Ideas for tuluki custom tattooer

[Raesanos]

Any ideas on what can be done to make the Tuluki custom tattooer differant from the Allanaki one?  In terms of what is offered, not code differences.

Am thinking about having them both use local animals for example.

[ale six]

A variety of bunnies and trees, pink hearts, and cute looking furry woodland creatures. And all the styles should be anime.

More serious answer:

Local animals would be good. Could offer things like the sun, (various phases of) moons, and stars as well. Tuluk also has a greater variety of wildlife handy, which would mean they likely have easier access to dyes, and a wider variety of them. So maybe the tattooist could offer choices in bright, vibrant and unusual colors in addition to the normal ones.

[Gimfalisette]

Styles should be different. Tuluk's got an emphasis on florals, lacy patterns, more intricate stuff, AND it's more of a tattoo culture, so one would think the custom tattooist would be a better artist than the Nakki one. So I'd suggest keywords for tattoos like:

Flowery
Lacy
Intricate
Elaborate
Finely-inked
Detailed

Colors: Eliminate jade. (Heh.) Put in silver and blood-red for the moons. I agree that Tuluk should have a broader potential color range.

Icons: Eliminate the cross. Maybe put in a "sun and moons" combination.

[jhunter]

Styles should be different. Tuluk's got an emphasis on florals, lacy patterns, more intricate stuff, AND it's more of a tattoo culture, so one would think the custom tattooist would be a better artist than the Nakki one. So I'd suggest keywords for tattoos like:

Flowery
Lacy
Intricate
Elaborate
Finely-inked
Detailed

Colors: Eliminate jade. (Heh.) Put in silver and blood-red for the moons. I agree that Tuluk should have a broader potential color range.

Icons: Eliminate the cross. Maybe put in a "sun and moons" combination.

For once, I agree with you on something.

[O]

How about some face and body paintings as well as henna and tattoos?

There are some nice pictures here:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/tribe/tribes/matis/index.shtml

I like the spots and stripes, but the whiskers a tad too open to abuse?

Lattices, flowers same scope as tattoos I suppose...and fun for parties, kids!

[O]

Actually those ones are tattoos, but I saw a tribe on tv with paint some time ago and I couldn't help but think of Tuluk.

[Ourla]

I also agree with Gimfalisette's ideas.

I really think Tuluk could use more abstract designs as well.  They're the folks most likely to decorate their skin for the sake of art and for the sake of simple beautification.  Some of my favorite tattoos there are the chaotic izdari board design and the series of simple slash marks.

Spirals, chevrons, striated lines, blackwork (biz slang for large areas of pure black ink), rectangles/triangles/circles/diamonds, dotwork, curvilinear designs, etc.  Also, the option to have 'symmetric' or 'asymmetric' in the tattoo's sdesc would be the bomb.

[mansa]

What does the Allanaki tattooist do?

[Gimfalisette]

What does the Allanaki tattooist do?

Stabs you in the head and calls it a tattoo.

[a strange shadow]

And Tuluki tattoos stab you in the back?

Then they call themselves 'Amos'.

[Raesanos]

What does the Allanaki tattooist do?

Lets you construct a custom tattoo with a given style, color, and image.

[Cale_Knight]

This is an idea for both tattooists, but I'd like the option to not take any kind of adjective.

I might want "a jade sword tattoo" instead of "a plain jade sword tattoo."

[WWYD]

Just for badness, put 'tower' in the Tuluki one. The Allanaki has a pyramid, which is really kind of..wtf, since that's where everyone knows Muk lives. In a pretty pyramid.

EDIT: In all seriousness, I'd throw in a few of the higher ranking noble house symbols as well. Kenku, quill, mace, ox, etc.

[Gimfalisette]

EDIT: In all seriousness, I'd throw in a few of the higher ranking noble house symbols as well. Kenku, quill, mace, ox, etc.

I would not do this. The noble houses already have their own private tattooists which are accessible to nobles, employees, and partisans. The Chosen wouldn't want just anyone running around the streets wearing their symbols.

[Aruven]

You could institute some of the features brought up for arm 2.0 - like maybe certain types of facial make-up, even though they don't change the s-desc.

I'd think tuluk a bit bigger on that sort of thing. Aside from that, I could see a bit more designs illustrating history. I like the moon ideas, but would like to see something that shows the rebellion - maybe like a shattered jade cross with an over-lapping sun or something.

One I think would be interesting is a design of the two colored moons behind a pyramid - so long as designs like this don't interfere with caste and house markings, like Gimfalisette mentioned.

[Elgiva]

Colors: Eliminate jade. (Heh.)

I disagree. Winrothols use jade as "their" color too. Go, jade and silver!

[Gimfalisette]

Colors: Eliminate jade. (Heh.)

I disagree. Winrothols use jade as "their" color too. Go, jade and silver!

Winrothols should already have their own custom tattoos available in their estate, and I really don't think jade would be seen on anyone else in Tuluk, unless it's a couple of special tattoos that were done for the Rebellion and the Copper War and the like, which even those are only going to be seen on a select few individuals to whom they have meaning. (In keeping with the Tuluki custom of wearing one's history on one's body.) On anyone BUT a Winrothol Chosen/employee/partisan/slave who is wearing jade and silver together, just jade as a standalone color should immediately invoke "Allanak!" And that is A Bad Thing (tm) in Tuluk.

[Elgiva]

On anyone BUT a Winrothol Chosen/employee/partisan/slave who is wearing jade and silver together, just jade as a standalone color should immediately invoke "Allanak!" And that is A Bad Thing (tm) in Tuluk.

I still disagree. I even have a feeling there already -is- a tattoo with jade used in mdesc in Tuluk (but I can't check now).

Well, unless Allanak avoids all tattoos with white color. In that case I might agree.  :twisted:

[Jherlen]

I think it's getting a little too simplistic when we're excluding whole colors just because some house or city has a "claim" to them.

If a Tuluki is going around wearing a tattoo of the Allanaki Jade Cross, that's one thing. If they just want a jade tattoo of a tregil on their cheek to match their eyes, or the new hat they bought from Kadius, is that a big deal?

Another example: The colors red and black are shared by several different Houses. If I get a red and black wyvern on my arm, I'm probably displaying Borsail pride. A red and black eclipsed sun is probably Kurac. Suppose now that I get a red and black crossbow tattoo. Is that tattoo reminding people of Borsail AND Kurac just by its colors, or do I maybe just like the colors red and black?

[Gimfalisette]

The point is, Tuluk doesn't -need- "jade" in its color selection. If there's a green or three needed other than "green", there's a lot of other choices: emerald, chartreuse, grass-green, malachite, moss-green, olive, viridian, etc.

Leaving jade in will only serve to muddle the cultural waters, add confusion, and potentially put a newbie who went to get a leet jade tattoo in the awkward position of explaining to a Faithful or Chosen why they're wearing Allanak's signature color.

As to "red" and "black" and the like, those are generic color names (category names), not specific colors, whereas jade is a specific color of the green category. If Tuluk's city-state colors were stated to be "vermillion" and "alabaster" (instead of "red" and "white") and those colors had become intensely associated with Tuluki citizenship/patriotism in game, then I would say yes those colors should not show up in Allanak at all, individually or in combination. Alas, Tuluki color-symbols are all generic color categories instead. Even so, you will never find the red-and-white color combination being used in Allanak in any fond context, and it would be reacted against pretty strongly.

[flurry]

-Trees, leaves, and other northern flora related things
-Instruments and other art related things
-northern fauna
-the color ivory and brighter colors in general

[bardbard#4]

Styles should be different. Tuluk's got an emphasis on florals, lacy patterns, more intricate stuff, AND it's more of a tattoo culture, so one would think the custom tattooist would be a better artist than the Nakki one. So I'd suggest keywords for tattoos like:

Flowery
Lacy
Intricate
Elaborate
Finely-inked
Detailed

I have to disagree here.  If anything, -Allanak- should have the flowery lacy finely-inked tattoos since 'nak is supposed to be more decadent and snooty, at least among nobility.  Tuluk should be more tribal and raw with heavy emphasis on castes, as its roots lie in that tradition.  Utep was a warlord, y'all.  For reelz.

[psionic fungus]

Come on!

Everyone knows the Southrons are the Barbarians.

[staggerlee]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWbEHGIfEeM&NR=1

I'm -sure- something like this has been posted before, but it can't hurt.

Basically the technique you'd be using is taking a bone with a sharp point, dipping it in ink and moving it along the skin, pounding it rhythmically with a mallet.

Getting beautiful designs is a matter of patience and skill but the results can look pretty incredible.  The thing that you should keep in mind with design though is that you're not going to have solid blocks of color, there's usually that texture of dots, though you can get really close.  Also there's not likely to be fine detail, so portraiture is probably a bad idea.

Also it takes a while and bruises like hell.  

Anyway, I hope that's of interest to someone. I saw someone getting a piece done in the icelandic tradition once and it was pretty fascinating to watch.

[Jherlen]

The point is, Tuluk doesn't -need- "jade" in its color selection. ... Leaving jade in will only serve to muddle the cultural waters, add confusion, and potentially put a newbie who went to get a leet jade tattoo in the awkward position of explaining to a Faithful or Chosen why they're wearing Allanak's signature color.

See, again, I think this is taking too simplistic a view. If nobles and templars are harassing people for wearing a color, I think they should think about more interesting reasons to harass PCs. There's a difference between wearing all jade&black/red&white, complete with Allanaki/Tuluki symbols, and just wearing a color. Think of it like sports teams -- you don't associate a guy wearing a color to a team that has that colors, unless he's wearing the logo.

As to "red" and "black" and the like, those are generic color names (category names), not specific colors, whereas jade is a specific color of the green category.

Well, okay. Crimson is a specific color in the red category and is the color of Borsail and a few other clans. Even so, I think it would be silly of a PC in the game to flag down a character wearing a crimson cloak and accuse them of being a Borsailophile.

Maybe part of it is that we're playing a text game and have less flexibility than actual reality, but I think making the statement that "Jade = Allanak" everywhere is a bit over the top.

[bardess]

From my experience you can wear jade or black as long as they're not together, or if it's just in small amounts.  If it's a patriotic event, though, it's probably not a good idea to wear jade or black or even green, because you might not wake up the next morning.

[Aruven]

The point is, Tuluk doesn't -need- "jade" in its color selection. If there's a green or three needed other than "green", there's a lot of other choices: emerald, chartreuse, grass-green, malachite, moss-green, olive, viridian, etc.

Leaving jade in will only serve to muddle the cultural waters, add confusion, and potentially put a newbie who went to get a leet jade tattoo in the awkward position of explaining to a Faithful or Chosen why they're wearing Allanak's signature color.

As to "red" and "black" and the like, those are generic color names (category names), not specific colors, whereas jade is a specific color of the green category. If Tuluk's city-state colors were stated to be "vermillion" and "alabaster" (instead of "red" and "white") and those colors had become intensely associated with Tuluki citizenship/patriotism in game, then I would say yes those colors should not show up in Allanak at all, individually or in combination. Alas, Tuluki color-symbols are all generic color categories instead. Even so, you will never find the red-and-white color combination being used in Allanak in any fond context, and it would be reacted against pretty strongly.

Maybe I'm being away from the crowd here, but I like it when cities have designated colors, unless a neutral house has similar colors. That's the way it used to happen - you could identify an ambassador or something (Not that tuluk and Allanak seem to have that relationship anyway)

[White Moon]

I would think a Tuluki commoner out of their heads for willingly wearing the color jade, unless employed by House Winrothol.

[Bebop]

What you have to think about it is jade is just a color of green.  Just because a sdesc says "jade" it doesn't mean ONLY Allanaki's wear that shade of green.  People wear blue clothes, little red dresses etc, the first thing people don't think is OMG A PATRIOT.  There is a big difference between wearing a color and wearing an indication of a color.  Now wearing a jade cross can get you in trouble sure, but wearing jade?  That's a little OOCly extreme if you ask me.

[staggerlee]

There are examples throughout history of style/color of specifically signifying certain classes.  For example you can dig up trial records from New England shortly before the American independence where people were accused of 'dressing above their station'.  

A lot of the time this was enforced by the rarity of dyes, since the process for creating blue/purple dyes for example was fairly hard it wasn't likely you'd see poor people running around in purple silk anyway.  And since shades were fairly hard to perfect, it wasn't likely that someone would be quibbling in court about whether or not a color is "azure".

How much bearing that has on this discussion depends largely on the docs I guess.

[White Moon]

That's a little OOCly extreme if you ask me.

To each her own.

[Southie]

I think if I saw a southerner wearing red and white, or a Tuluki wearing jade, I'd think to myself "Heh heh, bad fashion sense." I probably would not think "OH MY GOD AN ENEMY PATRIOT!!"

But hey, everybody can react differently to things like that.

[Shiroi Tsuki]

I think it should be up to the character whether they'd wear the colour or not, not up to the selection at the tattooist.

It's not like only Tulukis get tattoos in Tuluk.

[Gimfalisette]

I think if I saw a southerner wearing red and white, or a Tuluki wearing jade, I'd think to myself "Heh heh, bad fashion sense." I probably would not think "OH MY GOD AN ENEMY PATRIOT!!"

But hey, everybody can react differently to things like that.

I really don't think any sensible Tuluki or Nakki templar or noble or anyone in a position to actually screw with PCs would REALLY think that someone was a traitor/spy/etc. for wearing the color of the opposite city-state.

But the point of the whole thing was, smart Tulukis would not be wearing jade, unless they were associated with Winrothol and thus wearing jade AND silver. Smart Nakkis would not be wearing red and white together. Yes, it's a fashion thing; fashionable Nakkis would also not be wearing the flowing, skin-baring styles of Tuluk, just like you're not going to see a Tuluki wearing a collar that keeps his/her head from moving more than fractionally.

It's a cultural distinction. Why is there something wrong with keeping it? Why are we arguing that jade should be appropriate in Tuluk when there are probably fifteen other descriptors for green that could be used instead? Tuluk does not NEED jade tattoos.

(The above question not directed at Southie, but to everyone who apparently thinks jade is a necessary color choice in Tuluk.)

[Bebop]

Actually I remember this from playing a Kadian:

However, the one staple of the Allanaki wardrobe is the color white.

http://www.armageddon.org/general/clothing.html

You may think oocly Lirathan, but that is typically the color of choice in 'Nak according to the documentation.

[Gimfalisette]

However, the one staple of the Allanaki wardrobe is the color white.

http://www.armageddon.org/general/clothing.html

You may think oocly Lirathan, but that is typically the color of choice in 'Nak according to the documentation.

White is not "the color of choice" in Allanak. The documentation just means to say that white never goes out of fashion in Allanak, like many other colors do. If orange is in the Kadian shops right now in Allanak, then orange is in fashion; if orange is NOT in the Kadian shops, then it is OUT of fashion and therefore passe. However, white cannot be out of fashion. That does not, however, imply that it is the principal color worn.

And like I said before, "white" is a color category, not a specific color name/shade. This is why "white" or "red" alone are not an issue in Allanak; however the combination of red and white would definitely cause raised eyebrows. "Jade", though, is a specific color of green which is highly and irrevocably associated with Allanak.

There's other things like this in game. For example, you're not going to see people in Allanak wearing sun-symbol stuff, unless they're Krathis maybe. In Tuluk, you're not going to see anyone wearing dragon-symbol stuff. Pyramids indicate Tuluk, too, and crosses indicate Allanak. These are important pieces of cultural identity.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

As an ex-gang-member, I can safely say that certain factions in RL certainly do associate colors with other factions. To this day, even in my now mundane life, when I see one of the homies wearing blue or red, I instantly wonder if that person is a blood or crip. I dismiss it nearly instantly as well, because where I live, bloods and crips aren't as wide-spread as they are in California.

But I still instantly, without mental effort, associate colors with sects and factions. In a barbaric world like Zalanthas, I can easily picture it being more extreme.

[Raesanos]

The new tattooer is in now, sorry for the delay, had to get a JavaScript utility fixed before I could make the necessary change.

Feedback welcome as always.