making the game more noob-friendly

[number13]

Armageddon is a great mud, and deserves a much higher popuation than it currently enjoys.  Granted, with a high population the roleplaying quality might diminish--but roleplaying quality=0 if there's no one else logged on to interact with.

Aside from the the obvious traits that are bound to ward off the carebear populations of most muds (player killing, one death, roleplaying enforced, and character approval) there are some other aspects of the game that strike me as real turn offs for the newly initiated--many of which seem fixable to me:

1: The move delay looks like lag.  A newbie seeing it may be convinced that the mud is on a unplayably slow server.  A simple solution might be to add a message (such as "Traveling...") that is echoed two to four times between moves.  Like this:

The Barren Wasteland (NEW)

> n

Traveling...
Traveling...
Traveling...you have arrived at:

The Sandy Dunes (SE)


2: There's a learning curve, but asking for help is intimidating in a rp-intensive enviroment--it makes me feel like my character is stoopid having to ask where common buildings are his home city, and blurting out an ooc remark to a room full of rpers elicits dark glances and sometimes no answer.  

I use to play Achaea (an excellent mud in it's own right)  One of the nicer features was the ooc Help channel--any player could listen in and answer newbie questions without breaking rp. Allowing newbies who haven't created their first character to talk on Help would also be nice--quite a few players are probably lost just because they can't get a sense of the mud before investing time creating a character (I know that's what turned me off six years ago when I first discovered Armageddon).  Others are possibly lost to the intimidation of creating a background and description without realtime feedback from other players.

3: A minor nit-pick, but it would be nice if the mud automagically e-mailed players when characters are approved (or disapproved).  I imagine some players are lost simply because they forget to check back in after approval.  A small reminder would be useful.

4: The craft command has unusally long delays between execution and completion.  I can certainly understand the delay when my character is making a larger object, but a 5 minute delay to scratch out a game piece on a already rounded sandstone disc is dishearting, especially if that disc should crack.

I realize it would proably be too much work, but a set of standard emotes that are optionally echoed during the creation of each crafting item might add a bit to the atmosphere and make the delay seem a bit more bearable.  Again, Achaea does something like this to good effect.

Anyway, I really like many aspects of the game and appreciate the time that the admins have put into it.  These are just some humble suggestions to make the experience more noob-friendly....those of you who've been around longer probably have some better ideas on how to accomplish the same thing.

EDIT:  one more thing....a word or two of encouragement after losing a character would be cool.  "Connection closed" only adds to the sting.

[Quirk]

Number 3 is already in place; you get an email from the mud to the address you specified telling you when your character is approved.

Quirk

[CindyLou]

1: The move delay looks like lag.  A newbie seeing it may be convinced that the mud is on a unplayably slow server.  A simple solution might be to add a message (such as "Traveling...") that is echoed two to four times between moves.  Like this:

The Barren Wasteland (NEW)

> n

Traveling...
Traveling...
Traveling...you have arrived at:

The Sandy Dunes (SE)

The website explains that there is movement delay, and that it isn't lag. There is ALSO occasional lag, but that's just the usual internet lag that you'll find anywhere.

2: There's a learning curve, but asking for help is intimidating in a rp-intensive enviroment--it makes me feel like my character is stoopid having to ask where common buildings are his home city, and blurting out an ooc remark to a room full of rpers elicits dark glances and sometimes no answer.  

If you're using OOC to ask for help, then people should either ignore it - if they don't know how to answer or are busy with their RP and can't/won't interrupt long enough to help, or they should help. In this, I feel it's very important for players to understand that they SHOULD be encouraging newbies who sincerely want to be part of the world. Using OOC shows that you are interested and eager. But sometimes, it's important for the newbie to understand that there might be things going on IC at the moment where the players just can't stop what they're doing to help.

I imagine that on Sunday, if the hypothetic shit hits the proverbial fan, a newbie showing up asking pretty please show me where I can get a new cloak is probably going to be met with a few groans. Don't take it personally - there's just this little matter of the world blowing up at the moment, and you just happened to show up at a very bad time.

I use to play Achaea (an excellent mud in it's own right)  One of the nicer features was the ooc Help channel--any player could listen in and answer newbie questions without breaking rp. Allowing newbies who haven't created their first character to talk on Help would also be nice--quite a few players are probably lost just because they can't get a sense of the mud before investing time creating a character (I know that's what turned me off six years ago when I first discovered Armageddon).  Others are possibly lost to the intimidation of creating a background and description without realtime feedback from other players.

I suggested an OOC area, where players would show up as their account names rather than their characters. Where players could help each other. It was met with some understandable criticism. I still like the idea though

3: A minor nit-pick, but it would be nice if the mud automagically e-mailed players when characters are approved (or disapproved).  I imagine some players are lost simply because they forget to check back in after approval.  A small reminder would be useful.

You already get this e-mail. If you didn't get it, it was an oversight, or maybe you happened to check in the game minutes before the e-mail arrived in your mailbox.

4: The craft command has unusally long delays between execution and completion.  I can certainly understand the delay when my character is making a larger object, but a 5 minute delay to scratch out a game piece on a already rounded sandstone disc is dishearting, especially if that disc should crack.

If you want to get more realistic, then understand that tanning hides takes several real life DAYS, not minutes or hours, to complete. The delay gives you an opportunity to create emotes to show onlookers what you're doing. Not everyone has the same style - maybe I might scratch the head of the Sun-king into my stone first, while you'd scratch his balls <grin> .  It allows you to give your character's skills some depth. On the other hand, I have seen some quirky code with a couple of the crafting skills, and it can be a little strange sometimes.

I realize it would proably be too much work, but a set of standard emotes that are optionally echoed during the creation of each crafting item might add a bit to the atmosphere and make the delay seem a bit more bearable.  Again, Achaea does something like this to good effect.

This would just promote laziness, because there are some people who will take any shortcut they can, when it's available. Using canned emotes doesn't add to the atmosphere. In some games, that IS the atmosphere and it works fine. But Arm is just, well, different like that. Emotes don't make the game. They add to it. And they add to it best when it's the player creating it.

EDIT:  one more thing....a word or two of encouragement after losing a character would be cool.  "Connection closed" only adds to the sting.

I agree with your edit note. The only caveat is that there are so many new accounts lately, that it would take too much staff time to send a note to each new player who's lost their first character after just a couple of hours of gameplay. It does happen though - after my first character died I got a note from Sanvean, I think it was..and I was thrilled that a staff member would go out of their way to offer their condolences on the loss. But my character lasted a few months, so it was a pretty big deal to me personally when she finally bit the dust. If she had lasted only a couple of hours, I probably wouldn't have cared one way or another if someone sent me a note.

[Anonymous]

You already get this e-mail. If you didn't get it, it was an oversight, or maybe you happened to check in the game minutes before the e-mail arrived in your mailbox.

Found them.  I used a hotmail account and they were automatically thrown into the junk mail folder by whatever filter ms is using.  ha.

If you want to get more realistic, then understand that tanning hides takes several real life DAYS, not minutes or hours, to complete.

Not worried about more realistic so much as less frustrating.  I've been emoting when crafting (esp. when somone's in the room) and understand the reason for the delay...just that it seems out of wack when it takes my guy longer to fashion a little game piece out of sandstone than it does for him to make a ornate stone jar.  Maybe if my crafting skill was higher the delay would be shorter?

I agree with your edit note. The only caveat is that there are so many new accounts lately, that it would take too much staff time to send a note to each new player who's lost their first character after just a couple of hours of gameplay.

It's pretty cool that the admins sent you an email when your character died--the level of dedication of the people on this mud amazes me, almost like a tabletop pnp game.

But I meant a automatic echo through telnet after you die.  Maybe I missed it, but when my guy bit the dust it just said "Connection Closed".  I was hoping for something a little more like:

"Sorry, you've just died but please create a new character."

And then maybe a summation of the character's stats.

[Quirk]

Looks like your link died just about the moment of death. Generally, you get to see the infamous ASCII mantis head come up that you see on logging in, with "Welcome to Armageddon". While it doesn't give you character stats, you get to see your past character list and options available for creating a new one.

Quirk

[My 2 sids]

Now my background is anything but marketing but it seems to me there are a few things we could do to better market ourselves.

First and foremost we need to decide whom we want to market.  Granted, not all of us came from the same background nor could we all agree on who will make the best players for the game, but I think if we can narrow our focus a bit we will be able to come up with marketing that will fit and work for that group of people.   My impression is that right now most of our marketing is focused on already skilled role-players and MUDers.  I hope players think about sharing this mud with e-mail and pen and paper based role players.  Actually, its not that hard to learn as one's first MUD.  Even people who maybe just like to write creative stories or who have no idea (or are scared of) role playing might learn to like Arm.  Also, don't count out people who may not be top role players.  If they have potential and are willing to work on their skills, maybe even invite them... they could get better.

Someone brought up crafting, about the only time I get board crafting is when I have absolutely no idea how something is crafted.  Personally, I think the delays are fine... after all they are told about in the Docs.

Newbie help ideas.  I think anyone can see how much this game is actually newbie friendly.  Many come up with ideas to help newbies, are willing to answer questions, etc.  As long as the –player- feels welcome and does not become too lost or frustrated... they will continue to play the game no matter how many characters.

Sometimes the game can be hard to explain.  Remember the outstanding logs posted in the Role-Play section of the docs.  These examples will show new people exactly what you are talking about and what they can expect in game.  If you are trying to show the format, you can list it.  If you are talking about the think command, give an example...if you want to stress the harshness of the world again, an example will help you explain your point.   There are many fine docs posted all around (not just in help files) and older players may want to equate themselves with the information available.  


I think giving out a bit more OOC information will help new players as well.

Without starting the debate on how long an IC day should be, I think esp. newbies would benefit from learning approximately how long things are.  For instance... how long should one wait to get a reply?  Icly people should be used to waiting weeks and sometimes months to get a reply from say a job offer or to deliver a message or anything like that.  Believe me, these questions do come up.  

What is a good background for someone who Icly has been living in a town all their life, but the player has absolutely no idea where anything is?  What do you do when you, the player, makes a mistake but its something your character should know?  How do you bring up Icly when someone is gone for so long?  These little questions can add up to big frustration with new players.  That's why they need to constantly be told that new players are like that ***WITHOUT putting down new players as somehow bad role-players***

[My 2 sids]

A few thoughts about how to interact with new players...

Sending newbies off into "schools" or the byn is fine, but remember the blind leading the blind get no where.  These places Icly need to be respected for what they are and NEED role players who are not newbies to join them.  The more experienced players that join, the better over all role play there will be and the more chance new players get to see good role playing.  

If you play a character of power who needs to "discipline" a new player's character... please keep the new player in mind.  I'm not saying go easy on them... but it needs to be handled in such a way the new player understands what happened.  It's one thing to have a templar kill you for making rude gestures to him, its quite another to die at the hands of a noble lady when you the player have no idea what happened.  Lecture as you punish (go over what they did wrong), pick a punishment that will allow the –character- to learn as well.  There are far too many deaths and not enough whippings/tortures.  Death isn't the only thing that makes this world harsh.  And if none of this is possible to do Icly, email the mud and ask a helper or someone to fire off a note to the player.  

One last idea, if you find yourself in need of making a new character and are alright interacting with a new player, why not advertise on the GDB?  Many times its just too hard/intimidating to strike up a conversation Icly.  I would think many newbies may feel more comfortable if they knew (or knew they would meet) at least one person in game.  It would also make for a wonderful way of mentoring that individual.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

I recently have been on a MUD where folks get an automated 'tips' personal echo for as long as they need it. It can be turned on and off.

This perhaps would be a helpful feature. They would show up like this every two minutes or so. I'll give an examle of what the first one should perhaps look like.

=======================================
Welcome to Armageddon. If you are new to the game, feel
free to message on the helpers shown on the following page
on the Armageddon website:

WWW.ARMAGEDDON.ORG/BLAH/HELPERS.HTML

These people will be able to help you through various
nuances of the game. These are special staff-approved
players who have knowledge of the game at large and can
assist you in your first foray into the world of Zalanthas.

To turn these tips off, type 'notips' and press enter.
======================================

This would direct many folks to the correct place for help, I think. I think that you would find a great many folks who would consider this newbie friendly and yet non-intrusive on the game world at large.

[creeper386]

I use to play Achaea (an excellent mud in it's own right) One of the nicer features was the ooc Help channel--any player could listen in and answer newbie questions without breaking rp. Allowing newbies who haven't created their first character to talk on Help would also be nice--quite a few players are probably lost just because they can't get a sense of the mud before investing time creating a character (I know that's what turned me off six years ago when I first discovered Armageddon). Others are possibly lost to the intimidation of creating a background and description without realtime feedback from other players.

I'm going to have to say there is a reason we don't have this. It's probably relies on the reasons we have dedicated players that the staff has allowed to work as helpers. You can email them, some have IMs. They are quite helpful. Also the staff tends to be good about answering major problems sent to the mud account, and the GDB is generally a good form of help from time to time when people aren't giving completely ridiculous answers.

OOC channels well almost ALWAYS turn off someone looking for a true RPing MUD. I know if I log in and see OOC flash acrossed my screen every few minutes, or every few seconds, I might stick around to poke at the code for abit but I'm not going to stick around for any length of time.

There are ways to ask for help. Can even ask before you ever create an account. Can get help with descriptions/histories. Can get help with just about anything. And most the time in real time response. More people just need to use it. If I remember right there are links all over the new information for helpers.

Creeper

[JollyGreenGiant]

One of the things that impressed me the most about Armageddon when I first came here was the complete and utter lack of ANY channels.  I like not having any channels, including OOC channels.

If email isn't fast enough, some of the Helpers, easily identified by the word "Helper" on the GDB are kind enough to supply various IM identifiers, allowing you to potentially get help very quickly.  

Perhaps in addition, an IRC "help" channel could be created (and the address posted on the main website).  There exists a potential for abuse, but the channel could be set up in such a way as to minimize this.

Anyway, the point of all this is to say that as Creeper suggested, there are people who would be just as happy to never see another channel again, especially an OOC one.

[Armaddict]

Agreed. Global channels suck.

[X-D]

I hate globals too, if I wanted to be in a chatroom, I'd hit IRC.

[Tmp]

The website explains that there is movement delay, and that it isn't lag. There is ALSO occasional lag, but that's just the usual internet lag that you'll find anywhere.

That shouldn't be an excuse not to have immediate feedback to avoid confusing the player. It's a sign of bad interface design when users are left to consult the manual to figure out whether a delay was lag, or indicative of a purposely designed movement delay.

This goes for some of the other actions/commands in the Mud, which I knew confused me to no end because of their lack of feedback whether entirely or incomplete. (I can't remember which ones in particular anymore ... being a newbie seems so long ago ... some skills/commands gives you minimal feedback messages that you're left hangin and wonderin if that's all to it and get confused as to whether it's normal or maybe just lack of your skill)

[Carnage]

Ugh, the last thing I want is this MUD to be watered down into some 100% newbie friendly piece of crap. Why don't we use big colorful ansi letters to welcome new players and make some annoncement channel that tells us when a new character/account is made?

Arm has a steep learning curve. If you won't take the time to learn it then you probably won't have time to fuck around with your character.

[sacac]

that reminds me.. Last saturday, I was looking for a mud to play while Arm was down and I found this one.. Created my character(answering the what race are you BS and all the other stuffs.) Then I joined.. And I was like "Disco.. get the funk up" seeing them bright colors, Then I was getting talked to by channels after channels(which scared the hell out of me for some reason:() Then I was like "Hey! I can turn this off, can't I?"
and they said "Yea just type blah blah(or some sort like that)" Then I was walking round.. killed by a turtle.. And sent to hell to find my soul and find a river and find 20 tokens to pay the river crosser. An I was like "AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH, Where do I find tokens?" Then there "All over the place. you have two hours before your permanetly dead" Then I clicked the X at the tp right corner and never looked back

What are the symptoms for Armadicction?

[crymerci]

That's what I love about you, Carnage-baby.  You're always so full of sunshine and showtunes.

[John]

I think some of these ideas might have some merit. I think the newbs should e-mail the mud account suggesting them. After all, what can it hurt?

Thanks a lot to the newbs though It's good to see newbs offering ideas on how to lessen the learning curve

[X-D]

What? I'm actually with carnage here *cringe* I see the steep learning curve as a very positive thing for armageddon in the long and short term.

Players who are willing to wade through everything, the docs, the curve, several dead pc's in a short space of time, are the ones that make this game, nearly all of us here have done so, Now, you want an example of a mud that does everything they can to help newbies, try archea...eeewwww.

Now, on the movement lag, I've see several different muds that have mv delay, one is Shadows of isildar, now, nothing against that mud, but the before and after style of mv lag and the little counter thing is just annoying.

I've also seen the.

east
You begin moving east.
.
.
You move east.
.
.
<prompt>
Thats even worse, specialy if things are going on, you sit there going, why in the world do I need this extra spam?

Anyway, in this current batch of newbies, I have run into several that really are trying, So, I help, when I can, using OOC or by setting example, and the ones who are not gonna try, well, you see them standing around naked and linkdead till a reboot.

[number13]

Players who are willing to wade through everything, the docs, the curve, several dead pc's in a short space of time, are the ones that make this game, nearly all of us here have done so, Now, you want an example of a mud that does everything they can to help newbies, try archea...eeewwww.

Compared to most other muds, archea is a work of art.  In spite of a convulted combat system, it has a large player base because of the dedication to helping noobs through the learning curve.    

I don't believe it's desirable for armageddon to have an archea sized player base--but it wouldn't hurt to think of additional ways to covert a few more of my fellow newbies into dedicated players.  

Little things like semi-detailed maps of the towns (er better than the ones in the help file) and perhaps a primer on how to survive in a given region might go a long way...for example, it took me while to finally stumble on to the Office of Mining and the templar's water "store".  Seems like my character should have already known how to find these places and why they are important.

I finally just broke down and made a crappy map of my homecity.  Seems odd that I had to resort to dungeon crawling techniques just to figure out how to get 'round my homecity.

[JollyGreenGiant]

Yeah, I don't like the idea of more spam to my screen.  Let's face it, not only does the website documentation explain that movement generates lag, but the help files for most commands, both on the website and in game, explicitly state whether delays are generated before a command, after, or both.

I also see the learning curve as something good.  A highly structured, roleplaying-intensive game environment like Armageddon needs people to read the documentation before they jump in and start playing.  A learning curve ensures that people will go back to the documentation for things - for the first couple of weeks I played, I kept the website help docs up and used them extensively; this not only gave me the answers I was looking for, but often pointed out things I needed to know that I handn't previously come across.

[Grey Area]

I think the difficulty level is just fine. After hearing of Armageddon from a friend and looking over the docs, I came into the game fully expecting to take a dirt nap during the first few hours. Instead, my first character survived in Allanak for a healthy 11 days of playtime.

Everything a new player needs to know is right there at their fingertips, and anybody who leaps straight in without taking the time to give the documentation even a cursory glance entirely deserves their wretched, screaming fate. They've got the docs. They've got helpers. They've got this board. I picked up the answers to everything that puzzled me just from skimming the GDB. Leave the learning curve the way it is.

[spawnloser]

Well, symptom number one...intolerance for all other inferior games.  I think you've found that one already.

[My 2 sids]

There is a big difference between keeping high standards and providing the tools nessisary to keep those high standards.

Now, I'll even agree we don't need an OOC room or whatever they are called... but I think it's counterproductive to be this highly cliquish group and then whine that we have no new players.

[Siasha]

I've only been playing for about five days now (jesus...and my online time on Arm has been over half that), and I thought I'd hate not having at least one channel. And I don't. It's bloody great. Wasn't too sure about the games lack of colour, but a few subtle colour triggers, and problem solved.
But speaking as a new player, the learning curve is fine. The MUD I came from had a pretty steep curve as well, so maybe I'm a little more desensitied to it than someone who came from a hack and slash background. I've spent hour upon hour upon hour, going through the helpfiles, and posts on this board, and gradually I'm learning, and picking up things.
In fact the website is one of the things about Armageddon that stands out in my mind. The wealth of information there is astounding, and if a potential player is unprepared to use such great facilities on their journey into, and through Zalanthas, then are they really the kind of players you want to attract?

They've got the docs. They've got helpers. They've got this board.

Add to that the ability to learn, the will to roleplay, and a computer with internet access (and a few gallons of your favorite caffinated drink of course) and that's all you need.

[SwanSwanHummingbird]

My 2 Sids hit the nail on the head.

A steep learning curve is -never- a good thing by itself.  All it does is turn away large numbers of people who could help take this simulation we enjoy so much to the next level.  When you're an experienced player who -can't find a job- because all the clans are -full-, that is the next level of realism I'm talking about.  We need to triple or quadruple our current player base just to fill out the nameless, faceless vNPC's in the world.  All the clans would reopen....it would be incredible.

BUT...we need to teach new players to do that!  And as it stands now, learning to play armageddon if you have no prior MUD experience is about next to impossible.  If you have MUD experience, you'll at least know the basic commands, but you won't know a damn thing about the world, it doesn't matter how much documentation there is.  Some things just have to be experienced to be understood.

So, what I'm saying is it would be ideal if we could beam the knowledge of armageddon into all the newbies heads so there would be no learning curve at all, but without that we should still do everything we can to lower the hump (while maintaining our standards) and to help them over it.

[Anonymous]

And as it stands now, learning to play armageddon if you have no prior MUD experience is about next to impossible.

Excepting about 4 hours of playing Achaea, Armageddon was my first mud.

Honestly, I think the biggest thing that will keep newbies coming back is the same thing that made me come back.  Seeing a bunch of other PCs who were playing at an amazing level of RP.  The rich in-character roleplay that I think is still the case (if not more) is what had me hooked from the start.

People coming from most any other mud or an mmorpg are used to a minimal amount of IC interaction peppered mostly with OOC jokes, comments or discussions.  Walking into the Gaj and seeing all of these people interacting and filling the room and bringing it alive is what brought me here and kept me here.

In other words, helping newbies is best done by showing them how awesome the gameworld can be.  Its that sort of thing that makes enduring the learning curve worthwhile, much more than having any sort of newbie school, channel or ooc breaks.

IMHO.

[Stroker]

It's bloody great.

HA, you said it!

[ShaLeah]

I barely read the docs when I first started, despite being urged to do so by both the mud and the friend who brought me here.
All I read was this.

http://www.armageddon.org/
http://www.armageddon.org/intro/ (I actually clicked on these links)
and
http://www.armageddon.org/rp/

I spent a LOT of time in game watching people, staring in awe really.  I broke character and said "How do you do (whatever) a few times. I was helped and offered help by a few people and eventually I ended up seeking information through the web pages and reading the then GDB.

I don't think the learning curve is that harsh at all, I think new player patience is low.  Unfortunately, it's not until people "get it" that these things stop bothering them so much.

I kinda like this idea:

I recently have been on a MUD where folks get an automated 'tips' personal echo for as long as they need it. It can be turned on and off.

This perhaps would be a helpful feature. They would show up like this every two minutes or so. I'll give an examle of what the first one should perhaps look like.

=======================================
Welcome to Armageddon. If you are new to the game, feel
free to message on the helpers shown on the following page
on the Armageddon website:

WWW.ARMAGEDDON.ORG/BLAH/HELPERS.HTML

These people will be able to help you through various
nuances of the game. These are special staff-approved
players who have knowledge of the game at large and can
assist you in your first foray into the world of Zalanthas.

To turn these tips off, type 'notips' and press enter.
======================================

This would direct many folks to the correct place for help, I think. I think that you would find a great many folks who would consider this newbie friendly and yet non-intrusive on the game world at large.

If the game itself was going to have a distraction in order to help newbies, I'd rather see something like that than a global ooc channel.

Another option would be to have an NPC in the hall of kings come to life and bother the newb with help.    (Yes, yes, I -know- the imms are busy, I was joking!) Actually... it'd be nice to have some Arm-addicts go Imm from every time frame of the world so that they can be nothing but newbie helpers, chase newbies around and pester them!

Okay, so I need to lay off the caff.  Anywhosoever, I like Arm's level of difficulty when learning it at first.


She who remembers quite vividly being a newbie...

[Bestatte]

The game I came from wasn't diku-based, nor did it have the "emote" system. It relied on a verblist and "act" which prefaced every sentence you typed with your character's name (yes, we saw people's names, but we still took the responsibility of introducing ourselves and pretending we were meeting unnamed strangers).

Coming to Arm was like coming to a whole new world, as if I had never played any game before. The only similarity, was that it was text-based, and moving "north" worked the same as in the other game.

The learning curve wasn't that difficult for me, I caught on pretty quick, and was lucky to have bumped into someone who happened to have time to give me a running start my first day playing.

But an idea that I'd like to suggest, that I will take from what the other game did, is the following:

When a character shows up on a brand new account for the first time, it flags the staff with a system message. At that point, either an IMM, or a Helper who's been paged with a "send" would get to an unoccupied room in their current city, and use a toggle to poof themselves into the Hall of Kings.

The IMM or helper would then talk to the new player prior to his picking the town he shows up in. They'd ask if the player had any questions before entering the world - if they understand that their half-elf is going to be treated like scum, or their elf is going to be mistrusted, if they understand about the perception of magicks by the general populace, and if they know what a templar is.

The player would be encouraged to ask anything, from combat mechanics to syntax to RPing a house servant, and anything inbetween. Most questions would be answered with links to the website, though "simple" stuff would be answered in as much detail as the player seems to need at the time. Things like - I read about emotes, and see the examples, but it's different trying stuff "live" so could we practice a bit? Stuff like that would be gone over in full - with encouraging words to let the player know his efforts are appreciated -even if he still needs work.

Once player and helper/imm are satisfied that the new player is ready to dig in to Zalanthas, the helper/imm would poof back to the private room and the newbie would be left to join the world.

If the player says "Nah, I don't need to read anything. I know Diku like the back of my hand!" they'd be reminded that this isn't a normal Diku, and that the Dark Sun genre is not a Tolkeinesque hobbit-land. He would be asked again - if he has questions, and given links to the main newbie pages on the website. If he insists that he knows everything and doesn't want any help, then he'd be left to his own devices, for good or for ill.

This, I think, would really help new players who WANT to play Arm, and not just some mud-hopper who picks it because it's near the top of some alphabetical list on a mudsite somewhere in cyberland. It would also warn mudhoppers that there ain't no free rides, or free lunch, and if they don't read and pay attention to things, they'll just end up frustrated or pissed and leave, having wasted their own time and anyone who tries to help them.

It will also encourage new players who are on the fence - those who have potential to be awesome members of the Arm community, but don't really grasp the depth and aren't sure how they feel about it, or were intimidated by the vast size of the documentation and couldn't deal with wading through it all. Not the ones who had no intention of reading - or don't care if they muck it up for others or not. I mean the ones who THINK they might like Arm, but just can't handle so much documentation up front.

I think something like this, a system to help new players live, in the Hall of Kings so that they're outside the RP area and still inside enough to see actual demonastrations of syntax and commands - and try some themselves - would be a huge help.

[The7DeadlyVenomz]

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I like this idea.

[Tlaloc]

Actually, I beleive some of us do try to intercept new players in the Hall of Kings, or at least, as soon as we find them in genneral. I know this has been something I've been dealing with lately, with a couple of other immortals, as self-appointed Newbie Wranglers.

Usually what we do, is occasionally search the 'who' list for new players, and if we see them looking lost (ie, wandering around aimlessly, looking for the bazaar, asking NPC's random questions, etc), then we intercept them, toss in some RP, and try to point them on thier way to a more 'Newbie Friendly' area - usually the local bar scene. Usually during this time theres alot of asking the new character about thier background, and figuring out which clan might suit them the best, and an attempt to get them into said clan. Sometimes this is the Byn (heh), but I've successfully gotten newbies hired into Houses like Kadius, Tenneshi, Winrothol...

As a player, I've watched out for newbies, and tried to take them under my wing, and I encourage everyone to do so, as well. I think alittle OOC hastle is worth it to get one more addict hooked on Crackageddon.

Unfortunately, we can't be everywhere, and when we're not bogged down becaues of time issues (due to spending time doing things like planning HRPTs, or whatever), we sometimes get caught up in other restrictions of staff-dom. However, we do our best.

Have any new players reading this been (or think they've been) the recipients of the Newbie Wrangling? How did it affect your descision to keep playing?

[creeper386]

Personally I think if your going to go to that level. It's be easier to set up a seperate port with a small little area accessible to helpers and staff and allows them to okay people to be in there so they can help them with things.

Overall though. It's just going to be alittle more help to the people that are sticking around, and a waste for the people that won't stick around. The learning curve isn't that difficult if someone acctually uses the resources provided. Even plenty of things that points out that it's alittle more then neccessary to read at least some of the documents. Although I could see more emphasis on helpers being more helpful. There are a few links but from reading the site it seems more of a last help you look into. Get people to email/PM helpers first. This may get helpers spammed some, but can always get more helpers for the basic, "New Player" sort of thing. I know even myself can bring someone into Arm with no MUD background and not too much mental strain on either one.

It's all there that a new player needs. May be hard to find, or seem like too much to read through at first but it's all there.

Creeper

[Rindan]

I actually have seen what Thaloc is talking about.  I e-mailed the MUD after words and told them what they did was awesome.  I believe it was Myrdryn who did it.  Some poor newbie picked Red Storm as a starting point and had either been killed once or simply mugged because he was stark naked.  An imm animated the bar keeper, gave him some clothing, and paired the newbie up with me and another patron in a little mini quest that sent him to Allanak, gave him some more starting coin, and in general put him in a MUCH better place then where he was.  I personally think that that sort of stuff does more to help then anything else.

You really can only spoon feed a newbie so much.  All of the information is there.  While we can continue trying to find ways to shove the information that is already there in a newbie's face, I think that the best solution really is just to get said newbie with other skilled players.  Once hooked up with other players I think that newbies stand a much better chance of staying.  Between the GDB, the sick help files, and a mind blowing website, I don't think you can make finding information any easier.  I don't think another newbie guide is going to help.  I think the burden is on the players to teach the newbies and get them involved.  Where the imms can I think they should throw in a lending hand and hook players up with newbies.  The example of a newbie in Red Storm is a great example.  An imm hooked a newbie up with a few players and get the newbie to a better place along with some clothing and starting cash.  The newbie didn't exactly get his hand held, but he wasn't left to the wastes.  I think that is the direction that things should go.

[Gorobei]

Have any new players reading this been (or think they've been) the recipients of the Newbie Wrangling? How did it affect your descision to keep playing?

I'm not a new player but, yes, this is a great service you're doing, Tlaloc.
On my first day of playing an imm followed me around the bazaar, animating various NPCs, helping me out when I got captured by the Ministry of Trade, etc.  That was enough to get me to log on a second time (I probably wouldn't have if not for the imm), and I found a nice, encouraging piece of mudmail.  So, I stuck around, and here I am.

[__Torax__]

GREAT BALLS OF TREGIL SHIT, MUK UTEP! :twisted:

[Sanvean]

My 2 sids wrote:

I hope players think about sharing this mud with e-mail and pen and paper based role players. Actually, its not that hard to learn as one's first MUD.

I've thought about this and it's one of the reasons Darklyn put together the flyer that's on the community page, which sorely needs updating. If anyone is interested in updating that, go for it. I don't have the Adobe authoring software, so I haven't. That's the sort of thing that could go up in game or bookstores.

I like the automated tips idea and will ask our coders how possible it is.


Tmp wrote:

This goes for some of the other actions/commands in the Mud, which I knew confused me to no end because of their lack of feedback whether entirely or incomplete. (I can't remember which ones in particular anymore ... being a newbie seems so long ago ... some skills/commands gives you minimal feedback messages that you're left hangin and wonderin if that's all to it and get confused as to whether it's normal or maybe just lack of your skill)

Please feel free to bug or idea something that you think should provide more feedback, and include what you think the feedback should be. We've worked on making these friendlier over time, but haven't caught them all.


number13 wrote:

Little things like semi-detailed maps of the towns (er better than the ones in the help file) and perhaps a primer on how to survive in a given region might go a long way...for example, it took me while to finally stumble on to the Office of Mining and the templar's water "store". Seems like my character should have already known how to find these places and why they are important.

I think the whatyouknow documents need to be updated - I'll add them to my list but if anyone wants to step up and suggest how various ones should be worded, go for it. By the same token, if anyone is interested in joining the Publicity group, which coordinates trying to publicize the mud and discussing how to broaden the playerbase, please PM me and I'll add you to that group.