Find out IC - what does this term actually mean?

[jhunter]

Find out IC usually means very simply, not I'm a dick and I don't want to help you, it either means It will be more fun to find out in game, or it would be cheating to find out out of game.

QFT.

[Lizzie]

Chiming in late. Find out IC usually means very simply, not I'm a dick and I don't want to help you, it either means It will be more fun to find out in game, or it would be cheating to find out out of game.

So now all you have to do, is make sure that every newbie to the game reads that one, singular post of yours before ever reading another thing about Armageddon.

Because if they don't, they'll probably assume the same that the rest of us assumed when we were tossed our first "Find out IC" - that you mean "I know the answer and you don't, and I'm not telling you. Hey everyone look at the nub asking stupid nub question let's all tell them find out IC so they feel even more stupid."

That seems to be the general consensus among the newer people who have posted their opinion in this thread. It is the *perception* - whether that's what the phrase means or not, is completely irrelevant. It makes people feel like they are inferior and not one of the "club" that gets to know stuff.

It also doesn't contribute to -any- discussion, it doesn't explain -how- to find out IC for people who are new enough that they have no idea, which is sometimes why they come here asking...it doesn't point anyone in any particular direction, and it is also often incorrect, as has been pointed out with previous references even to a couple of staff responses.

In short, "Find out IC" is perceived as rude and unhelpful. If you want to be -perceived- as a rude and unhelpful person, by all means use the phrase, all by itself, in answers to newbie questions. It won't mean you -are- rude and unhelpful, but that is how you will be perceived.

[LoD]

Chiming in late. Find out IC usually means very simply, not I'm a dick and I don't want to help you, it either means It will be more fun to find out in game, or it would be cheating to find out out of game.

So now all you have to do, is make sure that every newbie to the game reads that one, singular post of yours before ever reading another thing about Armageddon.

Because if they don't, they'll probably assume the same that the rest of us assumed when we were tossed our first "Find out IC" - that you mean "I know the answer and you don't, and I'm not telling you. Hey everyone look at the nub asking stupid nub question let's all tell them find out IC so they feel even more stupid."

That seems to be the general consensus among the newer people who have posted their opinion in this thread. It is the *perception* - whether that's what the phrase means or not, is completely irrelevant. It makes people feel like they are inferior and not one of the "club" that gets to know stuff.

It also doesn't contribute to -any- discussion, it doesn't explain -how- to find out IC for people who are new enough that they have no idea, which is sometimes why they come here asking...it doesn't point anyone in any particular direction, and it is also often incorrect, as has been pointed out with previous references even to a couple of staff responses.

In short, "Find out IC" is perceived as rude and unhelpful. If you want to be -perceived- as a rude and unhelpful person, by all means use the phrase, all by itself, in answers to newbie questions. It won't mean you -are- rude and unhelpful, but that is how you will be perceived.

I'd appreciate your input a lot more if you didn't sound like a broken record attached to an open hand that systematically slaps everyone that doesn't support your message.

I'm sorry that you, and some others, have such a strong reaction to players encouraging you to seek an answer out ICly and choose to view that person as rude and unhelpful instead of choosing to believe they might:

a) Not know the answer to your question, but recognize that elements of the answer should be found ICly.
b) Know the answer, but not know the best places to find the answer OOCly -- since they learned it ICly.
c) Know the answer, but don't expand upon it because while they can keep the content of their response appropriately ambiguous -- they don't want to encourage an open dialog that may result in the spread of IC information by a poster that doesn't understand the difference.

You can wish up to the Immortal Staff, write into mud@armageddon.org, or contact one of the many Helper players that are volunteering to be helpful -- but you choose to throw your question up into the crowded GDB and expect a concise and helpful response.

And you wonder why you get disappointed?

Instead of being sarcastic and antagonistic toward people who aren't supporting your direct line of thinking, perhaps more constructive elements would be appropriate if people still don't seem to agree with your opinion.  Some suggestions might be:

• A Newbies Only forum on the GDB in which only Helpers and Immortal Staff can post.
• Sticky posts with FAQ's in the most common spots new players look for documentation.
• FAQ's sent out with the general character acceptance letter linking them to the Newbie Forum.

There are some occasions and reasons why people may choose to utter the phrase "Find out IC.", and if you want people to respect your opinion and respond with thoughtful and constructive arguments, then you should consider returning the favor.

-LoD

[Krath]

Chiming in late. Find out IC usually means very simply, not I'm a dick and I don't want to help you, it either means It will be more fun to find out in game, or it would be cheating to find out out of game.

So now all you have to do, is make sure that every newbie to the game reads that one, singular post of yours before ever reading another thing about Armageddon.

Because if they don't, they'll probably assume the same that the rest of us assumed when we were tossed our first "Find out IC" - that you mean "I know the answer and you don't, and I'm not telling you. Hey everyone look at the nub asking stupid nub question let's all tell them find out IC so they feel even more stupid."

That seems to be the general consensus among the newer people who have posted their opinion in this thread. It is the *perception* - whether that's what the phrase means or not, is completely irrelevant. It makes people feel like they are inferior and not one of the "club" that gets to know stuff.

It also doesn't contribute to -any- discussion, it doesn't explain -how- to find out IC for people who are new enough that they have no idea, which is sometimes why they come here asking...it doesn't point anyone in any particular direction, and it is also often incorrect, as has been pointed out with previous references even to a couple of staff responses.

In short, "Find out IC" is perceived as rude and unhelpful. If you want to be -perceived- as a rude and unhelpful person, by all means use the phrase, all by itself, in answers to newbie questions. It won't mean you -are- rude and unhelpful, but that is how you will be perceived.

Lizzie you are wrong in your statement except how people may perceive it. Being here from almost the beginning of arm, Find out IC has ONLY ever meant It will be more fun to find out in game, or It would be cheating to find out ooc. And no it doesn' add to the discussion it gives them the answer the need, figure it out for yourself because if it isn't in the helpfiles odds are your PC would not know about it. And, if you dont have want to take the time to read over the extensive documentation and helpfiles, then thats your problem.

[Lizzie]

LOD wrote:

You can wish up to the Immortal Staff, write into mud@armageddon.org, or contact one of the many Helper players that are volunteering to be helpful -- but you choose to throw your question up into the crowded GDB and expect a concise and helpful response.

And you wonder why you get disappointed?

Me? I've never asked a question on the GDB that would result in a "find out IC" answer. I don't know where you got that idea, I never said I had. I don't "get disappointed" because after having lurked here for almost a month before ever making my account over a year ago, I learned not to bother, and to read the help files and the documentation instead. Because most of the information I would need to know, you can find out OOC, not IC.

Krath, I stated my opinion. An opinion can't be wrong, or right. It's an opinion. And telling me that I'm wrong about feeling the way I feel, is being arguementative and non-contributory to the conversation.

[The 4th Kankman]

An opinion can be 'wrong' by being based on false assumptions and incorrect facts.

Yours qualifies in both spheres, concurrently ignoring the primary arguments in the last two posters' statements.

The 'Help' files are there for a reason.  Use them liberally, and understand that this MUD is not designed for those
demanding the truth about the coded 'mysteries' of the game through a casual, hand-me-down Q&A session.
The MUD itself is based on the continual exploration of these features, with some exceptions (several of which
turn out to be bugs), and does not cater to those seeking a direct answer to most of their coded quagmires.

There are many gaming multiverses that will readily provide the type of real-time, newbie-catering dialogue that
you're suggesting.  This is not one of them.

~ The 4th Kankman of the Armageddon

[Oleupata]

Inflammatory thread necro. That's pretty impressive.