Hxloo, I'y Jot.

[Nyard]

Translation:  Hello, I'm Jim.

What I was wondering is, when speaking in a language that my character isn't very good with, or that the listener isn't very good with, shouldn't there still be a way for them to clearly say their name, since names translate the same in all languages?  It's frustrating trying to say my name correctly if I'm talking in some other language.

[Mook]

Wonder if staff would make an exception to the no-emoted-speach rule, in the case of one-word introductions.

emote pointing to himself, the tanned, long-haired man says in tribal-accented sirihish, "Tarzan!"

[Jherlen]

There are ways to get around the language barrier, if your character thinks about it. (hint hint).

[Larrath]

Wonder if staff would make an exception to the no-emoted-speach rule, in the case of one-word introductions.

emote pointing to himself, the tanned, long-haired man says in tribal-accented sirihish, "Tarzan!"

Very doubtful, for reasons I won't go into.  Use a translator or the Way.

[Anael]

Or say the name several times in a row, there's a chance they'll get it sooner or later. It's perfectly IC, I believe, to have your name mangled by language misunderstanding.

Melchisidek : He wants to know your name.
Ahmed Ibn Fahdlan : My name is Ahmed Ibn Fahdlan Ibn Al Abbas Ibn Rashid Ibn Hamad.
Herger the Joyous : Eben?
Ahmed Ibn Fahdlan : No, listen, My name is Ahmed Ibn Fahdlan. "Ibn" means "son of".
[To the others]
Herger the Joyous : Eben.

[Ghost]

Use the way?

[Cenghiz]

My father's name is 'Ali'.. It's pronounced like 'AAlieh', at least this is close. But still, your pronouncation would be wrong, it would be wrong many times. That's why there are accents. People speak words differently, even when they know how it's written and called by people native to a language.
So a dwarf's telling you his name would be heard just like blubbering if you didn't hear a lot of dwarven names before. It's normal and I'm against passing the language barrier with something.

[JohnGalt]

Say the name in captial letters.  Capital letters seem to have a higher chance of translating properly.  If they can't understand you even with capital letters, I'd roleplay that you're accent is so difficult to understand for them that they just plain have no idea you're even giving them a name.

[Mean_Old_Bastard]

Or say the name several times in a row, there's a chance they'll get it sooner or later. It's perfectly IC, I believe, to have your name mangled by language misunderstanding.

Melchisidek : He wants to know your name.
Ahmed Ibn Fahdlan : My name is Ahmed Ibn Fahdlan Ibn Al Abbas Ibn Rashid Ibn Hamad.
Herger the Joyous : Eben?
Ahmed Ibn Fahdlan : No, listen, My name is Ahmed Ibn Fahdlan. "Ibn" means "son of".
[To the others]
Herger the Joyous : Eben.

What Anael said. Seconded.

[Sholdyn]

Say the name in captial letters. Capital letters seem to have a higher chance of translating properly. If they can't understand you even with capital letters, I'd roleplay that you're accent is so difficult to understand for them that they just plain have no idea you're even giving them a name.

Uncool man. That's just code abuse.

[lazycritic]

Shouldn't names sound the same regardless of language?

I mean, I don't translate my name to Spanish when I'm speaking Spanish. I just keep my old name.

For that reason, bypassing the language code to simply state a name should be acceptable. Also, revealing more about allundean could help people make real elven names.

[Sholdyn]

I disagree. Like was said before... Your name might be the same in all languages, but often people can't hear or pronounce a name properly if it's a different language. I know LOTS of people that can't get Asain names right, no matter how much they hear them.

[Marc]

And what name are you giving?  Your real one?  What if your name is Boot or Cloak?    Black or Scar?

While the idea has merit, there is absolutely no way of doing it without the language code being completely overhauled

[Angela Christine]

Sometimes the other person is incapable of hearing or pronouncing the name correctly, because the sound doesn't exist in their language, so they didn't learn it as a child and probably haven't studdied linguistics and phonetics since then.

Some people, perfectly normal people, can't hear or pronounce the difference between B and P.  Bot and Pot sound exactly the same to them.  Apparently the sounds are the same, except that P's are asperated and B's are not . . . or something like that.  You can feel the difference in air flow if you hold your hand in front of your mouth when you say them.  Other languages have more asperated sounds, and other differences in sounds like tone, that english ears can not detect or can not make sense of.  Apparently this is why some kinds of Chinese speach may sound angry to english people, even when they aren't angry, because if they changed to what a Canadian would consider a polite tone of voice it would actually change the meaning of the words.  We sort of have this in english, but on the sentance level rather than the word level, by going to a higher tone of voice at the end of a sentence you can change it from a statement into a question.  From "Bob is comming with me." to "Bob is comming with me?" though the tone of voice thing would be a cheat, you should really rearage the syntax to "Is Bob comming with me?" but people are lazy sometimes.  There is also the 'glottal stop' that isn't used much in english but is in some languages, right there in the middle of Batman, where the "t" should be but really isn't.   The "t" isn't silent, otherwise Batman would sound like a sheep superhero and he certainly isn't Baaaah Man, it's something else.


http://cla.calpoly.edu/~jrubba/phon/learnipa.html
http://cla.calpoly.edu/~jrubba/phon/ipafaq.html
These short pages show phonetic symbols for english and the very subtle difference between some sounds.  

If you can't _hear_ the sound you probably aren't going to be able to say the sound correctly.  No matter how many times that mantis tells you his name you will keep saying it incorrectly.




However, all of that has nothing to do with the real issue here, which is Keywords.  You're character is probably happy to keep calling that elf "longneck" or that Muark "damned gypsy" but you the player need to know how to correctly spell (but not pronounce) the name keyword, so that you don't have to keep targeting him with an sdesc keyword and accidentally refering to another "tall" or "brown" person in the room.  If not for keywords, would you really care what that half-breed bastard's name was?  Of course you wouldn't!   :twisted:  Normally I wouldn't be against using OOC means to solve what is essentially an OOC problem, but some people might be using that OOC problem to prevent another OOC problem from becoming an IC problem.  Suppose that elf doesn't really want to give the Templar his true name, so he gives a false name.  But the Templar goes "assess -v <name>" and immediatly knows it isn't really his true name because of the error message!  But with the language barrier intact, the Templar may not know for sure if the elf gave a false name, or if the the language code is mangling the translation so that the elf is giving the correct name but the Templar's player isn't getting the correct spelling.  You can't be certain if the other player is deliberately witholding the keyword or not.  On the other other hand (some people in Zalanthas can have more than two hands) deliberately withholding keywords is a little shady OOCly, since keywords are an OOC construct.
 So I just don't know.


Angela Christine

[JohnGalt]

I don't think the issue is being able to speak their name properly.  The issue, is being able to learn their name as a keyword so you don't talk to the other dark-skinned, bronw-eyed man standing next to them all day long.

Often times I use someone's name as a keyword, when ICly my character doesn't even know that persons name even though they speak the same language.  If you have a keyword in your sdesc that prevents confusions, then let people be confused as to what your name is, no problem here.

[Mean_Old_Bastard]

emo kicks ~3.man to drov with an ultra soccer kick of d00m

use target numbers. Its easy enough.

edit:

Oh, edited to add. The last object or person to enter a room gets to the top of the list.

Therefore, look man, will always look at the most recnetly arrives target with 'man' as a keyword.

So look 3.man if you and  a buddy (all man keywords) followed him into an empty room. That would look at the guy you followed.
It works well for me.

[Larrath]

You can't emote using a number modifier.
'emote looks up at ~3.man' will simply not work correctly, and numbers are also unreliable, especially with things like sneak.

Perhaps some 'identify' command, though even that looks a bit annoying.

Code Select Expand


> identify self Effmi
The petite woman whose chest isn't quite as petite points at herself and says, 'Effmi'.
Keyword added: 'Effmi'.  Current keywords: Amosetaella petite woman chest chesty curvaceous curvy breasts melon breasted heavy Effmi Dewmi Slaught.


[Mean_Old_Bastard]

http://www.zalanthas.org/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=14015&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=15
The thread right below this.

adding your own keywords could lead to code abuse.
having someone 'title' you, like a kank would work (although for that to save, that -woudl- entail extra coding)

[spawnloser]

Say the name in captial letters. Capital letters seem to have a higher chance of translating properly. If they can't understand you even with capital letters, I'd roleplay that you're accent is so difficult to understand for them that they just plain have no idea you're even giving them a name.

Uncool man. That's just code abuse.

Let's think about this, though.  When you type in all caps, what does that mean for your character?  Most, like in other non-game forums, would assume that your character is shouting.  Now, what do most Americans know to be fact?  That shouting slowly at someone makes them more likely to understand your speaking of a language they do not normally understand.

[Cuusardo]

The obnoxious, obsidian-skinned man exclaims, in sirihish, "DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE WORDS COMING OUT OF MY MOUTH?!"