Let 'em through

[valeria]

Not every statement of 'Idea X could be abused like this' is intended to trash the idea, either.  A lot of times (to me) it's potentially constructive, in that it's something staff could consider when implementing the idea and maybe plan on coding around, or plan on putting some other way of keeping tabs on it in there.  Just because something has the potential to be abused doesn't mean it's not a good idea that won't get coded.

[Nyr]

Just because it's a good idea doesn't mean it will get coded, either.  This is one of those cases.

[RogueGunslinger]

Just because it's a good idea doesn't mean it will get coded, either.  This is one of those cases.

I just, sorta assume this about every proposed idea, then suddenly, out of nowhere BAM cool thing #7 gets implemented into the game and I'm surprised and happy..  And Synth, my man. You were getting pretty ridiculous there, toward the end.

[Kalai]

I prefer feeling like I can use the code and not be abusive in the process, so if a code idea could easily make things less that way I'd rather someone point out how, and how to fix it.

Here's my idea on how to approach this: Have someone wearing the uniform gain a small bonus on shadowing someone in, and sneaking inside the compound; or have someone not doing so gain more of a penalty.

[X-D]

I think Synth and Mali are right on.

It only takes one person to abuse something to cause an amazing mess for both players and staff.

As to people coming down one "every good idea with the abuse hammer" Really, when I see it, it looks like people pointing the cracks and loopholes out so people can rethink the idea and maybe even close them up. Or in some cases, this being one of them, to go Huh, maybe it was not as good an idea as I first thought.

Myself, abuse aside, I really don't see any reason for such a thing to be put in.

The only reasonable use I could see for it is if there were to be like rentable clan compounds for uncoded clans where you as the clan leader can hire npcs guards etc.

But I think there are plans for things something like this in arm2...or at least I remember it being talked about on the reborn forum when it was open.

[Talia]

I think Synth and Mali are right on.

It only takes one person to abuse something to cause an amazing mess for both players and staff.

Yes, this. I had no idea how much staff time it can take to clean up one of these messes, before I had to deal with some. It's a very poor use of staff time when we have to collectively spend 10-20 hours on a situation of this nature. And, it's emotionally draining--no staffer wants to spend their time policing or cleaning up. We'd really much rather spend our time animating for you, building cool stuff for you, and facilitating your plots. It makes us grumpy to be cops and maids.

I very much endorse the suggestion that if you want to do something of this nature, rather than rely on code, you should communicate with staff. (Preferably by report first, then by wish.) We don't want to stop you from making conflict or pursuing plots. We do want to make sure the world reacts realistically toward you and what you're doing.

[solera]

As it stands, you can roleplay this entire scenario out with existing code.  You just have to shadow someone in and out of your target compound.  This obviously is more difficult than it sounds, which is good, because it creates another choke point:  skilling up sneak, hide, sleight-of-hand and/or steal + potential very large amount of time spent waiting for the shadow in and the shadow out > satisfaction from griefing.

This seems to to give you what you want Chettaman, once you've gone to the trouble to acquire the colours, doesn't it?

[Chettaman]

Darn those bad roleplayers!
but yeah... I already thought of how to do it with the existing code.

But they got a good point. lol. I totally know someone would steal everything just to sell it without a thought of roleplay in mind. Just to get the loot.

[hyzhenhok]

It would be amusing to see the piles of different clan uniforms that people would start stockpiling, though.

As it stands, you could always try wishing up if you are dressed up a particular way and want NPCs to react accordingly. You never know.

[Chettaman]

See... that's why I love you, dood.
Not just because your picture kind of reminds me of Venom.

[Sam]

I think it'd be fine with those clans with a high turn over rate and high amounts of personnel. Like the Byn.

[boog]

Allowing things hitched (that aren't PCs) to you would be swell, too.

[Saellyn]

I think it'd be fine with those clans with a high turn over rate and high amounts of personnel. Like the Byn.

No. I don't need some random guy in a Byn/Kadian/Salarri cloak walking into my compound and backstabbing me in my sleep, then abusing hide/sneak to get out unscathed.

[Sam]

I think you are being overly dramatic.
If it gets abused, get rid of it.
If it doesn't, don't.

In my opinion, this should be doable on the Byn and Kuraci compounds at the least. They have the most people and the highest turn over rate, I think.

[Saellyn]

I think you are being overly dramatic.
If it gets abused, get rid of it.
If it doesn't, don't.

In my opinion, this should be doable on the Byn and Kuraci compounds at the least. They have the most people and the highest turn over rate, I think.

I prefer to be over-dramatic and safe in an instance like this, given my experiences with the game, than take the risk that somebody -isn't- going to abuse this and use it to kill a guy they hate the crap out of, then walk out unscathed.

[jstorrie]

My clan gets its warehouse sacked by asshole newbies (in front of hundreds of VNPCs) every month already. I'm pretty sure that if the clan-flag system was replaced by cloak checks I would have a clan of corpses and no recourse but player complaints within... a week? Five days, tops.

[ianmartin]

The problem is that "breaking the rules of the game" isn't just a 5-yard-penalty-and-repeat-second-down kind of thing.  Oftentimes "breaking the rules of the game" means you totally fuck up entire plot lines, ruin characters that have hundreds or thousands of hours sunk into them, and completely ruin the attitudes of rules-abiding players.

[/quote]

Soooooooo, ALL plots should succeed because thousands of hours were put into them???  Not following that pattern of thought.

Three gith lying in wait along the road to ambush people happens to attack and kill the only two vivaduans in the party who weren't paying attention would screw up plot lines too.

[Cutthroat]

The problem is that "breaking the rules of the game" isn't just a 5-yard-penalty-and-repeat-second-down kind of thing.  Oftentimes "breaking the rules of the game" means you totally fuck up entire plot lines, ruin characters that have hundreds or thousands of hours sunk into them, and completely ruin the attitudes of rules-abiding players.

Soooooooo, ALL plots should succeed because thousands of hours were put into them???  Not following that pattern of thought.

Three gith lying in wait along the road to ambush people happens to attack and kill the only two vivaduans in the party who weren't paying attention would screw up plot lines too.

Not exactly what was said there. More like "plots shouldn't fail because of some player that happened to want to ignore the game world at the time", or in general, break the rules. Players that follow the game's rules can and do expect failure for other reasons.

Since this idea is possible with staff support via reporting intentions in a character report, and staff support ensures nothing ridiculous happens, perhaps it's best left that way.

[Nyr]

The problem is that "breaking the rules of the game" isn't just a 5-yard-penalty-and-repeat-second-down kind of thing.  Oftentimes "breaking the rules of the game" means you totally fuck up entire plot lines, ruin characters that have hundreds or thousands of hours sunk into them, and completely ruin the attitudes of rules-abiding players.

Soooooooo, ALL plots should succeed because thousands of hours were put into them???  Not following that pattern of thought.

Three gith lying in wait along the road to ambush people happens to attack and kill the only two vivaduans in the party who weren't paying attention would screw up plot lines too.

While this is a derail, your comparison is not valid. Players are not gith.  Gith are NPCs.  NPCs don't break the rules, players do--and no, not all players, just the ones that do break the rules.

I'm going to lock this thread.  Please don't bump inactive threads to post derails.