The 'rinth.

[Synthesis]

Hey, you newbies out there in the 'rinth need to log out right now and read this:

http://www.zalanthas.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=2536

Specifically, the part that says:

"Creating a 'rinther character does not give you
licence to go on a killing spree through the alleys. If a certain lone,
person was to gain such a reputation it is likely that he or she would be
dealt with by a number of "concerned citizens".

The Labyrinth isn't a place for you to level up.  If you want to spar, join the Byn.  Sure I, probably more than anyone, understand the vicious pull of the need for skill development, but running amok and killing everything in your path until you're in poor condition is also very poor form, and High Twinkery.  I don't care -what- IC justification you think you have, it doesn't hold a drop of water.  Just stop what you're doing now, and dream some other concept up, or you're going to get brutally whacked.  And if you don't, you -certainly- deserve it.

And yeah, you can make a bloody fortune on the items that dead NPCs give up...but that is so -totally- unrealistic that it's sickening.  You're taking clothes from people who just got SHANKED TO DEATH.  Grimy people who just got brutally murdered.  People who are wearing those clothes because they're so valueless that nobody would ordinarily bother them for wearing it.  These clothes are filthy, disgusting, and probably COVERED IN BLOOD, so making your fortune this way is supremely bad form.  And anyone not wearing mere rags is probably wearing that gear for a really good reason: they have a kickass gang of hard-hitting, merciless bastards to back them up.  Sure, you might be able to kill that guy...but can you take his friends when they show up to collect the debt they're owed?

So, read the damn archived post, and adjust yourselves accordingly.  Or someone's going to come calling, I guarantee it.  It might not be me, but sooner or later someone with a wallet that says "Bad Mothafucka" is going to teach you the error of your ways.

[cyberpatrol_735]

Nicely put.

This also goes for those hunters that think they have to kill -every- single living scrab on the entire planet so that they can make uber armor or whatnot. Guys.. it takes the fun out for the rest of us, seriously.


*opens up wallet*

[Anonymous]

Amen brotha!

I think there should be a Sam Jackson NPC (the afro-haired, bad mutha-fucka) that just sits in storage until someone starts a killing spree in the rinth. Then when the kill count raises he gets possessed by the imms, walks out into the alleys, kills the twink, and looks damn good doing it.

[marko]

The alleys have and always will police themselves in one form or another.  Anyone that runs around slaughtering indiscriminately will find themselves with a knife in the back - at some point.  Sometimes it only takes a little while sometimes it takes longer.

The point is, you won't get ahead by slaughtering in the 'rinth for no reason.

[Flaming Ocotillo]

The labyrinth code has changed a lot over the years, and something to keep in mind is that most of the corpses you see littered all over the alleys are due to NPCs killing each other for their gear. Yes, there's a lot of interesting code unique to the rinth that gives it a very realistic feel. It's taken some time for the code to get to this point, but I feel that the current code is fantastic, after a few years of tweaking.

If you're seeing corpses all over the rinth and thinking that PCs are responsible, I'd say NPC fights make up the majority of rinth deaths in the alleys. There are lots of NPCs who prey on each other, not just other PCs (which was the case for years), and so now you can see the bone-strewn, corpse-ridden scenery that all the room descriptions portray, in a coded form.

If you see someone repeatedly killing all types of NPCs for no other reason than the fact they're NPCs, then you can can assume they're playing the "rinth killer" role, whether they know it or not. However, if you see a PC killing an NPC for the value of their gear or items, I wouldn't immediately brand the player a twink, or playing in poor RP, considering there are NPCs everywhere that are motivated by the exact same thing, and will do the exact same thing, should they encounter said NPC. Also, you may often see a PC selling NPC gear to a shop, but keep in mind that the PC may have never attacked an NPC before. In the old days, you'd often run into PCs who assumed your PC was a rinth killer because OOC knowledge suggested that if a PC was holding onto a several rinth-specific NPC items, that PC had killed NPCs for them, because it was the only way to acquire them. This just isn't the case anymore. Today, the bodies are everywhere.. NPCs are behaving the way they I feel they should - murdering and looting anyone who has something valuable and worth taking for themselves, and leaving the rest to scavengers.

The bottom line is, I have a very hard time figuring out which PCs are murdering NPCs frequently when I have a char in the rinth, because the NPCs are leaving a trail of bodies for the PCs to interact with. This also gives me the message that even if I did see PCs doing the same thing, why should my PC find that unusual? Seeing a PC murder unarmed children and cripples may raise a few eyebrows when there's nothing to be gained (no NPCs tend to do this, as a note), but seeing a PC kill a reasonably-geared NPC for their loot? I've seen NPCs do it plenty, so why wouldn't a PC do the same? I feel that Synthesis does touch on a problem with the mass murderer PC who goes around killing every NPC, just because they're NPCs, but I don't feel that PCs that murder NPCs for loot is in any way unrealistic or contrary to what the code, room descs, and room echos are telling us takes place in the rinth everyday. Making an RP session out of killing every NPC you come across in the rinth is definately different than making an RP session out of hunting for an NPC with valuable gear and murdering them.

[Kalden]

I disagree. The 'rinth is a harsh place. People (yes, even 'rinther urchins) are getting shook down all the time. People with only one hand have to be very ingenious to survive.

There's a tactful way to go about it, of course, and there's the more twinkish newbie way...

[Synthesis]

RE: Flaming Ocotillo

Yes, the code has changed drastically over the years.  And, as far as I know, there are only a couple of NPCs in the 'rinth that aren't flagged safe, and I've reported these as bugs.  When they first changed the code, the NPCs went berserk on each other, but they fixed (most of) those problems quite some time ago.

[Cegar]

Not to mention that certain 'rinth NPCs attack certain 'rinth merchants which bugs them, rendering them unable to sell/buy merchandise. A lot of NPCs still are crazy kill-fiends, moreso than would be believable.

[Flaming Ocotillo]

From what I can see, without getting into any IC details about the factions and mini-gangs that roam the rinth, a lot of the NPCs killing each other are behaving in the way I'd expect. If this isn't the case, and NPCs in the rinth are only meant to go aggro on PCs, I'd say the code could use some improvement (or rather, stay in their current "broken" state of NPC vs NPC philosophy). For years, the NPCs of the rinth would team up against ONLY players.. and fights in the rinth would become PC vs NPC battles. It was a dark time for the code, where old men and bag ladies would start punching at you because an elf NPC happened to mug you near them, but the code has improved tremendously since then.

To suggest that the code isn't actually supposed to have NPCs fighting, or treating each other like they treat PCs, is pretty discouraging from my standpoint as a player. I'm not sure why you would believe that the old system of PCs vs NPCs makes for a more realistic role-play environment. The NPCs -will- attack players if the proper conditions are met, so why would those same conditions not apply to other NPCs? If there is death and killing in the rinth, then you'd expect death and killing in the rinth. I have a hard time believing that some of the NPC fights I've seen aren't by design.

[LauraMars]

I like it when they fight.

[Cegar]

My main beef is the buggyness caused by the NPC on NPC hate. Too IC to get into, but suffice to say it is rather annoying.

[jmordetsky]

I agree.

That said however, if the clothes are valueless, then that should be reflected in their value at a shop.

[Rindan]

First, I think that 'rinth clothing should be valueless.  As it stands, there is an abundant number of 'rinth stuff that you could sell to a Kadian shop for a pretty penny by anyone's standards.

In regards to NPC on NPC hate, I think it is broken and bugged as things stand now.  You can log in right as the game goes up and there is a pile of bodies already there.  I don't think that NPCs slaughtering each other adds much to the game and gives people the wrong idea about what is acceptable behavior in the 'rinth.  The fact that you can wade through the slaughter and easily net yourself a few hundred 'sid off the piles and piles of equipment is simply wrong.

I don't hate the idea of NPC on NPC fighting for atmosphere; I just think that it should be very limited instead of the wholesale brawling going on right now that leaves piles of bodies all over the place.  If NPC on NPC fighting is going to continue, then at the very least I would like the NPC killers to loot anything of value from their victim, instead of dropping money bags around the 'rinth.

I would be all for corpses of people who have died of hunger being scattered all over the 'rinth.  Hell, it might even add a little atmosphere to run across the corpse of a child who has clearly died of starvation.  If someone is desperate, they can even loot the small scraps of rags the corpse has for clothing.  That would be completely in character.  What isn't in character for the 'rinth though is piles of corpses that some times have a solid 100-200 'sid worth of stuff on them.  I would rather see this come to an end.

[Ghost]

I don't hate the idea of NPC on NPC fighting for atmosphere; I just think that it should be very limited instead of the wholesale brawling going on right now that leaves piles of bodies all over the place

Right, I agree.  Instead of seeing NPC killing NPC, it would be better to have some scripts telling someone died a few blocks away or so.  We have one script like that I think, having a few more instead of NPCs killing each other would work better.

Part of the problem I think, it is not an obvious one.  Well, the problem exists because certain NPCs hate certain race/gang/whatsoever.  And oddly enough, these hating-each-other NPCs are living so close to each other, one of them walks into the other's territory often and we get the fight.  So if they are seperated, the problem will be solved.

[Cenghiz]

Oh? Now NPCs don't always gang on you? They are allowed to fight each other?
For a real long time I haven't made a real 'rinthi character (I picked 'rinth and lived in Allanak a few times just because of the character's history), claiming it's always twinkish to work on pickpocket and assassin skills at the very beginning. If there are improvements made, maybe I should go try it myself IC, eh?

[Vesperas]

My only beef is that I can never taken any 'rinther character of mine into the alleys without finding some PC IN THE ACT of killing NPCs within 10 minutes.  I mean, hell, its almost gaurenteed.

Scavenging off already-dead corpses is one thing, but just walking around killing anything that moves (be it a new PC or an NPC) just to get the crap that no one in their right mind would buy, or train skills, is retarded.  

The 'rinth is hard, yeah.  But come on, if you are going to play a psychopathic killer, play it with style.

[Ghost]

My only beef is that I can never taken any 'rinther character of mine into the alleys without finding some PC IN THE ACT of killing NPCs within 10 minutes.  I mean, hell, its almost gaurenteed.

Probably the rinth was pulling some newbiesh hack & slash minded people at that time, I would think.  In my first times in the rinth, I was like that too.  Though from time to time, there happens to be PCs with some wits trying to put a better atmosphere than serial killers.

After a char or two, I am thinking of Rinth again.  It is a great place giving lots of RP opportunities.  It is my favorite place