Started by Void, August 27, 2021, 11:59:40 PM
Quote from: Shalooonsh on August 28, 2021, 12:41:13 AMGood question! The issue here is though that Zalanthan systems of 'worship' are completely different from Earth's Religions.For instance, in the south, people do not believe in Tektolnes as a benevolent overlord who protects them and guides them and blah blah blah.They understand that he's a Dragon, and that they do not wish to be devoured, so they thank him for not devouring them and letting them live, while eating their enemies sometimes. It's not belief that they'll be better for it, it's hope that he won't notice them or if he does, that he will find something more tasty to eat.In the north, people do not "worship" Muk-Utep. They understand that he has an understanding of the world that they couldn't even comprehend, and that all the suffering they're going through is due to some weird plan he might have. They don't say "Walk in His Light" as a benediction --- they say it as a WARNING. As in... "Don't do anything outside of his plan, or you're fucked."Belief systems like this don't really have schisms as is typical with earthside religions. We don't have fundamentalists, or extremists (unless you count Templars), and we don't have strays. You either understand that they can crush you and that they deserve your thanks for not doing so... or you're a heathen who is outside of His Shadow/Light, and therefor beneath notice as well as often beyond worth.
Quote from: Khorne8 on May 07, 2016, 12:22:32 PMQuote from: dravage on May 07, 2016, 06:30:31 AMSmall, quick, easy to execute. Elf children?
Quote from: dravage on May 07, 2016, 06:30:31 AMSmall, quick, easy to execute.
Quote from: Shalooonsh on August 28, 2021, 12:41:13 AMFor instance, in the south, people do not believe in Tektolnes as a benevolent overlord who protects them and guides them and blah blah blah.They understand that he's a Dragon, and that they do not wish to be devoured, so they thank him for not devouring them and letting them live, while eating their enemies sometimes. It's not belief that they'll be better for it, it's hope that he won't notice them or if he does, that he will find something more tasty to eat.
Quote from: Nao on August 30, 2021, 04:07:43 AMThe devotions templar was not around when I first played the game - he's a recent-ish addition. I've always been finding him a little odd. Devotions didn't really fit into my understanding of Allanak and how I thought they saw Tek. I'm still not sure how they fit into the overall picture - other than maybe obvious lip service that most people would recognize as such.There's always the odd exception, but I have a hard time seeing the average citizen in Allanak as religious in any way.
Quote from: Jihelu on August 30, 2021, 06:30:11 AMYou don't sit outside the city in the hot burning sun, begging a lifeless statue of a monster for mercy, surrounded by people wearing silks and filth, unless you really believe that that statue up there is gonna help out /somehow/.
Quotere·li·gion/rəˈlijən/ Learn to pronouncenounnoun: religionthe belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.
Quote from: Veselka on August 30, 2021, 05:21:57 PMQuotere·li·gion/rəˈlijən/ Learn to pronouncenounnoun: religionthe belief in and worship of a superhuman controlling power, especially a personal God or gods.I mean, the fact that these people actually exist (or in a much more palpable sense than Yaweh or Allah) and doesn't rely on faith to elicit belief in their existence, should reinforce religion not eliminate it altogether.The lack of religion really is a hold over from Dark Sun, where there are no Gods because something something astral plane something something doesn't exist in the pantheon.There are many different kinds of religion, and our understanding of organized religion of course does not apply in Zalanthas.I mean, think about this guy:Doesn't he (and the cult that follows him) remind you of someone? Even down to the magic, the sorcerer-king, and the rule by power not by acceptance.--But Religion is treated like a four letter word in ArmageddonMUD, even though for all intents and purposes, people practice religion of some kind in tribes (animism, at the very least), and in the city states.I think having a document that acknowledges that religion as we understand it IRL is not what religion is or can be in Zalanthas, and providing examples of what is acceptable, would do wonders for the hush-hush grey zone it's perpetually been in.Just as with non-ubiquitous writing in a text-based medium, the lack of acknowledgment of Religion in the game (while still having organizations and areas that truly do have some form of religion) is a bit head-scratch worthy to me. I understand the company line must be towed. But it is natural for humans (and I imagine some of the other humanoid races) to explore the world spiritually, either through internal or external means. It makes it unnatural to constantly play nietzsche-esque nihilists who believe in nothing, Lebowski.
Quote from: Ami on November 23, 2010, 03:40:39 PM>craft newbie into good playerYou accidentally snap newbie into useless pieces.
Quote from: Hestia on August 30, 2021, 09:07:54 AMThere are no widespread and known "organized religions" in Zalanthas. There are quasi-religious beliefs but there's a big difference:Muk Utep is an actual person. It's not some mysterious all-seeing being in the sky that no one gets to see until they go to heaven. It's not a promise of heaven at all.Tektolnes is the Dragon. His Black Robes have real actual power and magickal horrifying scariness that is palpable. It's not about believing that you'll go to hell if you disobey. It's more like you're already in hell, so your best chances at sanity are to pretend that you're okay with it.
Quote from: Jihelu on August 31, 2021, 08:33:36 PMAlso: Imagine the observations that would be made if people now met people in Zalanthas (And assuming they passively observed and weren't enslaved and murdered for it). They would most definitely classify whatever the people are doing before the dragon statue, the water temple, and the other dragon TEMPLE as religious belief of some type. They actively use their Ruler/God's presence/name in their greetings and goodbyes (Which fits in a lot with...real societies.), they obey his servants (Through force or fear) as the Law, etc.
Quote from: The7DeadlyVenomz on August 31, 2021, 01:07:45 AMHaving played in Allanak most of the time I've played this game, the Dragon is absolutely a "god" to his citizens, and while there's plenty of duck and dodge and scrape and make a show of it, there's plenty of people who also absolutely believe he saves and protects them in one way or the other, and has a chance to hear their prayers. It's always been a religion (in fact, the state-sponsored religion of Allanak), for the 22 years I've been playing, and so it's pretty confusing to hear 2 staff members take a different view of things.When I played in Tuluk, I felt like worship of the Sun King was also a religion, one with less verbal enforcement of course, but just as serious behind the scenes.
Quote from: Dar on September 07, 2021, 03:17:48 PMWell, considering there are "Temples" to Tek, it kind of him to s that he is considered deity.What may differ though is the type of deity. Let's take Greek mythology. They did not worship those gods because it would benefit them in the afterlife. In fact, they'd all be going to the same place. They worshipped them for real time, current life benefits. Lay a sacrifice to Poseidon and you'll catch many fish. Don't and your boat will capsize and you'll drown. Also. If muk utep is not a god, then why the hell are his templars called "the faithful". What faith?
Quote from: Inks on September 08, 2021, 04:43:25 AMQuote from: Dar on September 07, 2021, 03:17:48 PM#logic
Quote from: Dar on September 07, 2021, 03:17:48 PM
Quote from: Morgenes on April 01, 2011, 10:33:11 PMYou win Armageddon, congratulations! Type 'credits', then store your character and make a new one
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