Your eyes flutter open

[valeria]

I suggested that.  The problem is as far as I can figure, they want to 'pretend' to still be unconscious.  To wake up without anyone noticing, so they can see what's going on around them.

Like in action movies, where the hero secretly wakes up, and then waits until the bad guys' backs are all turned to kick ass and take names.

[janeshephard]

Like in action movies, where the hero secretly wakes up, and then waits until the bad guys' backs are all turned to kick ass and take names.

QFT. And afterall this is an action mud yes?

[Gimfalisette]

And afterall this is an action mud yes?

No, it's not, actually.

[janeshephard]

And afterall this is an action mud yes?

No, it's not, actually.

There's lots of action it. The point I was trying to make, somewhat sarcastically, is the code forcing you to wake up like that makes it impossible to play a sneaky type. Maybe assassins and such could have a "feign" skill. Much like rangers can wander through storms without losing their way, assassins are able to feign sleeping while they stay awake.

[Synthesis]

And afterall this is an action mud yes?

No, it's not, actually.

So why does everyone walk around armed to the teeth?

[Nyr]

Side note: this is possible in Arm 2.  adverbial commands.  nuff said.

[RogueGunslinger]

And afterall this is an action mud yes?

No, it's not, actually.

There's lots of action it. The point I was trying to make, somewhat sarcastically, is the code forcing you to wake up like that makes it impossible to play a sneaky type. Maybe assassins and such could have a "feign" skill. Much like rangers can wander through storms without losing their way, assassins are able to feign sleeping while they stay awake.

I'm attempting to see how it makes it impossible to play a sneaky type...

em squints.

[Gimfalisette]

And afterall this is an action mud yes?

No, it's not, actually.

So why does everyone walk around armed to the teeth?

While most PCs may do so, most V/NPCs do not. Players tend to approach ARM as if it's an "action MUD" (H&S), but I don't believe that accurately describes ARM. (Though it does accurately describe ARM's long-ago origins.)

I'm attempting to see how it makes it impossible to play a sneaky type...

It doesn't, of course.

[UnderSeven]

I'm vaguely turned off by this that the people pushing for the change more or less ignore the very valid arguements that point out this sort of control over yourself isn't really even possible.  The closest I've seen is the arguements of making the eyes fluttering opened a hemo, but even that kind of is pushing it for me.  I think very people are instantly awake when they come to. 

I just finished reading a forgotten realms book.  I hated it.  the main characters got out of situations by constant hands of god.  Oh now they can go into a TRANCE that makes them more powerful so they can handle this previously impossible situation.  Why do I bring this up?  I honestly think a change like this would be more toward the whole unrealistic ways out of situations that bad dnd writing (all of it) already adheres to. 

Now to switch sides, if you were the person who had unconscious person who refused to admit to wakedness and was using this 'skill'  what would you do?  Hit them and let them use their MAD SKILLZ that they trained all their life because they're a leet assassin (as written in their background, man they're so dark and emo) to ignore the pain and continue to pretend to be asleep so you can't possibly get anything out of them? 

Yeah, sometimes the code forces realism on our characters, this is an example of one of those times and I'm completely in favor of the realism (no you can't pretend to be asleep right when you wake up) to remain.

[X-D]

Hey, Amos, it has been a couple hours, think he is awake yet?

I don't know Malik...better hit him again just to make sure.

etwo hammer

kill dude

BEEP

Huh, guess he was still out Amos.

Well, out for good now.

Joking part aside, if I could not be sure then that is pretty much how it would go, Better hope they upgrade mercy because about every 5 RL minutes your PC would be getting another crack to the head.

[Gimfalisette]

I just finished reading a forgotten realms book.  I hated it.  the main characters got out of situations by constant hands of god.  Oh now they can go into a TRANCE that makes them more powerful so they can handle this previously impossible situation...Yeah, sometimes the code forces realism on our characters, this is an example of one of those times and I'm completely in favor of the realism (no you can't pretend to be asleep right when you wake up) to remain.

u7's got it. All of this, right here, is what I mean about ARM not being an "action MUD." In an action movie MUD, the hero always wins, the hero always gets the girl, the bad guys always lose and probably die, the loot is awesome, etc. ARM is not like this; in ARM, if you don't wanna get conked on the head repeatedly to keep you asleep so that the "bad guys" can do what they want to you, then you'd better beg/bribe/barter your way out of it, rather than expecting the code to deus ex machina you out of it.

ARM's current code is realistic. Deal with the fact that this means your PC doesn't always win.

[Aaron Goulet]

For the reasons mentioned by UnderSeven and others, remaining asleep (or waking up as you please) simply doesn't seem realistic.  If you were faking unconsciousness from the start, that's a different matter, but as of now a 'feign' skill doesn't exist.

[MarshallDFX]

I just finished reading a forgotten realms book.  I hated it.  the main characters got out of situations by constant hands of god.  Oh now they can go into a TRANCE that makes them more powerful so they can handle this previously impossible situation...Yeah, sometimes the code forces realism on our characters, this is an example of one of those times and I'm completely in favor of the realism (no you can't pretend to be asleep right when you wake up) to remain.

u7's got it. All of this, right here, is what I mean about ARM not being an "action MUD." In an action movie MUD, the hero always wins, the hero always gets the girl, the bad guys always lose and probably die, the loot is awesome, etc. ARM is not like this; in ARM, if you don't wanna get conked on the head repeatedly to keep you asleep so that the "bad guys" can do what they want to you, then you'd better beg/bribe/barter your way out of it, rather than expecting the code to deus ex machina you out of it.

ARM's current code is realistic. Deal with the fact that this means your PC doesn't always win.

Won't stop me power emoting.

em swings through the air, hacking you into pieces.  Gripping the bloody blade between his teeth, he jumps off the Shield Wall, pulling his linen-constructed hang-glider out from his ass and swooping to safety.

[BlackMagic0]

And then you fall to your death, break your neck. As got no coded glider? Duh.

I'd not know if I should laugh my ass off, or file a player compliant if someone emoted that and jumped off the Shield Wall..

[musashi]

While I agree with UnderSeven in that, I don't think it should be possible for people to control their own actions so precisely when waking up, I do feel that the "eyes flutter open" message should in fact, be an hemote.

Just today, I woke up in the living room of Ourla's house and she and her son were having breakfest. I laid there with my eyes open watching them for about 2 minutes before they bothered to look over at me and realize I was awake. Most people I think ... make little to no noise or sudden jerky actions when waking up, they just open their eyes whil their brain boots up. I think it is unrealistic to assume that every single character in the room is automatically going to notice that. The exceptionally observant might, and the people actually -watching- the sleeping person most assuredly will, but to me, having it be an hemote seems like the most realistic way to represent the situation in code.

[Aaron Goulet]

While I agree with UnderSeven in that, I don't think it should be possible for people to control their own actions so precisely when waking up, I do feel that the "eyes flutter open" message should in fact, be an hemote.

Just today, I woke up in the living room of Ourla's house and she and her son were having breakfest. I laid there with my eyes open watching them for about 2 minutes before they bothered to look over at me and realize I was awake. Most people I think ... make little to no noise or sudden jerky actions when waking up, they just open their eyes whil their brain boots up. I think it is unrealistic to assume that every single character in the room is automatically going to notice that. The exceptionally observant might, and the people actually -watching- the sleeping person most assuredly will, but to me, having it be an hemote seems like the most realistic way to represent the situation in code.

Earlier in this thread, I took the same stance as you, until someone pointed out the difference between waking up from a restful(?) night's sleep versus waking up after being rendered unconscious by blunt-force trauma.

[RogueGunslinger]

In the instance of going to sleep, well hell, I'm positive I've woken up numerous times without opening my eyes. I figure'd we were talking about being knocked out via the way or blunt trauma?

[Gimfalisette]

Yes, what Aaron said. As X-D pointed out earlier, the OP wasn't really talking about waking up from sleeping. He was talking about waking up from being deliberately knocked unconscious by an enemy. Different things.

[Only He Stands There]

I used to pass out frequently in my youth, and had a couple of horrible mountain biking accidents (I used to do trails all the time).

In nearly every situation, I awoke, gasped, instantly sat up gibbering and, in a couple instances, even wandered around in circles for a moment before sitting back down. Probably most frighteningly, I don't -remember- doing these things. The 3-5 minutes after awakening are all a blurry haze, every time I've ever passed out or been knocked out.

So, no - I don't think you can sekritly wake back up and spy on your captors, or bide your time to ninjakick the shit out of them.

[Spider]

Yes, what Aaron said. As X-D pointed out earlier, the OP wasn't really talking about waking up from sleeping. He was talking about waking up from being deliberately knocked unconscious by an enemy. Different things.

I've been knocked unconscious before, and I cannot/couldn't recall at what point I came to. It pretty much felt like I had teleported from where I was to walking down the street, oblivious to what happened. So, I don't think it would be possible to just lie and wait, pretending to be unconscious, after getting knocked silly in the head. Just my thoughts. But of course, my experiences are not universal, grain of salt I suppose.

~Den

p.s ^^ Stole my thoughts. I'll post it anyway.

[musashi]

I would say even then, the majority of people are likely to come to without much in the way of sudden movement or loud noises. I took a minute to try and find information about people's reactions when waking up from feinting or suffering trama, but none of what I found seemed to indicate they would do anything really abnormal unless you know ... their brain was actually damaged.

So my thought is: Should they be able to actively control themselves when just coming to like that ... no, but should the normal physical response they can't control be so obvious that everyone in the room automatically sees it ... I would say no again.

But even if the change wasn't made and it was kept as a standard echo to everyone in the room, then I think the echo should be changed to something like "So and so opens their eyes, coughing an jerking violently as they come to." or something like that to reflect the reason why there is absolutely no missing the fact that they just woke up.

I suppose I'd be happy with either option.

[Gimfalisette]

In nearly every situation, I awoke, gasped, instantly sat up gibbering and, in a couple instances, even wandered around in circles for a moment before sitting back down. Probably most frighteningly, I don't -remember- doing these things. The 3-5 minutes after awakening are all a blurry haze, every time I've ever passed out or been knocked out.

I've never been knocked unconscious, but every time in my life that I've taken a bad blow to the head (most recently just last year while ice skating), it's pretty much like this. Blow to head -> major disorientation and whacked-out behavior.

But even if the change wasn't made and it was kept as a standard echo to everyone in the room, then I think the echo should be changed to something like "So and so opens their eyes, coughing an jerking violently as they come to." or something like that to reflect the reason why there is absolutely no missing the fact that they just woke up.

Currently, players are free to RP their waking however they like. Eyes fluttering open is not really a big deal, as far as the code "power-emoting" on us. I wouldn't want this changed.

I really don't think any changes are needing, except to player perception of how such a situation really should be RPed. (Even me, I don't think I've RPed this that well in the past.)

[UnderSeven]

While I agree with UnderSeven in that, I don't think it should be possible for people to control their own actions so precisely when waking up, I do feel that the "eyes flutter open" message should in fact, be an hemote.

Just today, I woke up in the living room of Ourla's house and she and her son were having breakfest. I laid there with my eyes open watching them for about 2 minutes before they bothered to look over at me and realize I was awake. Most people I think ... make little to no noise or sudden jerky actions when waking up, they just open their eyes whil their brain boots up. I think it is unrealistic to assume that every single character in the room is automatically going to notice that. The exceptionally observant might, and the people actually -watching- the sleeping person most assuredly will, but to me, having it be an hemote seems like the most realistic way to represent the situation in code.

You prick.  Allow me to fix your quote.

Hi, I'm Musashi, and today I awoke to BEING AT A SMALL APM THAT NONE OF YOU GET TO BE AT NEENER.  and it was awesome.  Oh, something brief about this thread before I get back to reminding you that I'M HERE AND YOU"RE NOT!

Thanks Musashi.  Remember that time in high school where I stole your lunch money?  No? You never found out it was me?  Well it was!

[RogueGunslinger]

He's been there for a while.

[Cerelum]

I just can't believe you guys are still talking about "trying to fake waking up".  It isn't possible.