Bar Brawling

[Boggis]

We should get something added to the brawl code helpfiles that explicitly states that you cannot do any special, non-weapon combat moves like kick, etc. I've seen 3 people now who are new players fall victim to this and lose their PCs - would be unfortunate to lose any new players over this. A help brawl file might be useful too instead of having it tucked away in help hit.

[spicemustflow]

Agree .

[BlackMagic0]

I believe we should have a detailed 'help brawl' file, Out side of the hit command.
Stating.. No combat abilities can be used, and making it bluntly pointed out.

I agree. Brawl helpfiles are hidden away to far back.

[Simple]

Agreed. Specify it on hit brawltest too.

EDIT:  Also nosave being a bit more obvious..

[Riev]

I may or may not have seen the most recent incident as well, and almost felt bad about it.


I mean, I can see how someone would think "Oh... I should try to kick him in the stomach" without thinking of death as the consequence.

[Zoltan]

One of my fonder memories of getting into Arm was using kick during a brawl out of n00bish ignorance. Granted it turned out a lot better for me than for most. I agree with the rest of you about having a 'help brawl' file.

[cyberpatrol_735]

> nosave arrest


That will save you a lot of noobish army of militia rushing in deaths.

I agree that the helpfile should be updated to reflect that only the 'hit' command is allowed within the brawl code.

For Arm 2.0 -
An idea from SOI code is this, for the first two or three hours, the player would be set with an invisible -newbie- flag that they could turn off by set newbie or whatever command might be appropriate if it was an experienced player.


Basically what this does is gives a prewarning.


For instance:

>kill man
Are you sure you wish to do that? You are in a lawful area and would be crimflagged for doing such. To continue with this action, append the '!' no quotes to the command.


> kill man !
You attack the man.
You get swarmed by guards.

A human allanaki soldier says, in sirihish:
    "I wish they'd move the jail closer to the criminals."


>east

Going that way would result in a rather nasty fall, if you still wish to attempt it, please append the '!' no quotes to the command.


> east !
You plummet to the ground below.
BEEP.
Welcome to Armageddon!




This would only last the first couple hours of play, and like I said, it would be totally easy to turn off for experienced players that wouldn't want to run around using ! all the time. I should probably post this on the reborn forum.. but it's a thought.

[spicemustflow]

nosave arrest

I'll just say it doesn't help much...

[Mood]

Nosave arrest won't help you in this situation. If you've initiated combat, the soldiers will attack first and ask questions later.

[Gimfalisette]

I think players can help on this by, when we see someone who seems like a newb about to get into a barfight, tossing out an OOC on how to do it and what NOT to do. It's far, far preferable to me to maybe annoy someone who does know what they're doing because I OOCed, than to possibly lose a new player completely because the code and help files were un-helpful. Nosave arrest, as folks have said, does not help at all in this situation, as the NPC soldiers cannot attempt a subdue during a fight and will only jump in and go for the kill on the hapless newb.

Other than that, yeah, I agree something should be done about brawl code and help and such. I've seen a LOT of PCs die to brawl code.

[Sokotra]

I'd rather just see the brawl code integrated with regular combat somehow, so that only drawing and using regular weapons will cause a "crimflag"... or if you continue to beat someone to death after a certain point, etc.   Kicking and bashing and stuff should be used freely and raucously.

[RogueGunslinger]

I'd rather just see the brawl code integrated with regular combat somehow, so that only drawing and using regular weapons will cause a "crimflag"... or if you continue to beat someone to death after a certain point, etc.   Kicking and bashing and stuff should be used freely and raucously.

I really don't see that solving the problem of newbies getting killed... In fact I see it doing the opposite.

[psionic fungus]

I disagree... Depending on how reputations and crime are handled.

If you're fist-fighting, and there are no soldiers around... Perhaps no-one cares... But when you pull a knife, perhaps some people around might think it's time to get authorities.  If you are beating on someone who is unconscious... Same deal.  Depending on the reputations, perhaps the commoners would get involved themselves...

I think that's all well and good.  Better than the way brawling works now.   

[Mood]

Personally, I think it'd be cool (and very Zalanthan) to be able to knife some guy for looking at me wrong, and not get instagibbed by soldiers.

[RogueGunslinger]

Personally, I think it'd be cool (and very Zalanthan) to be able to knife some guy for looking at me wrong, and not get instagibbed by soldiers.

Now this I agree with. You cant even do this in the 'rinth's bars.

[Tisiphone]

Personally, I think it'd be cool (and very Zalanthan) to be able to knife some guy for looking at me wrong, and not get instagibbed by soldiers.

Now this I agree with. You cant even do this in the 'rinth's bars.

YOU can't, but that's because you're a little shit, not a gang boss. NOBODY tells the Guild who to knife or not knife. In the 'rinth, I imagine, depending on the control of the area (that is, who's playing there at the time, because frankly, the power structure is largely dependent on the players) there could be much MORE draconian law and order; cf prisons.

Then again, at the wrong times, it might be rampant anarchy. Depends who's on top.

[Sokotra]

I'd rather just see the brawl code integrated with regular combat somehow, so that only drawing and using regular weapons will cause a "crimflag"... or if you continue to beat someone to death after a certain point, etc.   Kicking and bashing and stuff should be used freely and raucously.

I really don't see that solving the problem of newbies getting killed... In fact I see it doing the opposite.

Because it makes everything more fluid, more consistent.. and makes more sense.  If I was a newb and started brawling and hitting people in the bar, then it would make sense to me that if I draw a weapon then I am going to get crim-flagged or at least cause others (soldiers or not) to get involved.  This would all be contained in the help files for "kill" and "hit" or "combat" or whatever... (I don't look at the help files much) and be easy to find and understand for newbies.  If changed, "Help brawl" would also contain some of these same things that you find in "help kill", but would more visibly highlight what the limitations might be in a common tavern setting.  Again, it would just seem to make more "common sense" and cause less confusion, imho.  Either way, I would like it better and it would be more realistic and fun. 

[RogueGunslinger]

I think if we did a survey, and tried to see how many people lost characters to sparring, then compared it to brawl code. The prior would win out.