Obsidian Coins.

[Carnage]

I imagine that the situation with Tuluk and Nobles' power is somewhat ambiguous. True the Nobles did win back Tuluk and have rebuilt it, but in a way, Tuluk and Allanak aren't the most important groups in the Known World. I imagine the World power system to be somewhat unstable and works through a wobbly relationship between the Merchant Houses and the Noble Houses. The Nobles are important in respect that they control the cities, they can kick anyone out of the cities that they want.

The 'nobles' didn't win back Tuluk. The citizens and slaves did. Second, nobles can't kick anyone out of the cities that they want. They can TRY to persuade a templar to, but if that person is affiliated with any other house chances are high the templar's going to refuse.

The merchant houses are important because they supply most of the equipment. If I'm not mistaken, I believe that some houses have their equipment made by Salarr. Where else is the Byn going to get those tents to use? Kurac. The merchant houses are the people who are relied upon for most of these goods.

So to avoid that, I imagine the Northern nobles would need Nenyuk's support with introducing it, so Nenyuk would need a benefit.

Nenyuk would play a pivotal role in that respect, yes. They handle most of the money in the Known World. Nenyuk would be the aspect that makes or breaks the whole thing.

On the flip side of the coin, why would Nenyuk want to be a part of it? It would strain their relations with Allanak, since it would strain relations with Allanak. Face it, would you be happy with the group that tried to destroy your economy?

As for that whole barter system business...that would be a real bitch to code, and I doubt it would be used. How often do you go into a shop, sell your item, then buy something of equalish value? Not very often. It's more often selling some excess equipment to cover stabling fees, or to buy that expensive cloak you've been saving up for from another merchant. All in all, it's not worth the trouble.

[John]

The 'nobles' didn't win back Tuluk.

I'm not too up on how the whole rebel thing worked, I thought there might of been Nobles in charge of the rebels. It was before my time.

nobles can't kick anyone out of the cities that they want. They can TRY to persuade a templar to

I made a generalisation with the term nobles and I understand why it caused confusion. Sorry about that. When I said nobles, I mean the people who are in charge of the city as a whole, as apposed to an individual noble. The Allanaki Senate (that includes Nobles, Templars and Tek. I know the Tuluki government is quite different, but I'm not exactly sure HOW different) can (and did) ban people out of a city. They banned the gypsies at one stage from Allanak and later on decided to let them back in. IIRC they did the same to Kurac. So The Senate with Tek's approval could decide to ban Kadius from Allanak. Now this would hurt Kadius because it would mean they've lost a major source of trade, but it'd hurt Allanak just as much (if not more) because they'd have to go to independant merchants for the items.

Hope that clears up what I meant. And I hope I'm not misunderstanding how things work.

why would Nenyuk want to be a part of it? It would strain their relations with Allanak, since it would strain relations with Allanak. Face it, would you be happy with the group that tried to destroy your economy?

I thought of that and couldn't think of an answer. Tuluk would have to offer A LOT of benefits to convince Nenyuk to create/allow the coinage. And yes Nenyuk accepting to make the coin would put a strain on Allanaki relations, and they'd have to do some clever politicking to keep Allanak happy, but on the flip-side, if Tuluki made a TON of concessions and Nenyuk still refused, that would put a strain on Tuluk's and Nenyuk's relationship, because it might look like Nenyuk is trying to hobble the Tuluki economy. So all in all, if the Tuluki Nobles got it in their head to create their own coinage, I wouldn't want to be Nenyuk

[Angela Christine]

As far as coins of different denominations. The introduction of the coin would be a lot easier. If Nenyuk told all the merchant houses, "We now have a glass coin that looks exactly like the obsidian coin, and the glass coin is worth exactly fifty 'sid" the other houses would just shrug and start to use the coins when Nenyuk would only give them the glass coins unless otherwise requested.

Forget glass, have Allanak issue a tiny steel coin worth 100 'sid.  Woo, that's some good coin.

AC

[Happy Merc]

SOI mud has support for several types of currency (is set up with two types of currency) and with varied types of coins (I think it's 1, 10, 50, 100, 200, 500, 1000). But I am not sure how hard or easy is that to implement to our codebase.

[EvilRoeSlade]

They weren't coins, they were pottery smashed into bits which were then used as money.

[HunterKiller]

On an ooc basis I could care less what currency we used in-game.  On an IC level it makes perfect sense to me that Tuluk would want to reject allanaki coin and everything allanak.  Tuluki pride themselves on their artistic nature - artists create.  Allanak took them over and killed their people.  To let allanak dictate currency would be, I'd imagine, pretty revolting and disgusting to the patriots of the North - would Muk give his cronies allanaki coin to pay for contractors and slaves to rebuild the shit allanak trashed?  *boggle*  It wouldn't have surprised me, especially right after the ousting, that many in the North would've thrown out everything allanak and started fresh with their own goods / currency.

Back to OOC again, I agree the barter system would be best handled in this situation.  It would be a refreshing sign of independence if allanaki coin were made literally worthless in tuluk.  Luir's might accept both coin and goods.

- HK

[Larrath]

If there were two kinds of coinage, Luir's would absolutely accept both.  Luir's is run by the Merchant House Kurac.

Which brings me to my main point here - the Merchant Houses are big players in this.  When Kadius works both in Allanak and in Tuluk, they have no reason to not accept Allanaki coins in Tuluk and simply move those over on a wagon every now and then.

As much as the Templarates are more powerful than the Merchant Houses, and as much as Tektolnes could wipe Kurac off of the face of Zalanthas if they pissed him off sufficiently, the city-states still need the merchant houses for their weapons, armors, furniture, clothes, drugs, taverns, banking managements and those awesome hawkers that wander around.

[Gaare]

-More types of coins sounds cool. Like a hand sized coin which may value one hundred, a large piece values one thousand, etc.. But on the other hand, why do we need that? I mean it sounds to complex to code such really. Also, example of coinage in SOI really sucks. It sounds fine at first and really fun while trading with NPCs.. but I do not agree it means much while trying to pay something to PCs. (time consument especially with two items in inventory.)

-Tuluki coinage. Well, I guess there must be some real IC reason which stops Tuluk to create her own coins. I have a theory.  If creating one obsidian coin costs around one obsidian coin.. Well, this means 'nak does not create more coins if and only if cost of creating coins becomes profitable.

So, being the single producer of coin does not bring anything to 'nak but mostly OOC prestige. ICly I doubt anybody really cares, but some  chosens and faithfuls.

[Maybe42or54]

Well, the ministry of Proganda says this:

We shall make a coin. Nenyuk will make every obsidian coin worth fifty 'sid.
We will make a wooden coin worth 1 'sid.
We shall continue to call the obsidian coin the Allanaki Coin.
We shall call the new coin, worth 1, the Tuluki Coin.

Thereby proving that Allanak is worth more than Tuluk.

[proxie]

interesting idea.

So the merchant Houses take Allanaki coins in Tuluk and Allanak and everywhere in between.

But your Joe Schmoe independent merchant? Maybe they only take the salvaged ceramic cups from the Tooth or the Firestorm. Or loreshi reeds. Baobab twigs. Perhaps barter item for item in the inde merchant stands, and you have to go to Kadius to buy a wooden cup to barter to Jane the small barrel maker.

Okay, on second thought, that... would really be painfully slow. But a Tuluki currency and Nenyuk taking their cut for exchanging the 'sid back and forth? And Luirs gleefully hand over fisting each form without regard? Sounds cool to me.

Proxie

[richter]

Already discussed and pointed out the impractical nature of obsidian as a form of currency.  I like the idea about ceramic.  Would make much more sense really since the material is much easier to mint.

As for SoI's code, it uses a modified version of Harshland's code, both of which feature more than one kind of coin object (HL using pennies and farthings and SoI using a decimal system).

Take care,

Jason