration to not be OOCly destructive with a character whose purpose is to kill. This is why it's rarely worth doing.

[Calavera]

I removed a couple posts. If you have a complaint about the way somebody is roleplaying, use the request tool. We do not tolerate call-out posts, nor posts with specific information about other people's characters.

[path]

Yeah. I betcha the staff frowns on serial killing. They'd be like...dude, too harsh. Tone it down some.

[Calavera]

Yeah. I betcha the staff frowns on serial killing. They'd be like...dude, too harsh. Tone it down some.

We also hate blood. And swearing. And alcohol and drug use.

Try to keep it PG, guys.

[Zoan]

We keep up all this murder, corruption and betrayal and Westboro will start picketing our server.

[Synthesis]

We keep up all this murder, corruption and betrayal and Westboro will start picketing our server.

Never read the Old Testament, have you?

[Kinther]

We also hate blood. And swearing. And alcohol and drug use.

Try to keep it PG, guys.

Whaaaaaa? My favorite four things!

[Zoan]

We keep up all this murder, corruption and betrayal and Westboro will start picketing our server.

Never read the Old Testament, have you?

In fairness, I don't think they have either.

[Cind]

if i were ever to play a serial killer, which i would not because no interest, i would kill vnpcs and npcs and maybe a bird or two out of the sky on my way home, with a big grin on my face. my main OOC goal would be the creation of fear amongst other pcs, rather than killing the pcs themselves, unless the opportunity is too obvious and too good for the game to pass up.

just an idea.

I think it could be a great role if done in good taste. There's a lot of panic in the OP about being smacked by the Imms for going on a killing spree... I really can't see this happening unless it's been done incredibly clumsily and without much thought.

[Synthesis]

We keep up all this murder, corruption and betrayal and Westboro will start picketing our server.

Never read the Old Testament, have you?

In fairness, I don't think they have either.

[RogueGunslinger]

A serial killer who only kills vnpc's and npcs would not make PC's have any sort of fear at all. They would probably just think you're a twink.

[evilcabbage]

A serial killer who only kills vnpc's and npcs would not make PC's have any sort of fear at all. They would probably just think you're a twink.

Or get them pissed off enough to hunt you down and kill you.

But anyone who kills NPCs/PCs/vNPCs is apparently a twink, and deserves to die, according to the philosophy of a select few who play this game.

Honestly, if you're average Joe Commoner, and you hear about a string of blonde haired blue eyed men and women being killed in your part of town, and you have blonde hair and blue eyes? You gonna be scared!

[Potaje]

I'm just going to add, that if you do kill someone, arrange the body to show it. I think just finding a body on the ground I usually think, oh that person must have died or hunger, thirst, heat exhaustion, old age, or anything but murder.

[Dar]

But anyone who kills NPCs/PCs/vNPCs is apparently a twink, and deserves to die, according to the philosophy of a select few who play this game.

I guess I am of those select few.

In all honesty, I would have no problems with you killing only vnpcs and npcs. As long as you arrange each murder with the Imms so someone is there to animate your potential victim and the world around you.


Otherwise ... you're just abusing the AI's lack of the I.

[Zharal]

I'm just going to add, that if you do kill someone, arrange the body to show it. I think just finding a body on the ground I usually think, oh that person must have died or hunger, thirst, heat exhaustion, old age, or anything but murder.

I agree.. one should arange the body so it shows there is mischift at hand and give a clue to the local milita that there is a situation at hand so they can try and get involved.  See I started this post to see the idea you all have as to how you would play a serial killer, what is a serial killer and why is he or she such. How would one play a role so that the Imms know your not just pking for kicksan grins as this can cause damage to storielines and create disinterest for players that lose there character to a twinkish death.  In truth after alot of reading on this post I belive that a well played serial killer is one that is your avarge joe, but under the serface is a twisted issue that could have been created in many ways from mental illness to mental distress due to tramatic events in the characters life.  I belive that a serial killer could be your best friend and a truly nice guy but something happends and he decideds that someone or a vpc needs to die, it should be well thouth out and played out. Also I belive that you should write the imms fore beginning your hunting to take out your target so they can know what is going on. Lots of think comands as well.  And remember it could be a situation that could take months to years to actually do the deed and you want to leave some sort of clue to let the general poulation know that there is a killer about and generate fear in the general public as well as give the militia something to do as they would focus on a killer on the lose.

[roughneck]

A serial killer who only kills vnpc's and npcs would not make PC's have any sort of fear at all. They would probably just think you're a twink.

Everyone knows that a pc who is a serial killer of npcs is just powering up until they start coming after pcs.  Kill them first!

[Zoan]

I played a NPC-only (well, during my tenure) serial killer. Well he was going to be a serial killer - I only got one victim until the Cheese got me.

[Cind]

was typing on IsFriday's thread and decided this was a more appropriate place for ideas.

idea: dwarven woman named Talia invents, in vengeful rage after the completion of her previous goal, a Focus to kill Amos, who has done something unforgiveable. later on, however, they end up in the same Byn unit or whatever, and they end up becoming friends and reconciling. her Focus remains the same because that's simply the way things are. or, maybe your pc defends themselves against an attacker, but is actually quite a fighter themselves and ends up killing the person by mistake, and it haunts them ever after. not all people who commit murders are what you would consider capable of doing such a thing.

[RogueGunslinger]

Well I can shoot that concept in it's... conception. Talia is a name that can't be used.

[Talia]

Well I can shoot that concept in it's... conception. Talia is a name that can't be used.

I killed everyone's ability to have a character named Talia. That makes me the biggest serial killer on the MUD. I think it also qualifies me as a narcissistic sociopath or whatever else is up in this thread here.

[Aruven]

What makes a person a serial killer, answer that and you might be able to make a compelling character. Note that the term 'a serial killer' did not rise up only until a few centuries ago. Not because mental illnesses that made people  serial killers did not exist, but because there were plenty of ways of exercising the 'urges' without being coined a serial killer. Hell, how many people were considered great and brave warriors during the dark ages, who had those very same urges, but due to easy influx of enemies to kill, were never considered evil or sick. How many serial killers worked in Inquisition? Was Thomas Tarquemada a serial killer?

Same goes for Arm. You might want to play out Dexter Morgan, but ask yourself ... why? Why do you have to hide your killer nature, if you can just go join Byn, Kurac, or Militia. You will have plenty of opportunity to exercise your murderous sadistic qualities and people might actually pay and praise you for it.

Of course your murderous nature may be more extreme. In which case you are a rampaging murderer. But if that's the case, then it's doubtful that you have any kind of social skills to be a serial killer 'a le dexter' instead you a are little more then an animal. Such things do happen, and in the past times ... were quickly proclaimed to be possessed by the devil, hunted down like a rabid dog, and slain.

A hitman is a little different, since they might end up needing to take down people who are not nobodies, not breeds, and not enemies. People who have political clout and DO have connections who will exact revenge. While of course hitmen might be serial killers as well, but odds are they wouldnt be very successful at what they do, just due to the sheer amount of noise they would produce and the fact that they would be working for free.

Awesome post.

[roughneck]

What makes a person a serial killer, answer that and you might be able to make a compelling character. Note that the term 'a serial killer' did not rise up only until a few centuries ago. Not because mental illnesses that made people  serial killers did not exist, but because there were plenty of ways of exercising the 'urges' without being coined a serial killer. Hell, how many people were considered great and brave warriors during the dark ages, who had those very same urges, but due to easy influx of enemies to kill, were never considered evil or sick. How many serial killers worked in Inquisition? Was Thomas Tarquemada a serial killer?

Same goes for Arm. You might want to play out Dexter Morgan, but ask yourself ... why? Why do you have to hide your killer nature, if you can just go join Byn, Kurac, or Militia. You will have plenty of opportunity to exercise your murderous sadistic qualities and people might actually pay and praise you for it.

Of course your murderous nature may be more extreme. In which case you are a rampaging murderer. But if that's the case, then it's doubtful that you have any kind of social skills to be a serial killer 'a le dexter' instead you a are little more then an animal. Such things do happen, and in the past times ... were quickly proclaimed to be possessed by the devil, hunted down like a rabid dog, and slain.

A hitman is a little different, since they might end up needing to take down people who are not nobodies, not breeds, and not enemies. People who have political clout and DO have connections who will exact revenge. While of course hitmen might be serial killers as well, but odds are they wouldnt be very successful at what they do, just due to the sheer amount of noise they would produce and the fact that they would be working for free.

Awesome post.

Ditto.

[Gunnerblaster]

That was a pretty awesome post, Dar.

I feel stupid for not having taken 'serial killer' in that sense. I guess, just because of what a 'modern' serial killer is to us, the first thing that stands out is some terrible slasher flick but that's not the case for Zalanthas.

[spicemustflow]

A serial killer can have urges that aren't easily satisfied on the field of battle or he might not be fit combat for whatever reason. For example, Gilles de Rais was a distinguished warrior and displayed great bravery in battle, but it didn't help much since he got off on torturing and killing young children. Even in that period (15th century, thought I'd have to google it up again) such crimes caused great outrage. Another example, Countess Erzsebet Bathory tortured and killed as much as 600 of her serving girls. Again, despite the general brutality of the period and her high status, she was sentenced for that.

I can easily think of many serial killer concept that would fit in the world of our game, even with its constant wars, famine, battle for resources and so on. Life is cheap and life of someone outside of your group is worthless, but unless the people of Zalanthas have lost all humanity (and there's plenty of evidence that they haven't) there will be lines that aren't easily crossed by a common person. Which means many killers would have to hide their nature.

[BleakOne]

That Countess Erzebet Bathory, was she the one who bathed in the blood of her victims... literally? If so, I remember she only got arrested because she killed someone related to someone half-way important (the exact details escape me).

[Wolfsong]

The exact number of young women tortured and killed by Elizabeth Báthory is unknown, though it is often speculated to be as high as 650. The estimates differ greatly. During the trial and before their execution, Szentes and Ficko reported 36 and 37 respectively, during their periods of service. The other defendants estimated a number of 50 or higher. Many Sárvár castle personnel estimated the number of bodies removed from the castle at between 100 to 200.

Modern historians Radu Florescu and Raymond T. McNally have concluded that the theory Báthory murdered on account of her vanity sprung up from contemporary prejudices about gender roles. Women were not believed to be capable of violence for its own sake. At the beginning of the 19th century, the vanity motif was first questioned, and sadistic pleasure was considered a far more plausible motive for Báthory's crimes.[4] In 1817, the witness accounts (which had surfaced in 1765) were published for the first time,[5] demonstrating that the bloodbaths or blood seeker for vanity aspect of Báthory's crimes were legend rather than fact.

The legend nonetheless persisted in the popular imagination.

Per wikipedia.

[spicemustflow]

Yeah, that's the one. It's been a while since I read the great crimelibrary.com entry on her, but I don't remember her killing anyone but peasant girls whom she lured in her service with promises of good pay. I think the rumors grew to a point where they couldn't be ignored anymore and it was, in fact, one of her noble cousins who decided to put her away so she wouldn't disgrace the family any more.

[roughneck]

Since Dar's post, this thread has made me want to watch the Dirty Dozen.  The old one with Telly Savalas (sp?) and Charles Bronson.  I loved that movie when I was a kid.

Fictional WWII story where the US conscripts 12 of murderous criminals on death row for a single suicide mission: to kill as many Nazi officers as possible during a big party at some resort in the mountains.

[Delirium]

I love that movie.

It's totally translatable to Armageddon, too. Basically every Byn unit ever.