dwarven tribes

[Sandlord]

is there a such thing as dwarven tribes? Do they exist or all dwarves city-dwellers

Or mine dwellers ::rim shot::

But in all seriousness, I don't believe I've heard of any Dwarven tribes.

[John]

I don't believe I've heard of any Dwarven tribes.

I was just about to say the opposite  :lol:

I thought I remembered reading somewhere it saying that there were some dwarven tribes in the Tablelands  :?

AFAIK there are no PC tribes

I thought I remembered reading somewhere it saying that there were some dwarven tribes in the Tablelands  

AFAIK there are no PC tribes

You're right, I remember that now, too. But yes, no PC Tribes I know of.

Typically each dwarf has his own thought process and aim and goal, etc. Otherwise known as their focus. Usually 'social' or 'communal' attitudes would be foreign to most, unless maybe they had similar focuses which involved living happily with other dwarves in a tribe-like setting. But then again a few might get together like that, then others join temporarily, or for other reasons. (Maybe a focus to marry a woman, who's focus is to live happily with her dwarven kin) that example might then bring in the dwarf who could care less about where he lives... being too focused on marrying the tribe-dwarf.

But Im not sure how 'similiar' focii go... might be hard to keep it going if kid dwarvii decide their focus involves leaving.

Im no dwarf expert though, havent even played one, so Im not the best source of information on the subject.

[John]

I once played a dwarf from a small dwarven town that most people didn't know about and the Imms let me play my char, so unless I slipped through the cracks (like I'm want to do) dwarves can live in a tribal/community setting.

Typically each dwarf has his own thought process and aim and goal, etc. Otherwise known as their focus. Usually 'social' or 'communal' attitudes would be foreign to most, unless maybe they had similar focuses which involved living happily with other dwarves in a tribe-like setting.

I think this is mainly an exaggeration of dwarves with their focus on PCs parts. The docs say EVERY dwarf is different with how bent on their focus they are, with some wondering how someone can help them with their focus each time they meet them while others are able to have relationships not concerened with their focus (although they'll still always think about their focus).

I think it would be fairly easy to actually have dwarves in a community setting. The reason I say that is a focus isn't external from the dwarf. The dwarf's life will shape their focus. If the dwarf lives in a dwarven tribe their focuses are likely to be something involving the good of the tribe. Now it probably would be difficult to start a dwarf tribe, but pre-existing ones would probably be fairly easy to keep going.

Then how did dwarven communities get started in the first place? Well when dwarves became a free race they would probably have been extremely close to others of their race (as seen through their abilty to keep their language intact), so it would of been natural to band together.

Just my 2 'sid *plink plink*

As I said, Im no real dwarf expert... so I dont know. But some of my opinion was based on the numerous dwarf threads Ive read and authored, the most striking of opinions... which seems to have some merit was by Tlaloc in Muls and Dwarves thread.

Tlaloc wrote:

Now: what do dwarves think about muls? Well, theres likely alot of answers, depending on the dwarf. I think a better question would be: "What do dwarves think about Muls and thier focus?"

Always remember that a dwarf's life, opinions, thoughts, beliefs, and actions revolve around his or her focus. The ultimate question is: would a dwarf really care enough about a Mul to stop thinking about his focus to develop an opinion on him? Perhaps the answer is yes. Perhaps the answer is no. Perhaps the dwarf is undecided untill a Mul either gets in her way, or helps her out.

This might seem alittle callous and uncaring, but then again, thats Zalanthas. Dwarves don't have some sort of feeling of 'Kinship' between one another, and I think they'd have an even less of one with Muls. Yes - the fact that some dwarf has to be enslaved and forced to breed with a human probably scores negative points between some Dwarves and Humans, but in the end humans, elves, muls, and other dwarves are ultimately just variables in a dwarfs attempt to fulfill his or her focus.

Namely the part: "Dwarves don't have some sort of feeling of 'Kinship' between one another..."

So usually a tribe of despondant and un-family like individuals wouldnt succeed. Typically tribes are family based... at least from my collective knowledge pool I think they are. Like tribes would give themselves names so they could all be collectively identified and made more unified, like kin.

Anyways, Im sure the subject has many possible facets and correct interpretations. A tribe of dwarves may succeed as a machine, working together to live, if not really caring for each other. And then again as John said, being born and raised into a tribe that was formed for whatever reason might perpetually influence the focii of newborns to have them keep the tribe going for whatever reason.
I.e.
A tribe may have formed by a handful of like-minded dwarves.
Their children while being raised develop focii that have do with preservation of the tribe, (gathering food, securing borders, etc.) Keeping it going.
Then as they got larger and larger the number of possible focused individuals on domestic tasks would ultimately be larger. I mean something keeps dwarves in Allanak, the same thing might keep a dwarf in the tribe-village-camp-thing.

So now in retrospect, after discussing both possible sides... I think it is indeed possible. Maybe more so at a larger scale. As the fewer dwarves means the less likely chance of perpetutity. Like a group of 5 dwarves might have one that wants to defend the camp, two that want to be prosperous guards in Allanak, one that wants to collect food, and one that wants to build tents. Whereas a group of 50 dwarves might have 10 that want to defend their home, 5 that want to explore the world, etc. Thereby making the chance for the tribe to live on.

Anyways... its late, sorry for the rambling.

[spawnloser]

After what John said, the one thing that comes to mind, for me is the first line of "The Dwarven Focus" in the racial roleplay docs:

It is a single, overwhelming goal which motivates every thought and action in a dwarf's life

That's in the docs and it says that they all are obsessive little freaks.  (Not to be insulting to all the hairy midgets out there.)  From my understanding, that being influenced by both all the docs I've read and also going back as far as Dark Sun (though I know that Arm is only based on Dark Sun and doesn't have to be the same), a dwarves life is their focus and the eat, sleep and breath only when their focus allows.  They could, of course, decide that to accomplish their focus, they should stay with the tribe...but then, years down the road, they may decide that the best way to accomplish their focus is to leave the tribe for some reason.  I'm not saying that they can't do anything that doesn't directly accomplish the focus, because to accomplish their focus, they might have to do all sorts of things, depending on what the focus is and what they may have to learn or accomplish as a stepping stone to their focus.

[John]

After what John said, the one thing that comes to mind, for me is the first line of "The Dwarven Focus" in the racial roleplay docs:

It is a single, overwhelming goal which motivates every thought and action in a dwarf's life

That's in the docs and it says that they all are obsessive little freaks.  (Not to be insulting to all the hairy midgets out there.)

Well I re-read the docs and saw

a dwarf will be considering their focus every time they meet someone, thinking "How can this person help me or hinder me in achieving my focus?" Exactly how cold-hearted this manipulation becomes depends entirely on the individual nature of the dwarf

Which I guess I misunderstood at first. I thought it was saying that dwarves can do things completely unrelated to their focus without having an anxiety attack, but I think that sentence meant that not all dwarves are going to completely manipulate everyone they meet.

Thanks for clearing that up for me  

[creeper386]

Namely the part: "Dwarves don't have some sort of feeling of 'Kinship'

That means... They don't have kinship AS A WHOLE. Elves don't have any race wide kinship. They still have tribes. Humans don't have a race wide kinship they still have tribes.

It means they won't be going around and just because another person is a dwarf they are going to be nice, NOT that they have no relationship with any dwarf ever.

Creeper, who well say, dwarves AREN'T HAIRY spawnloser![/quote]

[spawnloser]

Right, I keep forgetting that Zalanthan dwarves are bald...unlike dwarves in most settings.

[jhunter]

I say go dwarves!!!

Get your own place, you hairless, obsessive-minded, stumpy bastards!

I find it sort of odd actually that there aren't more dwarves with a focus related to building a dwarven community.

They experience racism in many different forms throughout their lives, folks magicked dwarves and humans turning them into mul freaks...you'd think that history itself would've spawned more dwarves with a focus to outdo or break free from having to live in societies that do these things to them.
Just a few thoughts on the idea, I may be a little biased on the subject since I'd really like to see a dwarven community on Zalanthas.

[creeper386]

I could have sworn I've read someplace that dwarves used to be seperated. Probably had their own societies, and such. Think it was pre-Dragon, during it's reign. Then pre-HG/Mul they were probably some of the best slaves, being able to be conditioned into absolute slaves and such, so living in large groups is a bad idea, as if slavers find you, everyones going down.

And most dwarves are quite open to helping with starting a dwarven city or something of the sorts. As long as it doesn't interfere with their focus, which alot of the times it could be considered a big help for their focus if you go into complex things such as economics and such. SHRUG.

Creeper