Does sparring with a dummy improve skills any? Is it purely for roleplay or can you benefit off of sparring with one?
It can benefit when you're extremely unskilled, but rarely after a certain point. It is not a dependable training device in its current state.
Extremely unskilled being novice level?
You can gain some hidden offense punching it at low levels, too. When you miss that is a potential skillgain. Honestly though it is far superior to spar people or hunt animals. You are likely better to spend that time RPing for contacts than afk fighting some dummy, unless you are stuck there due to chores.
Find an AI elf to train on,
If you can hit it and it can't hit you, you aren't training well.
Yes there are coded benefits to training with a dummy, no it is not just for RP purposes. The benefits come primarily while at "novice" of whatever skill you're trying to improve. Remember there are several coded combat skills that -can- improve, and not all of them show up on your skills list (coded offense, as someone already mentioned). Also remember don't try to kick or backstab or sap the dummy unless your clan docs/employer PC say you can.
I do not see why using -kick- on the dummy would be frowned upon.
I think it's because the coded echos associated with kick imply a living breathing person on the receiving end.
Sweet, thanks for the replies everyone.
Quote from: Jave on December 24, 2015, 06:33:36 PM
I think it's because the coded echos associated with kick imply a living breathing person on the receiving end.
If you kick a dummy hard enough it'll break. It's got coded "broken dummy sawdust leakage" built right in as a reminder that you're not supposed to do that.
So...
Kick it as much as you want.
Exactly.
Quote from: Lizzie on December 24, 2015, 10:05:39 PM
Quote from: Jave on December 24, 2015, 06:33:36 PM
I think it's because the coded echos associated with kick imply a living breathing person on the receiving end.
If you kick a dummy hard enough it'll break. It's got coded "broken dummy sawdust leakage" built right in as a reminder that you're not supposed to do that.
I guess in that case the reason you aren't supposed to kick it is because your Sgt will beat your ass for breaking training gear.
Quote from: Jave on December 24, 2015, 10:47:06 PM
Quote from: Lizzie on December 24, 2015, 10:05:39 PM
Quote from: Jave on December 24, 2015, 06:33:36 PM
I think it's because the coded echos associated with kick imply a living breathing person on the receiving end.
If you kick a dummy hard enough it'll break. It's got coded "broken dummy sawdust leakage" built right in as a reminder that you're not supposed to do that.
I guess in that case the reason you aren't supposed to kick it is because your Sgt will beat your ass for breaking training gear.
At one point the staff saw that people were ignoring the echoes and continuing to kick the dummy, and they removed it from the training area and told the clan leader PC that he'd have to order another one from Salarr, because it was broken beyond repair. Suffice it to say the rest of the crew wasn't happy, they were still required to attend training, but no longer had a dummy to train with when no one else was around. It was a couple of RL months before it was returned the sparring area, IIRC.
Quote from: Professional on December 23, 2015, 10:35:22 PM
Does sparring with a dummy improve skills any? Is it purely for roleplay or can you benefit off of sparring with one?
"If your character has some basic knowledge of a skill or spell (i.e., if it appears in your 'skills' list), then it will improve by doing it over and over again. When you fail in an attempt to use a skill or spell, there is a chance it will improve. "
A sparring dummy happens to be -really- easy to hit though.
About kicking a dummy
You're going to let a half-giant hit at it with bone weapons, but not let an elf kick at it? Because it will break it?
The first response Jave gave makes more sense.
It's shitty that the code hasn't been fixed to represent the kinds of targets we are actually kicking though.
Or just mention how hard we kick that way it doesn't need to be specific. We can do the emoting.
Quote from: Medivh on December 24, 2015, 11:43:06 PM
Quote from: Professional on December 23, 2015, 10:35:22 PM
Does sparring with a dummy improve skills any? Is it purely for roleplay or can you benefit off of sparring with one?
"If your character has some basic knowledge of a skill or spell (i.e., if it appears in your 'skills' list), then it will improve by doing it over and over again. When you fail in an attempt to use a skill or spell, there is a chance it will improve. "
A sparring dummy happens to be -really- easy to hit though.
About kicking a dummy
You're going to let a half-giant hit at it with bone weapons, but not let an elf kick at it? Because it will break it?
The first response Jave gave makes more sense.
It's shitty that the code hasn't been fixed to represent the kinds of targets we are actually kicking though.
Or just mention how hard we kick that way it doesn't need to be specific. We can do the emoting.
It -will- break it. I'm not talking ICly. I'm talking codedly. It is coded so that if you kick it hard enough it will start to leak, and eventually it will break.
Another question since you're all still here...
Regarding skills I have no clue about. Say I had no skill in piercing (it doesn't show up in my skill list). If I constantly work with piercing weapons, will it ever show up in my skill list, or am I bound to the skills I start with as a character?
That's pretty stupid considering you beat the hell out of them with training weapons all the time. The dummy SHOULD break eventually, and more SHOULD have to be ordered. That's reality.
Quote from: Professional on December 25, 2015, 12:18:13 AM
Another question since you're all still here...
Regarding skills I have no clue about. Say I had no skill in piercing (it doesn't show up in my skill list). If I constantly work with piercing weapons, will it ever show up in my skill list, or am I bound to the skills I start with as a character?
You will never branch a weapon skill as a class that doesnt get it.
Excluding advanced ones as warrior.
Quote from: Jihelu on December 25, 2015, 12:40:35 AM
Quote from: Professional on December 25, 2015, 12:18:13 AM
Another question since you're all still here...
Regarding skills I have no clue about. Say I had no skill in piercing (it doesn't show up in my skill list). If I constantly work with piercing weapons, will it ever show up in my skill list, or am I bound to the skills I start with as a character?
You will never branch a weapon skill as a class that doesnt get it.
Excluding advanced ones as warrior.
What about skills that are not weapon skills?
Quote from: Professional on December 25, 2015, 12:49:29 AM
Quote from: Jihelu on December 25, 2015, 12:40:35 AM
Quote from: Professional on December 25, 2015, 12:18:13 AM
Another question since you're all still here...
Regarding skills I have no clue about. Say I had no skill in piercing (it doesn't show up in my skill list). If I constantly work with piercing weapons, will it ever show up in my skill list, or am I bound to the skills I start with as a character?
You will never branch a weapon skill as a class that doesnt get it.
Excluding advanced ones as warrior.
What about skills that are not weapon skills?
There is one exception, being Pilot I THINK!, but other than that nope.
Quote from: Professional on December 25, 2015, 12:18:13 AM
Another question since you're all still here...
Regarding skills I have no clue about. Say I had no skill in piercing (it doesn't show up in my skill list). If I constantly work with piercing weapons, will it ever show up in my skill list, or am I bound to the skills I start with as a character?
It doesn't really work that way, but no, you're not bound to the skills you start out with. You get those skills. With use of THOSE skills, you will eventually "branch" new skills that are part of the overall "skill tree" of that guild (or class, or profession, in other games). Example
Weapons:
piercing [novice]
(and no other weapon types)
Two-handed [advanced]
And maybe if you try two piercing weapons, one in one hand, one in the other hand, with all your practice you might eventually "branch" the backstab skill. Then, you'll see:
Weapons:
piercing [journeyman] backstab [novice]
Two-handed [master]
That isn't the actual progression you should expect, but rather the general idea of how progression works in the game.
Pilot is an exception, as noted above. There might be one or two other skills that will show up on your skills list just by using them. But weapon skills are not among those. Weapon skills will either come with your "starting" list of skills, or branch from the advancement of your starting skills. But that's only for guilds that have weapon skills. Some do not.
AKA:
Merchants suck shit at weapons using them will not help you.
Though they will raise your super sekret offense/defense stats but thats another thing, not a skill.
Quote from: Professional on December 25, 2015, 12:18:13 AM
Another question since you're all still here...
Regarding skills I have no clue about. Say I had no skill in piercing (it doesn't show up in my skill list). If I constantly work with piercing weapons, will it ever show up in my skill list, or am I bound to the skills I start with as a character?
Ride, Pilot, Accents, and Languages are the exceptions to this. I think that's it?
Quote from: Medivh on December 25, 2015, 02:32:00 AM
Quote from: Professional on December 25, 2015, 12:18:13 AM
Another question since you're all still here...
Regarding skills I have no clue about. Say I had no skill in piercing (it doesn't show up in my skill list). If I constantly work with piercing weapons, will it ever show up in my skill list, or am I bound to the skills I start with as a character?
Ride, Pilot, Accents, and Languages are the exceptions to this. I think that's it?
I didn't think you could get ride like that?
Kick is fine to use against sparring bags. I just loaded up Red Storm East's worst nightmare and let it kick a dummy for 10~ minutes. Backstab, sap, throw, and archery are the skills that should be avoided on dummies, and the latter two can be practiced on archery dummies.
Quote from: Akariel on December 25, 2015, 03:40:11 AM
Kick is fine to use against sparring bags. I just loaded up Red Storm East's worst nightmare and let it kick a dummy for 10~ minutes. Backstab, sap, throw, and archery are the skills that should be avoided on dummies, and the latter two can be practiced on archery dummies.
What happens if you sap or backstab a dummy?
Can't copy and paste from my phone, but it sends a message to staff saying X player is doing Y, then stops the player from doing it.
Also using weapons on a merchant will improve your pc in combat although not as fast or noticeably as having the skill. Jihelu is incorrect.
Thanks for confirming about the kick Ak.
Quote from: Inks on December 25, 2015, 06:41:56 AM
Also using weapons on a merchant will improve your pc in combat although not as fast or noticeably as having the skill. Jihelu is incorrect.
Thanks for confirming about the kick Ak.
You can also practice kick, backstab, throw and archery skills on a merchant, especially if it's a PC merchant you're attacking.
Quote from: Inks on December 25, 2015, 06:41:56 AM
Also using weapons on a merchant will improve your pc in combat although not as fast or noticeably as having the skill. Jihelu is incorrect.
Thanks for confirming about the kick Ak.
I'm 38% sure that it will only increase your muh sekret offense and defense and even your even more sekret skills im not sure I can talk about or maybe I'm just full of shit but for actually coded skills like "Hey I'm master at piercing" it shouldn't do shit.
Quote from: Bushranger on December 25, 2015, 08:21:26 AM
Quote from: Inks on December 25, 2015, 06:41:56 AM
Also using weapons on a merchant will improve your pc in combat although not as fast or noticeably as having the skill. Jihelu is incorrect.
Thanks for confirming about the kick Ak.
You can also practice kick, backstab, throw and archery skills on a merchant, especially if it's a PC merchant you're attacking.
I liked the double meaning. This too!
So in the end, sparring with another PC is leagues more effective than sparring with a dummy? And that after novice level, sparring with a dummy is near pointless?
Yep.
So how long does it usually take to move a skill from novice level to apprentice (I am assuming that is the level above novice). I just want to know that its not going to take an unbelievably long period of time for me to hold some sway in the tough world of Arm.
Also are new players limited to the very basic character creation or is it possible for a new player to have a special application for a character to be accepted?
You can special app as a newbie. I recommend playing three or four PCs before you spec app for something like an elementalist, though.
It depends entirel yon the skill. Some take longer. Some don't.
Quote from: Professional on December 26, 2015, 05:01:51 AM
So how long does it usually take to move a skill from novice level to apprentice (I am assuming that is the level above novice). I just want to know that its not going to take an unbelievably long period of time for me to hold some sway in the tough world of Arm.
Also are new players limited to the very basic character creation or is it possible for a new player to have a special application for a character to be accepted?
The actual mechanics of the code are intentionally obscured to players. There are also a LOT of variables that determine when you get your skill bump, even if the formula itself is the same from one character to the next. Examples of things to consider:
1. How often do you fail in a single session of trying?
2. Is it a combat, craft, magick, or auxilliary skill?
3. What's your character's location when working on the skill in question? (a crafting hall in a clan compound will be most likely to give you some kind of benefit that crafting in the middle of Stonecarver's Road won't give you)
4. Are there any impedements for your character? Is he standing/laying in bed drunk/sober spiced up/sober at a significant bloodloss/healthy poisoned/healthy wearing armor/wearing sandcloth armed/unarmed buffed with magicks/not buffed etc. etc. Depending on which skill you're trying to improve upon, any of these variables can impede or boost your success rate.
That being said, what Saellyn said: that some skills take longer and some don't, applies. Basically, you'll be -capable- of all your starting skills from the get-go. Some of them will start at apprentice, so they already come with a "skill bump" built right into the class. Most start at "novice" and the psionic skill "contact" now starts at "master.
How long it takes from novice to bump to apprentice depends on the skill and how it's used. Certain skills are intended to take awhile (weeks) to get better for the "average" player with average play-times (a couple hours a day that gets divided into use of skills and doing non-skilled RP stuff). Other skills might show an improvement in just a few days. All of them seem to have a plateau, where you think it just won't go anywhere, and then, when you're the most frustrated - boom - you get the bump.
Sure you could have a special app, but if you don't know the game world very well, it's kind of pointless. Two reasons:
1. whatever specialty you're trying to include is more likely to be rejected - it's harder to intentionally diverge from the norm in a way that makes your character believable to others, if you don't know what the norm is.
2. characters of newer players are typically shorter-lived than characters of players who've been around awhile. It'd be a shame to waste a special app on a character that ends up dead in a few hours because the rest of the game world reacted to your special character's specialness.
Quote from: Professional on December 26, 2015, 05:01:51 AM
So how long does it usually take to move a skill from novice level to apprentice (I am assuming that is the level above novice). I just want to know that its not going to take an unbelievably long period of time for me to hold some sway in the tough world of Arm.
Also some skills are stuck at novice (such as analyze), weapon skills are much tougher to advance than other skills (even apprentice level in a weapon skill means you're highly skilled), some skills have guild-dependent maximums, and it's much more effective to train some stealth skills with a group than by yourself.
The real secret to skilling up, especially when you're new, is to not die. Watch out for falls, and solicit advice before you set out in any unfamiliar direction. It can also be tempting to try to hunt increasingly dangerous prey in search of greater challenge for your character, but nothing will kill you faster. Practice escaping instead of killing.
Quote from: CodeMaster on December 26, 2015, 12:37:34 PMeven apprentice level in a weapon skill means you're highly skilled
(http://cdn.smosh.com/sites/default/files/ftpuploads/bloguploads/laughing-gifs-old-timey.gif)
More helpfully, weapon skills are tough to raise correctly (and I hope that gets looked at) but apprentice weapon skill is definitely not "highly skilled" heh.
All you really need to know for the basics of skilling up is right there in the helpfiles - skills improve upon failures. Get a few failures per training session. Then go kick your heels up and enjoy interacting or doing whatever else you'd like to do. It's very easy to work into believable daily roleplay without getting silly.
Weapon skills aren't just tough to raise correctly, they're slow to raise in general. However... If you want your character to be competent, you only need survive for a while. Hardly anyone gets above journeyman in weapon skills before they die or store. So even though weapon skills are hard to increase, it doesn't really matter, for 80% of the playerbase.
There's a small subset of veterans though, who know how to survive and do well, and game the code to get everything beneficial. They have been alive for real-life years, you will never be stronger than them as a mundane. You might as well just wait for them to die as well.
Or you could just play a mage, and obliterate those long-lived characters who took real-life years to branch an advanced weapon skill. And you could do it in the blink of an eye after 10 days played.
Quote from: Delirium on December 26, 2015, 01:05:06 PM
Quote from: CodeMaster on December 26, 2015, 12:37:34 PMeven apprentice level in a weapon skill means you're highly skilled
More helpfully, weapon skills are tough to raise correctly (and I hope that gets looked at) but apprentice weapon skill is definitely not "highly skilled" heh.
At the high end of apprentice you'll stop missing most creatures. I wouldn't call someone out for claiming to be pretty competent with a high-end apprentice weapon skill. If they're a hunter, they've got what they need.
Ooooookay, we're getting into territory we need to stay out of guys. Let's not discuss what weapon skill is "adequate" (but it's called apprentice for a reason).
Thanks for all of the answers, everyone. I really appreciate it.
Now, another question :)
How often do story tellers interact with the players of Arm? There is one instance that I have actually noticed a storyteller in the room with me, but surely they are there more often than that right? Or is it a rare thing to actually have one deepening the immersion?
Quote from: Professional on December 27, 2015, 08:46:07 PM
Thanks for all of the answers, everyone. I really appreciate it.
Now, another question :)
How often do story tellers interact with the players of Arm? There is one instance that I have actually noticed a storyteller in the room with me, but surely they are there more often than that right? Or is it a rare thing to actually have one deepening the immersion?
If you're talking about SandyClaws the Githmas Mantis, then it's a once-a-year occasion. Another occasion, though I think they missed this year, was the Thanksgiving turkey that came a'gobble-gobblin around the game-world.
This is generally the only time you will ever see a storyteller animate something that doesn't belong in the gameworld. You shouldn't ever see a storyteller as themselves. In other words - you won't (or shouldn't) ever see Adhira show up in the Gaj, or Nessalin pass you under the Span.
You might see an animated gith, or an animated bartender, or you might run into some random tall handsome muscular man that shows up with some kind of plot-starting news. But all of those are "normal" things to see in the game. You wouldn't treat them like storytellers, you'd treat them like gith, bartenders, and tall handsome muscular men.
That's what I was speaking of. There has only been once instance when I knew it wasn't a regular PC, but a storyteller animating another character.
In general, each Storyteller is assigned to a couple of clans to oversee. For example, I'm in charge of the T'zai Byn, and the Sun Runners.
Whenever I'm online I monitor those two clans (meaning I see every thought/say/tell/emote/etc done by any character in those clans). Once I'm finished manually ignoring the people having mudsex I keep an eye out for opportunities to jump in and animate for the people who are out doing stuff.
Sometimes that animation takes the form of a pack of raptors to breathe life into how pack hunters behave.
Sometimes that animation takes the form of a sandstorm to breathe life into how harsh the weather conditions actually are.
Sometimes that animation takes the form of a bartender having a bit of banter back and forth with the clientele.
Sometimes that animation takes the form of a medic babbling on about his life story while patching up a Runner after a job.
But if you are playing an Indy character who is not affiliated with any clans and you don't communicate with us thru character reports to let us know that you're up to something, it's easy for you to slip through the cracks. If you'd like more Storyteller attention and your character has something they want to try and do that requires staff support, the best way to make sure you get it is by giving us character reports about your activity and letting us know what you're up to and what you'd like from us.
I've worked with communicative Indy characters in the past to push stories forward, so I'm always game to help.
Quote from: Lizzie on December 27, 2015, 08:56:19 PM
Quote from: Professional on December 27, 2015, 08:46:07 PM
Thanks for all of the answers, everyone. I really appreciate it.
Now, another question :)
How often do story tellers interact with the players of Arm? There is one instance that I have actually noticed a storyteller in the room with me, but surely they are there more often than that right? Or is it a rare thing to actually have one deepening the immersion?
If you're talking about SandyClaws the Githmas Mantis, then it's a once-a-year occasion. Another occasion, though I think they missed this year, was the Thanksgiving turkey that came a'gobble-gobblin around the game-world.
I -knew- that was a thing! I even loaded up the turkey - But no one else remembered and they told me not to bring it around for some delicious treats. :c
Quote from: Jave on December 27, 2015, 09:48:30 PM
In general, each Storyteller is assigned to a couple of clans to oversee. For example, I'm in charge of the T'zai Byn, and the Sun Runners.
Whenever I'm online I monitor those two clans (meaning I see every thought/say/tell/emote/etc done by any character in those clans). Once I'm finished manually ignoring the people having mudsex I keep an eye out for opportunities to jump in and animate for the people who are out doing stuff.
Sometimes that animation takes the form of a pack of raptors to breathe life into how pack hunters behave.
Sometimes that animation takes the form of a sandstorm to breathe life into how harsh the weather conditions actually are.
Sometimes that animation takes the form of a bartender having a bit of banter back and forth with the clientele.
Sometimes that animation takes the form of a medic babbling on about his life story while patching up a Runner after a job.
But if you are playing an Indy character who is not affiliated with any clans and you don't communicate with us thru character reports to let us know that you're up to something, it's easy for you to slip through the cracks. If you'd like more Storyteller attention and your character has something they want to try and do that requires staff support, the best way to make sure you get it is by giving us character reports about your activity and letting us know what you're up to and what you'd like from us.
I've worked with communicative Indy characters in the past to push stories forward, so I'm always game to help.
Okay. Guess I'll just need to pay more attention for you guys :) Thanks for the answer.
EDIT by Jave: Just fixed your quote for you ;)