New speed idea: Crawl

[FantasyWriter]

Protip: Never ever ever let yourself get below half stamina for any reason other than: OMFG, I'm going to die.
I -try- to not ever let myself get below 75%.

[Harmless]

I really dislike the idea of moving on no stamina. Too much of a change in game balance and I don't want people with water packs making it across the known that way.

But, to be more positive in this thread, I do like some things about this, like the idea that someone with a broken leg or some other awful injury would have a well-coded way to slow their movement down, that it could allow people to enter narrow entrances (maybe), that narrow entrances that people can already enter will now have a neat way to code the extra time it'd take to get through those narrow entrances.

If the imms deemed something like this worthy of a sneak chance, it'd be wilderness only.

[musashi]

Um ... it's easier for babies to crawl than it is for grown ass people.

Babies have tiny little stump legs. Adults don't. It's apples and oranges to compare baby and adult physical characteristics.

Just thought I should point out the obvious.

[BleakOne]

Um ... it's easier for babies to crawl than it is for grown ass people.

Babies have tiny little stump legs. Adults don't. It's apples and oranges to compare baby and adult physical characteristics.

Just thought I should point out the obvious.

Oh god, now I'm thinking of dwarfs crawling everywhere.

Curse you and your hilarious thought-making!

[James de Monet]

I really dislike the idea of moving on no stamina.
...
If the imms deemed something like this worthy of a sneak chance, it'd be wilderness only.

I'm certainly not suggesting one should be able to crawl at 0 stamina. I was discussing that only in the context of people's seeming ability to do so RL to decide if crawling should consume more or less stamina than walking, but even in RL, they don't get far.

And actually, I think the sneak thing is interesting in that, if you were in a crowded room IRL and someone tried to crawl out of it, 98% of the people would not notice, as that person would be completely blocked from their sight. Anyone watching them would see, and anyone right next to them. In an empty street, yes, everyone would notice. In the forest, it would be very hard to notice them, but in the open desert, the thing that makes people visible from far away is a dark, man shaped silhouette against the bright sky (or brightly reflecting sand).  Someone crawling in that environment would be less noticeable from far away due to the shortening of their silhouette, but just as noticeable up close.  In a rocky environment...could go either way.  I think if a sneak chance was going to be considered, it would have to take all those things into account. I would think, at best, it would be an untrainable skill, with about a 25% chance of not being noticed. If you want better than that...just RP crawling while sneaking, because clearly that is really what you're trying to do.

[Narf]

I really dislike the idea of moving on no stamina.
...
If the imms deemed something like this worthy of a sneak chance, it'd be wilderness only.

And actually, I think the sneak thing is interesting in that, if you were in a crowded room IRL and someone tried to crawl out of it, 98% of the people would not notice, as that person would be completely blocked from their sight.

I think if you tried to crawl out of a crowded room, you'd have everybody and their brother staring at you within a few seconds.

[MeTekillot]

Yeah. People's eyes, especially their peripherals, are attracted to movement and all that. Unless everyone in the room is so ludicrously tall that they cannot see the floor, you'll be noticed.

[greasygemo]

Every time I have ever tried to crawl out of a room, I have not once successfully avoided detection.. It always seems like a good idea at the time though..

[James de Monet]

I think that all depends on how large the room is and how crowded.  You try to crawl out of a bank or a classroom, yeah, everyone is going to be staring. But if you crawl out of a bar, only the people directly around you are even going to be able to see you to notice. Their bodies will block the people behind.  Besides, it's not as though Zalanthas has fluorescent lights. Buildings are dim inside.  Most people, if they saw anything at all, would just see a commotion around the door.

[Maker]

I thought we had parents in this discussion, or maybe their kids are so grown they've simply forgotton.  Someone earlier got it right.  Babies don't crawl first because it is more energy efficient.  They crawl first because they lack the balance necessary to stand/walk.  Crawling takes more energy because 1) more muscle groups are taxed more, and 2) a single bipedal stride is longer than a crawling "stride".

I think you'd need the obvious movement delay penalty, but also the increased stam cost.

[Maso]

Guys, I don't think realism is all that important here.  Our movement code is already pretty unrealistic.  Instead, I might suggest that we decide how we want this to impact the game before we work out specific mechanics.  We should settle on answers to the following questions:

1) Do we want to add a way for someone who is out of stamina to move, albeit possibly very slowly? - omg yes. it's -the- most annoying thing EVER. Or maybe you can go into - stamina, which is capped at like -5 and you can only crawl. Last ditch attempt to...make.......it.......to.....the......*mantis head*

2) Do we really want another mode of stealthy movement? - why not? It doesn't seem like it would actually be useful as a mode of stealth movement, per the OP's outline.

3) Do we want to force this mode of movement on characters who have lost a certain percentage of hit points? - not sure

4) Do we want a way for drunk people to move without risk of falling down? - hell yes, it would be HILARIOUS

[FantasyWriter]

I would actually like to see a slow movement position forced on PCs below X% of HP.  NPCs as well.
Near death PCs/NPCs should not be able to flee like a scalded erdlu.
This might actually discourage sparring/hunting/xp-farming beyond what a sane person would do if they were injured.
Flee as normal, then once you are in the room you fled to, you would be in the crawl position.

I think Maso's suggestion about negative stam would be cool as well.
Even under good conditions, it should take a good IG hour to get from -5 to zero, though.

Crawl should also make it easier to enter a fall/climb check room without falling.
>crawl (carefully approaching the edge of one of those nasty tablelands holes)
Carefully approaching a massive pit that could mean either a meaningless NPC-induced death or riches beyond your greatest dreams, you begin to crawl.

All of the above considered, even a relatively fast d-elf should have a good 30 second delay crawling from one outdoor room to the next.

[Maso]

I think Maso's suggestion about negative stam would be cool as well.
Even under good conditions, it should take a good IG hour to get from -5 to zero, though.

I just feel like the number of times I have been at 0 stamina (for whatever krathdamn reason, yes ok I suck at this game), but I've been like 1 or two rooms away from somewhere more inviting to sit (not necessarily safe - just like a room with some shade or a dirty puddle or a boulder to sit on or whatever, basically more appealing from an RP perspective than a life saving...thingy), and I'm just sat there thinking...if this were 'real life'....I'd just fucking crawl my ass over there.

[Harmless]

edit: meh, nobody takes this idea seriously anyway.

[lordcooper]

Just try crawling to the nearest shop and see how tired you get.

[James de Monet]

edit: meh, nobody takes this idea seriously anyway.