Men and Women: Flirtacious Bothering

[bcw81]

I'm still a mite peeved that people laughed at my male combat person for wearing a dress simply because he was a man. Gender equality people.

[Jihelu]

If I wore a skirt ic people would shit on me but if I asked a helper in chat they would say its perfectly fine and canon to do so.
Make up your mind game.
MAKE UP YOUR MIND.

[Jingo]

Well I mean. Yeah. I played a character that had long fingernails and wore khol with some feminine clothing. And everyone assumed I was playing a male whore?

[SuchDragonWow]

I'm still a mite peeved that people laughed at my male combat person for wearing a dress simply because he was a man. Gender equality people.

Gender equality and sexual dimorphism are not mutually exclusive, and I'm not sure why you get peeved about it.

ETA:  I can't recall seeing it anywhere, but I presume cross-dressing isn't taboo in Arm culture.  Like, when you're intentionally trying to appear as the opposite sex, not wearing women's clothing to be edgy.  Anybody know?

[Dar]

Does anyone know any kind of historical reasoning why men gravitated towards using pants and women skirts? Aside the whole scottish stuff. Seemed like that fashion was pretty pervasive across many cultures and continents.

[boog]

I feel like it had something to do with riding horses.

[Pale Horse]

I'm still a mite peeved that people laughed at my male combat person for wearing a dress simply because he was a man. Gender equality people.

Gender equality and sexual dimorphism are not mutually exclusive, and I'm not sure why you get peeved about it.

ETA:  I can't recall seeing it anywhere, but I presume cross-dressing isn't taboo in Arm culture.  Like, when you're intentionally trying to appear as the opposite sex, not wearing women's clothing to be edgy.  Anybody know?

This has been brought up, before..as has much topics, really.

I think the arguments eventually come out saying that a male wearing a dress would not be ridiculed for being a male wearing a dress because a dress is feminine and grrly, they would be ridiculed for wearing something that is not cut for their body.  Same with a female wearing a codpiece designed for a male body form.  Sure, the dress/codpiece might have some practicality (it covers/protects the body) but it would not be unimaginable that they would be on the receiving end of some "fun-making" because of it.  It is more about the "hilarity" of seeing someone wearing something "funny."

[Lizzie]

It has to do with Judeo-Christian dogma:

Deuteronomy 22:5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God.

[Pale Horse]

I feel like it had something to do with riding horses.

From what I remember in the (loooong ago) history courses I took, the rise of trousers sprung up among many different cultures that made use of the horse as a mount.  It was practicality and I had a professor that speculated that the same practicality carried it over to everyday use for either gender.

[Lizzie]

As for in-game donning of dresses, I think it depends on the dress. If the dress is described such that it's clear that it was made to hug curves, tapering in at the waist and flaring out at the hips, with bust darts - then it was clearly made for a female body.

Just like pants - if they have a front flap, it's probably designed for a man, so that he can whip it out to pee without having to drop his drawers.

[Dar]

It has to do with Judeo-Christian dogma:

Deuteronomy 22:5 The woman shall not wear that which pertaineth unto a man, neither shall a man put on a woman's garment: for all that do so are abomination unto the Lord thy God.

That really doesnt explain why Native American people, people of Asia, Slav, and Scandinavia all had similar differences. 

This is what I'm kind of wary of. Here we have a fact of historical life. It has "nothing" to do with gender inequality. But because someone, somewhere, somehow made it into gender inequality 'as well', then if a person is really looking for ways to get offended, they're gonna get offended.

[Pale Horse]

As for in-game donning of dresses, I think it depends on the dress. If the dress is described such that it's clear that it was made to hug curves, tapering in at the waist and flaring out at the hips, with bust darts - then it was clearly made for a female body.

Just like pants - if they have a front flap, it's probably designed for a man, so that he can whip it out to pee without having to drop his drawers.

Agreed.

[Raptor_Dan]

Didn't experience this a couple years ago. Wore dresses, no one batted an eye, got several compliments. Kohl and earrings too, and on both earrings! GASP. Nothing. Feel like the long fingernails were part of the problem, maybe, not sure, not enough info. Never enough info. *weeps*

How come I never get that kind of treatment as much as others do?? I'm good at shutting that shit down.

Girl: Why are you wearing a dress?

Me: Why are you wearing pants?

Man: Why are you wearing a dress?

Me: Why aren't you?

I've had male hookers too, but no one ever seemed to be nearly as interested in the pretty, twenty-year old, buff male hooker as they were the forty-year old, greying, female hooker. Then again, if that's all I played, one, then the other, back and forth, my stats would change.

[Raptor_Dan]

Side note, you people got deep. I say you guys all of the time, and I love analyzing my language and making it more accurate, with all of the help I can get from folks like Lauramars. How did I miss 'you guys' remaining in my everyday language?

[SuchDragonWow]

I think the arguments eventually come out saying that a male wearing a dress would not be ridiculed for being a male wearing a dress because a dress is feminine and grrly, they would be ridiculed for wearing something that is not cut for their body.  Same with a female wearing a codpiece designed for a male body form.  Sure, the dress/codpiece might have some practicality (it covers/protects the body) but it would not be unimaginable that they would be on the receiving end of some "fun-making" because of it.  It is more about the "hilarity" of seeing someone wearing something "funny."

That is the gist of my comment about dimorphism.  Men and women are two different genders, and their equality in Armageddon and their physiological differences are not part of the same argument.  Clothing made for the female figure probably does not fit the male figure correctly, unless the description of the item gives that impression, or your main description describes your awesome manboobs.  Getting peeved because people laughed that you apparently can't dress yourself is an odd sentiment to me.

[BadSkeelz]

Men and women are different sexes. "Genders" are a socially-constructed set of rules and characteristics that may or may not be keyed to a particular sex.

In Zalanthas, I would only question a man wearing a dress if he was fighting in it, just as I would someone who only fights in plain clothing.

[SuchDragonWow]

Men and women are different sexes. "Genders" are a socially-constructed set of rules and characteristics that may or may not be keyed to a particular sex.

Fair point about the definition of gender, but a man wearing ill fitting clothing still has nothing to do with gender equality.

[bcw81]

To say a piece of clothing is cut wrong for a man (without said piece of clothing specifically describing boob-holsters) is about as silly as saying any piece of armor an elf can wear is cut wrong since it was intended for a human.

[SuchDragonWow]

To say a piece of clothing is cut wrong for a man (without said piece of clothing specifically describing boob-holsters) is about as silly as saying any piece of armor an elf can wear is cut wrong since it was intended for a human.

Yo, but it is.  That's why we have tailors.

[bcw81]

Yes. That's exactly the point. A tailor can fit a garment to your body shape in the same way they can resize that piece of armor Dead Amos the Human was wearing for Giant McGiantston.

[Beethoven]

I think it's fine to say that the trend in Zalanthas seems to be that women typically wear skirts or dresses rather than men. Even the docs hint that some clothing items are more commonly worn by one gender than the other.

That may differ from culture to culture. There may be some tribes or whatever where men wear skirts just as often as women, etc.

I don't think it makes sense to ridicule a man IG for wearing a skirt, however, because there is nothing ridiculous or weak about being feminine or female. It may not be the usual clothing trend, but it's nothing to particularly mock.

That's the way I prefer to see it.

[SuchDragonWow]

I don't think it makes sense to ridicule a man IG for wearing a skirt, however, because there is nothing ridiculous or weak about being feminine or female. It may not be the usual clothing trend, but it's nothing to particularly mock.

Yeah, I don't think I would, since nothing in the fashion docs mentions it.  I'm more likely to give you Hell if you're not following those docs, really.  If you're rocking a short dress with your hairy legs and buttcheeks all hanging out, and your manboobs crammed into cleavage, and we're in Allanak, that's where it becomes a thing for me.  

[Desertman]

I remember a couple of great male characters who wore dresses.

I can honestly say I never laughed at them IC for it. I laughed behind the keyboard a lot though. It's pretty damn funny almost every time.

Most of the time the character wearing the dress ALSO goes out of their way to point out they are wearing a dress, because they are doing it for attention, and want people to notice "I"m a man wearing a dress, give me attention and give me a reaction.".

[Dar]

There is an Kuraci jacket that specifically mentions "feminine" in it's sdesc, on account of a custom design to fit the female anatomy. I've once wore it as this rinthi grebber and had a lot of funny conversations about using the cavities for breasts as a way to smuggle spice.



PS: The idea got shot down, because everybody knows those cavities are the first things the soldiers grope during those gate searches.

[bardlyone]

I'm with the group that sees the dresses/skirts thing as a nonthing. FFS a kilt is a skirt of a certain cut, and no one ever says anything about those. I think it's fair to say that like everyone else who's forced to use a tailor when something doesn't fit properly in order to wear it, dress guy likely did too, so those darts are hugging pecs.