Economy Split - Dorm/Clanned Apartment idea

[BlackMagic0]

You're in a land that has no luxury.

[Synthesis]

You're in a land that has no luxury.

Tell that to Minna.

[Salt Merchant]

Some of you are going overboard. This isn't CavemanMUD with only a few rocks to knock together. It's an entire city, and that means there -will- be opportunites for the clever, so some commoners -will- do better than others. Not everyone lives five families to a mud hut. Good grief.

[Ghost]

I can't make a comparison on the IC sense, ICly, yes the clans would likely consider it is too much of a cost to give apartments for the employees.

However, clanned PCs not being able to rent an apartment is a big downer when you make comparison with clanned vs indies.  Independents, as it was brought up before, have easier access to coin and thus can rent apartments too.  Without derailing this and making it a clanned-vs-indy thread, I think if there was an apartment complex just outside the clan compounds, would make more of a reason for people to choose clans.

[Twilight]

In Twilight's ideal world:

The improbably awesome coding guru's would rework the apartment code, such that the options for rent payment and renting apartments is updated to better facilitate the renting of apartments by multiple people, with multiple people paying.  So you could have three people paying a third each of the cost.  If one person doesn't keep up on their payments, their access is dropped and the other two see an increase in their rent.  Anyone paying rent can add another person, at which point rent is adjusted to the new (lower) rate for everyone.  Everyone has a command to see the sdesc of all other renters of an apartment.  A new clan job is added (renter).  Functionality added to rent an apartment for a clan.  Anyone flagged (renter) could pay the rent.  Add commands so a (renter) could designate what clan rank and above could access the apartment.

Then, staff would drastically increase rents for all apartments.  Like a minimum of 4x to 5x the current cost.  Enough to encourage the renting of apartments by multiple people as being the economical way of doing so (sorta like having several families living in some tenement room, strangely).  Enough to discourage the renting of multiple apartments (unless you are renting part of it, ie with friends/enemies).  Enough so that the top end apartments are beyond the means of anyone except rich merchants or those supported by people with a generous stipend (or several well to do folks banding together).  Enough to encourage joining a clan for the limited amount of storage area you might get.

Some people would still twink to get the coins to rent, no doubt.  But it would be nice to get away from the current somewhat, IMHO, spoiled attitude towards apartments being something necessary that everyone would/should have. 

[Taven]

Not true Taven. They can get an apartment. Just like they can now. In Allanak, I've never visited/been there when there were -zero- vacancies. And yes I do check. There's always a room available somewhere in the city.

There are also back rooms of bars for 100 sids per visit.

In Tuluk, there are 2 entire buildings worth of apartments that are usually totally vacant, and dirt-cheap, and if all you're wanting is sex, it won't bother you that you can't store much in them or that they're mostly target practice for burglars.

There are rooftops and balconies and hidden nooks and crannies and abandoned buildings all over Allanak which wouldn't cost a single sid to use, if all you wanted to do in there was have sex or an occasional private talk with someone.

My long long-term independents have never had an issue with having a "nice" apartment for themselves. In this case "nice" means either one decent-sized room that's not the worst available (or "nasty"), or a two-room apartment on about the same level. I would imagine that people who have played more seriously/aggressively in an independent role have been able to get even better places. My clanned PCs usually don't have that type of apartment.

It seems to me that something is off when clanned life is supposed to be better then the independent life, and you have that situation. You're supposed to join up with whichever clan because they provide security and whatever perks. If an independent has the means to make a lot of coin and easily hold an expensive apartment, and you're clanned and have to go with a "nasty" place (or no place) to keep any sort of spending coin.

Availability of apartments is part of it, but the main focus of the dorm idea is not to make more available (though it does have that nice side effect), but rather to save a clan member the coins that they would be spending on an apartment.  The dorms provided for clannies wouldn't be huge or spacious, they'd be a decent, small place.

Clanned people need to have their clanned accommodations on their clan property. Now, having said that, I do think there's room for the general idea..

(Further explanation of idea, etc)

I think that the basis of the two ideas is different. One is to try and make clanned life more appealing, and the other is because of the challenges of business for GMH provided by locations. While I can agree that the location thing is annoying , it's not the same topic (but you could make a thread to address it!).

In Twilight's ideal world:

(Stuff)

This is an interesting idea, but I think that it would make playing an independent too hard. You wouldn't be able to afford any storage space at all unless you had a group to work with. If you're just starting out, nobody knows you. There's no incentive to rent with you (a random stranger who might steal from them), unless a group of new players were all generated at the same time, and thus all looking for an apartment at the same time, and had similar playtimes.

[Salt Merchant]

It seems to me that something is off when clanned life is supposed to be better then the independent life, and you have that situation. You're supposed to join up with whichever clan because they provide security and whatever perks. If an independent has the means to make a lot of coin and easily hold an expensive apartment, and you're clanned and have to go with a "nasty" place (or no place) to keep any sort of spending coin.

A GMH clanned character, played casually, has it very sweet. For almost no effort, he has food, water, a -safe- place to store things, a place to train, clannies at his back, and an income.

A clanned character that is active should be able to generate more 'sid than just his income. Even if it means doing actual work like surreptitiously shoveling shit (just like an indie would do).

[Ashes]

Why not try for this IC?

[netflix]

A clanned character that is active should be able to generate more 'sid than just his income. Even if it means doing actual work like surreptitiously shoveling shit (just like an indie would do).

In some of these clans, many of the "side ways" of earning coin as an indie would are against clan policy.

[Synthesis]

A clanned character that is active should be able to generate more 'sid than just his income. Even if it means doing actual work like surreptitiously shoveling shit (just like an indie would do).

In some of these clans, many of the "side ways" of earning coin as an indie would are against clan policy.

So violate clan policy, duh.  You don't have to be a templar to be corrupt.

[netflix]

So violate clan policy, duh.  You don't have to be a templar to be corrupt.

Perhaps not, but saying that you -have- to be corrupt to make as much as an honest independent is rather asinine. Not to mention the fact of the level of bitching that commences when the punishment for breaking said policies may be instant termination from the job.

[Synthesis]

And yet, I see so many clanned characters running around with really nice things.

[Sephiroto]

The wealth of being in a clan is not necessarily in the coin you make but in the basic needs of your character being met, the relationships forged with co-workers, and the power of those fellow clan members to back one another up.  The wealth of joining a clan is the relative security provided by those those things.

If clan members want to break/stretch rules to earn an extra coin, then good for them.  This isn't OOCly wrong.  If there is a problem with it, perhaps it should be addressed ICly with some lashes or witholding of pay.  If you see someone habitually breaking clan rules for profit, email their staff or snitch on them in-game.  Rule-breakers can't be punished ICly if the leadership is ignorant of what is happening.

There are pros and coins to either side of the clanned/indie lifestyle.  I really don't think that we should change the game to make them both the same or equal.  There is a price to pay no matter which route you chose to take.  Those who break the rules often profit most, until they're caught.

[Salt Merchant]

A clanned character that is active should be able to generate more 'sid than just his income. Even if it means doing actual work like surreptitiously shoveling shit (just like an indie would do).

In some of these clans, many of the "side ways" of earning coin as an indie would are against clan policy.

That hasn't stopped people in the past, it's just created drama when discovered (not a bad thing). And if a GMH clanner works hard, he should be able to make coin directly for the clan too, making things or selling them according to his role. A good Agent will hand out bonuses for hard work.

[Jdr]

And yet, I see so many clanned characters running around with really nice things.

This. You don't need to be personally wealthy to have personal wealth. Please your noble master and he'll give you pretty things. Wealth isn't all about coin.

[Delstro]

I am in favor of a doorless/curtained room large enough for a cot/mat and a chest for the lowest ranks.
I am in favor of a doored rooms large enough for a cot/mat, chest, and shelves for life sworn/higher ranking members.

Shit, I've been a merchant in a few merchant houses and never had a room to myself.