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Ah, crumbly-house. The great equalizer!
How is it nonsense to have a good chance to knock yourself out when you fall?
You would need to consider the severety of the climb. Are you scaling the wall of a 2-storey building? Is there anything on the description saying that the building has easy foot and handholds, making the climb no more difficult than a ladder?
Is it a sheer cliff 50 feet up in the air? Or just as difficult - a sheer cliff 50 feet -down- from where you are standing?
Do you have a couple of months experience climbing? Do you have the appropriate equipment to climb? Maybe a rope with hooks on one end, sturdy boots with ankle support and toe-grips? Or are you just pretending you are the Zalanthan version of Spiderman, and assuming you can just zoom up buildings by sheer willpower alone?
Jstorrie has it right. It's that one particular room in the game that drives me most nuts. I've...fallen off a thirty foot balcony, been pitched into the air by a wave and landed on sand head-first. Been clobbered in the back of the neck by a pair of fists. Knocked my head on concrete more times than I can count by tripping.
-Never- have I been knocked unconscious in real life. But this one rubble-strewn room you walk through is death incarnate. Just not fond of the fall on your neck and lose consciousness. You're more likely to be badly hurt than lose consciousness in a terrible fall, seems the opposite in zalanthas.
That room is a deathtrap. My, at the time, 60 day assassin fell on his neck twice there in the space of one day. About the only two times I really was glad the 'rinth was completely uninhabited during Euro daytimes.
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It's November... as christmas lights go up you'll see exactly how realisitic it is to become bady hurt by falling just a few feet.
Besides, if there is rubble that probably means you're landing on top of rubble and god-knows what... maybe one little stone pushed a pressure point.
You know, last time I got really drunk I think that happened to me.
Anyhow, I just wanted to point out that maybe this should be thought about in terms of playability and not realism. I don't necessarily see a huge problem with it, but that's just me.
I'd rather take 100 stun than have a broken leg, and I'd rather take stun than hp damage, which seems to be where this conversation is leading.
You try to climb up but slip, you may not be falling from a foot up, you may be falling from ten feet up, and people get knocked out from less. I had a sneaky character that kept falling and getting knocked out 50% of the time at that spot (strength poor, agility exeptional). Just roll with it.
Taking a possibly unrealistic knockout blow is probably better than taking a very realistic broken ankle or leg, which is easy to do even from a stepladder.
If I can fall five feet from the monkey bars and break my elbow, then slip on some ice and fall three feet or so, breaking the other, I think it's something of a blessing to fall the equivalent of a story or even ten feet and only get knocked unconscious.
Annoying as hell? You bet it is. But I'd rather have to wait out the time needed to come back around (yes, worrying all the while about someone/mob coming in and ending my character's life), then have to deal with the time required to heal a broken limb, and the possibilities of permanent damage done to your bone (as is the case of my right elbow).
So if your character falls badly enough to be knocked unconscious, you roleplay it to the extent of being fine once they wake up?
I don't know if I, living in a supposedly extremely deadly desert world with people around every corner wanting to harm you, would prefer to be rendered unconscious for hours over spraining an ankle or breaking an arm.
I think the question is whether it's reasonable that an average person who messes up while climbing upwards, even if it's a five foot fence, pretty much always gets knocked out. Especially considering the fact that they'd probably make it through a three room fall if they fell the "conventional" way.
Quote from: "BuNutzCola"Jstorrie has it right. It's that one particular room in the game that drives me most nuts. I've...fallen off a thirty foot balcony, been pitched into the air by a wave and landed on sand head-first. Been clobbered in the back of the neck by a pair of fists. Knocked my head on concrete more times than I can count by tripping.
Sounds like life has been pretty rough on you..
QuoteIf I can fall five feet from the monkey bars and break my elbow, then slip on some ice and fall three feet or so, breaking the other, I think it's something of a blessing to fall the equivalent of a story or even ten feet and only get knocked unconscious.
What are you? Mr. Glass?
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You're falling onto rubble, from a height. Just roll with it meant RP it out and stop complaining. We've all been there.
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First of all, not every fall bears the same consequences. You do not lose 100+ stun everytime you fall. Secondly, yes, it is unrealistic that it does not more accurately reflect what you are actually falling on, or the distance that you are falling.
But thirdly, and most importantly, your attittude is really smothering your concern. Calm down some. We'll likely get better fall code in ARM2. Shoot, we might get better code in this version, but it's not as likely when you bring up the topic be being angry.
Okay, I agree with you on the falling climbing something versus falling from the top. I also don't think that people go unconscious all the time, unless they are -extremely- unlucky.
I don't know how the code works, but I'm assuming that it is rolled out.
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Quote from: "Greve"I've never seen it deal less than 90 stun damage, and it usually deals around 100. It can also do 120.
Well that's weird, I think. Maybe it has something to do with where exactly it's happening or your present characters stats. Was it the same on previous characters?
If not, maybe it's a bug?? I dunno, not around long enough to give good opinions.
Whoa.
Given your example, I suddenly see your mote of anger.
I'm really, really sure that's a bug. You should only lose stamina in those situations. Falling from room to room is the only reason you should ever lose stun or hp.
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Right.
Now personally, I have never had what you're describing happen to me. I'm at a serious lose for why it is feasable. I have never lost stun in the same room for failing a climb check.
I've fallen and lost stun, yea, but not so much, so regularly. Are you at some crazy place you can't tell us about, cause otherwise it's weird.
So.. lemme get this straight. A world can have magick, psionics, silt-horrors, and yompars that can kick full-grown humans in the head (don't ask), but you're getting your panties in a twist because you're getting knocked out from a fall?
C'mon. If you can suspend disbelief for the shit I mentioned, certainly you can fabricate a reason why a fall would knock you out. Maybe Zalanthan brains are more susceptible to sharp blows?
USE YOAR IMAGINATION.
(http://www.pcusa.org/today/archive/images/mrrogers.gif)
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You completely missed the point.
Actually, I've always hated it...happily I normaly play dwarves so losing 90-120 stun does not normaly KO.
BUT, to anybody who says it is no big deal...It is.
Its a crit fail to climb that is IMO silly. You can be standing in an indoor room that is described as cramped yadda yadda...so, we are not talking cathedral ceilings here. Try to climb, slip, fall on neck WHAM 100 stun. Now, EVEN if you made it near the top on that climb and slip, its only like 6-10 feet top end. Give me a break...you should NEVER get that crit fail from the bottom room of a climb IMO, even outdoors where the rooms are supposedly larger.
Then to make matters worse, you can take a three outdoor room fall, call it 30-50 feet and only lose 80 stun total. Does not matter if its free fall or bumping everything on the way down, I lose more stun falling off the first rock of a 50 foot climb then jumping from the top without a shoot...huh?
*snicker*
Just going to say this right now...you're all going to complain ten times more when there's no places to get better at climbing without having to fall two rooms, because of all of the people who complained about critical failure in some places. Or rather, you're all going to complain about how much harder it is to climb.
Critical failure happens in everything. If you want stories of it happening from such small distances, I can look around for you. Just be glad you can't DIE from it in most cases unless it happens...
A: With your character being stupid.
B: With your character being unable to see the bottom of the climb.
C: With your character using it to try to lose someone, in which case you'd better have some confidence with it.
This might sound stupid. But have you ruled out the obvious and checked to make sure your "no-save" is set correctly? I remember once trying to climb something I had climbed a few times before without any problem. And fell. Because my nosave was set wrong.
Quote from: "Lizzie"This might sound stupid. But have you ruled out the obvious and checked to make sure your "no-save" is set correctly?
Yes.
Just wanted to let you know your concern has been noted and placed in the climbing discussion for the new incarnation.
Cool, thanks.
I don't like the 'you land on your neck'-message, it's a bit ridiculous and you shouldn't be landing head-first from a normal fall, Could the message be changed to 'You fall and hit your head'?
Anyway. I don't think it's happening way too often, but if the frequency was reduced a bit, I wouldn't be against it.
Also, climbing in game is unrealistic in the sense that our characters constantly overestimate themselves. If I start climbing something and notice that it gets too hard and that I don't see a fairly safe way to go on, I stop and climb back down. The way the game works right now you just either fall or make it to the top, There could be a third option in game where you fail to make the climb, but don't fall. This would happen your skill check is in the middle between falling and making it all the way up.
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Quote from: "Greve"
While we're at it, wouldn't it be great if climbs had a coded difficulty that a character could gauge, with some of the trickier ones requiring a good climb skill to accurately determine? It should be much easier to climb craggy rocks or a plank wall than a vertical basalt tower. As far as I've seen, climb rooms in the current game don't have varying difficulties.
They already have varying difficulties.
Haven't we all agreed that falling on your neck is gay and shouldn't take away that much stun, or leave you knocked out? It seems like a lot of you are just agreeing on the same thing, but rewording your agreement, thus adding to this topic with repeated points on the same side of the arguement.
I think it's silly, unless you're like 30 feet in the air when you fall, and maybe the imms could just reword the messaging so instead of it saying you fall and land on your neck, it would say something like.
climbing to nearly the top, you fall 30 feet and land head first. That way it would at least make sense. And they could keep it the way it is.
I think we're agreed that falling on your neck is not cool and shouldn't take away that much stun, or leave you unconscious? It seems like a lot of you are just agreeing on the same thing, but rewording your agreement, thus adding to this topic with unnecesary repeated points on the same side of the discussion.
Quote from: "Simple"I think we're agreed that falling on your neck is not cool and shouldn't take away that much stun, or leave you unconscious? It seems like a lot of you are just agreeing on the same thing, but rewording your agreement, thus adding to this topic with unnecesary repeated points on the same side of the discussion.
Wait didn't I just say that above him?
this seems like as good a place as any to bring up the absolutely silly fact that you can flee up a sheer cliff only to fall unconcious.
Quote from: "daedroug"this seems like as good a place as any to bring up the absolutely silly fact that you can flee up a sheer cliff only to fall unconcious.
Actually, that has been fixed and is no longer possible.
oh really... any chance i can get the char that died from it back then :-P
alright... I am sorta seeing where you're going with this rant... My character fell off a roof.. And I went, let the dog out.. Went and dropped off the little brown kids at the pool.. Then microwaved a meal and came back and he's still unconscious..wtf.