Look Echo for Hemote 2016

[najdorf]

great idea. adds depth to raider vs. victim interactions too

[RogueGunslinger]

A fantastic April 1 prank would be to give "skills", "stat", and "weather" a room echo.

Also "time", "eq", "inv", "look self"

Look self already echo's.

[Beethoven]

A fantastic April 1 prank would be to give "skills", "stat", and "weather" a room echo.

Also "time", "eq", "inv", "look self"

Look self already echo's.

Don't mess with me, RGS.

[RogueGunslinger]

Err. Now you've got me wondering if I'm wrong.

[BadSkeelz]

remove '>look self'

#have2usemirrors2016

[Beethoven]

I'm always habitually typing look self. I have to edit gobs of 'look self' spam out of my logs. Don't tell me that other people can see my narcissism.

[valeria]

I'm pretty sure it doesn't echo...

[Jingo]

#psi intercept 2016

[Delirium]

I'm always habitually typing look self. I have to edit gobs of 'look self' spam out of my logs. Don't tell me that other people can see my narcissism.

I do this a lot, mostly to make sure I'm not carrying around something dumb or forgot to take off/put on some piece of equipment.

I keep forgetting that you can put 'armed' in your prompt and would probably gloss over it if I did, anyway.

I'm 99% positive "look self" does not echo unless you attach a command emote.

[BadSkeelz]

>equip shows you what you've gotten equipped, if you'd care to skip your mdesc. >look me does show what you look like to others, so some advantage there. I'm also 99% sure it doesn't have an echo either.

[Beethoven]

[Thunkkin]

Woo! Been hoping for this for yeeeaaaaaaaars. THANK YOU THANK YOU.

[whitt]

-Look changes
  -Look <character> now treated as a hemote, includes any emotes attached to the command, and can be spotted with watch the same as hemote
  -Look <direction> shows items of sufficient weight.
  -Look <direction> does not show empty description for hidden items.

Woot!

[Chettaman]

xD
I can't tell if it's a joke! But I hope it's not!

[Vositus]

>equip shows you what you've gotten equipped, if you'd care to skip your mdesc. >look me does show what you look like to others, so some advantage there. I'm also 99% sure it doesn't have an echo either.

I still prefer to >look me. It's invaluable for combat heavy roles seeing as how we're almost always armed and/or covered in blood...

God damn I love this game.

[Jingo]

I don't like this change.

[Kankfly]

I don't like this change.

I don't either.

Here's my gripe about it:

For me, I always treat 'look' as a blatant look, unless emoted 'with a glance'.

My reasoning is, if you can read this guy's mdesc down to his last toe scar, and see his equipments down to the thong he's wearing in his pants, then that's a blatant look.

If you walk into the Gaj and everyone that is in the Gaj looks at you, then you would notice that people are looking at you.

Now you have to look at people - which becomes a hemote, and then you have to emote about looking at them.

>look bob
>em eyeballs ~bob.

When this solution can be managed with just 'look bob (eyeballing !bob)'.

I get the argument that you can't always spot someone looking at you immediately, or from across the room. In that case, why don't we just put in a new code command? Like, 'glance'? Glance will only show partial information about the PC you want to look at, for example, just the equipments, or just the main description. That way, when you look at someone, you're looking, checking out his looks, the color of his cloak, if he's wearing that Kadian armband, what weapons he's actually using.

For me, I feel this look as a hemote is just a partial solution and not the full one.

[LauraMars]

STAFF DON'T LISTEN TO THESE NAYSAYERS

74 votes in favor 7 against says this was the right decision right

RIGHT?

[Delirium]

I like the change, but it needs other things added to address concerns.

So, ok, how about this.

"look" should stay as it is (hemote), except it does not show mdesc, only sdesc and gear.

"study" command should be added with warning echo and pre-delay. This replaces old look and is a blatant "looking you over from top to bottom"-type command. It shows mdesc. It can be command-emoted. It doesn't have to be a hostile interaction - think somebody checking you out, or looking directly at you, or, yes, staring you down.

Other option but with huge potential can of worms:
look continues to show mdesc, but cheap, widely available mdesc hiding gear is introduced. Study and peek reveal mdesc.

Just spitballing here, but I think the main concern is the amount of information given in a "possibly hidden" look - remove mdesc from the equation and I think we'd be good.

[Lizzie]

I like the change, but it needs other things added to address concerns.

So, ok, how about this.

"look" should stay as it is (hemote), except it does not show mdesc, only sdesc and gear.

"study" command should be added with warning echo and pre-delay. This replaces old look and is a blatant "looking you over from top to bottom"-type command. It shows mdesc. It can be command-emoted. It doesn't have to be a hostile interaction - think somebody checking you out, or looking directly at you, or, yes, staring you down.

Other option but with huge potential can of worms:
look continues to show mdesc, but cheap, widely available mdesc hiding gear is introduced. Study and peek reveal mdesc.

Just spitballing here, but I think the main concern is the amount of information given in a "possibly hidden" look - remove mdesc from the equation and I think we'd be good.

It doesn't address the problem. The problem is, how do I know whether or not to roleplay staring at someone, if I have no idea if they have some feature worth staring at? The only way to tell if someone has something worth staring at is the current LOOK command. I look at the guy - see that he's rather ordinary, no one that I know, nothing unusual, and now I know I can safely ignore him, OR try to get to know him, or not give him any more attention than I'm giving any other ordinary person in the room that I don't know.

BUT if he has a humpback - then I'll know that I really do need to react to seeing it now. Whereas - if his mdesc is hidden, I won't know about something THAT blatantly obvious.

I'd end up studying every single hooded person or person I don't already know, and we're right back to square one - except now I'm stuck with a clunky delay in addition to the awkwardness.


In short: I treat the "look" command as an ooc device, to give me, the player, more information about the scene I'm in so that I can know whether or not my character needs to react to the scene appropriately. I append the "look" command or supplement "look" with a follow-up emote when I know that my character is already reacting in some fashion. Opting in (adding emotes after using the OOC device of "look") is much more flexible and graceful than opting out (pretending you didn't actually see something to avoid the ooc device from becoming an IC thing).

[whitt]

In short: I treat the "look" command as an ooc device, to give me, the player, more information about the scene I'm in so that I can know whether or not my character needs to react to the scene appropriately. I append the "look" command or supplement "look" with a follow-up emote when I know that my character is already reacting in some fashion. Opting in (adding emotes after using the OOC device of "look") is much more flexible and graceful than opting out (pretending you didn't actually see something to avoid the ooc device from becoming an IC thing).

Agreed.  I'd like it if look (emote) still echoed, because that's a look "with effort".  Whereas the plain old look is the same look you give every person walking towards you on the street.

[Delirium]

Something as obvious as a hunchback would (and should) be in the sdesc.

[LauraMars]

what if he's got a hunchback but he also has a huge tumor on his nose, dreadlocks, and a missing hand?

you can't fit every single easily noticeable, distinguishing characteristic into an sdesc

[Lizzie]

Something as obvious as a hunchback would (and should) be in the sdesc.

Yes, you're right. But it isn't always. It often isn't, in fact. I've seen more "dark-skinned brown-eyed" people with massive scarring and disfigurement or unusual inks, than PCs whose players have actually included those features in their sdescs. I typo them, but usually nothing comes of it and the massively-disfigured dwarf remains "the short stocky dwarf" for the rest of his existence as a PC.

In addition, someone with several blatantly obvious features won't be fitting them all on an sdesc, because it has a fairly short character limit. I've seen plenty of this as well, so it's not a rare "what if" impossibility.

[Delirium]

These seem like edge cases that the player should be RPing via emotes regardless. But... fine, what would you suggest that can be easily implemented without sacrificing look hemote?

The third suggestion I have is to revert look back to an echo but have a "brief look" command that turns them into hemotes.

or maybe it should just be >brief party

Wherein eat, taste, drink, sip, and look all turn into hemotes. Haw.


Honestly, the best case scenario is likely the introduction of the study command alongside mdesc-hiding gear, but people seem really opposed to that for some reason.

Personally I like the suggestion and think it solves everything neatly (and leaves "mdesc" in normal looks for the Lizzies who just HAVE to know if you have a wart on your nose).

Keep in mind that unless the person is smart enough to change out their gear, a mask - mdesc hiding or not - isn't going to save them from suspicion.