Noob Tutorial

[Cavus]

Why not code a small tutorial world and give noobs some instructions by NPCs before they are ported in our world? I mean come on Arm is losing many people because of lack of tutorial. Help files take time to read and many new players first want to sense the game then read documents. Even if they read it first, they won't be able to read enough always. Only players who stay and play are the ones we recruited from RL since we have chance to give that tutorial at their computer in their house.

[Jherlen]

I mean come on Arm is losing many people because of lack of tutorial. ... Only players who stay and play are the ones we recruited from RL since we have chance to give that tutorial at their computer in their house.

Do you have any data to back this up?

ale six and I found Arm on our own. We'd both mudded elsewhere before, but I don't think Arm is driving people off in great numbers because we don't have a newbie land.

edited for grammar

[Cavus]

Data is the times I see offline new characters in Gaj sleeping area. And, I remember my first minutes and I think it would be hard to stay in game if Ghost and Gaere and some other friends had not helped in front of my computer.

[ThirdEye]

How about at starting a new account, some prompt comes up asking where you heard about the MUD?

[Morgenes]

How about at starting a new account, some prompt comes up asking where you heard about the MUD?

We've been doing that for years

[Bushranger]

I discovered Armageddon on my own. I still to this day do not know anyone in RL who also plays Armageddon. I am still playing - I've been playing for many years. I remember the days when there wasn't even an account system for Armageddon, to keep track of Karma there was a point during character creation where you typed the name and password of your previous character.

My point being, RL interaction is not required for new players to begin playing Armageddon. Yes, there is a lot in the help files and theme information. Yes, new players are expected to be at least familiar with some of that information (which is why there is an Introductory Information page as the first entry on the website) and it does take some time to become familiar with it. I like that.

Infact, I like that alot. I'm glad it takes time to learn. It's the first stage to weeding out twinks from the ranks of this RPI (Role-Play Intensive) mud. It means that those who do stay to play in the world of armageddon have some dedication to knowing the help files which in turn means they have some familiarity with the theme and thats a good thing. We're not the largest mud on the internet but I don't want to see Armageddon try to be. That would mean attracting as large an audience as possible instead of focusing on what the mud does so well, enforcing a role-playing world.

I do not think a short tutorial the first time a new account enters the world, before the hall of kings, would be a bad thing. I do think that the players who are not disuaded by the lack of a tutorial and take the time to read up on help files (on the web and in game) are the sorts of players that would be a welcome addition to the mud.

[Cuusardo]

We're losing players?

I don't think the linkdead people you find are people who are "leaving" the mud.  I think a lot of them are newer players who don't realize that you can't just close the telnet window to quit.

[TheGivingTree]

Well... Armageddon does have a steep learning curve. New people do have difficulties learning the ins and outs that are considered simple in the game. Such as simple commands and basic in-game rules. I say you should put that introductory to Armageddons on the website in bolded-caps. O__o That way... not even certain people who are tormented by dyslexia can miss it. (sarcasm intentional.)

[Aldiel]

Actually, one of the reasons I stuck with Armageddon in the beginning was because I didn't have to go through some lame tutorial, and if we were going to make a tutorial, I'm not sure how it would work.  I would rather see a link to a noobie walk-through on the main menu screen in the MUD then a IG tutorial.

[Fnord]

If a tutorial was added, I'd say have it as an option from the Hall of Kings. For example, point at the n00b school bus or a place on the map to begin your journey. The the tutorial area could be an OOC space, that didn't interact with the live world.

[UnderSeven]

Don't be so hard on the original poster.  He does have some point there.  

When I first found arm, it took me literally months to go from casual newbie to actual player.  This game can be hard to figure out.  Really really hard.  My first three chars were total throw aways, and it takes a fair bit of commitment to get into that.  I have tried to recruit a few people who haven't pulled it off before.

That being said, I don't think a tutorial area would make any difference at all.  First of all from games I've played that did have them, rarely did I find I have the patience to do them.  On top of that what makes arm so hard isn't a matter of commands or automated mud code, at least I don't think so.  It's the player world and all that's going on, knowledge of the game and interactions.  The sort of thing you can really only get from inside playing the game.  Ultimately I don't think this idea would change anything other than make a double redudancy to our webpage and extensive help files.

Automation just can't make up for the complexity of this game.  If anything, I think a newbie tutorial zone would turn more people off.

[Flashback]

I like the idea of a tutorial zone as an option from the Hall of Kings. It could have a few baby critters, a cheapo merchant, some hapless bystanders to steal from. Basically a way for everyone to learn their skills with.
The thing that confused me most for weeks was the emote syntax and I still use Moab's quick guide. One of the handiest ways to learn is having the help files up and examples. So, if you're concerned about newbies learning the syntax of things before the game, teach them all the basics. Make them move a kank into a stable and whatnot. Tell them the basics like put your coins away and other things. You could even make it mandatory to talk to some NPCs by showing them examples with an OOC echo then they have to repeat it to advance. I suppose it would need some timers too so vets couldn't stand around and abuse it all day to better themselves before starting.
Anyway, reinforced help files would help newbie mudders, if there are any on Armageddon. I suspect there isn't but if you're worried about them, teach them so the vets can pull their hair out less later on.

[amoeba]

Data is the times I see offline new characters in Gaj sleeping area

I have also seen many linkdead people in other muds, even those with newbie zones, and even in WoW as well.  Many people don't get that their character is vulnerable while linkdead.

I would not like to see a newbie zone, rather I would like to see dedicated IG mentors.  I think it would be cool to have the occasional between serious characters role of mentor. Make up a grizzled old man and get the occasional send from an IMM stating that there is a new player in the Gaj who could use some help. Then go over and interact with them in game to give them a feel for the place with a bare minimun of breaking the atmosphere of the place.

Just a random thought, not to be taken too seriously.

[Lizzie]

Hello, I'm pretty new here, but I lurked for a few weeks before starting to play. I played in another RPI and it had a little section where you could check out commands and syntax before entering the game. You would show up in that section as a random-generated "silly mob" like the green-polka-dotted troll. Helpers could also enter this area and would also have a mob desc so you wouldn't know who they were in the game. It was all very anonymous and all very helpful. Combat was disabled in the area, so you couldn't be a snert there. Mostly it was just to get a little help with things, for people who couldn't find what they were looking for in the help files, or didn't understand what they found.

This is my first character here and I'm having a great time, and I was lucky that I came from another diku-based RPI so I didn't have too much trouble with syntax. But if I came from somewhere else I think it would've been overwhelming. I almost remember what it was like being a newbie in the other game, and I empathize with the poster of this thread here. I think it would be a great idea to have some place where newbies can apply what they learned on the website in the game without worrying about ruining RP or embarrassing themselves with their character.

That's all I wanted to say, thank you.
L. Stanson

[Tlaloc]

Welcome to Armageddon, Lizzie!

[gfair]

I found Arm on my own.

The truth is, there isn't a lot to learn, and what you need to learn first is not lengthy at all. That's why we have the Quickstart doc, which is one page long.

http://www.armageddon.org/intro/quickstart.html

This is something that anybody can read, there is no argument for this being a lengthy document. You have to do a lot more reading for other muds.

I think your argument isn't correct. Arm has only grown in the 4-5 years I've known of it. What you probably are forgetting is that there is a ton to read for any mud, it's just that with Arm it's up-front, because Arm is realistic. In other muds you start a character within minutes, having read nothing, but you have to read a lot more after that to understand the game and do anything with it.

[Sir Diealot]

In a word.  

No.


In many words.

No, unless it was simply an optional thing that taught only commands, or only arm-specific ones that can confuse people.  Otherwise, I think learning the game, through being blasted by a Templar you attempted to spam-steal from, is a learning experience that would do a lot of newbies some good.

[Larrath]

I am very much in favor of an optional Tutorial area.

It could have one room dedicated to every major area in the game to help newbies actually understand what the Sea of Silt, or the 'rinth or Red Storm are like.
When I started, I thought the 'rinth was a giant maze carved into a mountainside a few leagues to the north of Allanak.  And I had no understanding of the Allanaki vs. Tuluki hatred.

So I really do believe it could be great.  People could go from section to section and learn inside the game, which is much easier (in my opinion) than reading all of the documents.  The new players' area could have something like 50% of the documents, only the bare essentials to be able to play and not die.

Not all new players come back asking for more after being killed by a templar.  Some of them don't even understand why they died and get frustrated and go elsewhere.

[Cavus]

Good point Larrath. By saying tutorial, I don't mean IC sensity training though. It is some basic commands, and yes some common knowledge such as Tuluk hatred, and who is a templar.

It can be totally  optionally because some people does not like tutorial. I am just suggesting the illustration of things at quickstart page. Bleave me if you are especially new to MUD games, it is not easy to understand dynamics with just documents. Some people think NPCs as PC for example:-)

For example,
Using:
talk,
tell,
prompt,
way to seek things and behave in game,
emote,
etc.

If you were a helper at a messenger, what would you tell to a newbie? Just tell and illustrate those things in that tutorial. It is not something to refuse, puting some optional tutorial does not hurt anyone, it may add one more person to playerbase and that's alot for us.

And being harsh game, and worl, and being realistic...Tutorial won't change these facts. You'll just make the begining smoother, then they will face with harsh world when they are in a city. Just create a tutorial world where they spawns optionally and practice.

[bloodfromstone]

A tutorial area could do the game a lot of good, I think. Optional, of course. Some may think that a sink-or-swim entrance to the world is the best way of learning, but that's simply not true for everyone. It works great for some. Others, not so much, and they end up thinking the game is boring/stupid/unfair when they sit at a bar for 10 hours in Red Storm with no one to interact with/can't figure out some syntax/get killed by a templar for not bowing.

[Anonymous]

I have always said that a newbie introduction could be tastefully done.  But, after many years, I agree that doing it in the way that most muds do this would be horrible for arm.

It would be nice if some of the commonly called "newbie" clans could be joined via the intro screen so that a few PC coordinators could get notified, for example, that x sdesc wants to be in The Byn (for example) in Tuluk/Allanak or whatever, so that someone could arrange a meeting.

Purely optional, of course, and they would still be ICly screened - but it would at least give an excuse for interaction to start.  This way people would have a way to fit their IC background more sensibly into the game without having to first learn the entire layout of the city and cross the big bridge of breaking into the clique.

I dunno - something to think about, maybe.

[Larrath]

Some MUD schools are good and others are bad.
I see no reason why Arm can't have an appropriate MUD School added so new players can look at it.

It -can- be done, and done well, and I would like to see an attempt made.

[Gaare]

I wrote same lines before, but...

IMO if a player is that lazy for even reading a couple of quickstart pages, then visiting bazaar.. then spend some coins to buy a bone longsword. There is little chance ARM addiction virus will affect her.

I knew a handful of commands, when I begin playing ARM. Also, there was no quickstart document (thanks to the Queen and ShaLeah) or LoD's walkthrough. Both are awesome, and seems extremely useful to me. Maybe, adding link of those in account creation mail can be another useful addition.

[Aldiel]

Hello, I'm pretty new here, but I lurked for a few weeks before starting to play. I played in another RPI and it had a little section where you could check out commands and syntax before entering the game. You would show up in that section as a random-generated "silly mob" like the green-polka-dotted troll. Helpers could also enter this area and would also have a mob desc so you wouldn't know who they were in the game. It was all very anonymous and all very helpful. Combat was disabled in the area, so you couldn't be a snert there. Mostly it was just to get a little help with things, for people who couldn't find what they were looking for in the help files, or didn't understand what they found.

This is my first character here and I'm having a great time, and I was lucky that I came from another diku-based RPI so I didn't have too much trouble with syntax. But if I came from somewhere else I think it would've been overwhelming. I almost remember what it was like being a newbie in the other game, and I empathize with the poster of this thread here. I think it would be a great idea to have some place where newbies can apply what they learned on the website in the game without worrying about ruining RP or embarrassing themselves with their character.

That's all I wanted to say, thank you.
L. Stanson

You know what, I know this is very unzalanthan, but this isn't such a bad idea.  If a player could select to go to this tutorial outside of his own character, this could be really, really helpful.  Maybe it could be some little village outside the known world.  I like the idea of anyone being able to go there and assist these new players.  The character you would play would be one of a short list of randomly generated mobs.

Code Select Expand


Press RETURN to continue.
You may:
    (C) Connect to your character   (R) Create a new character    
    (T) Enter Tutorial           (?) Read menu options  
    (L) List your characters             (V) Toggle ANSI/VT100 mode    
    (B) Toggle 'brief' menus            (O) Show Race/Guild Options  
    (P) Change account password    (D) Documentation menu        
    (E) Change your Email              (X) Exit Armageddon          
               
Armageddon is OPEN.


Edit: Change it from "Enter Noobie Tutorial," to just Enter Tutorial because that made it sound too much like a l33t hack an' slash game.

[Anonymous]

IMO if a player is that lazy for even reading a couple of quickstart pages, then visiting bazaar.. then spend some coins to buy a bone longsword. There is little chance ARM addiction virus will affect her.

You know what addicted me to arm?  It wasn't because I read a bunch of help files and bought a prop in a bazaar.

It was when a friend of mine whom I knew OOCly arranged to meet me in game, adopted me, and showed me what role play really was.

Before that, it was a bunch of wankers sitting in a tavern whispering to each other, and a lot of props and rules that I didn't know much to do with.

What makes Arm addictive is PC INTERACTION, not rules, props, and descriptions.