Retaining new players (and vets)

[LoD]

I know that there's information that's kept from character-to-character on each player, which can be requested through the request tool, but what if there was more of a 'comment' command Staff could use when viewing/observing a PC's relative behavior (good or bad) that wouldn't necessarily be something that needs to transcend that specific character.

Perhaps those comments might be something that is distributed with the automated "death" email and could serve to help that player learn what the Staff observed of them.  Questions surrounding this might be:

1. Is no information better than bad information as far as retention goes?
2. With the less active role in running clans, would Storytellers be more apt to supply such comments?
3. Would receiving a death email with no comments push someone one way or the other, if they expected or hoped there would be comments?
4. Would it help to have 1-2 Storytellers who manage "new players" (perhaps noted by an * or something to Staff when playing their first characters) and are encouraged to supply more feedback when someone is just beginning?

It seems like people enjoy feedback, but I wonder if a system like this would be a benefit or a hindrance based on some of the above mentioned factors.

-LoD

[RogueGunslinger]

I also like the death email idea. OOCly, my favorite part of the game was when a staff told me about what I was doing wrong in the game. Made me feel special that the imms themselves were watching me, not just leaving me out there to rot Any personally written email will do, I think.

Just a note here, from the context of this, I think there may be some confusion about the implementation of this 'death email' idea.  Staff will not be watching for characters to die and going off and personally sending email when they do.  This would be something that would be automated, that when your character dies the game generates an email and sends it to you.

How about an automated e-mail randomly chosen from a list of pre-created, personal feeling, e-mails.

[My 2 sids]

(my post didn't post?  )

I think the Docs are key to both Newbie and Vet retention.

Newbies:  Arm is both wonderful and wonderfully complex world.  The easier it is for newbies to learn how to interact and how to get involved (difference between knowing syntax and knowing how to get involved in plots) is crucial to get and keep player interest.

The Docs need organized in a way that is both informative AND different from reserching a thesis.  They also need to be followed in a way so the newbie player can accuratly predict the IC conciquences of their actions (if they can't someone predict, then the game becomes frustrating) 

*  Maybe the idea of smallar starting pools would be good because it would require less documantation for the newbie to read through before starting. 

*  More walkthoughs and some good Logs to read over gives a better sense of what to expect and what to get excited about

*  Heck, maybe even put some "teaching NPCs" in some of the starting houses to help educate ICly

The Docs also are a great way to retain vet. players.  The docs are what reminds players about the infinate possiblities!  The game only remains fresh and exciting when players get the chance to have new experences with every new PC.

Sometimes the PC-to-PC interaction has a way of making Zanathas very small and constrictive (you're 'rinith PC is known to the Tuluki nobility; the experence of being a guard to Oash becomes much like the experence of being a Bynner; being an aide to the templarate is much like being an independent crafter because they both present the same possibilites and often interact within the same plotlines).  The Documantation speaks for all the VNPCs and NPCs who make Zanathas much bigger and less constrictive (a reminder that no matter how rich your breed gemmer may be, he's always going to be spat upon; a reminder that once you set foot outside the 'rinith you're a target of soldiers; the possiblity that as a young noble you could bring shame upon your family if your name gets mocked in a bard's song)

Keep things separate and allined with the documantation ensures a player can have a wide variety of experences with every new PC = that means the player has interest in the GAME, not just one character and then takes off after it's death.

[number13]

How about an automated e-mail randomly chosen from a list of pre-created, personal feeling, e-mails.

Dear Sir/Madame--

It is with a heavy heart that I noticed the demise of AMOSASSKICKER. The character was a true joy to snoop on. I fondly recall the time he WTF! that guy just one-shot sapped every single NPC in Traders, one by one. His death due to Spontaneous Combustion was a tragedy.

We dearly hope and encourage you create a new character and rejoin the game soon.  Our records show that you have earned -100 karma over the course of AMOSASSKICKER's life.

[garbanzo]

How about an automated e-mail randomly chosen from a list of pre-created, personal feeling, e-mails.

Oh man ... I had so many devious responses to this suggestion that I couldn't pick between them and thus I'll just move on and say ...

I think a system that e-mails some sort of feedback to characters is a great idea.  However, for many new characters, I imagine, it will be unlikely that there will be much feedback to give.  If the character is three hours old and was just smooshed by a scrab or fell of the shield wall... well ... I guess a generic "cheer up and come back" e-mail IS a good idea.  There'd just have to be a way not to send such an e-mail to old-timers who might feel it was salt in the wounds to get a generic "cheer up" message.

[staggerlee]

How about an automated e-mail randomly chosen from a list of pre-created, personal feeling, e-mails.

There'd just have to be a way not to send such an e-mail to old-timers who might feel it was salt in the wounds to get a generic "cheer up" message.

To be totally blunt, sometimes old timers need to throttle that sense of entitlement, and just chill out a bit.

[My 2 sids]

Can I suggest IC family as a way to help Newbies?

Being someone's brother/sister/cousin can link a veteran player and a newbie player in IC context.  Then the noob's PC has an IC opprotunity to shadow and watch vet. players in action.  At the same time vet. players have an IC opprotunity to say "no, back it down... that's now how things are done around here" if a Noob PC gets our of line/ goes beyond approprate IC behavior. 

Maybe a Helper's Board or something where a player can annonously say "I want to create a hunter/ trader" and then be matched up with a veteran player and together make some kind of IC connection.   

[Thunkkin]

Maybe a Helper's Board or something where a player can annonously say "I want to create a hunter/ trader" and then be matched up with a veteran player and together make some kind of IC connection.   

I really like this idea.  I understand fully the reasons why staff don't want 'regular' players doing all their clan recruitment and friend-finding through the OOC mechanism of the GDB.  However, I really think such a board would be VERY beneficial for the game.  I think it would really cut down on the number of newbies that log in, aren't sure what they want to do immediately, and then end up wandering out into the desert OR they're hoping to join an organization, their use of the way sucks, and they just get frustrated after starving alone in an inn somewhere.

[FantasyWriter]

When a newbie contacts me through the helper page, I usually try to send them towards a clan that I know has active PCs who will suit their and their PC's interest.

It the rare case where this doesn't work, I have played matchmaker to get them to meet with another PC "veteran" player IG and handle things IC from there.

I would never steer someone that I knew I would be helping OOC to deal with me IC, that would just be wierd, awkward... and against the rules.

http://www.armageddon.org/intro/helperrules.html


[edited to add:]
Becoming a helper is a great way to help retain new players, btw.

[My 2 sids]

The problem with steering newbies to clans though is then we get entire clans of the newbie leading the newbies AND/OR vet players being OOCly forced to play babysitter/ make decisions OOCly because suddenly they're serounded by PCs who can't interact the way other vet players PCs would act.


As you said, play matchmaker.   I'm not asking OOC helpers to go IC.  I'm saying a board that plays IC matchmaker.

[Gimfalisette]

The problem with steering newbies to clans though is then we get entire clans of the newbie leading the newbies AND/OR vet players being OOCly forced to play babysitter/ make decisions OOCly because suddenly they're serounded by PCs who can't interact the way other vet players PCs would act.

This really wouldn't be an issue if the Byn, Kadius, Kurac, and Salarr all simultaneously had decent leadership that could take a newbie or three under their wings. Then there would be clan hookups for newbies in both Nak and Tuluk. The problem is that usually, only one or maybe two of those clans has leadership that's up for this task.

When I led in AoD, we didn't take -complete- newbies due to the OOC requirements of the role (since soldiers with attack-crim powerz can really screw other PCs up), but we generally had one or two newer players who were still learning much about the game, and it wasn't all that difficult to fit them in. So, one or two or three newbies at once seems pretty handle-able to me, as a leader.

[FantasyWriter]

The problem with steering newbies to clans though is then we get entire clans of the newbie leading the newbies AND/OR vet players being OOCly forced to play babysitter/ make decisions OOCly because suddenly they're serounded by PCs who can't interact the way other vet players PCs would act.

Yeah, I have been there before... this is always something that it difficult to deal with.
I would assume that most new players are recruited by current players, rather than through websites or randomly stumbling upon it.

Most of the people I have brought into the game, I have had them make characters that I could work with and teach ICly (or at least IGly).
Be sure to block them from your IM during these times though (it will save you much sanity).

[My 2 sids]

This really wouldn't be an issue if the Byn, Kadius, Kurac, and Salarr all simultaneously had decent leadership that could take a newbie or three under their wings. Then there would be clan hookups for newbies in both Nak and Tuluk. The problem is that usually, only one or maybe two of those clans has leadership that's up for this task.

That's really two different leaderships though:  OOC leadership for new players AND IC leadership for the clan.  That's a lot to ask one player (here, your role is to IC achieve the clan's IC goals  BUT do so in a way that allows you to OOCly take care of the newbie players)

It's an entierly different PC concept to create a PC who is willing to show the ropes to a kid with potential.  It's quite another to create a PC you know will be branded as "N00B wrangler" for an entire group of newbie PCs.

[Gimfalisette]

That's really two different leaderships though:  OOC leadership for new players AND IC leadership for the clan.  That's a lot to ask one player (here, your role is to IC achieve the clan's IC goals  BUT do so in a way that allows you to OOCly take care of the newbie players)

It's an entierly different PC concept to create a PC who is willing to show the ropes to a kid with potential.  It's quite another to create a PC you know will be branded as "N00B wrangler" for an entire group of newbie PCs.

I don't see taking one to three newbies under wing as that much of a problem, assuming the clan leader is also competent to recruit veteran PCs into the clan. Other veteran players will help to care for the newbies too.

I recommended elsewhere that imms should require from apped leaders for the GMHs and the Byn an implicit agreement in accepting the position that "newbie care" is part of the deal, which I'd see as totally reasonable. Newbie care SHOULD be one of the functions of clans. All of the good leaders I've known have done this as a natural part of leadership, anyways.

[garbanzo]

Hrm, nevermind. 

(That is, nevermind my post)

[LoD]

That's really two different leaderships though:  OOC leadership for new players AND IC leadership for the clan.  That's a lot to ask one player (here, your role is to IC achieve the clan's IC goals  BUT do so in a way that allows you to OOCly take care of the newbie players)

It's an entierly different PC concept to create a PC who is willing to show the ropes to a kid with potential.  It's quite another to create a PC you know will be branded as "N00B wrangler" for an entire group of newbie PCs.

Newbie care SHOULD be one of the functions of clans. All of the good leaders I've known have done this as a natural part of leadership, anyways.

I definitely agree with Gimfalisette on this one.  If you are currently occupying a position of leadership within an accessible and coded clan, and you believe that handling newbies (to some degree) is not one of your inherent responsibilities, then you're doing two things:

1. Kidding yourself.
2. Missing out on a great opportunity (for you, for them, and for the game)

Wrangling the characters of new players can be entertaining (they at least keep things interesting), rewarding (seeing them develop over time), and important for player retention -- which has a direct impact on everyone's enjoyment of the game.  Newbies were always my favorite and preferred potential recruit, because I knew that they were much more likely to be honest in their desires, innocent in their experiences, and interested in what we had to offer rather than taking on an obviously established player and all of the learned behavior, mannerisms, and habits that can accompany that personality.

Don't write them off -- Draw them in.

-LoD

[staggerlee]

I'm inclined to agree with LoD. And training newbies doesn't mean you can't be hard on them. A lot of them eventually seem to get themself killed or kicked out of whatever organizations they're in... but that's not to say they're not learning from the experience.

Sometimes its amazing how much of a beating a newbie will take and still keep coming back. Clan forums are a particularly excellent tool, and you can certainly remain ic and be hard on them without oocly discouraging the players.

If I was going to play a leader I'd certainly want the core of my underlings to be experienced, but having a few new players to teach isn't so bad. Hell it can be kind of fun to take them under your wing and show them things that they're experiencing for the first time.  Taking them on as family members can prove to be an excellent experience as well, some of them might disappoint, but some can turn out to be surprisingly fun rpers.

I would also agree that most new players are likely recruited through word of mouth, or know others that play Arm.  Which is a good reason not to waste too much time on rigorous ooc training processes, tour guides and the like. 

[SMuz]

Personally, I find it exciting every time a newbie joins my clan. I like how they play. There are of course, the twink clanners who join a clan for the sole purpose of grinding up their stats (with free food) and then quitting and doing something else. Newbies usually don't do this much, not the ones who'd stay in a RPI, which is why I love them

Most of the players who are willing to get past the writing a description part and reading docs tend to be intelligent and don't need much OOC guidance anyway. IC guidance is part of your responsibility as a leader.

[Voular]

More maps in general. Drawn maps.

My biggest fear when I started playing was stepping outside of the Gaj and getting lost, because I thought quit rooms were really rare. Honestly. I started to draw my own little maps, which just lead me to get even more lost. Curse the ball throwing NPC! >_>

Drawn maps, of Tuluk, Luir's, Red Storm and Allanak. And a general one. We have enough talented people here to create such!

[tortall]

So, moving your contact after touching jalapinos is a BAD idea.

Especially during a RPT.

[manonfire]

So, moving your contact after touching jalapinos is a BAD idea.

Especially during a RPT.

We find these truths to be self-evident.

[SMuz]

Well, my sister just picked up the game, and from it, I've found the first 4 hours into the game can be extremely boring. Peak times are boring because everyone's off having fun, hunting, arguing, whatever. Nobody on the streets or in the taverns. Non-peak times are boring too, because everyone's sleepy and doesn't want to talk to you. Also, there's the fricking sandstorms in 'Nak that happen every night (which are a way of life, but let's face it; a player who doesn't know where anything is will feel bored).

So, I think above all, the players need to feel that the game is alive and active whenever they do log on. Maybe a simple tip like "If you don't know what to do, join a newbie friendly clan, or hang around the Gaj or the Sanctuary". Going out and getting your character permanently killed by a monster with a weird name is not really a good way to learn how fun the game is.

[Synthesis]

Well, my sister just picked up the game, and from it, I've found the first 4 hours into the game can be extremely boring. Peak times are boring because everyone's off having fun, hunting, arguing, whatever. Nobody on the streets or in the taverns. Non-peak times are boring too, because everyone's sleepy and doesn't want to talk to you. Also, there's the fricking sandstorms in 'Nak that happen every night (which are a way of life, but let's face it; a player who doesn't know where anything is will feel bored).

So, I think above all, the players need to feel that the game is alive and active whenever they do log on. Maybe a simple tip like "If you don't know what to do, join a newbie friendly clan, or hang around the Gaj or the Sanctuary". Going out and getting your character permanently killed by a monster with a weird name is not really a good way to learn how fun the game is.

It would be mildly amusing if alcoholism were hard-coded a la Dwarf Fortress, so that people would be more inclined to congregate in taverns to get their daily ale ration.

> stat
Your encumbrance is light.
Relationship to the land is neutral.
You are currently speaking sirihish with a northern accent.
Your mood is foul-tempered.
You are sitting down.
You are refusing saves on: arrest.
You are not being merciful.
You aren't watching anything in particular.
It has been 5 days since your last drink, and it's starting to affect your performance.

[musashi]

Isn't there an addiction code in game already? 

[Morgenes]

You will now get an email when your character dies.  It only gives a link to the bio tool, but it's a start.