Half-Elfs????

[Intrepid237]

Is it just me, or are there a large number of Half-Elfs passing themselves off as humans? Like, a lot more than usual...

[Kismetic]

Is it just me, or are there a large number of Half-Elfs passing themselves off as humans? Like, a lot more than usual...

Dunno, I never really try to figure that out unless my PC would care.  Usually, they don't.

[Gunnerblaster]

By this time, in Zalanthas' history, who doesn't have a little elf in them?  

But, on a more serious note: When creating a Half-elf, it is now 'mandatory' that you select whether or not he/she looks either more: A.) Human, B.) Elf, or C.) Noticeably Half-elf.

Don't go around OOCly thinking that every 'tall' individual you come across, who says 'has muscular legs' without mentioning 'pointy ears' is some half-elf whatever trying to pass as human.

[Intrepid237]

I don't OOCly wonder about it. It's just ICly obvious most of the time. And there's a lot of them to be sure.

[Synthesis]

> hunt

You crouch down and begin looking for tracks...
>

You notice:  the tall, rangy man scratches the back of his neck, pretending to scan the horizon.

Less than an hour ago, a humanoid moved in from the east.
Less than an hour ago, a long-strided humanoid moved in from the east.

> tell malik Damnit Malik, some necker been tailin' us since we left the gates, but damn if you don't step light.

[Majikal]

> hunt

You crouch down and begin looking for tracks...
>

You notice:  the tall, rangy man scratches the back of his neck, pretending to scan the horizon.

Less than an hour ago, a humanoid moved in from the east.
Less than an hour ago, a long-strided humanoid moved in from the east.

> tell malik Damnit Malik, some necker been tailin' us since we left the gates, but damn if you don't step light.

This made me fucking lawl.

[Thunkkin]

My first character (ranger in the militia) led a templar across the desert, hot on the trail of her long-strided half-giant guard that I was sure was a rogue elf gicker.

"There's definitely long-strided tracks here. But it's as if the trail vanishes. Perhaps they're flying sometimes, Lady Templar?"

Good times.

[Gunnerblaster]

My first character (ranger in the militia) led a templar across the desert, hot on the trail of her long-strided half-giant guard that I was sure was a rogue elf gicker.

"There's definitely long-strided tracks here. But it's as if the trail vanishes. Perhaps they're flying sometimes, Lady Templar?"

Good times.

I'm pretty sure I rode in on this one, halfway through.

Either that - Or this is a common thing.

[brytta.leofa]

My first character (ranger in the militia) led a templar across the desert, hot on the trail of her long-strided half-giant guard that I was sure was a rogue elf gicker.

"There's definitely long-strided tracks here. But it's as if the trail vanishes. Perhaps they're flying sometimes, Lady Templar?"

Good times.

I'm pretty sure I rode in on this one, halfway through.

Either that - Or this is a common thing.

Done it too.

[Jingo]

Is this really a thread?

[Kismetic]

Is this really a thread?

Not really ...  the title was purposefully misspelled to give a hint.

[Cindy42]

for merchant types, I imagine being a half-elf looking human gives somewhat better wisdom and they don't need to get worried over not being able to be hired. Kind of not much motivation to create a full-blooded human, especially if your character doesn't need to know they're not halfy.

[Seeker]

I wouldn't worry about it.  

The best thing about disgusting half-elves trying to pass themselves off as humans (or alternatively as elves) is that eventually they are all destined to fail, get caught in their lies, and then we get to watch them suffer all those lovely consequences.

[Anaiah]

*cough*

Look, statistics! 

[Cutthroat]

If this is the case, I wouldn't really call it a problem so much as it is more likely just a trend.

If a half-elf player has picked to look human in chargen, then their sdesc and mdesc should be noticeably human and make no obvious references to half-elven features. You would technically have to look for half-elven personality traits in people to determine if they were half-elven. You would also have to keep in mind that human personality traits are widely varied and a human with a mental or personality disorder could act like a half-elf (or any other race, or something completely different). And lastly, since there are relatively few counted half-elves compared to humans and elves, your PC would likely be more inclined to guess an obvious human or elf is obviously a human or elf, if you can see their ears and eyes.

[Intrepid237]

I wasn't complaining about it. Just wanted ta starta conversation. And yeah, they always get caught lol.

[Kismetic]

*cough*

Look, statistics! 

I <3 u so

[MeTekillot]

for merchant types, I imagine being a half-elf looking human gives somewhat better wisdom and they don't need to get worried over not being able to be hired. Kind of not much motivation to create a full-blooded human, especially if your character doesn't need to know they're not halfy.

You really should think about things from a roleplayed standpoint instead of a coded/IRL advantage standpoint, as you seem so fond of doing.

[Cindy42]

for merchant types, I imagine being a half-elf looking human gives somewhat better wisdom and they don't need to get worried over not being able to be hired. Kind of not much motivation to create a full-blooded human, especially if your character doesn't need to know they're not halfy.

You really should think about things from a roleplayed standpoint instead of a coded/IRL advantage standpoint, as you seem so fond of doing.

Please don't. My statement doesn't give proof that I do this, and and you're just attacking me out of the blue. This is an interesting thread.

[Saellyn]

for merchant types, I imagine being a half-elf looking human gives somewhat better wisdom and they don't need to get worried over not being able to be hired. Kind of not much motivation to create a full-blooded human, especially if your character doesn't need to know they're not halfy.

Whether YOU know it or not, your character will STILL have the insane tendencies of a half-elf, regardless of the fact ICl they don't know. It'll just be thought of as them being totally fucking insane.

[Pale Horse]

There's been a lot of half-elf attention, lately..are we up to them in the hate cycle, already?

[Shepard]

There's been a lot of half-elf attention, lately..are we up to them in the hate cycle, already?

What's next again... magickers?

We've recently done, half-giant, city-elves, burlgar and pickpocket guilds....

[Riev]

There's been a lot of half-elf attention, lately..are we up to them in the hate cycle, already?

What's next again... magickers?

We've recently done, half-giant, city-elves, burlgar and pickpocket guilds....

With the opening of the Atrium, I think assassins and the poison skill are going to be coming up real quick.

[lordcooper]

Wouldn't mind seeing a little warrior hate.  That's rare enough (probably because 70% of us are playing them at any one time.)

[Kismetic]

Wouldn't mind seeing a little warrior hate.  That's rare enough (probably because 70% of us are playing them at any one time.)

No way dude, just playing a special app assassin/thug with disarm.  Don't be skurd.

[Synthesis]

Heh, if they got rid of the warrior class, I bet the PC turnover rate would quadruple.  But uh, yeah...on-topic: a half-elf merchant would likely be perceived as too unreliable for any but the most desperate business partners.

[Kismetic]

Edited for derail.

[Synthesis]

Heh, if they got rid of the warrior class, I bet the PC turnover rate would quadruple.

I always thought rangers were the most numerous, most survivable guild.  It's not?

They are generally, but not during the noob period.

[Is Friday]

If anything, rangers are the reason for the high turnover rate.

[Intrepid237]

You really should think about things from a roleplayed standpoint instead of a coded/IRL advantage standpoint, as you seem so fond of doing.

I've always seen coded advantages as a push towards proper roleplay. Like the code just lets you know your strong points and I always thought it added to roleplay. Like the higher wisdom of Elves for example. Or the super strength of Half-Giants.

[MeTekillot]

You really should think about things from a roleplayed standpoint instead of a coded/IRL advantage standpoint, as you seem so fond of doing.

I've always seen coded advantages as a push towards proper roleplay. Like the code just lets you know your strong points and I always thought it added to roleplay. Like the higher wisdom of Elves for example. Or the super strength of Half-Giants.

"Playing half-elves that look human since they get a higher wisdom stat and can just act like a human merchant" isn't really pushing toward proper roleplay.

[Synthesis]

If I were an evil coding overlord, I would secretly make half-elves who look human also roll human stats.

[Thunkkin]

You really should think about things from a roleplayed standpoint instead of a coded/IRL advantage standpoint, as you seem so fond of doing.

I've always seen coded advantages as a push towards proper roleplay. Like the code just lets you know your strong points and I always thought it added to roleplay. Like the higher wisdom of Elves for example. Or the super strength of Half-Giants.

"Playing half-elves that look human since they get a higher wisdom stat and can just act like a human merchant" isn't really pushing toward proper roleplay.

Yes, because that's what she was advocating. Oh wait, no, she was saying the opposite and that it could be a problem because it didn't provide incentive to play a human merchant. At least, that was my reading. Congrats on swooping in to lecture her for noticing this potential pitfall. None of our other posters ever notice possible code-related abuses and bring them up here for discussion, so I'm glad we're really focusing in on Cindy for this.

[brytta.leofa]

If I were an evil coding overlord, I would secretly make half-elves who look human also roll human stats.

And half-elves who look elven also roll elven stats but be rumoured to have a special rapport with beasts of all kinds?

[Nyr]

You really should think about things from a roleplayed standpoint instead of a coded/IRL advantage standpoint, as you seem so fond of doing.

I've always seen coded advantages as a push towards proper roleplay. Like the code just lets you know your strong points and I always thought it added to roleplay. Like the higher wisdom of Elves for example. Or the super strength of Half-Giants.

"Playing half-elves that look human since they get a higher wisdom stat and can just act like a human merchant" isn't really pushing toward proper roleplay.

Yes, because that's what she was advocating. Oh wait, no, she was saying the opposite and that it could be a problem because it didn't provide incentive to play a human merchant. At least, that was my reading. Congrats on swooping in to lecture her for noticing this potential pitfall. None of our other posters ever notice possible code-related abuses and bring them up here for discussion, so I'm glad we're really focusing in on Cindy for this.

Thunkkin has hit the nail on the head.  I was trying to think of a way to respond to this, but it can be broken down to:  "don't pick on players on the GDB."

[MeTekillot]

i'm just gonna say here that was my bad. Sorry.

[Saellyn]

Thank God I wasn't picking on anybody... I try not to do that whenever possible.

[Intrepid237]

"Playing half-elves that look human since they get a higher wisdom stat and can just act like a human merchant" isn't really pushing toward proper roleplay.

I don't think I mentioned anything about that. And a half-elf should still act like a half-elf. But if you disagree and think Half-Giants shouldn't roleplay being strong and whatever else I said in my post that's your choice I guess.

[NOFUN]

INT is the most useless stat once you max out your skills. If you intend to keep your character alive for a year or two then it's not worth having a high skill in. Just saying. I do base my characters around the code, so do most people which is why most HGs are warriors. Nothing wrong with it at all. But hey, kudos to whoever plays a c-elf warrior or a HG merchant.

[Bilanthri]

INT is the most useless stat once you max out your skills. If you intend to keep your character alive for a year or two then it's not worth having a high skill in.

If you want to play an intelligent character, then Wisdom is an important stat, regardless of how fast you will max your skills.

It's Role-Play, not Roll-Play.

I wonder if I'm letting myself be goaded, as this is clearly what was being pointed out just a few posts ago.

[NOFUN]

The problem with using a coded stat as an indication of your characters intelligence is this: say I happened to get a halfling with exceptional intelligence, that halfling would be a super genius compared to the average human.  But this halfling is only as smart as his or her player is OOC. Kind of seems unfair that a player is expected to role-play dumbly based off a stat while it being impossible to play a character who is far above the normal human INT accurately.

[Shepard]

We do know that it is WISDOM and not INTELLIGENCE

two different things...

Wisdom: the quality or state of being wise; knowledge of what is true or right coupled with just judgment as to action; sagacity, discernment, or insight.

Intelligence: capacity for learning, reasoning, understanding, and similar forms of mental activity; aptitude in grasping truths, relationships, facts, meanings, etc.


We do not get a roll of what our intelligence is...

[Kalai]

Intelligence is rolled into Wisdom, as per the Wisdom help file.

You can be smart and still make poor decisions. It's not that much harder to portray someone smarter than you might be, as it is to portray someone less smart than you might be fairly. In dwarves, their lack of wisdom is due more to narrow-mindedness than to actual lack of intelligence; they'll likely devote enough time to be plenty smart in particular, generally focus-related areas (learning slowly outside their area of expertise). A half-giant has entirely different reasons for a low wisdom (an actual lack of critical thought, but there's no reason for them not to learn many areas of expertise, if they wind up imitating folk who do). There's a good deal of flexibility in how to interpret a low or high wisdom if you're human, ranging from having a knack for things but no particular inclination to pry deep, to thinking deeply about matters that normally wouldn't draw attention, to being devoted to a particular pursuit and slow to try things outside it, to having an attitude that your (first) way is the best way and refusing to listen to helpful pointers about how not to shatter the stone while carving it... Stats have relevance from a coded and roleplay standpoint, but they aren't intelligence-RP straitjackets.

[Riev]

Wisdom is, from a coded standpoint, how capable your character is at learning new things.

This is why dwarves have a lower wisdom, because they are so single-minded and focused that learning something new or different takes time.

This is why Half-Giants have superbly low wisdom and go around mimicking others. They don't necessarily LEARN the skills they're mimicking until after a long time of doing it. This is why HGs make such good soldiers. After a few years, they get comfortable doing the same thing, over and over again. They are like Institutionalized Children.

Elves, on the other hand, have sharp minds, and are always looking to twist a situation in a creative direction. This is why elves have higher wisdom.



And thus, using the coded differences between human wisdom and half-elven (with human features) wisdom is kinda zonky, and the staff monitor people on a semi-regular basis. I'm sure if someone rolled a half-elf that looked human just for stats, and never really acted like or felt compelled to roleplay like a half-breed would, the player would eventually be called out on it.

Right? Because staff monitor our roleplay, and it is their job to ensure we're adhering to the documentation many of them CREATED. Right?

[Riev]

Stats have relevance from a coded and roleplay standpoint, but they aren't intelligence-RP straitjackets.

Because of how I type, and how my thoughts are organized OOCly, many of my characters come across as having more intelligent vocabulary, or seem to be intelligent. However, depending on their wisdom stat, they will make some REALLY STUPID decisions (getting mad at his GMH Agent boss and telling them to fuck off, pissing off nobility, pissing ON a templar). Sure, he's smart, but his wisdom stat was so low that in his mind, this was how the situation will be handled.

[Kalai]

Half-elves have higher wisdom than humans, and we know they always make the best and sanest decisions.  

I have this sneaking suspicion that we just renamed intelligence to wisdom, rather than actually having a measured wisdom ability.

... also, for some reason you got 'pissing on a panda' stuck in my head. Damnit. I don't like that song.   Partly because I can't even remember the melody but it is still stuck in my head.

[Nana]

Aside from a few good posts here or there, this thread is really just garbage. I come onto the general discussion board and browse after many many weeks of not browsing it, and finding this, I feel confirmed in my decision to basically ignore this particular board, and just play the damn game.

[Cindy42]

just play the damn game.

This is why I stopped GDBing so much after a while. Now its an hour max. After you've played enough, you've heard the stuff on the GDB several times, the gems are still there, but its sort of discussing things you already know simply because the game is cool.

And, no, I don't really want to read all this, especially since someone's supposed to be picking on me or something. I _could_ list advantages of human merchants over half-elven, human-looking merchants that everyone knows already but, hey,

The rock with the listen skill says, in southern-accented sirihish,
"Who gives a flying fuck?"

[Xagon]

The rock with the listen skill says, in southern-accented sirihish,
"Who gives a flying fuck?"

The paper with slashing skill does, that's who.

On topic, the Arm code cut out most of the mental stats, as compared to D&D. Charisma is superimposed by your own playing, and intelligence and wisdom are combined into the latter.

what about Half-elves that look elvish? Should they inherently get -more- wisdom compared to the human, or even the human-looking half-elf?

[Celest]

I have a half-elf character planned, but I'm not sure if high wisdom will necessitate that I RP them differently than I intend. Obviously, I can RP them however I want, but would it be in poor sport to RP them as socially naive and overeager if wisdom is their primary stat? It seems like, because it's a half-elf, the half-elfiness could plausibly trump any wisdom if I want to RP it that way.

[Marauder Moe]

No, it would not be poor sport.

As wisdom is Arm's only mental stat, I think it's fine to represent it however you want.  Reasoning, memory, charisma, perception, morality... I think you can feel free to choose what a high score means in terms of your RP.

[Cindy42]

The paper with slashing skill does, that's who.

I owe a lot of Arm deaths to that sucker. DAMN THEE, PAPER!

Yeah... I mean, I act like a fucking idiot, but I'm supposed to have an IQ of 130. Your personality always trumps your brains, for my characters anyway, probably because I can relate to that.