@Emits and Longer Emotes

[Pungee]

Does anyone else feel limited by the constraints of the 2 line emote? I was thining that perhaps if its feasible by the MUD's constraints, the staff might feel up to implementing @Emits without a limit on pose length? You could force an inclusion of the sdesc for the @emit to successfully go through to prevent poses without people's names in them. If that doesn't sound good to anyone... Maybe just extending the emote length? Two lines is... suffocating at times when you really just want to RP your little heart out.  

[Malifaxis]

Yeah, but at the same time, I know a few players (myself included) who could write a damn book about how they pick their fingernails.

And while it's fascinating when I do it, it sucks when other people do it. *snicker*

I think another maybe 40-80 chars would be really nice, hell, even another 20... because most times when my lines get truncated, it happens about one or two words bef...

[Malifaxis]

before I'm done.

[spawnloser]

I'm with you on this one, Mali.  It's always at the very end.

[Lazloth]

I'm personally not a big fan of the 255+ byte emotes.  There's nothing that prevents you from not incorporating CRLFs.

emote while #me is seated on an antiquated leather couch, cool breeze flitting into the room through the open stained-glass window, propped by a tiny piece of of folded leather that doubles sometimes as a wallet, @ points out in a raspy, cigarette-caked voice that, although pretty and eye-catching, lengthy emotes are a chore to wait for and the axiom, passed down from one generation to another, that 'quality not quantity' does, in fact, carry some ounce of validity.

[Dan]

As far back as I can recall, I have never had an emote cut short on me. Though talking to people, sometimes what I say gets cut short. Im in favor of leaving it 'as is'. I think that emote and say length is reasonable and people must use a bit of restraint at times. You have alot to say? Why not use two medium length emotes instead of one massive one?

[Bestatte]

I'll agree, and go a step further. Some people emote in more detail than necessary and it ends up detracting rather than adding to the scene.

An example: You and your crew are awaiting orders from your superior, and you're all gathered at the bar. Crew Member Joe walks in.

Joe pauses at the entry, tugging a finger of his purple polkadotted gloves and quietly perusing the crowd with a soft grunt.

You notice Joe and wave him over to your table.

Joe tugs on the second finger of his purple polkadotted gloves, his crimson-lashed darkened wide-set luminous perky verdant orbs staring vacantly at the wide, tall wall covered with knicknacks and half-empty bottles of various things.

You sit there.

Joe tugs on the third finger of his purple polkadotted gloves, a single strand of his perfectly coiffeurred hair vibrating gently in front of his lustrous creamy silky krath-bronzed pock-marked mustachioed bearded face as a tiny little itty bit of breeze wafts through the old decrepid used worn hole-adorned door.

You sit there some more.

After six more emotes, Joe notices you at the table beside him, but by then the boss has already come in and explained to you all that you need to know, with the exception of Joe, who has spent the last half hour real-time emoting moving into the room. So you now have to spend the next half hour waiting for your boss to repeat the whole fucking thing.

[EvilRoeSlade]

I'm very much against this.  Anybody who is emoting that long is either making a run-on sentance or including inane details that they've already mentioned every emote, have no bearing on the current situation, and which your character probably doesn't notice anyway.  Right pisses me off.

[Pungee]

Allright. I can pose several different ways. Here's an Arm pose.

The short penguin wearing red walks across the room towards the bar, his little Vans for Penguins make a slapping noise on the floor.

Thats about as detailed as I can get in the short constraints without going over. Now a MUSH pose is much longer and more involved and MUSH RP moves at a CRAWL. I like it but it's way too involved for Arm. I won't even write one up for an example, just imagine me describing the way the tarp in front of the door is pushed back. The subtle movements one does to check clothing in front of everyone else and the location of my Penguin's various glances as well as any expressions on his face.

What I'd like to be able to do is this though:
The tarp on the door is pulled aside by the short penguin wearing red. With a quick, slightly waddling walk he walks across the room towards the bar - his feet making little slapping noises as their soles hit the wooden floor. The short penguin wearing red's eyes go this way and that in a lazy, utterly unobservant and disconnected manner.

Besides, in RP intensive scenes it's REALLY nice to have the ability to pose in more detail. Otherwise things, to me anyway, start to feel repeatitive.  

[Dracul]

This problem can be solved by hitting enter more than once.

[Pungee]

This problem can be solved by hitting enter more than once.

While an obvious, but good, suggestion this creates a problem(maybe just for me, who knows i'm weird like that   ). RP usually goes in turns, at least with what I'm used to, so when I finish an emote I usually think of it as snubbing someone else when I go ahead and emote again. Also, it comes out as spamming if I have a particularly detailed thing to express and in my mind also breaks continuity of play.  :shock:

So you can see why I like the idea of an extended emote/@emit kind of dealy bopper.

[Ghardoan]

"...and the axiom, passed down from one generation to another, that 'quality not quantity' does, in fact, carry some ounce of validity."

Right on, Lazloth! To me, a great writer (or emoter) is one who can be as descriptive as possible with the fewest words.

On Armageddon MUD, I have seen a trend of cramming emotes with a ridiculous amount of unnecessary adjectives for the sole purpose of trying to appear sophisticated.  It is an easy habit to adopt, and I know that I am guilty of doing it on several occasions, myself.  Still, the more I learn about writing, the more I realize that it is a waste of words and effort, not to mention less clear than a concise emote.

On the other hand, every player has their own way of playing, and I see nothing wrong with that, as long as it does not ruin the experience for another.  Flowery emotes have never bothered me, personally; I just thought I would share my point of view.


Ghardoan just realized how completely off-topic his post is.

[FiveDisgruntledMonkeysWit]

I love big, flowery, descriptive EMOTEs. I love using them, and I love reading them... Most of the time.

If I'm in a life and death situation, I don't really give half a shit as to how your character wipes down his sword before combat. It also greatly irratates me when people EMOTE or speak excessively when in a large group (like an RPT, or a tavern with twenty people or more). If the templar is deciding the 'rinth rat's fate, I doubt my character or anyone else would be interested in a little saga regarding how you tie your shoe laces.

Phew, excuse me. I went a little deeper than I meant too with that... Anyways, like I said, I'm a fan of the big and over-done EMOTE, espicially during combat or intense situations, so long as it's relevant. If you're sparring, a good EMOTE would involve how your character swings his weapons or how he moves his feet... But we don't really care about how he glances to the side to admire a nearby desert rose with flecks of sand spotting it's petals, or some such. Anyways, I EMOTE a lot, and they're generally pretty lengthy. Sometimes my speech gets cut off, and it's usually because I put in a long EMOTE in before it with the ()s. However, if you have a pure-breed EMOTE getting truncated... Then tone it down! Either that, or get some equipment with shorter short descriptions... Some of those cloaks out there have to be like eighty characters, I swear...

Anyways, I believe it was Pungee that said that he considers it rude to EMOTE twice in a row, or whatever. I don't particularly think so... Your character did one thing, then the other, and having a nice little pause is a fine way to indicate the passage of a few seconds of time. Of course, Pungee, I'm not suggesting you change the way you play... Just saying that if you ever come across me in a tavern, you're free to spam-EMOTE as much as you like.  :wink:

[Ghardoan]

"The tarp on the door is pulled aside by the short penguin wearing red. With a quick, slightly waddling walk he walks across the room towards the bar - his feet making little slapping noises as their soles hit the wooden floor. The short penguin wearing red's eyes go this way and that in a lazy, utterly unobservant and disconnected manner. "

Very cute.  This makes me want to go out and buy a Pungee doll.

Ahem.  Anyway.  My only recommendation here would be to find a way to word the emote differently, so that it might perhaps be split into two emotes.


Ghardoan

[Dracul]

One suggestion to the emoting in turns comment. I'm thinking you didn't mean it was rude, but rather via typing speed, that is just how it happens in which I agree.

Copy and pasting is great for that though. Write out an emote, cut it, write out he first half. Enter. paste. enter.



I like long emotes, I hate long hoods and facewraps and two line sdecs.
Although I'll admit I commonly (at least with certain characters) wear hoods nearly everywhere- for ic reasons though.

[Cuusardo]

I wholeheartedly agree that one does not need excessively long emotes.  We really don't need to see something about the color of a person's eyes, or the beefiness (or lack thereof) in one of their limbs, or the sound their boots make while walking in their every emote.

[Dracul]

I wholeheartedly agree that one does not need excessively long emotes.  We really don't need to see something about the color of a person's eyes, or the beefiness (or lack thereof) in one of their limbs, or the sound their boots make while walking in their every emote.

NOTE: That is every -third- emote that we need this.


another note I forgot to add. Emits, not putting your sdesc, could easily get abused. *shrug* of course many things can get abused, but those could be VERY annoying.

Dracul, typing one word in caps so even those with language difficulties understand.

[Pungee]

I wholeheartedly agree that one does not need excessively long emotes.  We really don't need to see something about the color of a person's eyes, or the beefiness (or lack thereof) in one of their limbs, or the sound their boots make while walking in their every emote.

But why not? That's the whole point of even emoting is to give background information about a character, their positions and their expressions. If we didn't need to do it (this is slightly extreme, I'll admit and I'd like to think it's uncharacteristic of me) why bother emoting on anything at all that is exampled by the code? I'm not saying "Why not throw emoting out the window!" But for example, why bother putting in what manner you walk to the next room (since the code does mention you walk away)? It's the emotes that build and describe a character's... well character. At least that's the way I see it. Not meaning to pick at anyones playing style, I MUSH'd for a very long time so I'm probably incredibly biased when it comes to why you should emote. Once again, for the sake of not sparking a flame war: I'm not insulting anyone's emotes or their RPing skills, just explaining the way I see something.  

[Cuusardo]

I just get tired of seeing the same people, who are around my character quite often, using the same old stuff in their emotes, and their emotes end up being the maximum length because of it.  I would much rather see more variety, especially describing what they're doing rather than a part of their body.  Sometimes you say a lot more when you say a lot less.

[Pungee]

another note I forgot to add. Emits, not putting your sdesc, could easily get abused. *shrug* of course many things can get abused, but those could be VERY annoying.

Yeah, I've seen MUDs that have a filter check on everything @emitted where it doesn't let it go through unless it includes your char's name/sdesc. That would probably be necessary, though I'd imagine more for accidental slips about forgetting to put yourself in the emote (I've done it many a time on a number of MUSHs and it's always embarassing).

[creeper386]

Dracul wrote:
another note I forgot to add. Emits, not putting your sdesc, could easily get abused. *shrug* of course many things can get abused, but those could be VERY annoying.


Yeah, I've seen MUDs that have a filter check on everything @emitted where it doesn't let it go through unless it includes your char's name/sdesc. That would probably be necessary, though I'd imagine more for accidental slips about forgetting to put yourself in the emote (I've done it many a time on a number of MUSHs and it's always embarassing).

Uh...

:Stomping around heaviely, @ snorts derisively at ~wrinkly.

Isn't that what you mean by EMIT... Specially if you have to have your sdesc in it!? Thats already possible...


Creeper

[Pungee]

Yeah, thats why its titled @emits And Longer Emotes    Maybe I should have said @Emits or Longer Emotes. Ah well, the weed-smoking penguin is allowed an oversight occasionally. Right?

Right?

Dammit I hate it when they go all creepy quiet like that...  :shock:

[Delirium]

pemo leaves rustle quietly against each other as the canopy overhead tosses in the wind, dappled silver moonlight filtering through to shine upon @ upturned face.

emo Suk-Krath's burning rays creep slowly over the horizon, gradually illuminating the stark beauty of the barren landscape stretching out in all directions around @.

emo howling wind and biting sands batter @'s huddled form relentlessly as the storm rages through the tangled scrub.


No need for a new command, just get creative with p/emote, I say. Emit would be nice but it's placing trust in the hands of players that, in a perfect world, would be aptly placed, but realistically, should be left to the Imms. :)

[Dracul]

I thought emit meant exluding your sdesc. effectviley....emitting it.
IE

emit A slow breeze flow through the room

[Delirium]

Exactly.

That's why emit would be bad to put in the hands of the general populace.

emit A vortex splits the sky with a thunderous explosion!

emit The dragon suddenly appears in the sky as the vortex implodes behind him, letting out a screeching, ear-splitting roar!

Someone sends:
     "I really wish you hadn't done that. He's not due for another 57 IC years."

wish all sorry bout ur luck d00d. lolol!

[spawnloser]

Um, even though this is getting completely off topic, I'll still mention that we don't need an EMIT command.  EMOTE is good enough.

Back to the original topic, though, I will have to agree with whoever said it (I'm forgetting right now) that it really is annoying when 'The figure wearing the cloak with the idiotically long description and the much too long for reality descripted veil coughs.'  Granted, I'm not saying that people shouldn't wear them...it's just a pet peeve.  I'd much rather see 'Templar Head-up-Bum does something in this and that fashion while standing on his head and ........................'  So long as it's appropriate to the situation and not overdone again and again.  I can agree with what Cuusardo said about the one person doing one thing over and over again around one group of people...especially when I've seen the same character only emote once using every possible ~ in his emotes as if it was all important.  I'd like to see emotes longer for when someone is describing how they do something...not the color of their toenails, cuirass, hair, eyes, butt hair and every other piece of gear they own.

I'm starting to ramble, so I'll let someone have the oppurtunity to interject.

[Clegane]

I'd like to see emotes longer for when someone is describing how they do something...not the color of their toenails, cuirass, hair, eyes, butt hair and every other piece of gear they own.

While some of us, on the other hand, deeply enjoy the richness that such subtle details provide when appropriately rendered. There is certain a point after which things become excessive, but I appreciate being drawn into the depth of emoting that entails the creaking of a piece of old leather, the colour of a clump of phlegm, or the combined staining of blood and feces on a soldier's boot.

Its really about finesse, I suppose. There's a real distinction to be made between people emoting richness for the world's sake and people trying to masturbate with a thesaurus.

As for repetitive verbiage, yes, it can be annoying when you play in a contained group and are reminded daily of a certain physical feature. However, I don't find it excessive in the least to draw attention to said feature in the presence of a new character. If every third line out of someone's keyboard describes the heady richness of their personal scent or something, it's going to get a bit cumbersome. But when that scent is an integral descriptor, it may indeed be important to draw attention to it whenever they meet someone new. If you happen to be the bodyguard for that deeply-scented noble or whatever, well...more's the pity for you. Go check the GDB another time as they launch into their pungent odor speech; just don't try and infringe on their desire to convey that feature ot others.

[ShaLeah]

I admit it, I'm a big fan of the longer emotes. Big fan. I love watching people who come into the room and command it and still, 2 years later, a good emoter makes me stop what I am doing to observe.

I can also agree that it -can- get quite overwhelming and tedious to watch, particularly if the person is slow, like I am, at typing. I tend to go from long emotes to short ones at (I hope) a pretty decent pace. I try to avoid the entire   talk (the glimmer of mischevious light in her passionately burning eyes concentrating their ardor on ~knife as ~rppartner speaks) Yes.   - thing.

Sometimes I look at an emote I do and say to myself WTF are you thinking.

On the other hand, if I want to create room mood, I do so, more often than not including other people in the room with it such as:

emote among the cheers and stomps of excited fans within the benches of the crowded arena, the sound becomes defeaning around ~pc1, @, ~pc2 and ~pc 3, its roar vicious for the taste of blood

Emits or Echos are for the immortals to set the mood. I wouldn't want that kind of potential abuse in the hands of some players, myself included. I may be tempted to be mean to someone my character doesn't like.  :oops:

ShaLeah
-who thinks she had too much coffee.

[Rindan]

I personally would like to see the emote lengths stay as they are.  I tend to occasionally bump into the limit and would not cry if another 20 characters were tacked on.  However, I think it is better to keep the emoting limit shorter rather then longer.  Half of Armageddon's charm is the speed at which the world moves.  The limits on emoting length go a long way to keep the world moving at a reasonable pace.  Emoting limits do not inhibit the quality of emotes in my opinion the slightest, only the speed.

For instance, let's say you are pissing around in a bar.  You are bored and start to emote the atmosphere.  This might be frivolous to some, but I think it is perfectly acceptable in a boring dull night where no one is around, or no one is talking.  Now, the emoting limits might prevent you from describing the entire bar.  This is a good thing.  Instead, you need to describe different aspects of the bar in short easy to swallow bites.  First you describe the spice smoke, then the elf in the corner, then the shitty lighting, then the shady guy who just walked in.  What this does is keep the scene alive and active.  Instead of shitty out a single pose every 20 minutes, you can spit out 10 in that same time and make the world much more active and interesting.  Further, if someone wants to interrupt, they have time to do so.  Quality is in no way inhibited.  Only speed is regulated, and in my opinion, it is regulated for the better.

[creeper386]

*sigh* I'm going to have to say I am in complete agreement with Rindan... Sad thing huh?


But good post. Good other posts... but if you like really descriptive things... Making longer or short emotes doesn't keep you from being descriptive, as Rindan said, it just keeps you from describing EVERYTHING at once. Sensory overloads are a bad thing. As are just too many things all jammed into one little bit... Think there are even rules to writing that go against cramming everything little thing about everything into a small amount. Now it may not be repetive for some, but reading tons of adjectives and such gets repetive, and also, it's all there, then it's all gone. And thats not good.


Creeper

[spawnloser]

Okay, the original reason I posted that I would like longer limits is for says...not really emotes.  I've never run into an issue with an emote getting cut off.  I'm more worried about when someone's blabbing on about one topic...why not allow it into one say?  As far as emotes that long...like Rindan said, if you're doing so much that you're getting cut off in one emote, you're being overly verbose with adjectives or you're packing too many actions into an emote.  Now, packing so many adjectives into an emote is in some small ways get's old...real fast.  Packing too much action doesn't allow anyone to interject.  As creeper said, too, if you do it all in one long emote, it's there and gone...spread your glory over several emotes, man (or woman)!  If you wanna be awesome, show them you are awesome by including your sdesc in there three times instead of only once!  People will notice it and remember you more!

[JollyGreenGiant]

I like having spoken lines cut off at some point, for the simple reason that at some point, the speaker does need to breathe, and it gives someone a chance to interject a comment mid-speech if they're so inclined.

Also, descriptive emotes are nice, but save the purple prose.  I'd rather respond with a number of shorter emotes to something, because it takes less time to type out and the people you're interacting with get a more immediate response that way.  On the other hand, if you're emoting in a more solo context, it doesn't matter how long it takes to type out.  But avoid purple prose and other such calamities.  If I see something that's going to take forever to read and doesn't look important, I probably won't pay much attention to it.

[Angela Christine]

When things get too long many people tend to skim, or skip to the end hoping to find the point.  This happens with physical descriptions too. A 4 line desc may not be inspiring but you can read it without interupting the flow of the scene, while a very long description (whether of a person or room) may get skimmed or skipped until "later."  

Personally I think the emote length is long enough.  I wouldn't mind another 80-200 characters on says, because (as you all know) I have a lot to say.    But on the whole I think the game is better off with the shorter length.  I wouldn't mind another couple lines on the Idea, Typo and Bug reports, but I can deal with it.

Part of the reason I prefer RP MUDs to RP MUSHes is the faster pace.  MUSHes often allow very long mixed emotes with speach, and often have a tradition of going in "turns".  So if you have even 4 or 5 people in the scene it can litterally take half an hour or more for your turn to come 'round again.  I can't wait that long!  I need to react now, not 20 minutes from now.  It's torture, and just a short step away from play-by-email or Bullitin Board RPGs.

AC