Just an idea. Say, your out in the middle of the desert. Some Scrab came out of nowhere, lookin for lunch. After a few minutes of fighting, you emerge victorious. But, oh no, he sliced a gaping wound into your arm. Now. This person has no bandages, so they're forced to resort to other measures, just to stop the bleeding. So they rip off a piece of cloth from their tunic or sleeves, and wrap the wound up right tight so the bleeding stops, and until they can get better, bandaged help. And if someone would come across a mortally wounded person, they would be able to bind up their serious wounds, and allow them to live! Even if they don't have a bandage. What do you think?
You already can do that, since the code doesn't let anyone bleed to death. If you're not being attacked anymore, the worst that can happen is you're stuck at the HP level you got hit to. The best that can happen is you get better. (not including dying of thirst and other environmental things).
So you can RP that you're tearing off cloth from your pants and binding the wound to explain WHY you're not really bleeding to death (since you're not).
Oh..But, The other day, I was mortally wounded, and I had small dips of HP, after it went into the negative level. I almost died. :/
Read over:
Help Bandage (http://www.armageddon.org/cgi-bin/help_index/show_help?bandage)
Help Bandagemaking (http://www.armageddon.org/cgi-bin/help_index/show_help?bandagemaking)
Hope that helps!
How does that help me?...
I was talking about someone that wasn't a talented healer or anything. A crude bandage, that can be used to stop bleeding, and heal tiny amounts of Health.
Mortally wounded means just that. It's pretty much a coin flip whether or not you're going to die, and the coin isn't weighted in your favor. You typically can't move much, if at all. Chances are you're not going to have the strength to tear apart cloth and then tie it to yourself with the sort of tightness needed to stop severe arterial bleeding.
If you do get that coin flip in your favor, and you can move again, great. Now you can emote and stuff. If not...
beep.
Welcome to Armageddon.
I wasn't talking about doing it myself, either. I was saying if someone would come across a mortally wounded person. Not themselves..Grah.
Seems to me that anyone knowledgeable in the ways of treating wounds would probably have bandages with them. For anyone else, just assume the treatment isn't effective. In Zalanthas, not many people know about veins and such. If your character doesn't have the skill, he probably shouldn't know that you need to put pressure on a bleeding wound and wrap it tightly, and even if he does, he'd probably do it wrong.
Yes, you, or another person can RP bandaging a wound and then you sleep it off. I think that is what you meant.
But try to RP it right.
Quote from: "Alnir"I wasn't talking about doing it myself, either. I was saying if someone would come across a mortally wounded person.
It is vaguely possible that a passerby would be nice, and save the person, at the expense of their own safety and resources. The more valuable the person is to the passerby if said person remains alive, the more likely the chance.
Or they might just kill them and put them out of their misery, and loot the body for valuables.
Either or. :wink:
If someone is "mortally wounded" -- hurt so badly they are all but dead -- it SHOULD take someone skilled at handling such wounds in order to heal them. Although at the moment the code is pretty friendly to someone who is "mortally wounded," I'd actually like to see blood loss (once someone reaches that level) actually kill them, if slowly -- every time.
In -that- case, I wouldn't be entirely averse to allowing an average Schmoe to attempt to aid them. It would NOT heal them, but merely prevent them from worsening (unless someone attempts to move them), although there would also be a risk of making them die faster. But, all the more reason to not do dangerous things alone, and still maintains true 'healers' as valuable.
Maybe.
I have also seen average Schmoe's almost bleed to death from small, profusely bleeding wounds, because they had no idea they should put pressure on it or how to do so properly. They had the wit to put on a trash bag like a poncho to keep the blood off the rest of their clothing while meandering over to the hospital, but it never occurred to them to put pressure on the wound. Certain pieces of knowledge we just take for granted.
-Savak
As long as you make it a 50/50 or 60/40 or something chance that the passerby will do it wrong.. That the passerby will rip off the blood covered bandage, to get a new one, that the passerby won't put arterial pressure above the wound, that (insert any number of bad bad things that can happy).. Because its really not as simple as direct pressure, in a situation like that.
This is exactly the kind of situation, in my mind, that calls for a wish. RP out the bandaging, and let the imms decide if you managed to kill them or not.
I don't see why Joe Schmoe wouldn't know how to apply pressure to a wound, or use a tourniquet.
Quote from: "Cuusardo"I don't see why Joe Schmoe wouldn't know how to apply pressure to a wound, or use a tourniquet.
Doesn't mean its going to help.. or do you want the unskilled use of an ability to be better then the coded skill?
Hmm Can you actually kill someone trying to bandage them.. and if you do.. is it a crime?
I'm talking about for roleplaying why people don't just bleed to death when they are injured, and they start to regain hps.
Bah. I say make the healer sub-class more important than it is. It's ICly an important talent, to heal folk, or to keep them alive, at least. When is the last time somebody said that they were a healer and you thought to youself, "Oh Joy!?"
If you make everybody bleed, slowly, or rapidly, depending on how badly you are injured, then you make a healer important. And despite what you say or think, it will not make the game less friendly, it would make the game grittier, harsher. And it will encourage socialization.
The person with no talent in banadaging should be able to help you on a 50/50 chance, and only binding the wound so that it bleeds no more, not actually succeeding with healing, unless you want it to be a 1% chance.
Anyone with the bandage skill should have a very, very, very tiny chance of hurting their patient. The typical failure message should be that they do no good to the wound, not that they are killing their patient.
Quote from: "The7DeadlyVenomz"Anyone with the bandage skill should have a very, very, very tiny chance of hurting their patient. The typical failure message should be that they do no good to the wound, not that they are killing their patient.
With a character I had, I once failed so badly trying to bandage myself that I did enough damage to push me under the point of where I wouldn't sleep until I healed. I'd been playing the character long enough to be relatively good with the bandage skill, but that was one awful fumble.
When that happened I always roleplayed it out as either putting the bandage too tight, or slipping while trying to stitch up a bad wound and causing more damage.
I also agree with Venomz' sentiments about the physician subclass being more important. Healers would be quite valuable in such a harsh environment.
Quote from: "Delirium"Quote from: "The7DeadlyVenomz"Anyone with the bandage skill should have a very, very, very tiny chance of hurting their patient. The typical failure message should be that they do no good to the wound, not that they are killing their patient.
I'd like that.. I never did understand how I would make things worse.. On the other hand.. my one 'long term' character had a talent for surviving mortal wounds,.. Which was handy.. cause after a year of constant combat training I never did manage to ever actually kill anything.
I'd rather like the stun points to drain away before your hp since I would think you go into shock and would lose conscience before you actually die from blood loss. That would also prevent people from using the Way to broadcast where they were last attacked and the person who attacked her.
Jokes aside, I don't think you can actually kill someone with the bandage skill, not directly. If the victim (or patient) is too badly hurt (or not badly hurt enough) you will not be able to even attempt to bandage them. You can only codedly bandage people that are severly but not critically injured, outside of that narrow range you just emote bandaging, hand them the bandage, and hope that they realize that they are supposed to wear it as an "I've been bandaged" roleplay prop.
Quote from: "The7DeadlyVenomz"Bah. I say make the healer sub-class more important than it is. It's ICly an important talent, to heal folk, or to keep them alive, at least. When is the last time somebody said that they were a healer and you thought to youself, "Oh Joy!?"
More likely "Oh no!"
"Look out! She's got a bandage!" :P
"I"m fine, really, 'tis just a flesh wound. Please Sarge, don't let Runner Wannabeamedic touch me!"
But I think that is because of bad experiences with newbie banadagers, a newbie bandager strikes more fear into the hearts of stout men than an experienced torturer does.
I'm not sure there is a big problem though. I mean, it is akward and a little silly at times, but not a huge problem. If the physician subclass were more useful more people would take it, and then the would-be poisoners would complain even more often about how physicians are over-powered and make it too difficult to poison everyone. (Hint to poisoners: if you want to be successful don't use the most common types of poison.
Of course cures for common poisons are also common.)
As for wounds, I've seen MUSHes where the healing time went up exponetially in relation to the amount of dammage, and it was icky. World of Darkness MUSHes often use the official WoD mortals' healing times chart:
Health level Time
Bruised One day
Hurt Three Days
Injured One Week
Wounded One Month
Mauled Three months
Crippled Three monthsThose are cumulative, after three months at Crippled you become Mauled, three months at Mauled you become Wounded, another month at wounded to become Injured, and so on. Each health level below "healthy" applies penalties to your physical attributes, that also get worse with each level. At the Crippled level you lose a permanent point in one of your physical attributes (and attributes are out of five, so losing a point is at least a 20% drop). If I'm remembering right, and I might not be because it's been a while, at Crippled and at Mauled you are pretty much restricted to bed rest, stuck in a hospital unless you are so rich that you can afford in-home care. Taking horrible, life threatening injuries and then being stuck in hospital for months afterwards is realistic, but it usually isn't
fun. From what I saw most people tended to only log into an injured character occasionally for a poinient scene where somebody visits them in the hospital, and the rest of the time they would play an alternate character, because pretending to be in the hospital is almost as boring as really being in the hospital.
Right now the near death state is sort of fun, in a dull and masochistic way. You are at negative hit points, the only thing that can really help is magick, you are past the point of bandaging and there is no surgery skill, all you have left is your own will to live. So you can either quit, and die, or wait it out for a looooong time and hope you recover. The numbers creep up as your body tries to heal itself, and down as your wounds, shock and bloodloss pull you towards the abyss. If someone takes your inert form to a safe indoor location then you will probably recover. If you are stuck on top of a dune, exposed to sun and wind in a scrab-infested desert then you are probably going to die, but it might take hours. If you have suffered near death wounds and you are also affected by thirst, hunger, poison or sickness, then you are almost certainly going to die. Funnily enough, if you remain in the near-death state long enough you will eventually be affected by hunger and thirst, because while near death you are unable to eat or drink, which is another nail in the coffins of people who get almost killed while in the thirsty outdoors. If you do manage to recover it makes for a great story. :wink:
Angela Christine
Well .. I know from personal experience that you can do damage with bandages... I don't know how far it goes though....
You need to be able to at least give water to those people who are mortally wounded. I say no to food, because they would have to chew, but water will go down their throat and help them whether they swallow it or not.
And I still say fix the bandaging skill. THe issue is not if you can kill them with it, it's whether you can help them. Remember, it's a MUD, so you have to banadage people to get better, and if you are not given the chance because folks are scared you'll hurt them rather than help them, then it can take an exorbant amount of time to get good, more time than it really should.
It might help if there was a way to practice bandaging without actually having to do it to a person who's wounded first. You wouldn't be able to practice it up to a hugely successful skill, but why can't someone with the bandage skill practice wrapping their own arm/leg or a friend, just to learn how to do it without cutting off circulation. Then once they get to a point, it won't get any higher using this method, because you can only study so much to do something before you actually have to do it to improve even RL, but they'll be less likely to accidentally cut the patients arm off while trying to wrap that broken wrist.
What, you mean work on the basics of how a bandage goes around a shoulder and what have you before even trying on someone with a gith spear and obsidian wreckage stuck in the joint of their shoulder?
Sounds like a good idea.. if only for the basics of applying bandages.