...Oh boy. More from Dr. J....
My issue:
I'm an old man without that much time for games. There are times I want to play non-ranger outdoorsmen. Very recently, I've been toying with Assassin/Hunters. I like storms, I like getting lost in storms. I like the struggle for survival that comes from getting lost in a storm, losing your mount and falling off the shield wall ;). What I don't like - is being stuck with an immobile character in a storm for 6 hours.
My solution:
Allow non-rangers to quit in the desert at the expense of most of their HP + Stam.
Exiting the game:
100hp 100mv 100st> Quit
You leave the game and struggle to survive in the wilds.
Re-entering the game:
Your time in the wilds has caused you to suffer. (all HP + Stam reduced by 50%)
50hp 50mv 50st>
Why 50%? Because this is the magic number that will force you to have to find shelter/civilization and sleep to regain your health which puts you in a very vulnerable position in the wilds. This will force non-rangers to very carefully consider quitting in the wilds.
Common arguments:
Q: jmordetsky why don't you just play a ranger?
A: Because it's fucking boring/easy/limiting and I can make money with a ranger faster then a dock whore when the ships pull in.
Q: jmordetsky why don't you just stay in the cities?
A: Because it's fucking boring/easy/limiting and I can make money in the city faster then a dock whore when the ships pull in.
Q: jmordetsky why don't you just plan your play time better?
A: Because I have a fucking life to live.
Q: jmordetsky don't you think it would throw the balance of the game off.
A: No.
I've always been in favor of expanding ranger quit to other classes/subguilds. Can't say I'd be up for the 50% idea because you'd be running into folks all the time...
A tall muscular man is here, bleeding heavily
You say, in sirihish:
"Dude what the fuck happened!"
A tall muscular man says, in sirihish:
"Nothing, I just broke camp."
You think:
"Why does everyone look like shit when they break camp.."
Maybe something like a 5-10 min delay before you quit out?
>make camp
You begin making a camp for the night
**5 min pass**
You setup camp
Come back soon!
_______ ___
/\\_____//~-_ _-~\\__
(~) ~-_ ~-_ _-~ _-~
(~) ~-_ ~-_ _-~ /-~
Welcome to Armageddon! (~) `~-_ ~_======_--~~ __~
This wouldn't really be a harsh penalty for subclass physicians.
In fact, that sounds like a really excellent way to practice bandaging.
Quote from: Synthesis on June 28, 2009, 05:15:16 PM
This wouldn't really be a harsh penalty for subclass physicians.
In fact, that sounds like a really excellent way to practice bandaging.
Login hurt for no reason to bandage up wounds that aren't there. This is RPI, right? ;D
Instead of health drain, drain all of the endurance and make the character at very hungry and thirsty.
Quote from: Semper on June 28, 2009, 05:49:35 PM
Instead of health drain, drain all of the endurance and make the character at very hungry and thirsty.
This I could go with.
Quote from: Majikal on June 28, 2009, 05:11:07 PM
I've always been in favor of expanding ranger quit to other classes/subguilds. Can't say I'd be up for the 50% idea because you'd be running into folks all the time...
Rather then breaking camp - the correct response would be - I was stuck in the wastes all week, I'm not really skilled at that.
re: Hunger/thirst -
I like it, but it would really be a penalty for me. I would just always keep food and water on me. No worries to quit then.
re: Physicians
Hmm - yea - I almost see that as a bonus though.
I think the relief of the many players who would believably use a quit-anywhere feature monstrously outweighs the unfortunate effects of the poor behaviour of a few. I'm behind the ideas in this thread as workable compromises not between playability and believability but between playability and self-flagellation.
Old idea is old. This was suggested first... what? Two years ago?
Not saying I don't like the general idea, but it's been discussed to death in the past with no change.
This is the part where we harrass the staff about it every six months for all eternity.
Quote from: spawnloser on June 28, 2009, 08:06:45 PM
Old idea is old. This was suggested first... what? Two years ago?
Not saying I don't like the general idea, but it's been discussed to death in the past with no change.
Alot of old suggestions get brought up again, looked at again and implemented. Quite of a few things added to the game recently were ideas from dusty old threads anew again. No problems with similar topics popping up twice.
Quote from: spawnloser on June 28, 2009, 08:06:45 PM
Old idea is old. This was suggested first... what? Two years ago?
Not saying I don't like the general idea, but it's been discussed to death in the past with no change.
I'm pretty sure I was the one who suggested it 2 yrs ago and yea - doesn't mean it DOESN'T ROCK! :)
New blood. New faces.
I'd bee fine with it if they were reduced to zero stamina and were in the early stages of hunger and thirst. It would be a reasonable exchange to be able to do something that they lack the knowledge to do correctly and would make them have to be careful using it. Log out in the wilds in an emergency in exchange for being pretty vulnerable (but not unexplainably wounded). when they return to the game.
So what happens if you log in with 50% hp and stam, but something suddenly comes up IRL, and you need to quit again?
Quote from: Qzzrbl on June 29, 2009, 12:16:34 AM
So what happens if you log in with 50% hp and stam, but something suddenly comes up IRL, and you need to quit again?
50% again.
50% hp is too much. Seriously, that'll put you into the 'need magick or sleep' area automatically. Reduced to 75% hp I can live with.
Quote from: spawnloser on June 29, 2009, 02:35:00 AM
Seriously, that'll put you into the 'need magick or sleep' area automatically.
Yea, that was sort of the idea. It makes it a much more serious thing. I think the big fear to this is a bunch of wandering warrior/nomads quitting whenever they feel like it. I think you really have to go to the 50% level + hunger + thirst to prevent that.
Wait...what exactly is the problem with a bunch of wandering warrior/nomads quitting whenever they feel like it?
Quote from: Synthesis on June 29, 2009, 05:10:10 AM
Wait...what exactly is the problem with a bunch of wandering warrior/nomads quitting whenever they feel like it?
For me personally, warriors quitting - I don't care. But the last time I brought this up, people felt there were balance issues with that and also that it would rob the cities of player base.
I don't really agree with the balance issue - but I do feel that if desert quit was too easy that the second issue would be real. Keeping desert quit scary forces you back to cities to stay healthy which I think is important. But, that is just the opinion of one (relatively handsome) man.
it would nerf rangers. duh.
I haven't been following the non-ranger quit discussions for a while, so forgive me if this has been suggested, but...
What if certain objects let you wilderness quit?
Like, say, a tent lets you quit out (and the tent quits too). The penalty would be paying for and carrying around a large, expensive tent.
There might be other items too, possibly consumable. Like, a desert survival kit that gets partially (or totally) used up when you quit so you have to keep buying more of them.
Quote from: Marauder Moe on June 29, 2009, 01:39:28 PM
I haven't been following the non-ranger quit discussions for a while, so forgive me if this has been suggested, but...
What if certain objects let you wilderness quit?
Like, say, a tent lets you quit out (and the tent quits too). The penalty would be paying for and carrying around a large, expensive tent.
There might be other items too, possibly consumable. Like, a desert survival kit that gets partially (or totally) used up when you quit so you have to keep buying more of them.
Yeah, but then people hop on the, "Why do I need to buy stuff IC so I can do something as OOC as quitting" train, and the discussion usually ends right about there.
He is carrying:
- a cracked desert-camouflaged tent
Well I've said it before, and I'm not going to argue in depth again, but ranger quit is not entirely OOC. It represents the IC ability to survive indefinitely (or at least long-term) in the wilderness.
Personally I don't think everyone should get ranger quit (but I can think of a few guilds/subguilds that should get it). But if they were, I'd want it to be for a hefty price (expensive and/or heavy equipment) so that actual rangers, masters of the wastes, still have an advantage.
Logging in with lowered HP/MV isn't a very good penalty. Either you simply rest it off (in which case the penalty is simply being delayed a few RL minutes) or you get unlucky and something eats you (which is something regular rangers face anyway).
Make all tents quit-enabled; but the tent does not quit with you.
- If you log back in and the tent's still there, you're placed inside the tent.
- If you log back in and the tent's gone, you're placed in the room in which the tent was pitched when you logged out.
What disadvantages over ranger quit? You've left a rather expensive marker showing right where you're going to log back in. It's easy enough for someone to steal it, or to camp out in your thoughtfully-provided shelter and wait for you to "wake up."
This change would eliminate 71% of the pent-up demand for staff support of uncoded clans.
Meh, the more I think about it, the more I think that consumable survival kits would be the way to go.
They're reliably worse than ranger quit because you have to keep paying for them and you're not completely free from having to return to civilization.
They're also something that non-ranger d-elves could reasonably use.
We could also have guild/subguild choice affect how well you use them. Like, maybe a warrior with average wisdom will get 4 uses out of a kit that costs like 100-150 coins. Higher wisdom, more uses. Lower wisdom, fewer uses. Burglar, pickpocket, and assassin could all have penalties. Hunter, nomad, and d-elf could have bonuses.
Could even have kits specialized for different regions (as in, they have different tools, medicines, etc). A northern survival kit would give you fewer uses if you're down south in the salt flats.
I don't see a huge need for this change. Its pretty easy to reach a quit-safe room. It's laughably so once you get a working knowledge of the wilds around Zalanthas. I have been vexed in the past by having to ride to a city/??? place to quit out before, but thems the breaks. Could always wish up 'emergency, have to afk.' I doubt the staff would grill you.
Quote from: Kryos on June 29, 2009, 02:38:27 PM
I have been vexed in the past by having to ride to a city/??? place to quit out before, but thems the breaks.
If you wanted to play subguild_nomad, you should have picked guild_ranger?
The tent idea holds some awesome merit, penalizes classes that aren't rangers and still keeps rangers feeling badass with their sexy trick.
Nomad, Rebel, Hunter and maybe a couple others should simply get ranger quit.
Quote from: RogueGunslinger on June 29, 2009, 03:05:36 PM
Nomad, Rebel, Hunter and maybe a couple others should simply get ranger quit.
I think those three would be awesome.
A rogue gickers wet dream, subclass ranger quit.
Make all wilderness-quitting require a tent. Rangers just get to quit out with the tent in inventory, while others have to pitch the tent and leave it in-game.
Yes, I said it: nerf ranger quit!
Quote from: brytta.leofa on June 29, 2009, 03:26:18 PM
Yes, I said it: nerf ranger quit!
There is a special place in the deepest darkest pits of hell for armers that say such things. It's called SoI. >:(
Is it just me, or have these ideas grown progressively more retarded?
Quote from: Synthesis on June 29, 2009, 04:40:27 PM
Is it just me, or have these ideas grown progressively more retarded?
I could answer more readily if you'd enumerate your concerns.
I think the kit idea has merit. Baring my idea, I'd take that.
Quote from: Majikal on June 29, 2009, 04:39:18 PM
Quote from: brytta.leofa on June 29, 2009, 03:26:18 PM
Yes, I said it: nerf ranger quit!
There is a special place in the deepest darkest pits of hell for armers that say such things. It's called SoI. >:(
This is kind of a bad comparison, considering that SOI is a lot more lenient about the ability to quit out of the game and doesn't treat it as a mystical IC ability.
Personally, I'd rather that rangers have ranger quit taken away and buffed up in other ways outside of cities. Maybe a bonus to fighting animals or resisting animal poison or so. Better for all characters to be allowed to quit in a sandstorm.
Ranger quit is an OOC advantage. Unless the purpose of rangers is to encourage low playtime players to travel outside cities, it's a bit iffy to give an OOC advantage to a guild.
I don't want to see everyone just quit out everywhere. Leave it the way it is, with Rangers being the only ones able to do it out of the blue, and force non-rangers to either have a tent in hand or a consumable travel kit. I like that idea.
I don't like the idea of pitching the tent and leaving it in-game. If someone steals it, that makes no sense at all--weren't you sleeping in it?
However, if having a tent in-hand allowed desert quit for everyone, that's fine by me, and the tent can wear down as you use it in such a fashion. I'd also be okay with consumable survival kits. I do agree that ranger quit shouldn't just be handed out to everyone free-like, but there should be ways for other guilds to quit in the wilds.