Ever Played an Assassin?

[jcljules]

Haven't come across anything on the GDB about people playing assassins--is it just not a popular guild? If you've played an assassin, how was it?

[Cutthroat]

I always thought assassin was the closest guild to the "guy/gal that can do anything in a city setting" type, just as much or even more than the burglar. I think it can be safely said you can make a guild_assassin and perform just about any type of job in at least a passable fashion.

[Simple]

Excellent city guild. Just don't back yourself in a toe to toe fight.

[Is Friday]

Hard adjustment from being able to either hunt or fight like a pro. Definitely a different kind of playing style than the popular guilds.

[Tisiphone]

Assassin is the city ranger.

[a strange shadow]

Assassin is the city ranger.

[Synthesis]

Assassins are as good as or better than every guild except warriors in a fair fight.

Further, I've had assassins that could drop experienced warriors before they could even draw weapons, in an unfair fight.

It's something special when you realistically have the ability to put someone in the negative hp range before they can even manage to type 'flee'.  I've had a couple of fairly bad-ass warriors...and none of them even came close to that kind of killing efficiency.

Factor in all the extra goodies...and yeah.  I'm actually kind of stumped as to why we aren't being overrun by ninjas.  Hell, with the new sneak+hide business, I'm surprised there aren't more blatant killings in the streets, because now you can -actually- get away with it, if you're that fucking good.

[Is Friday]

Probably because it's much harder to be an assassin than a warrior.

[Malken]

I'd die for a good assassin to hire.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

I'd die for a good assassin to hire.

[Elzocone]

I've played a few assassins, some successful, most unsuccessful.

If you're talking about playing an assassin as a literal assassin (someone that kills people for money) is not as say, playing a warrior or ranger as an assassin.  Assassins get dirty tricks that rangers and warriors don't get.  In return I believe they are balanced out with this in mind.  They have to utilize stealth/surprise/fighting dirty to their advantage, where as warriors and rangers use their strengths.

If you make a PC with the intent of becoming an assassin for hire, don't start out thinking you can assassinate anyone right when you start.  You'll probably die, or have a great long struggle (playing an assassin as a straight up combatant is difficult compared other combat oriented guilds).  To start out, you'll probably want to master the art of stealth and surprise.  You might also want to get some kind of formal training and attempt to learn to fight 'fair' like 'normal' people do it.  Joining the Byn or some other military organization will be good for this (but expect to be humbled while sparring).  But in the end, if you want to become an expert at killing people, you're going to have to kill some people.  Be creative, if you're counting on killing someone in a fair fight you'll most likely fail.

I see people saying that they'd love to find a skilled assassin, but the truth is (as far as an independent assassin goes), most people would probably rather use someone they know/trust (someone in the clan), instead of using someone they don't (and maybe for good reason, is it wise to trust someone that kills other people for money).  Assassins don't go around telling people "Hey, I'm an assassin, can I kill someone for you?" (not good ones), so inquiring minds might have to do some digging.  But in general most people have to work for some organization or another to survive (or just to have fun, being a loner can be boring).  The romanticized 'hit' where someone comes and offers big money to an assassin to kill someone is very rare, not something an assassin could make a living off at least.  They'll probably need to find way to feed themselves in the mean time.

[Qzzrbl]

I thought an assassin's reputation was something very important to any successful assassin? At least that's what the docs say....

[Agent_137]

in allanak, you better have the right rep with the right people who are also tipped appropriately.

in tuluk you might be able to afford being a little more public with it because it could be considered art, but still.

[jcljules]

yeah, that is a problem--how would you get the word out, as an assassin? and how many assassinations are actually called for?

[flurry]

I had a lot of fun playing an assassin.  It does require a certain amount of patience, though, and it's not as obvious how to develop your skills as it is with other classes.

I think the biggest mistake (and source of frustration) for some people is that they think of the class as being all about the backstab skill.  If you remember that you're playing a roleplay game, it isn't.  The class gives you a lot of tools to develop your craft, and you just have to be creative and realize you have a lot of avenues to explore rather than one single skill.

As to how to get the word out, one good way is to earn the trust of some people in power. When I played one, I would (over time) let some nobles and templars know what I could do, once my character felt comfortable enough with them. If one takes you under their wing, you're well on your way to getting involved and building that reputation. Just have a little patience and don't expect an easy road.

[Elzocone]

I thought an assassin's reputation was something very important to any successful assassin? At least that's what the docs say....

To me, part of being an assassin is that it's somewhat of a secret.  It's more difficult to kill someone if they know who's after them.  There's no chance of slipping them some poisoned food/drink or getting them alone in a secluded place to kill them.

The important thing is that the right people know your reputation.  But sometimes that can be difficult with the limited player base (and somtimes OOC chatter) it's not easy to keep a secret in Zalanthas.

[psionic fungus]

Played lots.  They're good.

One thing that does bother me is the designation of Assassin as a city class... I see an Assassin as the link between the Fighter Classes (warrior and ranger) and the Rouge Classes (burglar and pickpocket).  The Assassin is both fighter and rogue, and as such I feel they should be equally comfortable in the desert or city.  An assassin should be able to hunt quarry anywhere they travel, not just within the city-walls.  Assassins should be the best class to play if you want to be a bounty hunter of any sort, but unfortunately it's just not so...

[Yam]

You really haven't seen threads about people playing assassins?


Really?

[Jenred]

Gypsy assassins are scary... they will kill you and steal your babies...



Just kidding, but seriously, the Gypsy assassins I've seen not only had a logical way to make money doing it (they -could- market themselves, since they didn't have to live in that city), but they also tended to be awesome in every way.

All my assassins were ok. One that was good... but never publicized his talent.

[Nile]

'Rinth. Assassin. Fun.

I've had a couple of what I'd call powerful assassin characters. Managed to find their way into a lot of murder and fun during their time. Patience is the key though. For advice I'd just recommend trying to survive past the 5 day mark. Backstab really isn't everything with the guild, they have plenty of good stuff...Meh.

[evil_erdlu]

I had a chance with assassins and I should say that coded skills mean not much more than 'nothing'... Literally nothing. If you are forced to confront your foes openly in a city atmosphere, you're already dead. It doesn't matter if you have a maxxed backstab skill or not because I have observed that we have mini-nukes called 'magickers', avatars of powers called 'templars'. Furthermore, people have allies and the more allies one has, the stronger that one is. So a wuss with three strong allies that he feeds with valuable information can prove stronger than your 50-day-old assassin.

So, guild_assassin? Take it if you want. But if you know to play your cards well, guild_merchant may be more than enough and you know what? They receive [edited -- please don't talk about what skills guilds get].

[Mood]

I had a chance with assassins and I should say that coded skills mean not much more than 'nothing'... Literally nothing. If you are forced to confront your foes openly in a city atmosphere, you're already dead. It doesn't matter if you have a maxxed backstab skill or not because I have observed that we have mini-nukes called 'magickers', avatars of powers called 'templars'. Furthermore, people have allies and the more allies one has, the stronger that one is. So a wuss with three strong allies that he feeds with valuable information can prove stronger than your 50-day-old assassin.

So, guild_assassin? Take it if you want. But if you know to play your cards well, guild_merchant may be more than enough and you know what? They receive [edited -- please don't talk about what skills guilds get]

lol.

[Gimfalisette]

I had a chance with assassins and I should say that coded skills mean not much more than 'nothing'... Literally nothing. If you are forced to confront your foes openly in a city atmosphere, you're already dead. It doesn't matter if you have a maxxed backstab skill or not because I have observed that we have mini-nukes called 'magickers', avatars of powers called 'templars'. Furthermore, people have allies and the more allies one has, the stronger that one is. So a wuss with three strong allies that he feeds with valuable information can prove stronger than your 50-day-old assassin.

So, guild_assassin? Take it if you want. But if you know to play your cards well, guild_merchant may be more than enough and you know what? They receive [edited -- please don't talk about what skills guilds get]

You played it wrong.

[Cutthroat]

I had a chance with assassins and I should say that coded skills mean not much more than 'nothing'... Literally nothing. If you are forced to confront your foes openly in a city atmosphere, you're already dead. It doesn't matter if you have a maxxed backstab skill or not because I have observed that we have mini-nukes called 'magickers', avatars of powers called 'templars'. Furthermore, people have allies and the more allies one has, the stronger that one is. So a wuss with three strong allies that he feeds with valuable information can prove stronger than your 50-day-old assassin.

So, guild_assassin? Take it if you want. But if you know to play your cards well, guild_merchant may be more than enough and you know what? They receive [edited -- please don't talk about what skills guilds get].

Um... templars are supposed to be powerful. Magickers too. It doesn't matter if you have a maxxed backstab skill or not because if you try to rip out a templar's or magicker's spine with your sharp bone spike they will burninate you.

That's not the fault of the guild itself, though. I encourage the OP jcjules, give guild_assassin a try, and see how he likes it.

[Reiloth]

Assassin = "Put-way-to-much-time-into-this-game-because-you-have-to-train-9000-different-skillz-and-won't-be-even-very-good-until-25-30-days-played-but-if-your-girlfriend-left-you-in-the-middle-of-the-night-because-you-woke-up-to-train-backstab-just-one-more-time-you're-on-the-right-track"

[Agent_137]

that's the ticket! Instead of wanting to play a master assassin, just convince yourself you really want to play a bumbling assassin. Then you can retire once you get good.

[manonfire]

To play an assassin, you must be comfortable with slow play. If you aren't, go play something else.

There's always a market for smirking warrior/thug Bynners.

[Is Friday]

Not to brag but this one time I played an assassin, and killed like, 3 half-giants, and then like... 2 magickers. Backstab is so cool. Definitely the best skill in the game, hands down. Probably better than Tek Magick.

[Kiri]

Oddly enough, of the four assassins I've played, none of them -ever- actually trained backstab. Not once. Though my first one had absolutely -killer- thrown skill. I never actually played her as an assassin, because I was very new to the game, and I didn't begin training her with that bent until much, much later. Then she drank cleaning fluid by accident. Alas.


The last one I played actually had insane sneakiness skills, but due to circumstances beyond her control, met her death in a rather horrible, but fascinatingly gruesome way before she ever actually got to KILL anyone.

[Good Gortok]

assassins are cursed by having core skills that are hard to justify practicing with any regularity

then they die on their first or second job

[jstorrie]

The assassin class is cursed by players who assume that set of starting skills instantly makes them an assassin by profession.

[Malken]

I think they should change the Assassin name to something like.. Urban Fighters or something like that..

then change "Backstab" to something like.. "Dirty Fighting"

[FiveDisgruntledMonkeysWit]

The one assassin I played for more than five hours had rockin' stats and kicked serious ass in the sparring circle. He'd take a slight beating at first, but then out of nowhere, I'd get a solid or better hit to somebody's head or neck. It was cool; it was like he was trying to backstab his opponents in mid-combat, always looking for that moment of weakness.
Of course, he was a conscript during the Copper War, so he was probably fighting mostly pickpockets and merchants. But I still felt like a mega-badass.

[Sephiroto]

Assassin is to melee as sorcerer is to magick.

[Desertman]

yeah, that is a problem--how would you get the word out, as an assassin? and how many assassinations are actually called for?

The best Assassin I ever played was Guild Ranger.

That aside...here are my pointers for being a "good" assassin.

Be professional. Dont run about like a lunatic whacking people in the streets, even the Rinth, to get your "backstab" up. The key issue to remember when playing an Assassin, is your typical Assassin is only a part time killer. He usually has a normal life he leads, its a good cover, for example he might be a well-liked craftsman or an aide to someone important (the be cliche), or if not, maybe he is never seen at all. (which can get boring, but to each his own). I would suggest going with the first set of examples, remember that you lead a normal life, and you sometimes happen to kill to suplement your income. Thats the difference between being a thug/murderer/crazy, to being a professional assassin. You do it for the coins, any enjoyment you get out of it is secondary, thats the mark of a professional. Anyone who wants a reputable assassin, will want a professional assassin.

Next, you want a good reputation. First of all, see my above comments about being professional. You ask, "How do I get my reputation out if I cant talk about it.". Well, you can talk about it, just be smart with who you talk to about it. If you are from the north, (which is perfect for playing an actual professional assassin), you should get licensed with the templarate there. Your name will then go onto a "list" of professionals in the city, and not only will the templarate use you potentially, but your name will also be available to anyone who comes looking to hire a killer for a job in the north. Remember, the people who hire you to kill in the north, have to get a license for the kill from the templars. The templars will occasionally put in a good word for you, and maybe get you work, in theory.

Merchant family members, extremely well-to-do indy merchants, and even the southern templarate (corrupt as ever, of course they want a good hired killer themselves) are all good folks to drop a hint to about your availability for "work".

In the end, dont act the fool, dont be a mass murderer jerkoff, and just live a normal life, until it gets time to NOT live a normal life.

Real professionals dont kill to kill, real professionals kill for profit. Keep this in mind and it will keep you from getting over excited and blowing your cover, and it will keep you from making stupid mistakes that get your character whacked by NPC guards and the like early on.

[Bogre]

Okay. I'd first decide what kind of assassin you'd like to be, i.e. how you think you'll like to kill people. You want to be able to destroy someone in combat, quickly and efficiently? Go warrior/ranger. Rangers make awesome outdoorsy assassins too. They aren't just for outdoors, either. Nasty bow skills can be put to use. And that gives you an easy cover. Want to break in then deal with them at your leisure? Pick burglar. Subclasses can also give you some really good viable options to improve your ease of kill. Oh, right, guild_assassin. I'd say burglars are the rangers of the city, but assassins can become very deadly. They -do-, after all, have skills tailored to it. It's not all backstab. I could even think of ways to make guild_merchants and pickpockets into very decent assassins.

Alright, figure out some way to train. Byn, noble house guards, hunting, sparring with a partner in crime, who knows. Obviously, you'll want to be decent in combat. Not necessary, of course, but always good to be able to spend some time in a ruckus. You can train up guild/subclass skills as well, but for some classes it'll be slow.

Don't tell people you're training to be an assassin unless you have a desire to be indebted to that person. Giving up information about yourself (and this goes for all chars) should be IC and will have risk to it, obviously. But there are times when you can be like, hey omg I'm not really a good guard, I can probably do better taking care of -x- on the side. Then the employer can be like lol well sergeant amos is really uber at assassin lol you can do stuff with him.

You don't have to go at it alone. In fact, I'd suggest finding a mentor, then in time finding partners, then apprentices, etc. They can all help you accomplish your goals successfully.

You talk about reputation? Meh. If you start being scary people will probably find out. Plus, I'd rather only be known to an employer who I'd trust, so i'd not have to have my name plastered everywhere. Do aliases, have other people do your work, whatever.

Oh, and here's an evil idea. If you want to be the one to get contracts...maybe you should eliminate your opposition, or get them to work for YOU. Call it a hostile takeover.

Just my two cents, without hopefully revealing too many of my plans for my future killers

[Sokotra]

Assassin = "Put-way-to-much-time-into-this-game-because-you-have-to-train-9000-different-skillz-and-won't-be-even-very-good-until-25-30-days-played-but-if-your-girlfriend-left-you-in-the-middle-of-the-night-because-you-woke-up-to-train-backstab-just-one-more-time-you're-on-the-right-track"

And then you die when a majicker walks in and immediately casts sleep on you and then proceeds to kill you dead.  Thanks for that, whoever that was so many years ago...

Thanks for reminding me, Reiloth.. I was just about to try an assassin again but you refreshed my memory on what a waste of time it is.  I suppose I'll stick to the warrior raiders.  Watch your backs.

[Malken]

Assassin = "Put-way-to-much-time-into-this-game-because-you-have-to-train-9000-different-skillz-and-won't-be-even-very-good-until-25-30-days-played-but-if-your-girlfriend-left-you-in-the-middle-of-the-night-because-you-woke-up-to-train-backstab-just-one-more-time-you're-on-the-right-track"

And then you die when a majicker walks in and immediately casts rainbow bright on you and then proceeds to kill you dead.  Thanks for that, whoever that was so many years ago...

Thanks for reminding me, Reiloth.. I was just about to try an assassin again but you refreshed my memory on what a waste of time it is.  I suppose I'll stick to the warrior raiders.  Watch your backs.

Because magickers can't cast rainbow bright on warrior raiders and proceed to kill them dead?

[manonfire]

Hey cool, IC info.

[Is Friday]

Get it while it's still hot.

[Sokotra]

Assassin = "Put-way-to-much-time-into-this-game-because-you-have-to-train-9000-different-skillz-and-won't-be-even-very-good-until-25-30-days-played-but-if-your-girlfriend-left-you-in-the-middle-of-the-night-because-you-woke-up-to-train-backstab-just-one-more-time-you're-on-the-right-track"

And then you die when a majicker walks in and immediately casts sleep on you and then proceeds to kill you dead.  Thanks for that, whoever that was so many years ago...

Thanks for reminding me, Reiloth.. I was just about to try an assassin again but you refreshed my memory on what a waste of time it is.  I suppose I'll stick to the warrior raiders.  Watch your backs.

Because magickers can't cast sleep on warrior raiders and proceed to kill them dead?

"Find out IC." 

[Synthesis]

I mean, if you really want to get down to it, assassins are about a million times better in PvP vs. most magickers than warriors are.  You know when everyone says "a well-prepared magicker can smoke anything?"  Well...the element of surprise pretty much puts a gigantic kibosh on that.  And hey, you can land backstabs that will smoke fools before they can type 'flee,' much less 'cast mon un elkros great googly moogly'.  And let's not even get into the other skills assassins get that warriors don't.

Weenie assassins get their faces melted all the time by raw combat power, sure.  But let me tell you:  if you can get your assassin up to greatness, you'll be ripping new assholes with such force that pretty much only Staff intervention will put an end to your rampage.  You still might get zorched by a magicker, but -anybody- can get zorched by a magicker:  that's just a risk you run when you play Armageddon.

[Sokotra]

The point that I think Reiloth and myself were making is that it takes quite a bit of time to be able to do anything worth a darn with an Assassin... which for me, personally, is a huge waste of time when I don't have a ton of time to invest in playing in the first place.

Oh yeah... and the majicker was invisible.

[jstorrie]

You can do a lot of things worth a darn with an unexperienced assassin. You can, for example, play a character.

[jcljules]

But how do you end up getting good at playing an assassin? You're not allowed to train backstab, right? And its also considered bad form to sneak everywhere.

[Desertman]

But how do you end up getting good at playing an assassin? You're not allowed to train backstab, right? And its also considered bad form to sneak everywhere.

Training backstab has always been "interesting" to me. I prefer to not play Guild Assassin, with my assassins, for this reason.

I heard you shouldnt train it on creatures, you shouldnt mass kill PC's, and since we are required to treat NPC's, like PC's, you can mass kill NPC's either.

So if you cant train it on animals, you cant train it on PC's, and you cant train it on NPC's, because you are supposed to treat them like PC's....who/what then do you train it on?

Oh, and you cant train it on sparring dummies, I found that out the hard way.

Actually, I am throwing this into ask the staff....I really dont know what to do in this sort of situation.

[Is Friday]

Why can't people train archery/throwing on sparring dummies? Is the code broken?

[jcljules]

But how do you end up getting good at playing an assassin? You're not allowed to train backstab, right? And its also considered bad form to sneak everywhere.

Oh, and you cant train it on sparring dummies, I found that out the hard way.

Exactly--so exactly how do you get good at backstab? Do you just...assassinate a lot of people? You'd need to be VERY lucky and VERY patient to do that.

[Desertman]

Why can't people train archery/throwing on sparring dummies? Is the code broken?

Because you will get this if you do...

Someone sends:
Please do not train archery/throw on sparring dummies. That is not what they are for.

Atleast thats what happened to me, it also happened with backstab.

[Is Friday]

Right I know that you aren't allowed to.

But I've never been told why.

[Desertman]

Right I know that you aren't allowed to.

But I've never been told why.

There are no answers, only the search my friend...only the search...

I think its because it has a huge potential to be abused...For example, someone throwing at a dummy day after day after day after day...which has happened a lot in the past before they made this rule, I gather.

[Janna]

I agree with Desertman. Out of all the classes, I find it very hard to play an assassin without coming up feeling like a twink no matter what you do. I guess the only staff approved way that -I've- heard is to RP out four or five sessions of you 'shadow training' or some such in your apartment/hall through the actions or maybe talking to a Vnpc mentor and request tool it in for a stat bump. So, really, unless you pester Imms for aid, or as Desertman points out, act like a serial killer, good luck.

[Desertman]

Well, Nyr in ask the staff has just answered our question. Go there for details but basically


You can backstab critters, you can backstab npc's, and you can backstab pc's...Just emote well as you do it.

You still cant backstab dummies though.

Its good to see the staff viewpoint shift on that over the years, I remember about 8-10 years back, a few got quiet angry about it and thier standpoints were pretty much the complete opposite.

[Kiri]

One way you can practice sneakiness is to... "spot" a shady looking character. Think to yourself... "That fellow looks suspicious. I wonder what he's up to. I bet (person of authority) might like to know!" Then sneak around after them. Many NPCs wander the streets.

You can also justify sneaking through the apartment by letting your rent get low and thinking that you dont want the guy to ask you for the next month's!


Backstab is a different matter and I've never actually used it. Ever. Because I never found a "reason" for my PC to even try it. 

[Furious George]

I'm chiming in a little late, but here's my thought...

I think that an assassin shouldn't come out the gate with the idea of how to backstab, but should instead branch it at a higher % than it starts now, but moderately advanced in the character's starting combat skills.  This allows for it to be considered an advanced manuver, and limits some of the twinkish guilty feelings that come with trying to figure out how to let that skill adapt itself to your roleplay environment.  This would also preclude finding people backstabbing rats or deformed children, simply because they feel backed into a corner when Joe Dwarf the NPC can ram a dagger straight through their back and out their chest in a shower of gore and blood.

It's like deciding going into the military that you're going to practice being a badass sniper when you've entered boot and just learned how to assemble/disassemble your rifle.

[Morrolan]

I think that an assassin shouldn't come out the gate with the idea of how to backstab, but should instead branch it at a higher % than it starts now, but moderately advanced in the character's starting combat skills. 

I agree with this.  I'd say (with no authority) it's too late to go through all this for 1.Arm, but for 2.Arm I'd at least like to see it where not every assassin gets it to start.  Maybe the way specializations will work, some will, however.

Morrolan

[jstorrie]

You can backstab whatever the hell you want, jcljules, as long as you've got a reason to. Don't backstab animals just to train backstab. Don't backstab people just to train backstab. If you're going to kill someone or something for some rational in-character purpose and you're going to surprise them to do it, go ahead and backstab them.

Same goes for sneak/hide. If you have a reason to be sneaky then go ahead and be sneaky.

The only objection people have had to backstabbing animals or NPCs is that people tend to do it just to train and not for some good reason. There's generally no good reason, for example, to go on some Rinth killing spree, or to genocide all tregils when you can't even skin them. There are many good reasons, however, to perform surprise attacks or to sneak around in a more general sense.

I don't understand what all the fucking gripes are about, here. There are many reasons for someone in Zalanthas to want to kill. There are many reasons for someone in Zalanthas to want to stay out of sight. If you can't figure them out, don't pick the 'sneaky killer' class for your PCs.

[Dalmeth]

Its good to see the staff viewpoint shift on that over the years, I remember about 8-10 years back, a few got quiet angry about it and their standpoints were pretty much the complete opposite.

The staff hasn't really changed their viewpoint.   The staff has been saying it's okay to backstab animals, and even NPCs for all the time I've been playing.  If staff ever did say anything of the sort, it was more to the point of not doing so excessively.  Just like you can do anything to excess.

To my knowledge, this game has never had a rash of highly trained backstabbers, so I don't think the staff is too worried about overpopulation.