Mount stamina too high?

[RogueGunslinger]

After using an erdlu as a mount for the past few chars, I'm a strong advocate for lowering mount stamina. As it is with currently, anything but an erdlu can run straight from Tuluk to Allanak. with maybe having to rest once.

I've found that I have more time to stop, roleplay, think, feel, and interact with other simply because I'm using an erdlu.

[AmandaGreathouse]

I would love to see mount stamina cut back a bit myself.

I pretty much always use erdlus IG. They're fast. 'nuff said. Though I do wish that other people would also stop, at least once, on a trip across the world, to let their mounts rest as well. Even if it's not necessary by the code, maybe you don't want to ride your animal until it's completely exhausted, right?

That said, though, I wouldn't want other mounts to have the same stamina as an erdlu. It's good that they have more. It's a good balance, short, speedy distance, or long, trudging distance. It makes sense, first off. And second, it's often very difficult to hunt without running an erdlu's stamina down in about the same number of rooms a ranger who's got decent endurance could walk, and it takes them much longer to regenerate it than it would the ranger.

Just sayin.

[Yam]

It takes a long time for any mount to regenerate stamina. I would find this to be incredibly annoying.

[Qzzrbl]

It takes a long time for any mount to regenerate stamina. I would find this to be incredibly annoying.

I find potential raiding stock going from Tuluk to Red Storm without needing to stop for anything incredibly annoying.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

Mounts don't actually take that much time to regenerate stamina. It seems like it because they have so much more than a PC.

[Yam]

Mounts don't actually take that much time to regenerate stamina. It seems like it because they have so much more than a PC.

Who says PCs all regenerate at the same rate?


The point is, I don't want to wait an hour for my beetle to go from exhausted to a little weary. And that's about how long it takes in many areas of the game.

[Lizzie]

Also, the OP might be forgetting, that mounts aren't only used to ride the road. Off-road, mounts use a lot more stamina than they do on-road. They tire quicker, and need a lot longer to regen than when they're resting at "pick typical resting spot for mounts here" location.

If you reduce stamina for mounts, there will be a lot less travel -off- road. And that means a lot less interesting trouble to get into, and that also means a lot less income for those poor raiders, and random sorcerers hoping someone will come by to play with them.

[RogueGunslinger]

Heh. I was actually referring to off the road. Considering certain IG things.


To add: I wouldn't even mind bumping the recharge rate for mount stamina. I just want people to stop every once in a damn while.

Currently, in game, with an erdlu, off the road( and I'm talking real tough terrain here too), I can get from tuluk to luirs in only one rest. That is with a mount that has the lowest stamina(that I know of) in game. I'm positive some of the other mounts hardly ever have to rest when taken outside.

[brytta.leofa]

As it is with currently, anything but an erdlu can run straight from Tuluk to Allanak. with maybe having to rest once.

If you cut back war beetle stamina by much, it will be impossible to travel from Allanak to Luir's Outpost without resting it for 10-15 minutes...right smack dab in the middle of [censored] country.

It all depends on how you want the game to be.  Right now, characters who can't kill gith, raptors, wild beetles, etc. still have decent mobility in the world because, mounted, they stand a chance of outrunning hostile things.  If every journey requires a stop, this will no longer be possible, especially with the sorts of wildlife that will track you all the way across the Known World until killed by a gate guard.

I'm not sure, but I think we're better off with even non-buff rangers being able to, well, range.

[Rhyden]

Currently, in game, with an erdlu, off the road( and I'm talking real tough terrain here too), I can get from tuluk to luirs in only one rest. That is with a mount that has the lowest stamina(that I know of) in game. I'm positive some of the other mounts hardly ever have to rest when taken outside.

That's true, but I think players have to be trusted to take the time and incorporate their environment, amongst many other things. For example, one could rent an exhausted mount then immediately pay 20 sid for it to be completely rested again. It's a loop hole, and it could be fixed, but for now we must entrust that the playerbase at a whole knows not to do this.

I'm not in favor of decreasing mount's stamina, as has been said, it takes a long time for mounts to regen as is, depending on the environment. If you've ever had to rest a tired mount in hot weather during a sandstorm, you'll know you may be resting for a good while.

[Synthesis]

Them wastes is plenty dangerous, son.

Plenty dangerous.

[shadeoux]

As it is with currently, anything but an erdlu can run straight from Tuluk to Allanak. with maybe having to rest once.

If you cut back war beetle stamina by much, it will be impossible to travel from Allanak to Luir's Outpost without resting it for 10-15 minutes...right smack dab in the middle of [censored] country.

It all depends on how you want the game to be.  Right now, characters who can't kill gith, raptors, wild beetles, etc. still have decent mobility in the world because, mounted, they stand a chance of outrunning hostile things.  If every journey requires a stop, this will no longer be possible, especially with the sorts of wildlife that will track you all the way across the Known World until killed by a gate guard.

I'm not sure, but I think we're better off with even non-buff rangers being able to, well, range.

My solution to this would be
A) Lower mounts number of endurance points say to 80% of current level.
B) Increase the mounts regeneration ability, to say, double of current if it's resting, equal to current if just standing there unmounted and unhindered by excessive amount of weight, and 1/2 standard regen rate as now if just riding/mounted normally (Stipulation to non-resting regen rates would be that they can't move for say 2 min)
C) You -CAN- walk mounts too, ever hold a Warbeetles' antennae while trudging through the wastes. Like a long beach with no water.

[Rhyden]

My solution to this would be
A) Lower mounts number of endurance points say to 80% of current level.
B) Increase the mounts regeneration ability, to say, double of current if it's resting, equal to current if just standing there unmounted and unhindered by excessive amount of weight, and 1/2 standard regen rate as now if just riding/mounted normally (Stipulation to non-resting regen rates would be that they can't move for say 2 min)
C) You -CAN- walk mounts too, ever hold a Warbeetles' antennae while trudging through the wastes. Like a long beach with no water.

I would dig this. Especially if there was some way to feed and water mounts to regain energy (and dispense dung) quicker.

[RogueGunslinger]

I'd be so down for the that.

* RogueGunslinger 'gasms

[shadeoux]

My solution to this would be
A) Lower mounts number of endurance points say to 80% of current level.
B) Increase the mounts regeneration ability, to say, double of current if it's resting, equal to current if just standing there unmounted and unhindered by excessive amount of weight, and 1/2 standard regen rate as now if just riding/mounted normally (Stipulation to non-resting regen rates would be that they can't move for say 2 min)
C) You -CAN- walk mounts too, ever hold a Warbeetles' antennae while trudging through the wastes. Like a long beach with no water.

I would dig this. Especially if there was some way to feed and water mounts to regain energy (and dispense dung) quicker.

Feeding and watering mounts, that would add a whole new problem and sets of items for imms to do, I would leave this out and if you wanted to, just RP it out. 1) Eating and drinking for your PC doesn't give them endurance from eating, I'd say no go for me.

[RogueGunslinger]

offer erdlu skin

you offer the erdlu your waterskin, and it drinks. (20 stam boost -20% water in skin)


It doesn't have to be used with food items. I'm sure some other code could be worked around to doing this.

Addendum: Though maybe not easily. I've no idea.

[Fathi]

I posted this in another thread, but I'll repost it here because it's still my main concern:

I would suggest cutting the amount of stamina that certain mounts get, but on the other hand, I wouldn't want to do that in a world where animals can insta-track to you no matter how far you run. Hm.

I think this change would do wonders for making travel more dangerous and interesting, yes.

But unless the way NPCs operate was drastically changed, I think that a change like this would only result in frustration and a bunch of dead newbie PCs. Raptors and other such tracking critters are already plenty dangerous and I fear that this change would make certain types of critter just about inescapable.

[RogueGunslinger]

That is truth. Hm.

[hyzhenhok]

The emphasis shouldn't be so much on slowing down mounts. The main things is to make rest spots more important for everyone outside of the cities. Make it so that most people can hop between population centers with very short rests at the primary rest stops along the road. We want people to be stopping and resting for a bit, but not forever, and off-road travel is already difficult enough. Tracking monsters usually don't aggro on you if you stick to the North Road; frankly, I'd be happy if the changes would stymie the "oh shit, I aggro'd something that tracks me, time to run to a city" mentality.

Increase the stamina cost for travelling on the road, but greatly increase the stamina regen for mounts who are resting in shaded rest areas. For major roads that don't have obvious frequent rest stops, add some. They should either be on the road itself or visible from the road. The goal would be to have people take a handful of minutes at each rest stop whenever they use the road, and to make things a little more treacherous for those who are in a hurry and can't afford to stop. You could even make a lot of these rest spots safe from tracking creatures; there are already rooms in the game that baddies will not follow you into.

Raiders would have a nice group of areas they could target with reasonable expectation of finding interaction. Anti-raiders would have points they could focus their guarding on. People would be more likely to find interaction along the road. Right now, that kind of interaction is extremely limited: it's almost entirely only d-elves and northern rangers who are deliberately using an erdlu who use the rest spots.

[RogueGunslinger]

Awesome idea Hyzhenhok.

[Fathi]

frankly, I'd be happy if the changes would stymie the "oh shit, I aggro'd something that tracks me, time to run to a city" mentality.

I don't want to derail the thread much, but this post left kind of a sour taste in my mouth.

What other option IS there, the way these creatures are currently coded? If you can't kill them, your only options are to run to a city or die. Distracting them with other prey doesn't work. Only one guild can hide from them. They don't get tired. They don't have to rest. They don't even have to use the hunt skill or pass a hunt check. It's the Zalanthan equivalent of being chased by a Terminator T-1000.

Don't blame players for taking the only survivable option around thanks to the fact that the code behaves in an unrealistic, asinine way.

[musashi]

I'd just like to chime in with ... if mounts' stamina takes a cut, I think it only fair desert elf legs take a cut as well. They are already magick enough as it is in comparison to riding anything.

[Twilight]

Hitch  (Movement) 


This command allows your character to lead a mount (or several mounts if you have enough familiarity with mounts) by their reins, as opposed to riding them. This will enable them to walk further, allow you to bring more supplies/goods on a journey, if desired.

I wish they didn't loose quite as much stamina as they still do, but you can effectively use this to increase your travel range somewhat.

[Sandstone]

I'm really not in favor of cutting mounts stamina. Even with a boost in regen, it would make things much more frustrating to those who do have to cross the sands as part of their role. As it is, recent IG events have caused travel to be quite a bit more hazardous and time-consuming.

For the most part that's good. But you're talking of adding more frequent rests, and so on. Keep in mind this adds more RL time to be able to make that trek from Tuluk to Allanak. Now sometimes I wouldn't mind this. But there are days where it's difficult to find the RL time to do a trek from one city to the other and back.

Also, yes, there will be times when characters need to be able to outrun the various dangers of the wastes. I do not want to see the average warbeetle suddenly less able to do so in a pinch, mid-trek. The last thing I want to do is run into Extremely Dangerous Huge Creature while my mount is already tiring.

If you really want to disadvantage erdlus from being used the way you are using it, then perhaps just the erdlus could be made weaker. As it is, many players can't even ride them because the birds just can't carry very much weight.

But as far as I'm concerned, I really don't want to have even more difficulties thrown at me because of it.

[Clearsighted]

It takes a long time for any mount to regenerate stamina. I would find this to be incredibly annoying.

I find potential raiding stock going from Tuluk to Red Storm without needing to stop for anything incredibly annoying.

Only beetles can do that, and just barely if they stick to only the road. Beetles are also incredibly slow.