Quote from: whitt on June 21, 2017, 08:32:06 AM

Quote from: nauta on June 21, 2017, 08:04:00 AM
Here are some phrases that if your character uttered them, other characters players bleeding modern day thought into the game would think they were an idiot or from another planet:

Fixed that for you.

Quote from: nauta on June 21, 2017, 08:04:00 AM
Examples:

'You little pussy.'  Meaning: You are weak only good for your breeding parts.

Women in Zalanthas are still the only ones that can bare children suggesting someone wasn't strong enough to valuable for more than that is  still viable, if entirely misunderstanding the rigors of childbirth.  You womb?  Just doesn't just have the ring to it.

Quote from: nauta on June 21, 2017, 08:04:00 AM
'Grow some balls.' Meaning: Get stronger Be a useful.

Again, only men in Zalanthas can impregnate a woman.  A man without balls can't.  They are, quite literally, a useless fuck.

Quote from: nauta on June 21, 2017, 08:04:00 AM
'Cocksucker.' Meaning: You are someone who enjoys sucking penises, usually said to a male,

Not in Zalanthas.

Quote from: nauta on June 21, 2017, 08:04:00 AM
usually to imply they are gay,

Not in Zalanthas.

Quote from: nauta on June 21, 2017, 08:04:00 AM
which further implies they are abnormal and/or weak.

Not in Zalantas.

Quote from: nauta on June 21, 2017, 08:04:00 AM
Why would a normal Zalanthan think you were  an idiot be perfectly fine with you for saying this?

Because Zalanthans are not neat, tidy, clean people.  Stuffing someone's hot, sweaty, smelly phallus into your mouth and sucking on it like a sugar candy is generally gross?  Bootlicker, Asskisser, Brownnoser all similar, but weaker versions of the same premise, but weaker insults as you aren't just touching the tip, you're wrapping yourself around it.

In short, I'll leave this quote, attributed to Betty White, but apparently Snopes says it's from elsewhere which is a shame, because I can totally hear it in her voice.

QuoteWhy do people say "grow some balls"? Balls are weak and sensitive! If you really wanna get tough, grow a vagina! Those things take a pounding!

Just to be clear, those were idioms and slang phrases from RL, not Zalanthas, which I do not think fit into Zalanthas naturally.  You can invent an ad hoc just-so backstory to make it so that your sexist and homophobic RL slang can fit, but why bother?

This is Armageddon.

Someone offends your delicate sensibilities?

Whip out that bone sword and cut off his prick. Pickle it with salt and wear it on a string around your neck as a reminder to others to be more polite.

Most of our modern complaints of sexism come from being helpless in the face of racism and sexism, directed at us by our employers or coworkers when we cannot do anything about it.

In Armageddon, you can always do something about it. If your own strength fails, use your cunning and coin to hire someone else. The shadows are always waiting to avenge any slight.

Agree with Miradus, more or less. With the point he's making anyway.

If there is no sexism in Armageddon, then you are being a sexist player by interpreting insults in your character's direction as being sexist.

If someone calls my character a whining little bitch, I'll respond in a NON-sexist way, by assuming they are referring to a female gortok in heat. I imagine a female gortok in heat is a rather unpleasant, smelly, nasty, violent, and otherwise repulsive creature. I'll accept that insult as though this was what they meant by it, and respond accordingly.

If someone calls my character the c-word, I'll probably attempt to let it slide because I know it's a trigger word for me personally. I have no logical explanation for it, has nothing to do with sexism for me. It's just a word that raises my hackles for no real reason I can think of.

As for the term cocksucker - I've always used it to describe someone I don't like. I never gave it any other meaning. It has always meant "the person (male or female) I can't stand because s/he's thoroughly unpleasant and churlish." I don't think that people who engage in the actual literal behavior are unpleasant or churlish. It's not a sexist remark, coming from me. It's just a handy term that "feels" good to say out loud when I'm really pissed at someone, so I use it in the game. For the same reason I say "shit!" when some abrupt, sudden, sharply unpleasant thing occurs. Not because I actually want to take a shit, and not because I think that the thing that is happening is a turd on the road. But because the word FEELS good to say out loud. It's just an expletive, that doesn't really mean anything at all when I say it other than - wowie, oh, jeez, gosh, hey. Shit just sounds better than any of those.

Bastard is a tough one - because bastard nobles are a thing, and they are gentically superior to commoners, though lack the status of nobles. So if a commoner were to call someone a rotten bastard, it'd probably be an off-handed compliment. And if a noble called them that, it'd be a grave insult. For that reason - the reason of logistics - I avoid using that particular word unless I am referring specifically to a bastard noble.

Pussy - I don't use that word for the same reason I don't use the word dick. They're funny words to me and make me giggle, I can't take any scene very seriously when I see those words scroll up on the game screen. They're immersion breakers, for me. And has absolutely zilch, nada, nothing, to do with sexism.

I can see full blooded highborn calling each other bastards as insults (thus challenging their right to authority or the legitimacy of their will). I don't think a commoner should -ever- use the word bastard as an insult, period.

A commoner shouldn't use the word "bastard" as an insult, but if someone did it I'd probably just assume they actually said something comparable and chalk it up to the Sirihish to English translation . Unless, of course, they were new or I otherwise suspected they didn't know better, in which case I'd try to let them know OOCly in a non-patronizing way. Sometimes those things just slip out, and sometimes they're a result of ignorance.

Also, I'm not saying all gendered insults are appropriate IG, but I don't like the idea of a blanket ban. Why isn't the way we've always done it OK, where if you felt that someone was being overly sexist you could report it? Saying "that guy is such a prick" is a lot less sexist than saying "stop trying to be the man of the house and get back to dusting the furniture," after all. The most sexist stuff I've seen in game had absolutely nothing to do with words like "bitch" or "cunt" or "dick." And yes, I have reported someone for sexism IG.

I remember when we had this discussion, and it was locked.

I'm more interested in "Is what Nergal said, canon? Can we get a MOTD or a Staff Announcement from ArmageddonMUD to solidify staff position?

Except we never did discuss the gendered insults. We discussed "necker" plenty, but the declaration about "dick" etc. just kind of came out of nowhere.

But yes, that is the important bit. I'm personally not going to consider it binding unless we get a more formal announcement because I trust staff to not hide important game rules on a random locked thread.

I'm going to stick to calling all fuckers "fuckers".

It's my trademark insult. You can't use it without copying me.

And if you do, you owe me sid.

I miss kank-fucker.
I also miss kank being a verb. 

I still use it as a verb. Whoops.

And I agree with Nauta, actually.

Be more creative with the gameworld theme in mind.

When did Kank stop being a verb?

Quote from: boog on June 21, 2017, 10:26:47 AM
I still use it as a verb. Whoops.

And I agree with Nauta, actually.

Be more creative with the gameworld theme in mind.

I agree, and I don't usually use those kinds of insults anyway, but it'd be good to know whether or not we will actually be punished OOCly for slipping and using them.

May not have. I just haven't heard it in two or three years, probably.

I still use it but I'm aware that realistically it'd be considered waaaay outdated, well beyond something that your grandfather used to say and into the territory of something your ancestors said.

Just did the math.... Going by the Year on the Chronology page that mentions the kank plague, it has been 99 Years in game.

Quote from: sleepyhead on June 21, 2017, 10:32:48 AM
I still use it but I'm aware that realistically it'd be considered waaaay outdated, well beyond something that your grandfather used to say and into the territory of something your ancestors said.

We use the "f" word, and I have no earthly idea where it came from.  I don't have a problem with using it, I just hadn't seen it in a while.
Release the KANKIN'!

Tbh, my go-to insult for someone being an asshole is Asshole.
I cant remember the last time I used one of the insults I am defending.
That being said, I want them available should I ever have the desire to use them.
More words are better than less.

I dont think I've said it, but I'd love to ask an angry character, male or female, why they have sand in their vagina. If that ain't thematic, I don't know what is!
Sand?
Amirite? 

Quote from: Melkor on June 21, 2017, 11:27:39 AM
That being said, I want them available should I ever have the desire to use them.
More words are better than less.

Yeah, but do you get your panties in a knot over words like 'toaster', 'computer', and 'top hat'?

(See what I did there with 'panties in a knot'?) 

Some RL idioms are not very Zalanthan.  Some RL idioms are.

True. Not disputing that. After all, I would have no reason to say the word toaster IG. If a female is being overly angry, aggressive, churlish, I would have a reason to compare her to a gortok bitch.

I also like making up dwarf words.

"You filthy groggletup. That's my seat. Get out."

Get triggered by being called a groggletup. I dare you.

The word groggletup is extremely problematic, as it speaks from a stance of stump-normative culture. Stop oppressing me.

#stumpprivilege

Please point me to official references that female gortoks are called bitches, as opposed to she-toks, vixen, jill, gortokess, or simply gortok.

Interested to know if it is actually documented somewhere, or folks have just assumed.

Cleverrrr.


edited to add:

So, despite the word bitch existing IG for decades, and the word bitch being in the curse help-files until this safe-space endeavor...

Bitch isnt a thing.