Armageddon MUD General Discussion Board

General => Roleplaying Discussion => Topic started by: Sliptippy on December 14, 2002, 05:31:36 PM

Title: Northern Ideals
Post by: Sliptippy on December 14, 2002, 05:31:36 PM
I've been thinking about this alot.  A simple discussion developed oocly about how do northerners view everyone else.  I post this because I'd like to have some feedback regarding the northern world view.

In the ooc discussion, there were some points made.  Maybe someone in the know can address them and clarify beyond the in game documentation?  Also, how significant is the liberation of Tuluk in the mind-set of the average (pick any race) Tuluki?

First, how do northerners see southerners?  Especially southern ex-patriots? There's an influx of southerners in Tuluk and it seems to be a faux pas not being chummy with them.   For rp purposes, a player would want to interact with them.  The docs refer to Tuluk having high resentments for Southerners.  Would it be fesible for a player character to reflect this in their role-play?  

Next point: Northern view on the races.
This was the next subject.  The in game docs refer to the general view on how races are seen.  Is there or will there be documentation available on how the races are seen with a northern flair?  How distinctive will Tuluk from Allanak?  

There are some odd looking tribals around Tuluk and I am thinking that they're not human, per se.  They seem to occupy the position of pseudo-guards, if I am correct.  These used to be folks from the rebellion.  Is there more of a cosmopolitan feel for Tuluk in the works?

Again an example: Around the region of Gol Krathu, a sizable number of urban elves have developed into a significant portion of the population.  Since the Liberation, the urban elven popualtion has been remembered for certain espionage and general annoyances to Allanaki oppressors.  While certainly not fully trusted, after all they are still seen as scheming, lying longnecks, the human Tuluki popualtion sees them as 'thier' longnecks and generally not lumped togather with elves outside of Tuluk, which of course are good for nothing, scheming, lying longnecks.

The above is an example but in the blurb it gives a small racial history, Tuluki history and identifies who sees whom as what.    

Alright, post away.  I'm curious as to how players and imms see this.
Title: Northern Ideals
Post by: Fedaykin on December 14, 2002, 05:59:45 PM
Personally, I think Northerners are going to view nearly all Southerners with initial skepticism or distrust, especially Allanakis, while Stormers and the like would probably be less so.  However, I also think that surviving rebels would hold and perhaps spread the view, given that there were Southerners in the Rebellion, that often some of the most anti-Allanaki people were those who lived there and endurred the tyranny of the Highlord's government.  Typically though, I think its going to come down to your character's personality and views, as well as who the Southerner is, rather then a generalized population wide attitude.  Thats just my opinion though.

   With regard to races, I believe Northerners might be more accepting of other races and groups given the wide variety of people who had to come together to liberate the land and the fact that tribals and mutants reside in the city.  However, I by no means believe that all of the races are going to get along perfectly or trust eachother completely.

   In many ways, I feel that since it has only been 13 or so years since the war, alot of the Tuluki population's attitudes, beliefs and such as a whole are and should still be developing.
Title: Northern Ideals
Post by: Anonymous on December 15, 2002, 11:19:26 AM
It's unthinkable to me that any northern born and bred citizen would trust *any* southerner.  Other than the relations the Byn and the merchant houses (all neutral organizations) have, all other southern people would be viewed with distaste and more often than not, loathing.  Think about it, you're suddenly free after being born in captivity under the Dragon's rule and suddenly all these southerners start coming in and just getting hired by Houses and the Legions and good 'ole northern boys and gals... how realistic is it to open your arms and embrace your enemy's son or daughter?  Not at all I think.  The north and the south are very different and the north is rebuilding, it hasn't even been 20 years since the liberation. Everyone remembers when they are wronged and Tuluk and it's citizens are certainly no different.

In my mind's eye Tuluki hates Allanak and Allanak wants Tuluk. Plain and simple. Why the feck would you trust?

It would have to take a huge life altering experience to justify
Title: Northern Ideals
Post by: Fedaykin on December 15, 2002, 02:29:55 PM
I don't think you can use the terms Tuluki/Allanaki interchageably with Northern/Southern any longer.

Without getting into specifics, I will also point out that one of the largest groups making up the Rebellion was a group of Southern outlaws some of whom who no doubt would have settled in Tuluk after the victory.  There were also Southerners in the high command, and I believe these sorts of things would be known to the Tuluki population at large given that those who remained would be full of stories about such things.  All Tuluki's would know that it was not just "good 'ole Northern boys and gals" who liberated the land.

Also, it often has been the templarate, the voice of the Sun King himself, who has welcomed Southerners of various sorts, and I think that alone would greatly influence alot of citizens' thinking.  As such, I am forced to disagree with your sweeping analysis.

I do also, however, disagree that all Northerners would lump the Byn and merchant houses into the category of "all neutral organizations" given the history of certain organization's actions in the North.

What happened to your character during the occupation?  Was he/she simply forced to endure a foreign rule?  Was her/his parents murdered by Allanakis?  Did you lose family in the war?  Endure oppresively harsh conditions?  What does your character know about the liberation and those who brought it about?

The answers to these questions are going to determine where your character falls upon a spectrum of trust, not some broad generalization.
Title: The hate should run strong
Post by: witchman on December 19, 2002, 09:42:44 AM
It seems to me that anyone not openly supporting the Northern government would be looked at with skepticism and distrust in the north.  By North I mean Tuluki.

If we take RL for an example there is still a level of distrust and skepticism between north and south in America.  How much more so twenty years after a terrible war like that which was between Allanak and Tuluk.

I swear, all y'll northern's are dumb feks anyway.  ;-)  You're lucky we all let ya go!
Title: ...
Post by: Carnage on December 28, 2002, 11:07:45 AM
In general, my current Northerner sees the Naki like a tribe of barbarians. They have public executions, while in the north, someone would just disappear. Everyone is scared of Tektolnes's watchful eyes in the form of the templarate. Notice up north how you see a lot less templar NPCs?

My character further sees Tektolnes as wishy-washy and rules by his whims. One day he wakes up and deems something illegal for whatever reason. Our great triumverate, however, keeps things balanced and justified within their civilized delegations.

Basically, you Allanak chumps are low-brow barbarians. The first few times I saw templars in the North, I stared at my screen and said, 'What the hell is this? These aren't templars! These are wimps! BASH SOME GODDAMN SKULLS IN!'. There really is a huge difference between the two cities that you'll see once you play a Northerner.
Title: Northern Ideals
Post by: Delirium on December 28, 2002, 02:56:36 PM
That reminds me of one thing I've been wondering about. What's the proper thing to do when you see a Templar in the north vs. south? Nod, bow, scrunch down in your seat and hope they don't notice you? I've heard of people being arrested for not bowing, yet when I've seen templars in the north, a polite nod or nothing at all seems to do the trick.

If it's too IC, whack me and I'll reread the helpfiles, but that little distinction was never really too clear to me.

I do like how in the North, you call them 'Chosen Lady/Lord' and in the south, it's just 'Lady/Lord'.
Title: Northern Ideals
Post by: Fedaykin on December 28, 2002, 03:31:37 PM
Hmm, I don't want to get too specific, but I think the bowing wave effect where everyone rises bows and sits down is extremely ridiculous even in Allanak, and more so in Tuluk.  However, sadly, I have started to see this happen on multiple occasions in Tuluk.

Of course you want to be respectful, but in this regard Tuluk will not be as harsh as Allanak.  I would say to perhaps save the flourishing bows at the waist, if thats your thing, until you actually come before a templar or noble, and not do it everytime one walks into a room.
Title: Northern Ideals
Post by: creeper386 on December 28, 2002, 03:55:09 PM
Yeah, I'd say things are alittle looser then in Allanak but if you come are approaching or being approached by a templar I would still think I bow would be appropriate.

I'd also like to say again, I think I've said it before, that often then not if your character doesn't have extraordinary senses to know when a templar enters the room, you tend not to be punished if you play it realistically. People say that you'd see everyone bowing even if you didn't see the templar himself. Like it'd be said before, if every bowed to a templar when they saw one they'd never get anything done, especially in Allanak where being a templar seems to be ALL the craze.

Also, for PC templars at least, don't know about the Imm run NPCs but wouldnt' doubt they'd be much different, they tend to be pretty good with acctually RPing things out, even to the point of not killing more often then killing. Thats just my experience at least.

Title: Northern Ideals
Post by: aeshyw on December 28, 2002, 04:01:41 PM
I'm not certain about rules in the north, but I think that in the south, if a noble -wishes- for everyone to acknowledge their rank and stature, they should have a servant or retainer announce their presence upon entering a room.  

That said, even if they don't, its up to the individual to decide if they saw the personage enter, and if so, if they wish to risk being seen as insolent if they chose not to acknowledge them.
Title: Northern Ideals
Post by: Carnage on December 28, 2002, 04:21:10 PM
From what I've observed, a nod of respect or a bow of the head is all right to a Northern templar. But that's from what I've observed, and I could be wrong.

Due to the war, the North isn't as strict as they once were. As such, it's not as strict with nobility and the templarate. I interpret that to mean you can be friends with a noble, as long as you know your place and don't get ahead of yourself.

In general, I think of the North as a parallel to our middle ages. I'd consider the destruction from the war/occupation of Allanak forces to be the Dark Ages, and the reconstruction afterwards to be like the Renaissance.
Title: RE: Bowing in Tuluk
Post by: Elzocone on December 28, 2002, 04:26:05 PM
Quote from: "Delirium"
That reminds me of one thing I've been wondering about. What's the proper thing to do when you see a Templar in the north vs. south? Nod, bow, scrunch down in your seat and hope they don't notice you? I've heard of people being arrested for not bowing, yet when I've seen templars in the north, a polite nod or nothing at all seems to do the trick.

If you're in the north and you want to show some respect, put your money where your mouth is.  Give them a couple thousand coins.  Then they'll know you aren't just paying them lip service.

This is kind of said in jest but it doesn't make it less true.  I think that the powers that be in the north are more pragmatic (than their southern couterparts, generaly speaking) and more interested in merit and good works than trivial things like, who bowed to who and who didn't.  They know who is in charge (and it isn't you :) !), they don't need to be constantly reminded with bows and other possibly insincere gestures.

But you never know, some of them might like to be bowed to.  When in doubt you should ask or fail on the side of caution and bow (or give them your coins :wink:) until you're told not to.

But that's just this guy's opinion.