Macros...

[Asmoth]

I have to say, this is more a pet peeve of mine than a complaint or legitimate gripe, I just wanted to see how the general consensus is interpreted.

In regards to the movement macros thing from ask the staff, I personally don't give a shit because I don't see all the scroll unless I'm following him and that's going to happen whether he moves a maximum code allowed pace or not.

What does bother me is players who spam my screen away with seven line long removing and changing of clothes every time the weather changes or everytime they go outside.

Again, totally not a huge deal because I will eventually just code in gags for people doing it so I don't see it, but I wondered if this bugs anyone else?

[Refugee]

Kudos to people who are RPing well enough to be changing out of their armor, and changing clothes according to weather!   

It is spammy though, changing out your gear.  I think it bothers me more as the one doing it than the one seeing it, because I'm self-conscious about spamming people - but when I'm the one being spammed in this way, I understand there's nothing they can do about it.

[JackGibbons]

Yeah, well I meant specifically for staff who are monitoring our actions for general staffy purposes.

If I'm nuking their screen with a sudden:

"S
S
W
W
W
S
S
S
S
W
W
W
W"

I would rather not hit that point where they're not annoyed enough to say anything to me, but are annoyed enough to squelch me, and thus miss out on the rest of my stellar attempts at RP

[Fujikoma]

If this is out of doors, I hope their direction sense is high enough... along with everyone following them at least wearing the appropriate protection methods. Heaven forbid a faster beastie should plow up on them.

[Malken]

It shows what kind of gamers we've become when we need to make macros to automatically take us from one spot to the other and how we also can't stand to wait 10 minutes for our mounts to rest up.

WHEN I WAS YOUNGER, MOUNTAINS USED TO CLIMB GODDAMIT

[Delirium]

Even back then, people still wanted FLYING SHAPS

[hopeandsorrow]

Heh, Macro's don't bug me that much.  Wish there was a way to control screen spam.

I feel a tinge of guilt when I need to unload a bag in front of some one and can't use the empty command.

Or spam sell a bunch of stuff.

Thing that always kind of jars me that we suspend disbelief when it comes to folks who wear their helmet in their sleep, at the bar, while sexing.

Like Zalanthas was inhabited by special needs people who for their own good need constant head protection.

Removing a helmet and storing it EVERY time you do something not related to combat does get annoying, I've tried it.  I just gave up at a point.

[Marauder Moe]

Kudos to people who are RPing well enough to be changing out of their armor, and changing clothes according to weather!   

This.

I think the benefit of wearing clothing/armor more realistically easily outweighs the occasional screen of spam that might happen if someone can't find somewhere private to change.


I don't like navigation macros, especially outdoor ones, and my opinion of someone using them will suffer.  However, I don't see them as a major problem with the game at the moment.  (And I suspect often enough they can prove to be actually dangerous.)

[fourTwenty]

Thing that always kind of jars me that we suspend disbelief when it comes to folks who wear their helmet ...at the bar...

Pssht. You're not drinking enough.

[Seeker]

Even back then, people still wanted FLYING SHAPS

Ha!

[Incognito]

Whenever I play a PC that has dual lives - one in one location and another in another location, I always make sure I swap out a lot of my gear.

While I understand that this could spam someone's screen - please also understand that switching gear is a must - not only for RP - but also for sheer survival (wont go into more IC details on that - but I think its easy to figure out what I'm hinting at here).

Coming to the part about macros - I personally use them - because, not using them and manually typing rem/wear a ton of times doesn't really reduce anyone's spam, and just increases my typing.

[Asmoth]

Whenever I play a PC that has dual lives - one in one location and another in another location, I always make sure I swap out a lot of my gear.

While I understand that this could spam someone's screen - please also understand that switching gear is a must - not only for RP - but also for sheer survival (wont go into more IC details on that - but I think its easy to figure out what I'm hinting at here).

Coming to the part about macros - I personally use them - because, not using them and manually typing rem/wear a ton of times doesn't really reduce anyone's spam, and just increases my typing.

So you're trying to avoid child support payments?

I envision you being a Kadian Agent who works in Allanak, but has a commoner logging family in Morins and you go there to visit every now and again.

(Scene: Kadian Estate)
The silk clad foppish man stands in his private room and quickly changes into a bunch of leather and dons weapons.

He makes his way to the stables and orders the stablemaster to not say he's seen him on fear of death by fancy designer cooking knives that Kadius sells.

(FADE)

(Scene: Outskirts of Morins)
Disguised Fop rides into view on in an Inix, a burly built woman who could kick his ass turns from the tree she's chopping down and yells off into the distance, "Kid's your dad is home!  Go help him with his bags!"

After Fop dismounts from inix, the burly woman smacks him on the ass and says, "I've been missing this..."

(FADE)

[Incognito]

Whenever I play a PC that has dual lives - one in one location and another in another location, I always make sure I swap out a lot of my gear.

So you're trying to avoid child support payments?

I envision you being a Kadian Agent who works in Allanak, but has a commoner logging family in Morins and you go there to visit every now and again.

LOL - If I were the Kadian Agent, I'd definitely NOT have a mistress who could beat me up, unless I had some Fale-ish blood in me - then all bets are off!

[hyzhenhok]

I can't really think of any situation where I would be bothered more by a macro executing a series of commands any more than I would be a fast typist. There is not much functional difference from memorizing how many w's and s's it takes to get from the Byn Compound to the Gaj and entering it all in manually every time, or doing it with a macro.

Same thing for changing clothes. I will say the >remove and >wear commands could probably stand to have post-delays so it's not quite as silly.

[Lizzie]

I don't use macros, but I do use aliases for spells whenever I play a spellcaster. Everything else I type out, and use my numeric keypad for directionals. I don't care if other people use them or not, however I ask that they please PLEASE add a reasonable delay time between commands. Nothing screams spam more than:

sit bar
open pack
get coins pack
buy #4
buy #4
buy #4
buy #4
buy #4
put mug bar
put mug bar
put mug bar
put mug bar
hold mug put coins pack
close pack
drink mug

Repeat similar for stabling a mount, renting a mount, preparing for a ride out to a combat situation, or any other activity that involves more than three commands.

[RogueGunslinger]

I use a very simple system for spells on Mushclient.

Alias:
cbath * *

Send:
cast '%1 un vivadu pret wril' %2



>cbath wek gith

you utter the incantation 'wek un vivadu pret grol'
OK.
You call upon the element vivadu, and a bath appears around lanky, yellow-skinned gith, a yellow rubber duck bobbing in its waves.

You could add an extra * for un/nil if you want.

[Lizzie]

I use a very simple system for spells on Mushclient.

Alias:
cbath * *

Send:
cast '%1 un vivadu pret wril' %2



>cbath wek gith

you utter the incantation 'wek un vivadu pret grol'
OK.
You call upon the element vivadu, and a bath appears around lanky, yellow-skinned gith, a yellow rubber duck bobbing in its waves.

You could add an extra * for un/nil if you want.

That's exactly the aliases I use (except mine is pbath, which covers the gith in pink paint and stuffs a lollipop in his mouth). Just don't forget to click the "expand variables" box on the right side of the edit buffer.

[JackGibbons]

I can't really think of any situation where I would be bothered more by a macro executing a series of commands any more than I would be a fast typist. There is not much functional difference from memorizing how many w's and s's it takes to get from the Byn Compound to the Gaj and entering it all in manually every time, or doing it with a macro.

Same thing for changing clothes. I will say the >remove and >wear commands could probably stand to have post-delays so it's not quite as silly.

I personally feel that the day goes by so fast, and emotes/says take a long time to play out compared to how much you could actually get said in a whole evening, that anything in a solo setting that frees you up to get back into RP faster is a good thing. In this case, going back to your residence and spam-changing alone with a macro in 5 seconds so you can head over to So and So's party and get some actual RP in, instead of investing more time and keystrokes solo-changing first is a win in my book.

[lostinspace]

I use a very simple system for spells on Mushclient.

Alias:
cbath * *

Send:
cast '%1 un vivadu pret wril' %2



>cbath wek gith

you utter the incantation 'wek un vivadu pret grol'
OK.
You call upon the element vivadu, and a bath appears around lanky, yellow-skinned gith, a yellow rubber duck bobbing in its waves.

You could add an extra * for un/nil if you want.

I like this a lot, mine are all like this:

>cbath1 gith, where 1 in this case is hardcoded to be wek. It works well enough, your solution is more flexible and you don't need 7 aliases for each spell

[catchall]

Same thing for changing clothes. I will say the >remove and >wear commands could probably stand to have post-delays so it's not quite as silly.

The problem with delays in that kind of situation is that instead of getting one instantaneous chunk of X lines of scroll, you get X individual lines and X empty lines over X*T time and if the player is using a scrolling prompt, they get X repetitions of their prompt as well.  In other words, you've attempted to "solve" the problem by making it much worse.

In this case, going back to your residence and spam-changing alone with a macro in 5 seconds so you can head over to So and So's party and get some actual RP in, instead of investing more time and keystrokes solo-changing first is a win in my book.

In principle I agree, delays should be reserved for actions with gameplay implications that call for a delay, not just because "it makes sense" that the action takes time.  However, keep in mind that private time to slip off and change into your finery is also an IC event with IC implications just like farting around at so and so's party -- particularly if there's someone with a mind to put a knife between your PC's ribs while they're in their underwear.  In that case, instantaneous spam-changing can rob them of their realistic and well-roleplayed chance to make that happen.

To me, then, it makes sense to have a delay only on armours, possibly based on weight relative to strength, since they provide combat benefit, and it is also realistic that they should take a bit longer to fit correctly.

[najdorf]

I think macros are frowned upon by staff.
I previously had a macro that saves in every 1 min, cause back then I was kind of obsessed with saving.
Staff found out about it and warned me not to do again.

[Delirium]

How long ago?

Staff have gone on record that it's okay to have macros as long as you aren't using them abusively (aka excessive automation, like having a "forage salt" script running while you play WoW).

[najdorf]

How long ago?

Staff have gone on record that it's okay to have macros as long as you aren't using them abusively (aka excessive automation, like having a "forage salt" script running while you play WoW).

8-9 years ago I believe.

[hyzhenhok]

I think macros are frowned upon by staff.
I previously had a macro that saves in every 1 min, cause back then I was kind of obsessed with saving.
Staff found out about it and warned me not to do again.

The automatic thing is what gets you in trouble here.

Shortcuts that allow you to enter a series of commands with a single command are perfectly kosher, because they still require the player's input and don't do anything the player couldn't do himself anyway.

It's things that automatically play the game for you via timers or triggers that are bad.

[Asmoth]

The main example of this was seeing this everytime I went outside

Asmoth removes his hat
Asmoth puts his hat in his backpack
Asmoth get his sunglasses from his backpack
Asmoth wears his sunglasses
Asmoth raises his hood
Asmoth zips his jacket
Asmoth puts on his earmuffs.

In two seconds slammed across my screen.

[John]

The automatic thing is what gets you in trouble here.

The idea that hitting save (a completely OOC command) every minute is acceptable and yet having a macro automatically do the same thing is unacceptable. The only thing I can think of is that staff were concerned on the strain this was putting on the server (8-9 years ago is a long time in the IT world. What we wouldn't bat an eye at now would have been terrible 8-9 years ago).

What's next? I get in trouble for having a macro that types in WHO every 5 minutes and yet as a player it's acceptable if I type it in every minute? That's not adding up.

[hyzhenhok]

The automatic thing is what gets you in trouble here.

The idea that hitting save (a completely OOC command) every minute is acceptable and yet having a macro automatically do the same thing is unacceptable. The only thing I can think of is that staff were concerned on the strain this was putting on the server (8-9 years ago is a long time in the IT world. What we wouldn't bat an eye at now would have been terrible 8-9 years ago).

What's next? I get in trouble for having a macro that types in WHO every 5 minutes and yet as a player it's acceptable if I type it in every minute? That's not adding up.

I find it extremely unlikely even 8 or 9 years ago anyone on staff would have thought there was a strain on the system.

It isn't a matter of harm. The principle of the matter is that if the player wants something to happen in the game, he should have to take an action to make it happen. This is a pretty common anti-botting principle in many games. There's no compelling reason to make OOC commands an exception.

[Dan]

The main concern staff side was probably seeing you saving while manipulating items in a save room? Where on a crash it might duplicate items. Other than that, someone had you in a clan and was watching the whole clan, seeing you save every minute would get old if you were just idling.

[Delirium]

The automatic thing is what gets you in trouble here.

The idea that hitting save (a completely OOC command) every minute is acceptable and yet having a macro automatically do the same thing is unacceptable. The only thing I can think of is that staff were concerned on the strain this was putting on the server (8-9 years ago is a long time in the IT world. What we wouldn't bat an eye at now would have been terrible 8-9 years ago).

What's next? I get in trouble for having a macro that types in WHO every 5 minutes and yet as a player it's acceptable if I type it in every minute? That's not adding up.

both of those examples (hitting "save" or "who") which you quoted are perfectly fine. I have a macro that hits 'time' every 5 minutes to keep my router from deciding I need to lag out.

an example of something that isn't perfectly fine:

an elaborate macro that equips your PC, gets a mount from the stable, hitch/mounts it, rides out to the salt flats, grebs for a day, and then rides you back, all without any input from the player.