Zalanthan names, not just for Arm 2.0, but for today!

[Marauder Moe]

I had a revelation today about how we can establish a set of Zalanthan names, rather than inventing them (which isn't that realistic).  Not only that, but we can do it without any staff help, without a name bank, and we can do it immediately.

It's simple: all we have to do is stop making up names for our characters.  Next time you apply for one, use a name you've heard in the past.

Haven't played long?  Check the history docs or the player submitted stories and logs.

Naturally, try and use a name of a character similar to yours.  Like, if you're applying for an elf, try and use the name of an elf character you saw once rather than a human name.

Thoughts?  Anyone else willing to pledge to use 100% recycled character names from now on?

[FantasyWriter]

I like it and think it is a very interesting idea... as long as everyone doesn't pick Amos.

An interesting spin on it for 2.Arm would to have a list of names and their meanings for each race/tribe/city/language.
Say one tribe could have a system like the Chickasaw Indians where a name like Itawanabba meant "sits on bench" (sorry only accurate one I know off the top of my head.) But actually have your name mean something.

-FW

[tarsier]

Cool idea, and realistic.

The meanings idea is good, too.

[Belgoikiss]

I would do this, I like the idea. Perhaps.. for those of us with bad memories we could all compile names of certain races here we've seen into one massive list and add it as a sticky so we can keep adding. I really like it Moe. Since I'm utterly exhausted and going to bed, I'll make a format of sorts instead of jogging my memory right this second. Anyone interested can just copy it and add their names.

Perhaps put a <m> or <f> or both beside each name, if the mood strikes you. And I'm unsure what staff thinks about living characters names. Perhaps we should leave those out for now to be on the safe side. Could also add the aforementioned meaning next to it, if there happens to be one you know.

----------------------------------------------------------

Human

Elf

Dwarf

Breed

Half-Giant

------------------------------------------------------------
Specialized Names

Tribal Humans

Desert Elves

Halflings

[Forest Junkie]

I guess I should be flattered if I saw someone going by a name a previous character of mine used. But no, I wouldn't be. I'd be pissed.

No thanks, I'll continue making up my names.

[Marauder Moe]

Pissed?  Why?

Do you get upset in real life if you run into someone with the same name as you too?

[Zoltan]

I like making up names for my PCs, too. But I usually draw from names I've seen IG before to fill out the vNPC cast.

[Ourla]

As long as the rule wasn't absolute, it might be cool.  I don't mind recycling PC names, but someone once ran a character with my GDB name which pissed me off.

[FantasyWriter]

As long as the rule wasn't absolute, it might be cool.  I don't mind recycling PC names, but someone once ran a character with my GDB name which pissed me off.

Was the sdesc "the lithe, dreadlock-tressed woman"?

[jhunter]

I rather enjoy trying to come up with new names that I haven't heard before or used before.

[Forest Junkie]

Pissed?  Why?

Do you get upset in real life if you run into someone with the same name as you too?

Eh, not the same thing. In game, if someone uses the -exact- name as a former pc of yours, it likely has more to do with flattery/stealing than it does pure chance as it would be in the real world.

[Ender]

Pissed?  Why?

Do you get upset in real life if you run into someone with the same name as you too?

Eh, not the same thing. In game, if someone uses the -exact- name as a former pc of yours, it likely has more to do with flattery/stealing than it does pure chance as it would be in the real world.

I bet Jesus and all his apostles feel the same way.

I think it's a solid idea, but I'd like to see cultural naming trends rather than a hard set list of names.  Maybe four of five popular names for Tuluk and Allanak and maybe a few tribes, and then a list of various trends, like tacking on a set of letters to a name to denote familial ties or some such.

Stuff like how Anderson means son of Andrew or Johnson means son of John.

[Forest Junkie]

I bet Jesus and all his apostles feel the same way.

OMG OWNED!

[Ammut]

I dunno.. let's say that a list -IS- created and made public, stickied, etc.

We get an influx of new players one week, all of which make pc's named... Amos or Malik or something you see a lot of.
Seeing four Amos pc's running around would make me angry.  Not only is it uncreative but I feel like it would really take
away from the character creation process by making it easier.  Breathing life into yet another Amos... bleh.

Let's also not forget that popular names change throughout the years.  Would the list have to be updated every so often?
I would think that over generations, people might name their children after themselves or their grandparents, but not
everyone.

[some guy]

I just kinda dislike how there are various code-related problems with multiple characters using the same names. Not just the risk of accidentally attacking the wrong guy, but various aspects of psionicism and magick as well.

[FiveDisgruntledMonkeysWit]

Do you get upset in real life if you run into someone with the same name as you too?

Haha, actually, I do. I'm kind of a dick like that.
I think it's a cool idea, and I personally try to use 'common' names every once in a while. But I agree with others; it shouldn't be a hard and fast rule. Or even a recommendation. But having a list of common names, organized by locale, would be a pretty cool resource.
Amos and Malik would of course have to be on the list. I'd also recommend 'Lo'. I've seen quite a few 'Lo's running around, though some were admittedly VNPCs.

[Marauder Moe]

Well don't get mad at them, get mad at your lazy parents for giving you such an uncreative name. 

I just think it'd be more realistic for names to be chosen more often than invented.

Also, I most certainly meant in-game names, not GDB names.  However, I know many people's GDB names are the name of their first character...

As for the code, well, contact accepts multiple keywords and in a busy room you have the keyword command.  I'm not going to discuss magick code, but I don't think it's such a terrible thing for a magick mishap to occur.  People on the Arm Reborn forum seem to adamantly desire such things.

Anyway, while a name bank is a great idea, it's been tried before and not enough people seemed interested in participating.  My main point is that we don't need a name bank. All you have to do just pull a name from your lists of past character acquaintances.

[Kyviantre]

It would be okay if you:

a) Didn't -have- to do it.
and
b) Asked people before stealing their name (I also would be severely pissed for people stealing mine, at least without asking.).

Personally, you'd be better to have a long list of 'approved' names, ones that the initial player themselves said, "Here, if you want it, please use it", rather than a free-for-all.  Its an okay idea, but personally, I like being creative, I like making the perfect name to fit the character, and people going, "Oh yeah, I'm totally <my char name here> too!" would ruin that part of the char creation for me.

In short, if its optional and you have an approved list for a name bank (sticky it, helpfile it, let people send in their old/new/current/future char names when they wish/when they finish with them), then fine.  If its a compulsary free-for-all, then drov-no, I do not think its a good idea!

[FuSoYa]

I'm going to chime in with I don't really see the point of this.  Just come up for a name you like and I guess if you -really- liked someone else's name at some point use that.

Brandon

[Marauder Moe]

Well, of course I can't force people to do it.  I just think the game would be better off if most people did, or most people did most of the time.


However, I don't see how reusing a name can be considered stealing.  Sure, OOCly you may have invented it, but did your character's parents ICly invent it?  And for those of you who've had PCs successfully reproduce, did you invent names for your PC's children or name them after some other PC/NPC/vNPC?

[Marauder Moe]

What if we added a minor caveat and encouraged people to only pick names of characters an RL year or more gone?

I understand a bit why you might be upset if someone named their character after a living character of yours, but what about a dead one?

[Desertman]

Pissed?  Why?

Do you get upset in real life if you run into someone with the same name as you too?

I once saw him snatch the testicles off another man named Derek.

It was entertaining, but disturbing.

He has an entire room in his lab full of "Derek Testicles".

He says its like looking into a mirror of his soul when he sees other "Derek" folk.

[Kyviantre]

Well, of course I can't force people to do it.  I just think the game would be better off if most people did, or most people did most of the time.

Why?  I don't see the great attraction myself.  I've met one other person with my first name.  The only person I know with my first middle name is my mother.  One person with my second middle name.  And two non-family members with my surname.  In my entire life.  It just gets complicated if you have two-of-the-same, even in RL, one of them gets nicknamed something else usually anyway!  Ergo, not much point.  I'd far rather see more people using nicknames from a list!

However, I don't see how reusing a name can be considered stealing.  Sure, OOCly you may have invented it, but did your character's parents ICly invent it?

Intellectual property dear?  Thats stealing.  If you -want- to share your name, thats fine.  I don't want people to use mine, and I think, as a player, that is my right.  I personally, don't want people using my name, other people obviously feel different.  So let it be an option, not a compulsive thing.

[Marauder Moe]

Intellectual property?  Are you serious?  The name is Amos, not Amos(c).   

It's totally not against the rules to re-use another player's character's name, as far as I know.

[FuSoYa]

Intellectual property?  Are you serious?  The name is Amos, not Amos(c).   

It's totally not against the rules to re-use another player's character's name, as far as I know.

Definitely agree with this point.  I feel especially in a game like Armageddon where they don't have a limit on one name per person ever on the whole mud that people are free to use whatever name they feel is appropriate within the naming rules.

Brandon

[brytta.leofa]

However, I don't see how reusing a name can be considered stealing.  Sure, OOCly you may have invented it, but did your character's parents ICly invent it?

Intellectual property dear?  Thats stealing. 

I'm not a lawyer, but would suspect that asserting intellectual "property" rights (you're referring to U.S. copyright law, I suppose?) on material that you've submitted to Armageddon staff to be approved for in-game use would be a dicey proposition.

Anyway, I'd love to see culturally specific guidelines posted for character names.  Right now we've got just slightly more of a mishmash than I'd like.

[Desertman]

The only time I would see a problem with re-using a name would be if it was just obviously copied from a previous character/NPC.


For example...

You can only have so many Gunthry The Wild Inix Warrior...men running around.


Of course, to argue against my own arguement...

It seems like you would see more Tektolnes characters.

I mean, I know atleast five people named Jesus.

Its sort of the same thing right?

[brytta.leofa]

If two characters share a very unusual name, there probably should be a good in-character explanation.  And we might expect that a character named after a famous person was born after the namesake Got Famous.

I'd love to see more commoners named after nobles, though.

> say (brightly, curtseying) Yes, Lady Borsail. M'name's Sighlara.

[Marauder Moe]

I suspect most templars would take issue with someone named Tektolnes, hehe.

However, in Arm 2.0 I wouldn't be surprised if people started naming children after Tek or Muk.


Also, I'm only talking about first names here.  I'm not advocating that it's ok to be named Pearl Terash or Kexxsa Tallid unless perhaps you had approval from those players to have a character who was actually related.

In real life family names are much more diverse than first names, and thus I would not advocate reusing those without permission from the player who created that family.  (Actually it might be interesting if people wanted to pass off the family trees of dead characters to other players who want a richer sense of lineage, but that's another topic.)

[Desertman]

I dont want to see people named after OOC'ly famous characters. IC'ly famous characters would be fine.


For example...


If you have a Ranger named William Wallace, that lived 150 days, but that entire 150 days was spent solo hunting, sitting in taverns, just being a commoner.

Sure, everyone would know your PC's name, they would have seen you with about 10 of thier own characters over a couple of RL years. You would be famous from an OOC standpoint, all of the players would know your character was a real frickin' badass.

I would hate to see more characters named William Wallace later on, after this ranger PC, because he wasnt IC'ly famous.


Now, if you had a 20 day warrior named Tallimbre The Merciful, who was the two time Arena Champion of Allanak, he would be IC'ly famous, and it wouldnt bother me at all to see a couple of pc's later on named Tallimbre.

[Ender]

Anyway, I'd love to see culturally specific guidelines posted for character names.  Right now we've got just slightly more of a mishmash than I'd like.

My feelings as well.  I'd rather see more of a rough guideline for social naming trends in various locations than a list of popular names.

For example (and by no means how it really is or could be)

Allanak:

Names tend to be one or two syllables and a mixture of the names of the parentage among the commoners.  So if the father was Amos and the mother was Malik a son could be named Malmos as cutting out a few letters to keep with the syllabic standard is not uncommon.  This practice makes the addition of middle or last names almost unheard of among the normal commonbase.  Last names among the known world generally denote belonging to a large and wealthy family organization such as a Great Merchant House or an entire tribe.

On the other hand nobles of Allanak tend to favor long and complicated names, often an amalgamation of a number of ancestors.  Normally these names are split between two names, a first and a middle name, one to denote the maternal side and one the paternal side.  The first name is dependent on which parent was a member of their birth house, or if birth through blooded cousins, which was of higher status at the birth.

Tuluk:  

Last names for normal commoner families are as well rare outside of Great Merchant Houses and bardic circles, instead Tulukis pride themselves on originality in their naming to prevent confusion.  Trends change like the wind in the growing citystate, but rarely will you see people named in honor of others, though names based on concepts or proper names for various animals, plants, days of the week, etc. are somewhat common.

As for the nobility naming standards are different from House to House, but generally follow similar trends to those of the commoners.  First names are individual to the Chosen and are selected carefully usually after parents consult records or a master bard to see if the name has been used before.  To name a young noble after a living noble is considered a great insult, though naming one after one who has already passed is only just a social embarrassment.  Middle names normally bare some significance about what the parents wish for their children, and are normal concept driven names taken from other languages like a name that would mean "strong of will" in bendune.



With all things we add to the documentation we have to keep what our goal is in mind.  We want the game to be more immersive and deep.  A list of popular names won't do that, but a rich detailing of what names mean and how they are formed from place to place can really add depth to your character and the culture they are apart of.

[Marauder Moe]

A fair point.

Though, my theory is that it's not like you would be naming your characters directly after someone else's character.  Simply that that we could consider most characters' names to be typical Zalanthan names and that there are lots of unrelated Zalanthans who share it.

However, I think it's also fair enough that if a previous PC of yours heard someone's name spoken in a public place, then perhaps the vNPC parents of a future PC of yours were in the same room and heard the same name and liked it.

[Furious George]

Well, as a point of reference, and I might well be wrong...I've yet to ever run into another dwarf named Thrain.

I'd just be happy if Amos disappeared, despite his glorious cookies.

[Marauder Moe]

In Allanak it might not be wise to name your child Thrain.  Someone making a Tuluki or tribal dwarf might want to consider it, though.

That said, I did actually see a character in the last few months named after a historical figure.  Kudos to that guy.

I have never met an Amos.  I think the last time the staff gave statistics, there were really only 7 characters with that name since the system started keeping track.

My whole point is that its realistic for names to be re-used, and I think people should do it more often.  (Also, am I the only one who's ever made characters with names that were deliberately not evocative of my character concept?)

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

I dont want to see people named after OOC'ly famous characters. IC'ly famous characters would be fine.


For example...


If you have a Ranger named William Wallace, that lived 150 days, but that entire 150 days was spent solo hunting, sitting in taverns, just being a commoner.

Sure, everyone would know your PC's name, they would have seen you with about 10 of thier own characters over a couple of RL years. You would be famous from an OOC standpoint, all of the players would know your character was a real frickin' badass.

I would hate to see more characters named William Wallace later on, after this ranger PC, because he wasnt IC'ly famous.


Now, if you had a 20 day warrior named Tallimbre The Merciful, who was the two time Arena Champion of Allanak, he would be IC'ly famous, and it wouldnt bother me at all to see a couple of pc's later on named Tallimbre.

All this. Absolutely agreed on.

[flurry]

Cultural guidelines for names, in a similar vein to those style/clothing guidelines, would be terrific.

The OP's suggestion isn't a bad idea at all, but I personally enjoy coming up with names for my characters.

[ale six]

I've seen characters over the years named after famous templars like Ihsahn and Sathis and Eunoli. I think this would be a normal thing for commoners to do. Naming after famous bards (Holten, Methyas, ... ) or famous arena champions/badasses (Paryl, Sujaal, ... ) or famous merchants (Pearl, Sargax, ... ) would also probably be pretty common, I'd expect.

If you're naming your kids after a templar or noble, a wise parent might change the name a bit, or give the kid another name to go by. After all, if Sighlara Borsail is a huge drunken floozy, her namesake's relatives might want to make her disappear to avoid, ah, any comparisons being made.

My own rule of thumb is that dirt-poor common characters would have really simple names, or even be named after objects or animals (Flower, Dagger, Serpent, Joz). Average commoner characters have just one first name, two to three syllables. Wealthier upper class commoners would have a longer or more complicated first name, and maybe even a last name if they have a wealthy and established virtual family. Nobles and templars usually have a complicated first name and one or more middle names, which might be based off of former relatives in their family. (Ceylara Borsail's middle name 'Ellandris' was taken from her NPC great-aunt, Ellandra Borsail.)

In terms of guidelines for naming, I agree it'd be cool if we had some kind of cultural guidelines. I noticed with House Borsail that lots and lots of their names happened to start with V (Vedelarin, Visandach), so I used that convention when inventing vNPC family. I think it'd be more common for established families with documented lineage to have more coherent conventions than your average commoner, though. Kadians and Kuraci and Winrothols etc can trace their heritage way way back, but average Amos probably doesn't even know who his grandpappy was.

[Ammut]

Would it be plausible to have certain cultural trends that might make it easier to create a name?

For instance, in the south, maybe most of the children's names are three syllables long, with a stress on the first
two syllables.

Keenuu-gi
Vaaluu-ka

Whereas in the north, names might also be three syllables long, but with a stress on the last syllable.

Aminraa

You get the idea, right? It kind of reminds of that guy from ESPN who has problems with four syllable words.
Mag-nif-i-cent.  Spec-tac-u-lar.  A-rug-a-la.

[tarsier]

I don't understand why people would pissed if someone used their old PC's name.

Having PC's with the same name should be okay... in one city, IRL, there are probably 1000's of John's and Jane's.
It should be similar in Allanak.

Even if someone did name their PC WIllliam Wallace, after the OOCly famous ranger, it should be okay, because that particular character probably wasn't the first WIlliam Wallace in Zalanthas history... see my point?


Also, if we were to compile a list, I think breeds wouldn't have their own... they would simply chose one from either the Human or Elf list.

[Kyviantre]

UK intellectual property law, not USA copyright law.  It was a while since I created my account, but I don't remember agreeing to giving up the rights to my intellectual property when I created it, ergo whats-mine-is-mine, whats-yours-is-yours, and if I want to borrow, I ask.

Like I said, feel free to go with customs, or a large list (either from people offering up their character names as suggestions, or of 'famous' folk), but I will not (never ever ever) agree that you should just be allowed to swipe someone else's name, whether they are living or dead.  Basing a character name off someone else's is fine, asking them if you can swipe part/the whole of their name and getting approval is fine, both are good things in my eyes (ie do them!  Go forth and enjoy what it brings you!).

But I would still be pissed.  I work hard on my characters, I work hard on their names, I would be severely irritated to find that someone had stolen an idea (not just liked the general concept and ran with it, but literally taken it nearly word-for-word), or a name without asking if I was fine with it.

...and I've encountered two people in the past year with the same 'famous-person-name', one male, one female.  Absolutely nothing wrong with swiping part/all of an NPC name, or rather, an important/famous NPC.  The nobles/Templars, while you might want to mangle the name a little, being named after Daddy's Favourite Party-Fale might be fine (still mulling that one, but so far brain hasn't thrown up any huge objections), but being named after commoner-Amos-#237...purely because you were bored and couldn't be assed to think up something original?  That, I really don't like.

So sure, culturally applicable types of names (everyone in the south begins with T, everyone in Luir's ends in 'essa' if its a girl, everyone in the north has fourteen letters in their name), fine.  But making it compulsary to share names...that I really, strongly, very-much-so don't like.

[Marauder Moe]

Well, for one, I don't believe I nor Armageddon MUD falls under UK IP law.

Two, I suspect that even in the UK the law doesn't consider every single damned thing you say or type to be intellectual property, particularly when you post it on the internet without a copyright notice.

Three, I understand you're upset with the prospect of someone using one of your characters' names, but I still for the life of me don't understand why.  Does it harm you?  Do you think someone is going to make a character with one of "your" names, play poorly, and then people are going to think it reflects badly on you?  Do you think they're going to make money off of the name?

but being named after commoner-Amos-#237...purely because you were bored and couldn't be assed to think up something original?  That, I really don't like.

You think I'm lazy?  That's not it at all!  My intent is to help start a realistic Zalanthan naming tradition, and in real life people don't make up names, they choose them.  I'm asking people to consider choosing Zalanthan names (ie names that Zalanthans have used, ie names of past characters) rather than load up a random name generator.

[Rairen]

Although without Kyv's militancy, I think I know what she means.  I once fell in love with an sdesc of mine.  It suited the character, had the right sound, was something I had never seen before.  A month later, a PC strolls in in newbie gear wearing a very similiar sdesc and, I was ticked.  Admittedly, it lasted all of a minute.  Admittedly, I've never confessed it to anyone before now.  But, yeah.  I couldn't believe I had that powerful of a reaction.  

Back on topic, I've always, always, always wanted cultural guidelines for character names.  Given that the divide between north and south is so narrow, OOCly, I think it's another way to help highlight those differences.

Further, on the name reusing issue, by playing Arm, you're throwing your 'creative property' into the communal pool.  There's no way to enforce that someone can't steal your name (other muds do; I rather prefer our method).  Likewise with signature emotes, clever sayings, or anything else you're proud of that you so much as type out.   As such, if it's a sincere problem - a problem greater than the pleasure you get from the game - I'd say you should pay somewhere else where you can greater control it.  Otherwise, it's part of the exchange for playing within a sharing community in which we build stories as a group.  You lose control.

[Kyviantre]

Making up a name, nicknames, a sdesc, a long desc, character quirks, a history, a family, to me, thats all part of the creative process of what I do when I make my character.

And once again, saying the same thing.  I have absolutely no problem with you doing as you like, but I strongly think you should only allow names into the 'pot' of people -willing- to allow their carefully thought up name to be used.

If Username wants her name 'Bob' to be a widely known name for children with red hair because in elvish 'Bob' means 'red', then let her add it.

If Nameuser wants to play 'Ken', and has it in their background/idea of the char that the name means sweet FA, and called themselves it because they thought it sounded pretty, and wants to keep that creational process to themselves, then I don't feel that you have the right to 'steal' that name and claim it for your own.

It is different with nicknames (ie raptor/scrab/dagger/Tho/Stumpy/etc), those are common ground/knowledge, but character names should be optional, in that you can choose to let them be used as 'common' names or not.

That solves your problem.  It solves my militancy (thank you Rairen).  Everyone is happy.

[Marauder Moe]

And once again, saying the same thing.  I have absolutely no problem with you doing as you like

If you have no problem, then stop suggesting that anyone who does this would be a thief and stop threatening them with prosecution under IP law.

but I strongly think you should only allow names into the 'pot' of people -willing- to allow their carefully thought up name to be used.

Name banks have been tried and didn't really pan out.  Maybe it would be more efficient to make a list of "reserved" names that people don't want to share?

If Nameuser wants to play 'Ken', and has it in their background/idea of the char that the name means sweet FA, and called themselves it because they thought it sounded pretty, and wants to keep that creational process to themselves, then I don't feel that you have the right to 'steal' that name and claim it for your own.

No one is going to take someone's name and claim they invented it.  They're just going to use it for a character.  Besides, I think any Zalanthan parent is perfectly within their rights to give their child any name they heard spoken in public.

That solves your problem.  It solves my militancy (thank you Rairen).  Everyone is happy.

I'm not happy.  You're still accusing me of conspiracy to commit some sort of theft.

EDIT: and I still don't understand why you object so strongly, though I'm willing to accept that it may be an irrational feeling you simply can't explain.

[tarsier]

Maybe it would be more efficient to make a list of "reserved" names that people don't want to share?

Sorry, but this would just be ridiculous.

[BreakBad]

No one is going to take someone's name and claim they invented it.  They're just going to use it for a character.  Besides, I think any Zalanthan parent is perfectly within their rights to give their child any name they heard spoken in public.

I agree with this. I really don't see using names you've heard  before as a problem.

[Delstro]

I would prefer that instead of saying we can/cannot use names from previous unrelated characters. I prefer that we declare naming standards for races. This is just a rough idea while I wait for lunch.

For instance:
Elvish names would be heavily inundated with vowels, meaningful names (such as the Allundean word for Gwoshi shit would be Nesht), etc.
Human Names would be average in that it takes naming conventions from all other species.
Dwarves were born by their parents to accomplish the parents' plans in some way. Dwarves would always have names that meant something. Their names could be translated easily into another language for the most part. I envision them being translated into simple, real objects. They would be named ridge, Tor, Fale, Road, Krath's Strength, and not so much named after people.
Half-elvish names would be dependent on what race their raisers were.
Mulish names would most likely be named after famous noble people to further their marketing. These could be names from Myths, Stories, History, etc. Or they could be very simple names such as Mul 215. Bco 3rd (which stands for Bravo Company, 3rd Division) and these names would change depending on where they were stationed.
Half-Giant names would most likely be named after simple ideas, objects, or names from myths, stories, and songs. This is because of their ingrained ability to blend in a society. What better way to blend than pick an idea Song hero you like and name your kid after it?

[FantasyWriter]

I would prefer that instead of saying we can/cannot use names from previous unrelated characters. I prefer that we declare naming standards for races. This is just a rough idea while I wait for lunch.

For instance:
Elvish names would be heavily inundated with vowels, meaningful names (such as the Allundean word for Gwoshi shit would be Nesht), etc.
Human Names would be average in that it takes naming conventions from all other species.
Dwarves were born by their parents to accomplish the parents' plans in some way. Dwarves would always have names that meant something. Their names could be translated easily into another language for the most part. I envision them being translated into simple, real objects. They would be named ridge, Tor, Fale, Road, Krath's Strength, and not so much named after people.
Half-elvish names would be dependent on what race their raisers were.
Mulish names would most likely be named after famous noble people to further their marketing. These could be names from Myths, Stories, History, etc. Or they could be very simple names such as Mul 215. Bco 3rd (which stands for Bravo Company, 3rd Division) and these names would change depending on where they were stationed.
Half-Giant names would most likely be named after simple ideas, objects, or names from myths, stories, and songs. This is because of their ingrained ability to blend in a society. What better way to blend than pick an idea Song hero you like and name your kid after it?

The tall, crew-cut-headed man says in southern accented English,
"Ah like it ah-laht."

[Marauder Moe]

All that sounds like work, though.  Immortal work too, even.

We'd not only need to compile a list of names, but also make basically a partial dictionary for several languages, and have it all approved by the staff.

I'm trying to avoid making anyone do significant large-scale work because otherwise it probably won't get done (like all the other times people suggested/tried to set up a name bank).

[Delstro]

I would just say "This is the Typical Zalanthan naming convention." "Here are a few examples." "Rock on."

[Kyviantre]

I'm not happy.  You're still accusing me of conspiracy to commit some sort of theft.

EDIT: and I still don't understand why you object so strongly, though I'm willing to accept that it may be an irrational feeling you simply can't explain.

I'm not saying you're thieving, I'm saying (in bold so it can't be missed)

I do not want my names copied.

I also don't want to use other people's names unless it is a decided family thing that I'm being invited into.

If everyone else wants to copy each others names, do so with my blessing.  I don't want mine used because it ruins that part of the game (the creative process) for me.  I spend considerable time over my names to get them exactly how I like them, even when they never even get mentioned from my characters lips in the game itself.

Point is, you need a self-updating page which is connected to a form (the request tool?) that people can say, "Okay, my name would be considered 'common' to <my city/race/tribe/gender here>'.  Then people wanting to look for a 'historical' or 'common' name could flick down this alphabetised page and select the name that they feel would suit their new character.

Failing that, in the character creation process, add a notation that says, "Would this character name be considered common (ie would you mind other people using it)? Yes/No", if "No", then thats fine, if "Yes", it gets added to some sort of file/page/list somewhere.

Both require immy help, but best you press for it in 2.Arm than 1.Arm, hmm?

[Marauder Moe]

I do not want my names copied.

I get that.  However, I still think you're being unreasonable.

I don't want mine used because it ruins that part of the game (the creative process) for me.  I spend considerable time over my names to get them exactly how I like them, even when they never even get mentioned from my characters lips in the game itself.

This I still don't get.  How does it ruin anything for you?  Do you really consider a handful of letters stuck together as some sort of artwork?  Some signature style of yours?  How far does your claim to originality go?  I notice all your character's names start with a K.  Are we also forbidden to make our characters' with K names?  What if I want to make ALL of my characters' names start with a K from now on?  Does that tread on your sense of style too?

Help me understand what it is you don't like so I won't accidentally offend you with future characters.  (And perhaps so we can reach a sort of compromise on this matter, though I suppose simply saying "Everybody start reusing names except for those of Kyviantre's characters" might do.)

[Kyviantre]

This I still don't get.  How does it ruin anything for you?  Do you really consider a handful of letters stuck together as some sort of artwork?  Some signature style of yours?  How far does your claim to originality go?  I notice all your character's names start with a K.  Are we also forbidden to make our characters' with K names?  What if I want to make ALL of my characters' names start with a K from now on?  Does that tread on your sense of style too?

Don't be sarcastic, it is unflattering.  The K's are to do with a mud that I played a long while back, and it turned into a horribly obsessive trend (that and I like the challenge).  All my character's real names start with a K, doesn't mean they are known by those names, its just one of those player quirks that makes everyone on the planet so unique.  Joy, no?

It ruins things for me because it does.  It breaks my IC/OOC line, it breaks my immersion, it breaks my interest, ergo, for me, it spoils things, hence, something I'm not interested in participating in.  No problems with everyone else doing it, no problems with 15 other people having the name Amos sitting at the bar with me, thats their choice, its not one I would pick for myself, but you (meaning anyone that wants to) go right on ahead.  If it makes the game good for you, if it keeps your interest, if you stay better immersed, if its something you want to participate in, great!  Fantastic!  Wonderful!  Anything that helps/allows/makes you enjoy the game and your character is always good.

(And perhaps so we can reach a sort of compromise on this matter, though I suppose simply saying "Everybody start reusing names except for those of Kyviantre's characters" might do.)

Go for it.

[Marauder Moe]

I apologize, that was a little snippy.  You haven't been entirely courteous yourself, though.  Can we both agree to try and be more civil to each other?

But I am genuinely confused.  Your objections keep changing.  Now it's an immersion issue?  But, wouldn't having names be reused be realistic?  In real life names are reused.  I know literally about 20 people named Mike/Michael, and have regular contact with about half a dozen of them.

[Kyviantre]

You keep asking me for -more- reasons, my reasons aren't changing, I'm just -giving- you more reasons, as requested!

And I know one other person (excluding a fictional person) with my first name, one person with my second name (my mom), know of two with my third (but saw them once and never again), and two non-family with my surname.  Since out of that, three of them live in the wrong country, and two in the wrong part of the country (north/south there), that means I know of one person with a similar name to me...who is family.  If its family, then shared names is fine in my book, since you probably know each other anyway, and can ask!  Family therefore is irrelevant in this situation.

My characters tend not to be the happy-go-family sorts, ergo, their names probably wouldn't be common.  There you go, yet -another- reason.  I don't play famous people, mythological people, or people with thousands of offspring, why therefore, would their names be considered 'common'?  Until I play an Amos, their names are part of their uniqueness.  It is something I like.  It is part of the reason I play this game (it is pretty darn unique!), and part of the reason I play MUDs in general.  Its fantasy dear, if I wanted to be called Mike, I'd go turn myself into a boy and go deed-poll myself.

If you want your characters to all have similar names, fine...choose common ones.  Make an Amos, make a Tek, make a namesaked Lord-Templar-Blangarang.  That is your choice, and there is nothing wrong with that!  If you want to be called that, great!  If the character turns out to be awesome, and makes the name famous, huzzah!  I just don't think that any odd name should be 'up-for-grabs'.

Common names, famous names, mythological names, names of plants/beasts/objects, yes!
My names (and whoever else doesn't want to share for whatever reason, be that they are specifically choosing uncommon names - you don't know that this isn't in their frigging background, don't assume!)), no!

I thought we came to a middle ground somewhere before...why am I still repeating it?

ps: Going to put into all of my backgrounds from now on that their parents named them weird things because they 'liked the sound of the letters', so the names can't be swiped 

[Mood]

Am I the only one who gets the urge to start naming characters after Kyviantre's?

[flurry]

Her objection sounds perfectly reasonable to me, even if I don't share it.

I think perhaps a (relatively short) list of common names for each region and race, along with a doc on naming conventions, would be the best solution. That would give a cultural feel to names that I don't think the OP's suggestion, taken by itself, would.

[ale six]

Am I the only one who gets the urge to start naming characters after Kyviantre's?

Me too.

[Kyviantre]

You do, I'll make a dwarf with the focus of "PK all characters with names starting with K"...and enjoy it! 

And Flurry, I like...he/she is my friend (poor person...), I like the short list of common names idea...if fact, lets just take that whole two sentences as being golden.

I think perhaps a (relatively short) list of common names for each region and race, along with a doc on naming conventions, would be the best solution. That would give a cultural feel to names that I don't think the OP's suggestion, taken by itself, would.

That, I like.  That is good!  Makes sense, shows the cultural differences in the same ways as the clothing-type file (which is good!), and adds insight into -why- these are common names, not just "Name after me plx!"

[aeshyw]

I've seen characters over the years named after famous templars like Ihsahn and Sathis and Eunoli. I think this would be a normal thing for commoners to do. Naming after famous bards (Holten, Methyas, ... ) or famous arena champions/badasses (Paryl, Sujaal, ... ) or famous merchants (Pearl, Sargax, ... ) would also probably be pretty common, I'd expect.

Have their really been more Eunolis? I remember there was another Pearl while I was still around, but I always thought that was a fluke and not a character named after Pearl Terash.   Ironically, back when I was playing Pearl I took to carrying a silt pearl around to just absently hold when people started giving me a hassle about Pearl not being a good in-character name, and now I see it in a Zalanthan name thread. 

[Gimfalisette]

I know of one character who had Eunoli as a middle name, yes. I've never seen it (at least not yet!) as a first name for anyone but Eunoli herself, though.

[Fathi]

When I was playing a character that could be considered, I guess, relatively "well-known" and was fairly long-lived, somebody made a character with the same name as mine.

They even had a similar sdesc, which is very weird, because my character's sdesc was fairly unique.

It caused a lot of drama and people thought my character had been horribly mutilated when they contacted this person instead of her.

I dunno if it was done as a tribute or if it was just a fluke, but I found the whole thing hilarious.

[AmandaGreathouse]

When I was playing a character that could be considered, I guess, relatively "well-known" and was fairly long-lived, somebody made a character with the same name as mine.

They even had a similar sdesc, which is very weird, because my character's sdesc was fairly unique.

It caused a lot of drama and people thought my character had been horribly mutilated when they contacted this person instead of her.

I dunno if it was done as a tribute or if it was just a fluke, but I found the whole thing hilarious.

This one, except the mutilated part. It was pretty funny, both ICly and OOCly it led to a lot of laughs. 

[Delstro]

That could have been me. I stopped playing for 2 weeks until I came up with a character. I log in and someone has a near identical sdesc as me and they had my name. Wow. I killed my PC off.

[Kiri]

As long as the rule wasn't absolute, it might be cool.  I don't mind recycling PC names, but someone once ran a character with my GDB name which pissed me off.

There was once another Kiri IG, which I found amusing, as it wasn't me, though that was my first PC, a long time ago.

I think it might be interesting to compile a list of famous PC names (templars, merchants, etc) to offer to people. My grandfather's name was Woodrow Wilson Dunn, and my father was Perry Commodore (after Commodore Perry). My brother was named after the doctor who delivered him, both my daughters have middle names of a maternal grandmother.  It used to be traditional to name children after famous people just as much as after figures of royalty or in the Bible, and I suspect it would be similar in Zalanthas.

I would suggest it be optional, of course. And I also apologize for coming in waaaaay late, apparently, with things other people have been saying!


As for getting upset with people using a name you came up with... well, just for the record, sometimes it happens -completely- unintentionally. A bizarre and rare coincidence, to be sure, but it does happen.

Also, imitation is a form of flattery.  I quite unabashedly stole the name of a character in another MUD that I admired very much. Sadly, her namesake was a diva, and a drama queen, and a wild-tempered bitch. Thankfully she didn't last long!

[brytta.leofa]

I double-dog dare y'all to name a southern character after a famous northerner, or vice-versa.

[Kiri]

I double-dog dare y'all to name a southern character after a famous northerner, or vice-versa.

I swear I am going to name my PC's first child after a certain famous person in the other city-state.

[Gimfalisette]

I double-dog dare y'all to name a southern character after a famous northerner, or vice-versa.

Been done, you know that

[brytta.leofa]

The gruff, stubble-eyed templar asks you, in sirihish,
  "New recruits, eh, sergeant?"
You exclaim, barking out, in sirihish,
  "Recruits!  Fall in tight an' speak yer names for th' Lord Temp'ar!"
Gulping, the tall, muscular man exclaims, in sirihish,
  "Mukupet, Lord Templar!"
The rugged, avuncular male exclaims, in sirihish,
  "Winterthrall, Lord Templar!"
The eager, warbeaded lass exclaims, in sirihish,
  "Lyra Than, Lord Templar!"

The gruff, stubble-eyed templar just stares at you.

[FantasyWriter]

The gruff, stubble-eyed templar asks you, in sirihish,
  "New recruits, eh, sergeant?"
You exclaim, barking out, in sirihish,
  "Recruits!  Fall in tight an' speak yer names for th' Lord Temp'ar!"
Gulping, the tall, muscular man exclaims, in sirihish,
  "Mukupet, Lord Templar!"
The rugged, avuncular male exclaims, in sirihish,
  "Winterthrall, Lord Templar!"
The eager, warbeaded lass exclaims, in sirihish,
  "Lyra Than, Lord Templar!"

The gruff, stubble-eyed templar just stares at you.

That's hilarious!