State of the magicker poll

[Zoltan]

Being a 'gicker in the 'rinth hardly ever works out.

So they should all be lacking muscles.  That's the only problem.

Heh.  Probably my favorite gemmer was my drunken asshole (who had great strength, because I prioritized wisdom either 3rd or 4th) who deserted from the Byn, raided noobs around Tuluk for a while, got bored and turned himself in to the Templars in 'nak, then somehow managed to get hired by Oash, and went back to raiding noobs around Tuluk (solely for personal amusement and/or enrichment).

Pretty funny lounging around the Oashi barracks covered in the blood from noobie explosions, while the other gemmed PCs are sitting around sipping tea and playing cards.  FYAD mekillots.  FYAD.

Ha, I remember that dude. My impressionable kid thought he was a total badass. I was up on my way to sort of follow in his footsteps when a hilarious gith-raping happened and I came home with my tail between my legs. 

[SMuz]

Too many, IMO, but I think the only thing to blame is that there's so many gicker guilds. A lot of people are going to try a bit of each. You might have 5 or so dedicated gickers at one time, and 20 of them who just want to try out some magick for a few days. There's 8-9 magick guilds compared to 6 mundane guilds. If it were simplified to 1-3 magick guilds, I'd bet gickers would be much rarer.

[Saellyn]

They're rare enough for me. I see a few, now and then, but unless they're wearing a big black gem that screams "GICKER" I don't really notice. So I consider not seeing and knowing as rare enough.

[boog]

Too many, IMO, but I think the only thing to blame is that there's so many gicker guilds. A lot of people are going to try a bit of each. You might have 5 or so dedicated gickers at one time, and 20 of them who just want to try out some magick for a few days. There's 8-9 magick guilds compared to 6 mundane guilds. If it were simplified to 1-3 magick guilds, I'd bet gickers would be much rarer.

I don't think they're even that popular ever, though. Sure, there's variety, but that's what subguilds are for, too. You can have a unique mundane every time you roll. Same with a gicker. I dunno. I don't even really see this as being a problem. What're they going to do? Cast at you outside of their quarter in the city where it's illegal and steal ur lootz? I guess there's always a chance of running into a gicker troll out in the desert, but in all of my time playing, I've yet to do this. (Don't get any ideas, Synth.)

Saying there are too many gickers is like saying there are too many Kadians, rangers (as said above), bards, gypsies. It comes and goes. There's really nothing to worry about.

[Saellyn]

I place a lot of faith in players playing good, fair mages (fair not meaning they're always nice or not likely to pwn you in the desert).

[Synthesis]

Too many, IMO, but I think the only thing to blame is that there's so many gicker guilds. A lot of people are going to try a bit of each. You might have 5 or so dedicated gickers at one time, and 20 of them who just want to try out some magick for a few days. There's 8-9 magick guilds compared to 6 mundane guilds. If it were simplified to 1-3 magick guilds, I'd bet gickers would be much rarer.

I guess there's always a chance of running into a gicker troll out in the desert, but in all of my time playing, I've yet to do this. (Don't get any ideas, Synth.)

You have any idea how expensive it is to stay drunk 9/11?  Sometimes I like to keep it real and not make my loot by doing [X] or [Y].  Y'all know what I'm sayin', gemmers, amirite?

[Taven]

In the absence of more engaging conflicts, I think that we've began using magickers as a crutch for inspiring intrigue in our plots.
Not that it matters... but if I had my way ( )... all magickal guilds would be drastically limited, so that the focus of the game returns to the mundane, city-state and GMH focused plots.  Zalanthas is a desert world - the story should be about two men trapped on an island with only one coconut, not catch-me-if-you-can set on endless repeat.  Magickers spread a wide wake, and while I recognize they're supposed to be terrifying and punctuate world-changing events with flashy colors and seared flesh, wine is becoming water, to the point that encountering a rogue magicker in the wilderness is commonplace, instead of being the tense, thrilling experience it should be.
...IMO.

I was suggesting that if magick had less of a presence in the world, players would be more compelled to work on plots that are more widely inclusive and hinged on Zalanthan institutions fighting for resource control.  If there is any secondary criticism, it is toward clan leaders that throw their minions at witch-hunts and call it plot.  I was writing about a problem I observed, and thus, I suggested a solution... limiting the number of magick roles.  Saying that magick felt commonplace, rather than rare, exciting, and terrifying, is giving context to WHY -I- felt it to be a fair tradeoff.

I think this was a problem once-upon-a-time, but magickers have been slapped around a lot IMHO. If you're a magicker, you have to bust your ass to get involved with the world and get a plot. It's all on YOU to find what's going down and get involved with it. The magicker is, by its nature, an isolating role. However, that doesn't mean that the PCs themselves want the isolation. It's a given that if you're gemmed you're severely limited by who will hire you. However, if you're encountering too many magickers, I would argue that it's because they want some interaction with someone. Magickers have just as much, if not more, plot trouble as anyone else.

[Cindy42]

a 'gicker inside the city but outside the rinth once made clear intentions to do fatal harm to me and i barely got out of it alive. though i suppose if you're someone important you have little to nothing to worry about from the gemmed.

one minute... i meant to quote someone else.

whoever was it that said they didn't think 'gickers were going to harm others inside the city walls, yeah. i think it would be very unlikely, but its happened to me.

[Nil AlSahni]

If you're a magicker, you have to bust your ass to get involved with the world and get a plot. It's all on YOU to find what's going down and get involved with it. The magicker is, by its nature, an isolating role. However, that doesn't mean that the PCs themselves want the isolation. It's a given that if you're gemmed you're severely limited by who will hire you. However, if you're encountering too many magickers, I would argue that it's because they want some interaction with someone. Magickers have just as much, if not more, plot trouble as anyone else.

I vote sekrit option t: Magickers stay a relatively average portion of the population. People bitch when they hang out alone and idly cast, and they bitch that there are too many when they come out and try to engage others in RP. Therefore: You cannot please people, and magickers are okay, it is instead a problem with people being unable to be pleased.

[boog]

If you're a magicker, you have to bust your ass to get involved with the world and get a plot. It's all on YOU to find what's going down and get involved with it. The magicker is, by its nature, an isolating role. However, that doesn't mean that the PCs themselves want the isolation. It's a given that if you're gemmed you're severely limited by who will hire you. However, if you're encountering too many magickers, I would argue that it's because they want some interaction with someone. Magickers have just as much, if not more, plot trouble as anyone else.

I vote sekrit option t: Magickers stay a relatively average portion of the population. People bitch when they hang out alone and idly cast, and they bitch that there are too many when they come out and try to engage others in RP. Therefore: You cannot please people, and magickers are okay, it is instead a problem with people being unable to be pleased.

Uh-greed.

[maxid]

I vote sekrit option t: Magickers stay a relatively average portion of the population. People bitch when they hang out alone and idly cast, and they bitch that there are too many when they come out and try to engage others in RP. Therefore: You cannot please people, and magickers are okay, it is instead a problem with people being unable to be pleased.

QFT

[NOFUN]

The only problem I've found my so far with the mages pc popluation is how they often outnumber the mundanes in high profile areas, like the gaj, since most mundanes are too busy with there clan and current IC friends, it often makes it difficult for a new pc to interact with non-Mage characters, with such role-play being limited to a nervous nod toward the mage before quickly looking away. I feel that the main problem Is the number of gemned mages as opposed to the number of mages since an ungemned, in the eyes of my characters is just another mundane.

[Cindy42]

why don't 'gickers try to be friends with each other?

i'm sorry about what i'm about to say---- but i think what the docs say about darkness and krathian 'gickers not liking each other is a bit cliche. they wouldn't really have any natural aversion to each other not based on their race or birthplace, as far as i can tell, unless there's an actual realistic reason for this... hmm. an IC reason is fine, but it would have to apply to everyone.

Tuluk is always the offical alternative to running into 'gickers, at least ones that keep their 'gicking to themselves so you never know.

a good, unsafe plot for a 'gicker would be trying to live in Tuluk. that's all the freakin' plot you need right there. if allanak is meant by this lack-of-plot discussion.... well, maybe any GMH house guys listening could start a tradition of hiring the occasional water mage or the occasional krathian mage or something. make a small, secret or not secret tradition out of hiring a certain type of mage, or hiring human mages. they're certainly worth the money, and helpful.

maybe gemmed can recruit for family members who WON'T think they're absolutely disgusting, or start out being parts of tribes, and spent time bonding with their folks before getting gemmed. live in luir's or red storm with a recruited friend or family member or two, find out later the one guy's got water witchness, then say, oh hey, we'll be financially stable for the rest of our lives if we go to 'nak. if... that's the case. or if the guy is willing to live down there to learn the craft. then you've got your buddies now.

[musashi]

i'm sorry about what i'm about to say---- but i think what the docs say about darkness and krathian 'gickers not liking each other is a bit cliche. they wouldn't really have any natural aversion to each other not based on their race or birthplace, as far as i can tell, unless there's an actual realistic reason for this... hmm. an IC reason is fine, but it would have to apply to everyone.

There's an IC reason for this. And actually, it extends beyond just krathi's and drovians. All the elementalists have the potential to have a severe dislike of whatever the opposite of their element is, it really depends on IC stuff and their character's disposition about being what they are.

But I agree that the way the docs have it written, it sounds kind of lame. But once you get IC and play a 'gicker and experience it first hand the IC reasoning behind the sentiment makes a lot more sense and gets cooler.

[Yam]

i'm sorry about what i'm about to say---- but i think what the docs say about darkness and krathian 'gickers not liking each other is a bit cliche. they wouldn't really have any natural aversion to each other not based on their race or birthplace, as far as i can tell, unless there's an actual realistic reason for this... hmm. an IC reason is fine, but it would have to apply to everyone.

There's an IC reason for this. And actually, it extends beyond just krathi's and drovians. All the elementalists have the potential to have a severe dislike of whatever the opposite of their element is, it really depends on IC stuff and their character's disposition about being what they are.

But I agree that the way the docs have it written, it sounds kind of lame. But once you get IC and play a 'gicker and experience it first hand the IC reasoning behind the sentiment makes a lot more sense and gets cooler.

There's also a huge divide between gemmed magickers, tribal magickers and 'rogue' magickers. As there should be.

[boog]

i'm sorry about what i'm about to say---- but i think what the docs say about darkness and krathian 'gickers not liking each other is a bit cliche. they wouldn't really have any natural aversion to each other not based on their race or birthplace, as far as i can tell, unless there's an actual realistic reason for this... hmm. an IC reason is fine, but it would have to apply to everyone.

There's an IC reason for this. And actually, it extends beyond just krathi's and drovians. All the elementalists have the potential to have a severe dislike of whatever the opposite of their element is, it really depends on IC stuff and their character's disposition about being what they are.

But I agree that the way the docs have it written, it sounds kind of lame. But once you get IC and play a 'gicker and experience it first hand the IC reasoning behind the sentiment makes a lot more sense and gets cooler.

Yeah. Musashi's right. Just sort of listen to him, then try it yourself.

[Cindy42]

i'm sorry about what i'm about to say---- but i think what the docs say about darkness and krathian 'gickers not liking each other is a bit cliche. they wouldn't really have any natural aversion to each other not based on their race or birthplace, as far as i can tell, unless there's an actual realistic reason for this... hmm. an IC reason is fine, but it would have to apply to everyone.

There's an IC reason for this. And actually, it extends beyond just krathi's and drovians. All the elementalists have the potential to have a severe dislike of whatever the opposite of their element is, it really depends on IC stuff and their character's disposition about being what they are.

But I agree that the way the docs have it written, it sounds kind of lame. But once you get IC and play a 'gicker and experience it first hand the IC reasoning behind the sentiment makes a lot more sense and gets cooler.

Yeah. Musashi's right. Just sort of listen to him, then try it yourself.

ah... i have not karma. and my intentions would be flawed anyway, i'm not even interested in most 'gicker roles. neither do i believe i deserve karma.

this thread is really awesome. sometimes i wonder exactly how much of this game i know jack about.

[Malifaxis]

i'm sorry about what i'm about to say---- but i think what the docs say about darkness and krathian 'gickers not liking each other is a bit cliche. they wouldn't really have any natural aversion to each other not based on their race or birthplace, as far as i can tell, unless there's an actual realistic reason for this... hmm. an IC reason is fine, but it would have to apply to everyone.

There's an IC reason for this. And actually, it extends beyond just krathi's and drovians. All the elementalists have the potential to have a severe dislike of whatever the opposite of their element is, it really depends on IC stuff and their character's disposition about being what they are.

But I agree that the way the docs have it written, it sounds kind of lame. But once you get IC and play a 'gicker and experience it first hand the IC reasoning behind the sentiment makes a lot more sense and gets cooler.

Yeah. Musashi's right. Just sort of listen to him, then try it yourself.

ah... i have not karma. and my intentions would be flawed anyway, i'm not even interested in most 'gicker roles. neither do i believe i deserve karma.

this thread is really awesome. sometimes i wonder exactly how much of this game i know jack about.

Some of us play this game for a decade or more and still discover new things.

Enjoy it

[boog]

i'm sorry about what i'm about to say---- but i think what the docs say about darkness and krathian 'gickers not liking each other is a bit cliche. they wouldn't really have any natural aversion to each other not based on their race or birthplace, as far as i can tell, unless there's an actual realistic reason for this... hmm. an IC reason is fine, but it would have to apply to everyone.

There's an IC reason for this. And actually, it extends beyond just krathi's and drovians. All the elementalists have the potential to have a severe dislike of whatever the opposite of their element is, it really depends on IC stuff and their character's disposition about being what they are.

But I agree that the way the docs have it written, it sounds kind of lame. But once you get IC and play a 'gicker and experience it first hand the IC reasoning behind the sentiment makes a lot more sense and gets cooler.

Yeah. Musashi's right. Just sort of listen to him, then try it yourself.

ah... i have not karma. and my intentions would be flawed anyway, i'm not even interested in most 'gicker roles. neither do i believe i deserve karma.

this thread is really awesome. sometimes i wonder exactly how much of this game i know jack about.

Special app.

[Marshmellow]

Honestly, Cindy (and others), different sorts of magickers have different things they're good at and/or different ways they're good at doing things.  It's not just that the docs say it's so.  It really is that they do clash when you try to do things together.  They aren't good at accomplishing goals using similar means.  Working together IS difficult for them.

Get the karma or special-app and find out the reasons on your own, but trust us, it's so.

[X-D]

First, I think that anybody trying to run a mage in Tuluk is a major twink.

Sorry, but the PC would know that mages are not allowed and they would KNOW that nothing can be hid from the templarate (true or not, that is what they would know), So anybody that is trying it is metagaming.

As to mages being friends, there is no reason why mages should be friends any more then anybody else, in fact, the knowledge of what a mage can really do should push them the other way, along with the fact that to a ruk, a whirans abilities should be just as mysterious as his are to a ranger. The difference is, the ruk knows first hand what his power can do and can only assume the whirans are at least as powerful.

[Saellyn]

First, I think that anybody trying to run a mage in Tuluk is a major twink.

Sorry, but the PC would know that mages are not allowed and they would KNOW that nothing can be hid from the templarate (true or not, that is what they would know), So anybody that is trying it is metagaming.

As to mages being friends, there is no reason why mages should be friends any more then anybody else, in fact, the knowledge of what a mage can really do should push them the other way, along with the fact that to a ruk, a whirans abilities should be just as mysterious as his are to a ranger. The difference is, the ruk knows first hand what his power can do and can only assume the whirans are at least as powerful.

There's this skill, called Barrier, which might be providing a (false?) sense of security. Any mage in Tuluk is not a major twink, they PROBABLY believe that they're safe.

[X-D]

Again, metagaming.

Nobody raised in Tuluk would ever believe they could be safe no matter what skills they might have, that is sort of the point to the all powerful godkings and templars types, they see all, they know all and nobody ICly knows exactly how it is done..other then the godkings and templars and they are not going to tell the lower then dirt commoners.

[Saellyn]

Again, metagaming.

Nobody raised in Tuluk would ever believe they could be safe no matter what skills they might have, that is sort of the point to the all powerful godkings and templars types, they see all, they know all and nobody ICly knows exactly how it is done..other then the godkings and templars and they are not going to tell the lower then dirt commoners.

Not that hard to believe that a gicker wasn't raised in Tuluk but lives in Tuluk, but whatever. I don't see the problem with it.

[Jingo]

First, I think that anybody trying to run a mage in Tuluk is a major twink.

Sorry, but the PC would know that mages are not allowed and they would KNOW that nothing can be hid from the templarate (true or not, that is what they would know), So anybody that is trying it is metagaming.

I'm allowed to make a magicker character in Tuluk. There's nothing in the documentation that says I can't.