How do you feel about PC killing?

[ShaLeah]

... insta-gank me without so much as a bit of preamble would intensely infuriate me.

Hell just dying pisses me off. I still rather be murdered than die to an NPC. I wonder how many times your characters have been murdered cause most seem to happen in a rather sudden, can't really get out of it kinda way.

[Scarecrow]

Looking at the responses here, I feel like a mass murderer.

[Vwest]

Looking at the responses here, I feel like a mass murderer.

You pretty much are.

You always keep it classy though, so don't feel bad

[Barzalene]

I'd find that a problem(people not looking for good alternatives to murder) if people actually were PK'd more than they were offed by NPC's, storage, and suicide. Sadly that just isn't the case. PK's are actually kind of rare, in my experience.

And honestly there's only SO creative you can get with revenge before things escalate.

I think what she means is that death threats and the willingness to escalate violence is too prevailent. I think that pks aren't as common as we might enjoy. Actual murders are neat. There were many pcs I've met over the years who had a knife in the back coming, but my pcs didn't have the wherewithal to get it done.

But I also have gotten death threats after an argument about who would skin the scrab which felt not like the world was harsh, but people'd by overgrown 8 year olds.  Sometimes you deserve a knife in the back. Sometimes you need a punch in the nose. They're not interchangeable.

[little chicken woman]

Kill my character any time you like. Really, as bad as I felt about it, I have no qualms with my character(s) being offed, ever, and especially would enjoy so if it's well played.

The only problem is that unless I'm not watching the screen closely enough for whatever reason I tend to avoid not screwing up the common-sense things that would make me as easy a target as that guy whose mdesc is unformatted who doesn't know how to use the talk command.

I got staff to kill me once. I thought that, hey, we're doing a thing where perhaps a random death out of fucking nowhere on one of us would actually be really fucking cool, so I wished up.

Unfortunately I had to disconnect and missed every emote of it, but I'm secretly kind of proud of that night.

What has made me never make a raider pc is that I sort of expect six out of ten of my victims to run and spam flee while I'm trying to emote, two of them to stay and then successfully flee as we fight and I never see them again, and one to stay with an unusually calm demeanor and end up making me look like a total flake who's never trained as they kill me. The one I do kill, has friends that ensure I will be spam-killed as soon as I'm alone by nighttime tomorrow.

Well I suppose those aren't terribly bad odds. Raiding is starting to sound like fun.

Personally I believe I have never directly killed somebody, and through the process of being alive have indirectly caused the deaths of three to four and gave twice as many of those close calls or survival reasons to leave a tavern early. I don't really feel bad about pking someone; I've never felt depressed or anything after being pked; I try to train myself to give up attempting to be long-lived, to genuinely enjoy those times and rp when it looks like someone in the same room is likely to get the mantis head. That's why the last attempt on my life was so fun. That was great.

As for vnpcs killed through initial backgrounds.... I'd say more than thirty, and less than fifty. A few were mass murderers.

[X-D]

Heh, Scarecrow...if I totaled up my PK numbers, You would feel better.

I have had Single PCs get around 20 kills.

As to how I feel about it. Same as I feel IRL, Killing is a permanent solution. And so, if somebody attacks one of my PCs, My Pc, if possible will kill them, as they have already shown to be a threat. And fully half my PKs have been self defense. A few duels to the death...which I enjoyed, well one the person that made the challenge ran...it was several RL days till I was able to catch up with him and deal out the death part of that duel. The rest were split pretty evenly between bounties and "He a needed killin" EI PCs who ignored rules, broke rules/laws did things on certain tribes lands after repeated warning, did not give in to raids, were raiders, killed/raided/attack friends/family/tribemates of my PCs. Oh, and mages.

And several accidents...but I do not count those.

[racurtne]

I'm kinda turned on by that.

Heyyyy       http://maleminded.tumblr.com/post/8352519487

On topic: I've never had a PC die to an NPC. I've been PK'd twice. Once was a couple arrows that were deserved. Another was when I was Linkdead. Honestly, neither made me angry or upset at all.

I think it's just part of the experience. I do believe, however, that there should be more less-than-lethal violence at times. The problem with that is most players often put their PCs in positions where by all rights they -should- be killed. Few people want to play along and betray what they consider to be their PC's loyalties. Or they want to murder you in retribution for public humiliation or something, so you have to nip that in the bud since it's -going- to escalate. Few people are willing to watch their PCs be brought low, be humbled, be wretched, fall from grace, be controlled in any way. This causes their PCs to die at the hands of other players (often authority figures). I've seen a lot of PCs be warned and not take the hint (and I'm not talking about ludicrous 'who skins the scrab' situations). I've seen people assume they are going to die, and therefore not want to have their PCs break (I suppose so that they are not remembered as traitors/weak/whatever). Sometimes they are right, of course. Some actions just don't fly.

I'm perfectly fine with ending a character. It's a story, and I enjoy the uncertainty in my own characters' lives. It's what makes the game exciting. That being said, I think what I said earlier bears repeating.

Oftentimes, you may not realize it, but you are asking for it.

[Riev]

I played a Templar once, and he was talking to a PC that got so fed up with him that he walked away and rolled his eyes. It wasn't an hemote, he outright walked away and rolled his eyes. Naturally, my Templar got upset at the lack of respect and told him to get back here. The guy ran into his Clan Compound like a tregil. Templarman wasn't afraid of the Clan Compound, and wished up to be let in. The guy ran out past the Compound gates, but not before I was able to set him to wanted. Rather than be carted off to jail, he killed like 3 Soldiers before they struck him down.


In all seriousness, I was going to tell the guy it wasn't smart to be so rude to me, in Public, and maybe give him a nasty talking to. Rather than accept the humbling, he ran from the law, killed officers of the peace... I mean. Come on. AND THEN HE COMPLAINED TO ME OOCLY BECAUSE HE KNEW WHO I WAS. Like Racurtne said... sometimes you people are just asking for it.

[HammerofJericho]

I played a Templar once, and he was talking to a PC that got so fed up with him that he walked away and rolled his eyes. It wasn't an hemote, he outright walked away and rolled his eyes. Naturally, my Templar got upset at the lack of respect and told him to get back here. The guy ran into his Clan Compound like a tregil. Templarman wasn't afraid of the Clan Compound, and wished up to be let in. The guy ran out past the Compound gates, but not before I was able to set him to wanted. Rather than be carted off to jail, he killed like 3 Soldiers before they struck him down.


In all seriousness, I was going to tell the guy it wasn't smart to be so rude to me, in Public, and maybe give him a nasty talking to. Rather than accept the humbling, he ran from the law, killed officers of the peace... I mean. Come on. AND THEN HE COMPLAINED TO ME OOCLY BECAUSE HE KNEW WHO I WAS. Like Racurtne said... sometimes you people are just asking for it.

Agreed. You prove you don't want roleplay...and I'll just off you rather than give you more options, simple as that.

[James de Monet]

I accidentally PK'd someone who was AFK once. In my defense they were somewhere they should not have been, sleeping, and AFK. Still feel bad about it, even though my char would (and did) shank that with glee. I didn't even realize they were AFK until I initiated combat and they're just standing there awkwardly fighting me, not drawing weapons...ugh.

I can't say I regret my other PKs, though.  I do mull over such actions more than other things, but as long as they're IC...

I think one of the other common causes of unnecessary PC deaths (besides overweening pride) is inflexible characters. Just because you dream up your character as a bad-ass, or a smart-ass, or a loon, or a free spirit, or whatever, doesn't mean that character (if a real person) could never get simple and acquiescing in a hurry if they thought they were going to die.  Players who are threatening your PC's life almost always tell you what they want you to do, in my experience. If you listen, and do those things, you will generally live (or get seriously betrayed, but, you know...). But players (especially newer players) always seem to feel the need to make their characters into cults of personality. Just a thought; if seeing a little of your character's personality pissed off someone dangerous, more of that same personality is probably going to piss them off more. Also, the more you talk when in trouble, the more likely you are to say something stupid. Stay simple, stay alive!

[Mooney]

I think one of the other common causes of unnecessary PC deaths (besides overweening pride) is inflexible characters. Just because you dream up your character as a bad-ass, or a smart-ass, or a loon, or a free spirit, or whatever, doesn't mean that character (if a real person) could never get simple and acquiescing in a hurry if they thought they were going to die. 

Hear, hear! I for one definitely assume every character out there will gladly and quickly kill me if they are able (and reading some of the replies here, that seems like the correct default assumption to make) which means that no matter how gutsy s/he may be, you can bet my character's going to take a checkmate very seriously and cave accordingly.

I completely support the whole free-PC killing and instadeath because in my mind, they make for truer, more immersive RP. You are really pushed to understand what lines your character will cross to live, the extent to their values, pride, loyalties, even idiocy, horniness, etc (is that hot piece of ass you just met really a safe shag?). Everyone has a price, and I've had revelations about my character when cornered.

As for personally PKing, short of an accident I haven't killed any of y'all yet. But I so want to, I just keep getting shaky cold fingers when the chips are down. Such a greenhorn 

[AreteX]

I invite more players to kill my characters.  Please!

I really do want to die more often to players.  It would make me store less!

[Fredd]

You know, It's threads like this one that make me keep trying to make a raider. IC just keeps taking me other directions

[MeTekillot]

The one I'm still mad about is the reason I don't play in Tuluk. Got brought in for questioning cuz I got attacked by a spooky nasty, accused of being in cahoots with spooky nasty because I carried weapons with me (?), blubbered and pleaded to Templar about innocence, instaganked by a slash to the neck.

The guy in charge got force stored a few weeks later, apparently, for bein a silly goose. And by silly goose I mean words inappropriate for use in polite company.

[X-D]

All that being said, I do wish arm had more methods to NOT kill somebody and that the ones that do exist be more robust.

Does not really mean I would kill less, I just prefer to have the choice rather then code quirks/shortfalls or lack of choices.

What amuses me is, there are far more ways to kill a PC available to a 0 karma mundane PC then ways to take them down without killing. And what few methods there are, are branched in most cases.
Same for when you add in magiok/karma. And mercy only works in melee and melee skills.

Sorry, I just think that is funny that the code on a RP enforced mud is actually geared towards death.


I think I will go find and necro the thread on last emote or whatever. Cause if I can't have better mercy and methods to take somebody down that do not kill right away, then it would be great to have a chance for that final emote on both sides to end a scene.

[Fredd]

All that being said, I do wish arm had more methods to NOT kill somebody and that the ones that do exist be more robust.

Does not really mean I would kill less, I just prefer to have the choice rather then code quirks/shortfalls or lack of choices.

What amuses me is, there are far more ways to kill a PC available to a 0 karma mundane PC then ways to take them down without killing. And what few methods there are, are branched in most cases.
Same for when you add in magiok/karma. And mercy only works in melee and melee skills.

Sorry, I just think that is funny that the code on a RP enforced mud is actually geared towards death.


I think I will go find and necro the thread on last emote or whatever. Cause if I can't have better mercy and methods to take somebody down that do not kill right away, then it would be great to have a chance for that final emote on both sides to end a scene.

I wish you could actually enslave a pc. And them not be force stored like. "If you want to keep playing, lets do this" that could make some very interesting rp.

[James de Monet]

I think I will go find and necro the thread on last emote or whatever. Cause if I can't have better mercy and methods to take somebody down that do not kill right away, then it would be great to have a chance for that final emote on both sides to end a scene.

I feel like this would get abused a lot by inexperienced players:

Code Select Expand

>lem WTF??

With his dying breath, the tall, muscular noob WTF??


>lem heaves all her gear into the fire

With her dying breath, the tressy-tressed noob heaves all her gear into the fire.

But even despite that....it might be worth it. Just for that chance to:

Code Select Expand

>lem A soft gurgling escapes @ as blood wells up in ^me throat, ^me lifeless eyes staring at ~killer, imploringly.

With his dying breath, a soft gurgling escapes the lank-haired man as blood wells up in his throat, his lifeless eyes staring at you, imploringly.

[X-D]

That possible abuse is nothing...already happens with ooc etc.

But yes, those are some nice examples...along with the other side.

As he prepares to pull his obsidian sword free of the lank-haired man's neck, the kinky-haired mercenary says in grunted sirihish, "I Told you I was a bad motherfucker."

Or

Pulling his long black dirk free of the lank-haired man's back, the tall figure in a skull embroidered black cloak says in sirihish, "Silky Kadius sends his regards...oh, and don't worry about that broach you stole."

Now true, you can do those anyway, but the entire point is for the other player to see it.

I believe it would turn PKs from gdb rage/quit posts more often to  Wow, cool death posts...specially on the very fast kills.


So much better then (generic backstab message)

Welcome to Armageddon!

[RogueGunslinger]

That thread was basically boiled down to "you do have a death emote, it's when you're in negative HP' If you get hit past negative hp, then you were kileld with a swift stroke and died instantly, and honestly don't deserve a last emote.

I like abrupt deaths as much as I like the drawn out ones. Maybe making negative hp go to -20 or just -15 would add more of a chance, that I'd be okay with.

[Marauder Moe]

Don't like the last words/emotes idea.

I think a better solution would be a range of health where your character is conscious but can't do anything but speak and emote (and mercy code would kick in for attackers).

[RogueGunslinger]

 

That's what negative hp is, but you can't speak. 

[X-D]

I would be happy with -20 as well, Since that would make mercy more likely to kick in and also make it so many other things mort instead of instakill.

It is also something that would be SILLY easy to do code wise.

And to Moe....That is still the same idea, I myself do not care about the method, long as it does basicly the same as the idea.

RGS's idea would fill the bill with the least muss and fuss. While still not changing when certain things really should kill you in one or two swats. Oh, no last words or time in neg HP...What do you expect, A Mek bit your head clean in half!

Although, I do wish you could hear while morted.

[Marauder Moe]

That's what negative hp is, but you can't speak. 

You're also unconscious.  So... 1 out of 3... not quite the same.

[RogueGunslinger]

Ahh, yeah. Hearing/seeing would be cool.

[James de Monet]

Although it would be harder to code, I think it would be cool if there were two stages of death. In the second one (-10 to -20) you would no longer heal naturally. This would keep people from abusing it as temp HP, create interesting RP carting your dying friends around, and still give more chances for emoting. Maybe if you could hear down to the current death point, then not in the new "verge of death", that could work out. I don't know about speaking, though.

It might also be good if you would lose HP gradually over time in the lower stage, to prevent indefinite waiting for rescue, and if you would have the ability to type "die" during this time, and give up the ghost.