Armageddon General Discussion Board

So, in RL, if you've ever picked rocks in a farmers field, if you've ever picked berries or fruit in the hot sun, if you've ever split a brush cord of firewood or dug up dinosaur bones in the desert, weigh in!

I think foraging should be way harder than walking, I vote five points per attempt. Hard work in the hot sun is hard and hot.

Five, as well.

Dwarves, muls, and giants should be at 2, to reflect being either bred for work, or simply possessing natural endurance, which led to them being prized slaves over the Ages.

I wouldn't change this.  The way stamina regen and foraging work (i.e. randomized list) already make foraging for shit pretty god damn annoying, even as a maxed ranger.

Doing it over and over again, I imagine, is symbolism enough for how tired someone gets.
We all know you forage until you've got like fifty stamina left or less, am I right?

In a way it's time appropriate.

I only forage until I'm exactly at the point where my stamina will be at its non-sleep maximum when I rest, so if I have to flee, I'll have the maximum amount of available stamina points.

#experience

Hard labor is hard.  The action of picking up one rock that you probably don't even want is not particularly hard within context of hard physical work.  I've worked manual labor jobs, and if I stopped after every twenty tiny tasks (100 stam by your count) to take a little doze, I'd have been fired on the first day.  

Your idea is already implemented in that 5 stamina will be deducted for every group of 5 forage attempts, and you'll often need at least that many to find anything good.  "Hard labor is hard" is not in any way an argument that this particular ratio is off, it's an argument against a zero stamina cost, which is not what we have.

I voted leave it at one.  As others have noted, the real hit comes in needing multiple attempts to, maybe, find what you're looking for.  Add to that the frustration of, "Oh look, I found a piece of granite - crap it's the only piece of granite in the entire of this rocky inhospitable rock-strewn lanscape, means the real hassle of foraging is the OOC commitment to burn through half-an-hour grebbing.  If you cut the number of potential successes in half or less?  There is no need to forage, it's a boring activity for a player with a more boring trudge to rest and sit thrown in.

Since I think foraging should only use the command when the idea is simply picking something up off the ground, and deposits should be used for anything involving actual digging, hacking, hoeing, chopping, etc, I changed my vote to leaving it where it is. Initially, I voted 5.

I accidentally posted in the other thread, but I think forage delay should be increased, not necessarily the stamina cost.  That's just me inserting an unpopular idea though.

I'm fine with one because real work doesn't exhaust you, after the first three days. The environmental cost is borne by dehydration. Sitting down at smoko breaks three times a day should be enough to replenish you.

5 stamina = Forage (Novice)
3 Stamina = Forage (Journeyman)
2 Stamina = Forage (Advanced+)

When you're new to foraging, you honestly have no idea wtf you're looking for or how you're going to really gather it, adequately. As you start to train your eye/hands to see/feel out the necessary things, it takes less time/effort. As you're really getting good at it, you can stroll through an area, size up everything you can use, and hardly break a sweat gathering it up.

Foraging isn't really something I'd class as hard labour.  You just kinda walk around until you find something, then put it in a bag.

While this is maybe realistic, I have to kind of return to what I said in another foraging thread in that you can't really set the bar for things in accordance to who has the very most time to play Armageddon.

There are plenty of players that don't have hours and hours and hours every day to sit there spamming forage, which honestly is tedious enough in itself, because when I'm sitting there doing that I'm not roleplaying and interacting and definitely not having fun.

That's enough of a time penalty for me, thank you. The only way I'd agree with this sort of thing was if the productivity ramped up to match the stamina expenditure.

Quote from: Gunnerblaster on June 20, 2015, 03:31:15 AM
5 stamina = Forage (Novice)
3 Stamina = Forage (Journeyman)
2 Stamina = Forage (Advanced+)

When you're new to foraging, you honestly have no idea wtf you're looking for or how you're going to really gather it, adequately. As you start to train your eye/hands to see/feel out the necessary things, it takes less time/effort. As you're really getting good at it, you can stroll through an area, size up everything you can use, and hardly break a sweat gathering it up.

The point is, you are breaking a sweat now, and the more inefficient you are, the more sweat you break before you fill your bag.

Quote from: roughneck on June 19, 2015, 09:15:55 AMI think foraging should be way harder than walking, I vote five points per attempt. Hard work in the hot sun is hard and hot.

In theory I agree. However there's a variable you need to look at which is obsidian mining. This costs X stamina and yet requires no skill to use. Foraging on the other hand requires skill, and has pre and post delays. If foraging uses as much stamina as mining obsidian and also requires you to have it at Y level before it's as useful as mining, than you're overpenalising it. The delay may (or may not) cause further penalisation as well.

Quote from: Gunnerblaster on June 20, 2015, 03:31:15 AM
5 stamina = Forage (Novice)
3 Stamina = Forage (Journeyman)
2 Stamina = Forage (Advanced+)

When you're new to foraging, you honestly have no idea wtf you're looking for or how you're going to really gather it, adequately. As you start to train your eye/hands to see/feel out the necessary things, it takes less time/effort. As you're really getting good at it, you can stroll through an area, size up everything you can use, and hardly break a sweat gathering it up.

Getting a better return on investment at a higher skill level is already fully represented in forage success rate. 

In game design it's generally a poor idea to go down the road of doubly or triply representing the same observation in game mechanics.  We know that a good forager gets objects more efficiently than a poor one.  Currently that is reflected by success rate.  We could represent that observation with a higher stamina cost, but in that case, we would want to standardize the success rate across all forage attempts since players are already paying for their poor skill in the form of stamina.  Doing both makes the system increasingly opaque even to the staff maintaining it, making it increasingly difficult to balance or debug, and tends to over-represent the observation you're trying to reflect in game.

Fine how it is.

I see no reason to nerf grebbing. Grebbing is not OP. It seems to work fine how it is.