Author Topic: REDSTORM!!!  (Read 3181 times)

Galdun

  • Posts: 173
REDSTORM!!!
« on: January 01, 2003, 12:08:10 AM »
Red Storm is void of any activity yet it possess so much roleplaying potential! A friend and I have permenantly stationed ourselves there and will attempt to make it a real bustling village.  Please feel free to help us populate this empty place.  Please reply and let me know what you think.

Galdun

Reiloth

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I concur with this statement
« Reply #1 on: January 01, 2003, 12:16:14 AM »
Upon reading the description of Red Storm, I knew that it was the rugged - almost Mos Eisley type of city: Ask no questions, and you won't get bothered. But upon entering there with my first character...I found it completely devoid of PC activity! It wasn't boring by far...The descriptions kept me satisfied for some time...

But imagine the potential for such a town!

This is a plea to those who wish to seek new adventure in this rugged outpost. I don't ask for you to break your IC attachments to the already bustling cities...But to take a risk.  :twisted:
"You will have useful work: the destruction of evil men. What work could be more useful? This is Beyond; you will find that your work is never done -- So therefore you may never know a life of peace."

~Jack Vance~

Bushranger

  • Posts: 1865
REDSTORM!!!
« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2003, 11:55:53 AM »
Red Storm is a very nice place to play in. I've enjoyed it for a number of years now, though not all of my characters come from there. If there is one problem then it is the general lack of PC involvement there.  It sometimes it becomes popular bustles with PCs for a month or two. This usually happens when Red Storm recieves an active agent, and this generates activity inside the village and creates jobs in the surrounding area so people don't have to leave to find work. Traditionally this agent is from House Kurac, but all the merchant houses have emporiums in Red Storm since the rebuilding of the village after the sand storm that destroyed it. I would like to suggest the other merchant houses invest some people into Red Storm. I'd like to see agents from all of the houses doing business there, the opportunity seems ripe for the taking.

Imagine it:

    Merchant politics as the agents compete with each other for the favour of the Sand Lord

    A business environment untainted by the tyranical rule of a Sorcerer-King or the bias of Luirs Outpost

    People who are willing to do almost anything, unfetted by Templars or Militia who wish to impose their own authority


Sounds pretty good to me  :wink:
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Swordsman

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Red Storm
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2003, 08:06:29 PM »
I tried to start a clan in Red Storm quite a few years ago, way before the silt flood, and it was very hard. But I've also heard of other people managing to get clans running there (and my hat goes off to them), so it's obviously not impossible. The trouble IMO is getting either a leader who's on-line a lot every day (rare breed, we all have RL work, heh) or else a fair-sized group of like-minded people together at the same time (the old 'sorry, you'll have to wait till my current PC dies' problem). I guess if a big clan took some interest in the place, it could get some PC activity happening more easily than just a PC or bunch of PCs going off their own steam. If anyone does get anything going there, let me know. :)

Swordsman

Rindan

  • Posts: 2825
REDSTORM!!!
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2003, 08:54:03 PM »
There was a clan that was in Red Storm that did a damned good job keeping that place active.  Not sure how they are doing these days, but for at least half a year Red Storm was kicking and full of people.  To get the numbers of people up it just takes a 'lets get it done' type of leader that is willing to go out of his way to recruit, be active, and (perhaps most importantly) stay alive.  My hat goes off to the two brothers who managed to do this for such a long period of time.

I always had a fantasy about being in a rough and tumble Kuraci unit based out of Red Storm.  The real issue is that while Kurac sits in a great position to get things moving in Red Storm and provide plenty of interaction that would draw on Allanak, I think it would be a strain on Kuraci PCs.  Kurac does a great job keeping Luirs filled with people.  However, I think that adding Red Storm to the list would be hard.  Even then, I think that Kurac could do it simply by drawing off poeple from Allanak.  The real issue is that then Kurac would be eating a large portion of the player base keeping alive two relatively isolated areas.  From a purely OOC point of view, I am not sure the imms want to see a clan grow so large (and thus shrink other clans) to keep a relatively isolated town kicking.

It seems to me that the focus is trying to keep the Allanak, Tuluk, and Luirs filled with people.  Trying to throw Red Storm, no how matter how painfully cool it would be, into the mix would probably be counter productive.  So, it is probably for the best that Red Storm remains a haven for PC run clans for the time being.

Anonymous

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REDSTORM!!!
« Reply #5 on: January 02, 2003, 08:45:59 AM »
Quote from: "Rindan"
I always had a fantasy about being in a rough and tumble Kuraci unit based out of Red Storm.  The real issue is that while Kurac sits in a great position to get things moving in Red Storm and provide plenty of interaction that would draw on Allanak, I think it would be a strain on Kuraci PCs.  Kurac does a great job keeping Luirs filled with people.  However, I think that adding Red Storm to the list would be hard.  Even then, I think that Kurac could do it simply by drawing off poeple from Allanak.  The real issue is that then Kurac would be eating a large portion of the player base keeping alive two relatively isolated areas.  From a purely OOC point of view, I am not sure the imms want to see a clan grow so large (and thus shrink other clans) to keep a relatively isolated town kicking.


Add to that the difficulty people have in differentiating active PC numbers from actual clan power.  If 20-30% of the PCs on at a given time were Kuraci split between Luir's, Red Storm and whatever side projects they got going, it results in a greater amount of sway/power/reach relative to the rest of the population.

Quote
It seems to me that the focus is trying to keep the Allanak, Tuluk, and Luirs filled with people.  Trying to throw Red Storm, no how matter how painfully cool it would be, into the mix would probably be counter productive.  So, it is probably for the best that Red Storm remains a haven for PC run clans for the time being.


I'd agree, or a clan that isn't already spread thin could get a group going down there, such as Kadius or Salarr.

The biggest things I'd like to see done in Red Storm are:

The north gate no longer closing at dusk.  (It just makes sense to me that an outlaw haven would be somewhere you could get to at the middle of the night)
Addition of one or two creatures that are worth hunting for relatively new PCs.
A shop added which sells items not available anywhere else.

Those three things would make Red Storm more playable in my eyes without changing the overall feel of the place.  IMHO.

Armaddict

  • Posts: 6187
Agreed
« Reply #6 on: January 02, 2003, 12:10:42 PM »
Red Storm -is- an unimaginable amount of role-play potential that's not really tapped by the playerbase.  The problem?  No PC's to interact with there, so no one else goes there.  We just need to get people to know that they -will- have something to do there, and perhaps activity will increase.  I really hate to see such great RP opportunities wasted :(

Another place like Red Storm in this way is also in game...the Labyrinth.  It has huge role-play potential, but most of those who come aren't really interested in the realistic role-play of the 'rinthi culture.  If we could get it better represented...the 'rinth would be THE shit :P

Anyway, like I said...the problem to overcome is the lack of interaction that's available, which makes boredom a problem.
She wasn't doing a thing that I could see, except standing there leaning on the balcony railing, holding the universe together. --J.D. Salinger

baby_cuz_Ima_thug

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REDSTORM!!!
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2003, 02:54:02 PM »
Gotta love the 'rinth :)
I love all the gang wars there have been, but the problem is the clans get so teritorial they kill each other off completely and then there is no pbase to replace the last group that died.
I've always wanted a Blood/krip kinda relationship there, were the elves would throw up east side and the guild would throw up west side and have colors added to the gangs and all the fun of bar fights and such.
but due too the coding if you fight in a bar you get beat down by like 20 NPCs at the same time.
and if you fight in the street You have the same problem, all of the muggers roaming around.

I am not sure if this is in, but what I would also like to see in the rinth is,
if you weren't born in the rinth, then instead of being mugged when you walk in, that if your wearing shitty clothing ex: stuff under 200 sids
then the NPC will leave you alone.

I used to play lots of thug chars, but what always happens is some idiot from the commoners quarter runs into the rinth unprepared leads an army of angry mugger NPCs right into the bar and then there are big bloody fights while everyone in the rinth dies in one spot.

maybe the NPCs could be set up in quarters, so instead of if you leave the rinth they leave you alone have it set up so if you leave there quarter they leave you alone.

Thats a little closer to Real life and it would keep the mass murders of 20 NPCs in one room dying.

also, maybe have a relastate office open in the rinth, one that can sell abandoned buildings or something, or at least give you akey too the building so you can "claim" it.

Reiloth

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Red storm
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2003, 10:15:44 PM »
To add -- Red storm is particularly dangerous, it seems. I am completely new to Armageddon, but i've been hungrily devoured by large black beetles quite often. My reluctance to start in Allanak is slipping, but the roleplay potential for Red Storm is ENDLESS. Its amazing that it is so abandoned.

I totally concur with the gates not being closed at dusk. It is a city of outlaws, renegades, and drug dealers. It seems like the gates would be wholly open to those of less-than-noble cause. Or perhaps a sewer entrance, or somthing of the like.

I also agree with the idea to implement less-powerful animals nearby Storm. Desert-Gear exclusivly found in Storm should be available as well, to attract more PC's to begin with.

Just a few ideas  :roll:
"You will have useful work: the destruction of evil men. What work could be more useful? This is Beyond; you will find that your work is never done -- So therefore you may never know a life of peace."

~Jack Vance~

Savak

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re: Red Storm gates
« Reply #9 on: January 03, 2003, 08:40:34 AM »
I always thought of those gates closing more for the sake of safety from large evening predators (silt horrors, worms, organized attacks from posses of would-be law-enforcers or various mobs of angry ppl looking to seek revenge on some denizen or other) than really to slow the movement of individuals or small-groups in and out, per se.  The relative cool of the night is, generally, prime hunting for certain critters, and since most humanoids can't see what's coming when it's dark...they batton down the hatches and hope for the best during the night.

Does that make more sense?

-Savak
i]May the fleas of a thousand kanks nestle in your armpit.  -DustMight[/i]

Anonymous

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Re: re: Red Storm gates
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2003, 09:21:34 AM »
Quote from: "Savak"
I always thought of those gates closing more for the sake of safety from large evening predators (silt horrors, worms, organized attacks from posses of would-be law-enforcers or various mobs of angry ppl looking to seek revenge on some denizen or other) than really to slow the movement of individuals or small-groups in and out, per se.  The relative cool of the night is, generally, prime hunting for certain critters, and since most humanoids can't see what's coming when it's dark...they batton down the hatches and hope for the best during the night.
-Savak


That's what I always thought too, which is why my suggestion was for the north gate to be left open since, IMHO, the southern entrance would be more likely to be assaulted by some freaking big thing, for obvious reasons.

Considering the Sand Lord built the city in spite of the dangers in the first place, I would think that the sid that could be brought in via midnight smuggling runs would be worth having a gate open.  C'mon, midnight smuggling runs in spite of the danger of the dark just sounds cool.

But I see your point, so, what if there was a javascript added to the gates where a person could knock on it, and there would be an echo about a guard looking through a peekhole in the gates and if the total number of PCs in the room is less than 5, the gates are opened for a few seconds.

Kinda like Bree in LOTR.

mansa

  • Posts: 9680
i disagree
« Reply #11 on: January 03, 2003, 04:59:04 PM »
i disagree with the ...oh...what was it called?


hmm...how do i use the quote thing again..


Quote from: "ChristopherRobertWoods"
Addition of one or two creatures that are worth hunting for relatively new PCs.



and

Quote from: "Reiloth"
I also agree with the idea to implement less-powerful animals nearby Storm.



It's Armageddon!  There is no newbie zone!  Yeah.  that's it.
The animals out there are supposed to be scary.  it's a scary world.  scary scary!  scary scary scary!  


Scary!
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You win Armageddon, congratulations!  Type 'credits', then store your character and make a new one

Anonymous

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Re: i disagree
« Reply #12 on: January 03, 2003, 06:11:16 PM »
Quote from: "mansa"
It's Armageddon!  There is no newbie zone!  Yeah.  That's it. The animals out there are supposed to be scary.  it's a scary world.  scary scary!  scary scary scary!  Scary!


I'm not advocating a n00b zone.  There are generally 3-4 different types of non-humanoids in the general vicinity of Red Storm.  They are all either huge or monstrous.

They need to feed on something, you know.  Outside of Allanak I can at least guess what those creatures eat.  Well, besides wandering people who have no business being outside alone....

How does adding something that is worth hunting for those who are untrained and would fit in logically within the ecosystem in any way relate to a n00b area?

If I was suggesting a n00b zone, I would say get rid of the scary things outside of Red Storm.  Which I'm not.

Bushranger

  • Posts: 1865
Re: re: Red Storm gates
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2003, 09:52:55 AM »
Quote from: "ChristopherRobertWoods"
what if there was a javascript added to the gates where a person could knock on it, and there would be an echo about a guard looking through a peekhole in the gates and if the total number of PCs in the room is less than 5, the gates are opened for a few seconds.


I don't know about the numbers thing. I would suggest here that the gates open if you are a citizen of Red Storm. The Sand Lord and his men might run an open village, but they don't let just any-one run rampant in it and outsiders are tolerated - not loved by all.

If you grew up with the guards on the gate I can see them more likely to open it up to you in the middle of the night.. rather than just open it up to a couple of strangers from who-knows-where? They may be smugglers, or merchants, or PSYCHO DEFILERS who want to sneak into the town at night to zombify everyone.
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Anonymous

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Re: re: Red Storm gates
« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2003, 10:34:57 AM »
Quote from: "Bushranger"
I don't know about the numbers thing. I would suggest here that the gates open if you are a citizen of Red Storm. The Sand Lord and his men might run an open village, but they don't let just any-one run rampant in it and outsiders are tolerated - not loved by all.


I'd disagree about the citizenship thing.  I just picture Red Storm as being very much an outlaw town with outlaws enforcing the laws.  A midnight run of stolen goods from Allanak to Red Storm is *just* the sort of thing they would open the gates for.

Especially because I don't think they close their gates out of fear of anything other than night beasties.

The threat of defilers, angry mobs or northern armies exists just as much during the day.

Someone else posted a better idea, IMHO, in a different thread.  That would be a gate only big enough to fit one person at a time.

Bushranger

  • Posts: 1865
Re: re: Red Storm gates
« Reply #15 on: January 04, 2003, 11:03:12 AM »
Quote from: "ChristopherRobertWoods"
I'd disagree about the citizenship thing.  I just picture Red Storm as being very much an outlaw town with outlaws enforcing the laws.  A midnight run of stolen goods from Allanak to Red Storm is *just* the sort of thing they would open the gates for.


Yes, I picture Red Storm as an outlaw town as well. The Sand Lord, however, is not simply an outlaw and he maintains strict order in his town - If you mind your own business and keep quiet then you're usually safe. Being from Red Storm, or one of the Red Storm based bands of criminals / smugglers / raiders would give a certain degree of respectability in the village. Imagine it; two people get involved in a rather vicious fight - one of them was born in Red Storm and works as a spice hunter or raider with a native group while the other is a smuggler from Allanak. Who would the guards beat down on most? The Red Stormer who probably has a group of friends and relatives in the village? Or the stranger, who might have a small group of friends in Red Storm but certainly isn't well known?

Besides, The devil you know is far better than the devil you don't.

Bushranger
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Anonymous

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Re: re: Red Storm gates
« Reply #16 on: January 04, 2003, 11:21:55 AM »
Quote from: "Bushranger"
Yes, I picture Red Storm as an outlaw town as well. The Sand Lord, however, is not simply an outlaw and he maintains strict order in his town - If you mind your own business and keep quiet then you're usually safe. Being from Red Storm, or one of the Red Storm based bands of criminals / smugglers / raiders would give a certain degree of respectability in the village. Imagine it; two people get involved in a rather vicious fight - one of them was born in Red Storm and works as a spice hunter or raider with a native group while the other is a smuggler from Allanak. Who would the guards beat down on most? The Red Stormer who probably has a group of friends and relatives in the village? Or the stranger, who might have a small group of friends in Red Storm but certainly isn't well known?

Besides, The devil you know is far better than the devil you don't.

Bushranger


I agree with what you've said, though guessing that Red Storm has a population in the thousands having someone around that can speak up for your citizenship would be rare.

More than that, I think that based on the sort of place it is, Red Storm citizenship would not be a common idea, as raiders/smugglers and the like would seem to have pretty mobile interests.

Either way, I don't see how it relates to the guards opening up the gates or there being a separate single humanoid sized gate to allow for the traffic of more nefariously gained goods after the sun goes down.

I'm guessing we'll just end up disagreeing, but if a place like Luir's, with marauding bands of gith and I'd almost certainly wager a smaller population, keeps its gates open at night, I don't see why Red Storm with its prediliction towards dirty deeds wouldn't have some mechanism in place so someone with some goods to sell at the bazaar couldn't get in at night.

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Perceptions of Red Storm Village
« Reply #17 on: January 04, 2003, 12:14:51 PM »
This post represents my personal views only; it does not represent any kind of official view on Red Storm Village or associated issues. Some of the information here may no longer be accurate because the staff constantly update the game world. (I am writing this as the staff member responsible for rebuilding Red Storm Village [its second incarnation, as far as I am aware] a few years ago, but I have since retired from the staff.)

There are a few things about Red Storm Village that, unfortunately, some players seem to have misunderstood or misinterpreted. My main point in this post is to gently caution people on two counts: (1) you sometimes need to be careful in interpreting how things have been implemented in the game world, and (2) you are probably not aware of all the IC background behind things in the game world, so some things may not seem to make much sense to you, but in fact (in the broader context of the game world) they do.

As an example on the first point, there is (or was, the last time I looked) a high proportion of hard-coded mul NPCs in the village, relative to other centers of civilization. This reflects the fact that, relative to other population centers in the game world, there are more muls around than usual. It would be a mistake, though, to go through the village doing a head-count of hard-coded NPCs and trying to deduce from there the actual (IC) proportion of muls in the village's population. This is because hard-coded NPCs do not necessarily reflect accurately the different groups in the IC population; they only reflect the key NPCs needed to keep the location working and inject a bit of unique flavor into it. This might also apply to other groups of people in the population.

As an example on the second point, I suspect that many people see Red Storm Village as an ICly 'simple' center of civilization. It probably does not strike most people as a particularly influential or politically complex place. As with most things in this game, however, there is a lot beneath the surface. Obviously, I cannot say any more here without starting to give IC-sensitive information away, but I will say that as far as IC background is concerned, Red Storm Village is well integrated into the rest of the game, probably to a much greater extent than what most players would realize. (Note that this is based on the situation a few years ago, so what I say on this may well be out of date.)

To address a few specific points (in no particular order of topic or author):

(1) unique goods: there are goods unique to Red Storm Village (apart from spice), but it is possible that shopkeepers' inventories have been rotated or changed with time. I created a range of clothing and equipment unique to Red Storm Village, but I do not know if this clothing is still available, or if it is still available only from Red Storm Village and not elsewhere.

(2) creatures: Red Storm Village lies in a very hostile area, both in terms of weather and local fauna. The last time I looked at the village, it was quite feasible for a reasonably experienced character (or group of relatively inexperienced characters) to survive there, but this may well have changed by now.

(3) gates closing at night: the idea of late-night smuggling runs certainly does have an appeal, but speaking strictly from my own personal point of view, this would not make sense in a region where the visibility is already bad enough in the day and there is essentially a sea of quicksand waiting for you just south of the village. Many characters have died for no other reason than they were (presumably) trying to get to Red Storm Village and missed it, riding into the Sea of Eternal Dust instead. Trying to do this at night would be suicidal for most people. Quite apart from this, I think people should remember that, large village though it is, it is still a village. While the village is well defended in terms of hard-coded NPCs and programs, ICly it is still just a village, not a city with legions of soldiers inside. There are a few other points that others have covered; overall, I think that it is very logical and ICly realistic for Red Storm Village to be closing its gates at night. (If you are playing a character who wants to make late-night smuggling runs, you should probably take the avenue recommended for all special cases: pursue the issue ICly and e-mail the MUD account with your related ideas and requests.)

(4) playerbase: as I understand it, the way between Allanak and Red Storm Village is now relatively dangerous. For most of the time that I have been involved with this game, it was relatively safe. Part of the attraction of Red Storm Village was that it was a very rough (in terms of atmosphere) game area within easy reach of Allanak, a major center of PC activity. It was good for a quick change of scene, and it was relatively feasible to actually be based in the village but go to Allanak if things were too quiet. Now, it seems, it is no longer feasible. I think that making the Allanak-Red Storm Village path less dangerous would help the village's activity level to rise. This could well also see a rise in PC raider activity in the area, making a trip to Red Storm Village more unpredictable with regard to safety, while not necessarily consistently more dangerous (unlike the case with relying mostly on NPCs to supply danger). All of these comments, however, I am making without the benefit of current behind-the-scenes knowledge, so they are only some casual thoughts.

Trust this has been of at least some interest.

Krrx

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Luir's Outpost and Red Storm Village
« Reply #18 on: January 04, 2003, 12:43:17 PM »
As with my post above, this is my personal view only, and does not in any way represent an official view on this topic. This post briefly addresses the comparison of Luir's Outpost and Red Storm Village, raised by Christopher Robert Woods.

To my knowledge, Luir's Outpost is considerably larger than Red Storm Village. Its IC population rose dramatically after the destruction of most of Tuluk some years ago, but even before that, I think that it was still larger than Red Storm Village. I believe there may be a post by Sanvean somewhere in this bulletin board system giving approximate population estimates for the major centers of civilization in the game. Luir's Outpost would also see much more traffic than Red Storm Village, being the mid-point along a major travel route (probably the biggest travel route in the Known World). Red Storm Village, on the other hand, is very much at the end of a travel route. In other words, I think it would be ICly realistic to expect legitimate traffic, possibly in large volume, through the night in Luir's Outpost. Caravans could be delayed by equipment breakdown, gith, or other reasons. I doubt this would be the case for Red Storm Village due to the danger of moving around at night in that region. (Most sensible characters that I have seen, who arrive in the region at night, wait until dawn before actually trying to get to the village.)

There are a few other IC reasons I can think of that would support Luir's Outpost opening its gates through the night while Red Storm Village closes its gates, but I leave you to consider the IC situation (and where appropriate, to probe for information ICly). As before, my views may be based on out-of-date information, so please consider them as being for casual discussion only.

Krrx