Increase elf strength

[MeTekillot]

Don't gotta make it human level. But it sucks. It sucks. It fucking sucks. It sucks so much. Oh my god. What the fuck. It fucking sucks. It's awful. Terrible. Horrible. Absolutely garbage. Crippling, to be honest, if you get hit with it low enough. You can get strength so low your starting gear puts you at 'easily manageable'. What the fuck?

[PriestlySiren]

While we're at it, let's raise agility and wisdom for half giants.

Or. Prioritize strength.

I'm against this.

[MeTekillot]

Prioritize strength so you can be mediocre instead of crippled, good idea.

[MeTekillot]

Strength determines both your chance to hit and how hard you hit. High agility is helpful for dodging but it sure isn't helpful when you're wearing 0 armor and someone manages to tell you about your life right to the neck with the lofty heights of your 80 hp.

Of course, reasonably, an elf would make up for their physical frailness by doing fight shit in a group with the advantages that confers, but good luck with your 0 clan options, lmao

[Lizzie]

Even with AI strength your elf will not be really strong. But he/she will have other attributes that humans won't be able to match. You have to just accept this, and learn how to play it. "Easily manageable" start can be rough but isn't a deal-breaker. Stow your starting sids in the bank and hang your waterskin on your belt, and you'll probably end up "light."

[MeTekillot]

Please tell me more about how elves are actually balanced and that's why people play half-giants more than elves

[MeTekillot]

Are dwarven wisdom and agility the same level of pathetic in comparison to human levels that elven strength and endurance are?

[Lizzie]

Please tell me more about how elves are actually balanced and that's why people play half-giants more than elves

Who's claiming that they're balanced? I'm addressing your very specific concern about elves not being strong. They are not strong. This shouldn't be news to you, it's been that way for a couple of decades. A new player might have a legit gripe because they might not realize that "not strong" really REALLY means "not strong."

I've never played a city elf. I -have- played a desert elf, mundane ranger with non-special non-magickal subguild. This is how she started, out of chargen:


Code Generated Long Description.
You are 39 years, 0 months, and 5 days old,
which by your race and appearance is mature.
You are 87 inches tall, and weigh 9 ten-stone.
Your strength is very good, your agility is good,
  your wisdom is above average, and your endurance is exceptional.
You are neither hungry nor thirsty.
Your health is 129(129), you have 179(191) stamina, and 103(103) stun.

You have been playing for 0 days and 0 hours.
You are standing.
You are currently speaking allundean with a desert accent.

129/129;179/191;103/103> Your encumbrance is very light.

The combination of stats is what made her codedly awesome, not any singular stat. That was Quirri's Claw. She ran the desert at "reasonably manageable" almost continuously. Sometimes got stuck at manageable for a few days, but I never emphasized stealth with her so it didn't really make that much of a difference. As I said - you play up the strengths, and downplay the weaknesses. Or you can work on the weaknesses to get them as efficient as possible, even if it's still limiting. And then play up the strengths.

That's how I always work on the code of the game, and with very VERY few exceptions it has worked in my favor as far as coded playability is concerned.

[MeTekillot]

Your singular anecdote has completely destroyed my argument with facts and logic. All I need to make city elves playable while still being a complete joke as a coded threat is to game the code with decades of experience? It's so simple.

[Lutagar]

d.elves are fine, being able to snipe people from stealth out in the wllderness is OP as heck

c.elves are a joke and need buffs either in the form of tribes, skills or stats and no shut up playing as an character that can't get hired into any clans (apart from the byn where they're worthless) and codedly can't do much nearly as well as other races isn't hard mode it's just unfun pretentious ego-stroking

[tapas]

Strength values as a whole need to be looked at.

It's never felt like bad agility, endurance or wisdom rolls were much of an obstacle.

But with a low strength roll it's like you need to prepared to get your ass washed by virtually anyone who prioritized it. Skills don't seem to matter that much. Leather armor will virtually defeat you. Carry weight will be a chronic concern.

And that zero day dwarf fighter with a club will smash you in two hits.

It might be tolerable to the legacy ranger with overloaded defense. But with any other 20 day character, it's a daily disappointment.

[Synthesis]

The staff don't care how much city-elves suck, as long as we keep playing them.

The solution is simple:

STOP PLAYING CITY ELVES

Just stop.  Don't play them for the challenge.  Don't play them as a temporary PC just to fuck around with.  Don't play them because you love the idea of them and just put up with all the trash coded disadvantages.

Boycott them until they get fixed.

[lostinspace]

D.Elves is pretty solid, I don't think they need buffs.
I am too ignorant of the facts with C.Elves, I have no opinion.

[JohnMichaelHenry]

Haven't played many city elves. A few. Almost always roguish types. They do have some nice advantages, including the ability to dodge very well with their high agility, along with a certain skill that all elves get. Straight from the docs:

Notes:
The differences between city elves and desert elves are only the result of their differing lifestyles--there is only one elven race.

Elves are not strong -- in comparison to most of the other humanoid races of Zalanthas, they are quite weak. They possess other abilities to compensate. If you are not happy running a character that is physically weak, you are advised not to choose this race.

So, two points from here: One, if there is only one elven race and the only difference is the result of differing lifestyles, maybe it would be better to give city elves the same coded stats as desert elves. I don't know for certain, but it does seem like desert elves are both stronger and have more endurance than city elves. Maybe staff could verify this.... Two, Elves are not strong We were warned. For the record though, if city elves do have to have sucky strength, they should have more cool stuff to make up for it. I mean, sucky strength, not being able to ride, not being able to join clans, can be rather crippling for what could/should be a fun character concept.

[Jarvis]

As someone who has played countless city elfs and enjoys doing so, I think them being pretty weak is what makes them so great. Hence why they must resort to skullduggery and things alike to get what they want. And if some of my C Elfs were any stronger, they would of made off with literally everything that wasn't nailed down in your apartment.

That said, I can see why this a valid point, but why not just play a half-elf then?

[Nao]

After playing one for quite a while, I honestly don't think celves need fixing. They have significant weaknesses, but they also have significant strengths in other areas. Utilize them.

[Eyeball]

City elf something/empowerment Rukkian to overcome strength woes. You're already going to be viewed as criminal scum even if you aren't, so what's throwing some magick into the mix.

[Jarvis]

City elf something/empowerment Rukkian to overcome strength woes. You're already going to be viewed as criminal scum even if you aren't, so what's throwing some magick into the mix.

This dude knows whats up.

[roughneck]

The staff don't care how much city-elves suck, as long as we keep playing them.

The solution is simple:

STOP PLAYING CITY ELVES

Just stop.  Don't play them for the challenge.  Don't play them as a temporary PC just to fuck around with.  Don't play them because you love the idea of them and just put up with all the trash coded disadvantages.

Boycott them until they get fixed.

You've played some pretty cool celves my man.

Rash was great, though he had the coded tribe support.

And you were Prystick, too, weren't you? Also a great celf.

Not disagreeing that the race needs some work, but there's fun play to be had.

[Synthesis]

Rash started out coded Sandas (and had AMAZING stats for a pickpocket), and had a custom magick subguild before magick subguilds were a thing, at a time when the tribe was open and being supported by staff.

Prystik started out independent, but I was playing during a time when the coded elven tribes were open and had staff support, and he eventually was recruited and rose to become the Voice of the Jaxa Pah.

See a common theme, there?

[Dar]

I'm totally against increasing strength on celves.

It might be beneficial to make celves minimum hp to be 90. Just avoid dumbass blink out story ends

[yousuff]

I'm totally against increasing strength on celves.

It might be beneficial to make celves minimum hp to be 90. Just avoid dumbass blink out story ends

95 even, but I agree entirely with this. I'd almost be inclined to consider lower values to be in the unplayable threshold

[manipura]

Rash started out coded Sandas (and had AMAZING stats for a pickpocket), and had a custom magick subguild before magick subguilds were a thing, at a time when the tribe was open and being supported by staff.

Prystik started out independent, but I was playing during a time when the coded elven tribes were open and had staff support, and he eventually was recruited and rose to become the Voice of the Jaxa Pah.

See a common theme, there?

I see a theme....back in your doctoring days you named characters after symptoms and prescription drugs.

[Strongheart]

After playing one for quite a while, I honestly don't think celves need fixing. They have significant weaknesses, but they also have significant strengths in other areas. Utilize them.

^
Thank you - I am glad that a lot of people don't realize the potency of a city elf ;]

[Heade]

I'm totally against increasing strength on celves.

It might be beneficial to make celves minimum hp to be 90. Just avoid dumbass blink out story ends

95 even, but I agree entirely with this. I'd almost be inclined to consider lower values to be in the unplayable threshold

Umm, can't humans have lower HP than that?