Taverns

[theebie]

> the common-looking hunter has entered from the south.

the crowded tavern,
this is a crowded tavern, full of people, most of them virtual, but
nonetheless there, its a busy place, loud and oh, full of people, you
can barely move.
the npc barkeeper stands here, polishing a glass.
the wild-haired npc someone stands here, doing something.
the cruel, blonde pc-guy sits here at table-3.

the common-looking hunter pushes his way through the crowd of
virtually dozends of people, the smoke thick in the air, reaching the
bar, where he kicks one of the lesser virtualnpcs to the side, settling
down on a barstool.

the cruel, blonde pc-guy points through the crowd at the common-looking
hunter, yelling: you there, come over here, and answer to my questions.

---cut---


as much as i do like pc-interaction, this always pisses me off.
its a CROWDED place, and dozends of people come in and go out.
no need to immediately just pick the one pc, hey, do that with some
vnpcs from time to time.
(and dont come me with that 'its a pure coincidence and happens stuff
please)

---theebie---

[Anonymous]

as much as i do like pc-interaction, this always pisses me off.
its a CROWDED place, and dozends of people come in and go out.
no need to immediately just pick the one pc, hey, do that with some
vnpcs from time to time.
(and dont come me with that 'its a pure coincidence and happens stuff
please)

Come on, let the VNPCs notice and interact with the VNPCs.  I don't play this game to emote with make-believe characters I play to interact with player-controlled characters.  VNPCs aren't there as a substitute for interaction or as a buffer when your character might get reamed by a templar.

Choosing to 'interact' with a VNPC instead of a PC doesn't add anything to the game.  Choosing to animate a VNPC in an otherwise dead scene does add to the game.

I just don't get this VNPC obsession people have.  To me VNPCs are there to provide a sort of structure to the game, specifically someone to run and tell the militia what a criminal twerp you are and for the occasional flavor.

Let the VNPC templars harrass the VNPC elves.  Let the VNPC militia rough up the VNPC independents.

[Gaare]

-- Actually that's a good point but I would not want to see people speaking with virtual people instead of PCs just because there are many of them in common taverns.

-- If you speak of how those cruel, powerful, rude PCs find your PCs always.. Well, that's pure luck most probably. (Or you are Mansa)

-- Those cruel fellas probably do that kind of conversations with VNPCs when their players were not logged in.. It is like.. When I need a soldier, elder, magicker or some important PC IG, and contact him/her, I would not want to know s/he is dealing problems of virtual NPCs. That would be waste if you ask me.

-- You can not know what the other PC was thinking or noticed.

-- Also I believe none of us can know, if there are Virtual elves, mercenaries, magickers, kadians, nobles, templars etc.. are avaliable in the public tavern unless it is mentioned in description of the room, or until we saw a room echo.

-- There are also virtual taverns where only many virtual fellas hang around. A city does not have only a handful of taverns.

-- If you really want those cruel fellas to summon and speak with VNPCs, I suggest you to do that yourself and be example to others. Like step into tavern, and if you are sure there is a cruel, rude powerful virtual person around, go and RP as you are being questioned by him/her. But, well I personally would not enjoy that.

At the bottom, I think you have a good point, but that's a game where we are trying to have fun and mostly there are a hundred people online but Zalanthas' population is one million. That's obviously bad RP to ignore Virtual NPCs, but interaction within PCs is the most important thing that makes me enjoy the game.

[Xygax]

As I've said in a previous post, you'll save yourself some agitation if you think of the VNPCs and NPCs as chorus-members in our little "play".  Your PC is a member of the primary cast and so more liable to have interaction with the other leads, more lines, more conflict, better SAG benefits.

-- X

[Cale_Knight]

Then why am I still using a janitor's closet as a dressing room!?

Stupid rabbit...

[Cuusardo]

Let me get this straight.

Your PC is being singled out, roleplay is practically falling into your lap, and you're complaining about it?

[Demonaire]

You've got a slightly backwards view, but can be corrected.



- Dr. Demonaire -

[bloodfromstone]

vNPCs (and NPCs, for that matter) are very important for a lot of things, but it would really not suit my fancy much at all to see them be used rather than PCs for interactive scenes. If a templar walked into a tavern, shouted that he needed to know where X was, who killed Y, or whatever, then emoted a conversation with a vNPC, gave a satisfied nod and turned on heel while PCs were present to answer, well... I'd give the templar props for keeping vNPCs in mind, but it hardly expands on our interactive enviroment if no one is interacting with one another.

[Bestatte]

If you really want to delve into the whole vNPC thing, how about this:

As you enter the building, a vNPC militia soldier who happens to be standing at the entrance, and was instructed by the templar to keep an eye out for you, ways the templar to alert him to your presence.

By the time you finish your emote, the Templar has already been informed via the Way by that vNPC militia soldier that you have just arrived.

There. That explains everything nicely, using your need to keep the vNPC population in mind.

[corona]

If you really want to delve into the whole vNPC thing, how about this:

As you enter the building, a vNPC militia soldier who happens to be standing at the entrance, and was instructed by the templar to keep an eye out for you, ways the templar to alert him to your presence.

By the time you finish your emote, the Templar has already been informed via the Way by that vNPC militia soldier that you have just arrived.

There. That explains everything nicely, using your need to keep the vNPC population in mind.

Cheers.  

[jmordetsky]

PCs are the star light glimmer of specialness in an otherwise unspecial world. They don't need to notice vnpc and npcs. Vnpcs and npcs are extras.

[jstorrie]

Yes, but at least come up with a reason for noticing the PC in question, even if it's just coincidence.

This goes too for mess halls, sparring halls, marketplaces, and any other crowded area.

I understand that PCs trump VNPCs but it's still very jarring every time I'm in a crowded room and other players act as if I'm the only person there.

[HardCarbon]

Let me get this straight.

Your PC is being singled out, roleplay is practically falling into your lap, and you're complaining about it?

 If the roleplaying  (heavy quotes) involved is nothing more then someone getting their rocks off by abusing you.. then  yeah..  I'd complain too.    

  Personally the number of special applications characters I've run into who seem to enjoy abusing normal characters is not good.   Yes I report the matter.. and yes the staff has done good things... but due to the nature of the game only after the fact.... I'd rather have been able to keep playing the character to be honest...


 Oh I guess special application isn't quite correct... I mean 6+ Karma characters, nobles, templars, and heads of merchant houses... I am a trouble magnet  mostly the RP is good in the case of one person.. Horrid.. but mostly good... Just wish I could fight back a bit better

[Manhattan]

if my pc was still a newbie and getting on his feet in terms of setting up his skills and finding friends ... and some fucking templar bothers my pc by singling him out and executing him ... yeah, i'd complain.

[Synthesis]

RE: HardCarbon and Manhattan

I'd just like to remind you that Zalanthas is -not- modern society.  Templars and nobles have the right (and in my opinion, an OOC responsibility) to fuck with you however they please.  And you should toady to them -immediately- unless you have a very good reason not to, because these people can and will have you killed for no other reason than that it amuses them.  Their players are not responsible for you having fun, or for letting you improve your skills.  Their players are responsible for playing them well--and playing these characters well often involves fucking with people in what modern people would consider an unacceptably mean and vicious way.

Quadruple this if you're in Allanak.

[Cyrian20]

Their players are responsible for playing them well--and playing these characters well often involves fucking with people in what modern people would consider an unacceptably mean and vicious way.

Quadruple this if you're in Allanak.

I hate to argue with you here, but they are responsible in a sense. They are supposed to animate the world, even if it is causing you terror. But not look for reasons to overly herass you. I.E. if you see some guy in all newbie gear (I know this is ooc rp steering but) Leave him alone and pick out some other guy, let the n0ob flesh out his character for an hour or 5 and then pick on him like hell, but not with the purpose of pushing him around to the point that it isn't entertaining....... Ignore all of this if the pc is acting stupid and doesn't rp bowing down like they are still supposed to.

[moab]

The whole "leave the guy alone in the newbie gear is silly.  Next thing you know, troublemakers will be dressing in newbie gear and insisting that templars and nobles leave them alone.

If you're in game, you're in game.

Nobles and Templars _are_ better than you and have rights that you only dream you have.  You should probably believe this if you are at all a citizen of the city.  You might even believe it if you are not.

While nobles and templars have a responsiblity to players, part of that responsibilty is teaching you who rules the roost.  One of the ways they do this is knocking you down a peg or two now and again.

[Cuusardo]

Strange the way people cry out for more gritty harshness on Zalanthas, and then suddenly don't want it when they get it.

[joyofdiscord]

Yes, but at least come up with a reason for noticing the PC in question, even if it's just coincidence.

This goes too for mess halls, sparring halls, marketplaces, and any other crowded area.

I understand that PCs trump VNPCs but it's still very jarring every time I'm in a crowded room and other players act as if I'm the only person there.

I agree.  A good bump-in in a mess line or a bustling tavern or market crowd of its own flavor is nice and adds a lot.  In any case you can always have your char's eye caught by something they are wearing to comment upon.

[Qetesh]

I really can't see the issue with the top scenario. This seems just fine to me. As Xygax and a few others have stated. PC's are there to interact with other PC's. In fact, if anything with the emoted example set, it looks like the PC walking is was attracting attention to himself by the use of NPC's.

The common-looking hunter pushes his way through the crowd of virtually dozends of people, the smoke thick in the air, reaching the bar, where he kicks one of the lesser virtualnpcs to the side, settling down on a barstool.

You've just pushed your way in and booted someone out of a seat.  I think that's a pretty neat emote, but really.. why not wear a sign on your back that says talk to me, I like to cause trouble?

Don't expect other PC's in the room to ignore yours when you walk in. Or not select yours out of a crowd just due to the fact that other NPC's are in the room. People play this game to interact with other people. Expect them to want to interact with you, be it good or bad for your Character.

[Oxidised Lizard]

but really.. why not wear a sign on your back that says talk to me, I like to cause trouble?

Because most Zalanthans can't read...  :roll:

[Qetesh]

Because most Zalanthans can't read...  :roll:

Damn you!!! *Shakes a fist*

[proxie]

*snickers*

Don't talk to the PC's with newbie gear? Okay, sure... just keep in mind, sometimes that newbie isn't a newbie, they may be in disguise. During my younger days, I remember at least once wearing newbie gear and no boots when I went a-spying... Twinky yes, but I certainly wasn't the only one who took advantage of people's kindness to those who are painfully new to the game.  Now at least it's harder to dress someone in the appropriate newbie gear for the region to make them blend in.

So glad we all live in a much more advanced culture, both in people's attitudes, but also in the newbie gear. (Some of it's pretty rocking, and highly preferable for looks and function, than even some uber elite clan gear.) My last half elf ranger kept her newbie boots until just before she died. Maybe the boots, unhappy with being cast aside, conspired with the nasty critter to eat her.

Proxie